what is reality and what is illusion ?

[Marblehead]

But there is no "me" to put them "there"...

 

Reminds me of the kids who's mother asks who did such and such and all answer "Not me."

 

Well, someone did it.

 

Reality is ruled by "cause and effect".

 

'Your' jewelry doesn't get created if 'you' don't create it.

[TaoMaster]

But there is no "me" to put them "there"...

 

a perfect example , The lie Yin- always follows the truth Yang+ Me+ no me -

[silent thunder]

Not sure about the taoist aspects of the OP.

I'm getting a strong dose of solipsism meets the hindu concept of maya.

Interesting, but not my thing.

[goldisheavy]

THE LAST PART

 

heres how it looks on paper

 

Yang+>future+ >+positive mass+ positve energy >+sensation-<-Negative energy <-negative mass <-past<-Yin

 

This is the spectrum of the duailty package.

 

That formula is very good, but I doubt many people will understand it.

 

I will try to explain what it means to the best of my ability.

 

Going from left to right, we see a process of volition unfolding.

 

Volition is not always simple, and from most beings' perspectives it should be considered to have many aspects to it.

 

So on the left we start with an aspect of volition which anticipates or expects or craves something in the future. This leads to the orchestration of sensation that is the fulfillment of that aspect of volition. However, there is typically also an aspect of volition that clings to sensations, because we tend to believe that only things which appear are real (that's basically what empiricism is about). So after sensation happens, there is clinging to it, which confers a quality of inertia to the sensation. Thus what at first appeared to satisfy becomes an entrenched expectation and a memory and something we see as "having been before," something imbued with a sense of the past or a sense of history. This inertial quality stabilizes experience and it also hinders experience, both. It can be seen as a good quality or a bad quality, depending on what you want your experience to feel like. If you prefer magical experiencing modes, then clinging and the resulting inertia are considered mostly bad qualities, since they rob the yang-side volition of its power to manifest things without any obstacles.

 

In other words, one's initial successes become the obstacles to one's later successes because of clinging to that very success as a sensation.

[Marblehead]

That is still very confusing.

 

When I am thirsty I get something to drink and drink util I am satisfied.

 

Is there really more to life than that?

[Stosh]

That is still very confusing.

 

When I am thirsty I get something to drink and drink util I am satisfied.

 

Is there really more to life than that?

I think Buddha would consider that a good descriptive for samsara.

But really I dont know whether he would say that it was all.

Its a good question.

[TaoMaster]

Illusion is what you are wrong about. The rest is reality.

reality is yang and illusion is yin

 

reality comes first then the illusion .

 

this is the basic law that governs all life and all things in the universe . the law of duality .

 

when you fully understand the yang and yin you will fully understand everything there is to understand.

 

the sooner+ you get to it+ the better +

 

the longer- you wait- the worse. -

 

its pure logic and as simple as simple gets

 

yang = + and yin = -

 

theres nothing more to this or anything every created by life in the universe than this

 

its as basic as basic gets

 

to get a better understanding of this you can start forming dua packages of yang and yin.

 

its not hard to do and once you get started youll be amazed at what you didnt know but now do.

 

youll want more and as you get a better understanding your ability will increase and you knowledge , your happiness, and all the other yang attributes.

 

theres nothing more i can say but to take this journey yourself . It must be this way , there is no other way .

 

your are already on that journey , if you were not you would not be here today reading this .

 

its a very personal journey and you wont be taking others with you .

 

they must also walk alone on their own journey as I have and am right now .

 

even if you walk with another on the same journey you are still walking alone , but just side by side with another.

[goldisheavy]

This is why I keep talking about subjectivity.

[Marblehead]

This is why I keep talking about subjectivity.

And I keep talking about objectivity.

[goldisheavy]

And I keep talking about objectivity.

 

The problem is, objectivity is unreal. It's an illusion.

[Marblehead]

The problem is, objectivity is unreal. It's an illusion.

And this is why we get into disagreements. Your view is opposite from mine.

[goldisheavy]

And this is why we get into disagreements. Your view is opposite from mine.

 

I know.

[beyonder]

reality is yang and illusion is yin

 

reality comes first then the illusion .

 

this is the basic law that governs all life and all things in the universe . the law of duality .

 

when you fully understand the yang and yin you will fully understand everything there is to understand.

 

the sooner+ you get to it+ the better +

 

the longer- you wait- the worse. -

 

its pure logic and as simple as simple gets

 

yang = + and yin = -

 

theres nothing more to this or anything every created by life in the universe than this

 

its as basic as basic gets

 

to get a better understanding of this you can start forming dua packages of yang and yin.

 

its not hard to do and once you get started youll be amazed at what you didnt know but now do.

 

youll want more and as you get a better understanding your ability will increase and you knowledge , your happiness, and all the other yang attributes.

 

theres nothing more i can say but to take this journey yourself . It must be this way , there is no other way .

 

your are already on that journey , if you were not you would not be here today reading this .

 

its a very personal journey and you wont be taking others with you .

 

they must also walk alone on their own journey as I have and am right now .

 

even if you walk with another on the same journey you are still walking alone , but just side by side with another.

 

Forty-One

Good and bad, self and others, life and death: Why affirm these concepts? Why deny them? To do either is to exercise the mind, and the integral being knows that the manipulations of the mind are dreams, delusions, and shadows. Hold one idea, and another competes with it. Soon the two will be in conflict with a third, and in time your life is all chatter and contradiction. Seek instead to keep your mind undivided. Dissolve all ideas into the Tao.

-Hua Hu Ching

[TaoMaster]

Forty-One

Good and bad, self and others, life and death: Why affirm these concepts? Why deny them? To do either is to exercise the mind, and the integral being knows that the manipulations of the mind are dreams, delusions, and shadows. Hold one idea, and another competes with it. Soon the two will be in conflict with a third, and in time your life is all chatter and contradiction. Seek instead to keep your mind undivided. Dissolve all ideas into the Tao.

-Hua Hu Ching

i dont consider myself having a mind and from what i see many will confuse the mind with life , the spiritual creator of all things.

its not mind body and soul for me its more like soul+ and body- .

 

soul is yang and body is yin .

 

yang always comes first and the yin . no exceptions.

 

the so called mind is whats between the two in a physical form . its a little of both in a way .

 

the mind is not thought. thoughts are a physical creations from life (aka the soul )

 

theres no morning afternoon and evening . theres only day and night . day is yang and night is .......anyone ?Bueller ? anyone?

 

yin .

 

theres no winter spring summer and fall , theres only summer+ and winter -

 

when the sun rises its day time and when it sets its night time. thats it . period.

 

the sun rises+ first+ , yang and sets- last- yin .

 

we wake+ in the morning + and we sleep- at night -

 

we are aware+ when we are awake+ and we are unaware- when we sleep-

 

there cant be awake with asleep . not becaus eof human nature , its the law of duality at work here.

 

its mankind that has sturred the kettel into a state of confusion and then passed it onto its children and then degenerated further to their children and so on .

 

its not about affermation + and denying- the yang and yin . its about sorting out whats yang and whats yin .

 

it will vanish all confusion . instantly

 

so this is why ive provided the meditatiion excercise of yang yin . not to deny nor affirm .

 

its not something you study , its about vanishing the lies and illusions thru meditational exercises

 

when you collapse a dual package ( yang and yin ) the yin will vanish and the yang will empower you .

 

theres only thoughts and no thoughts.

 

when a flower is born+ it grows+ up+ gets old- falls- down- and dies-.

 

its the same for all life forms in the universe including the planets which are also life forms.

 

the planet we are on started out small, it grew and some day it will die .

 

i use the + and - next to the words for a better understanding just befor i hit the send button

 

yang is + yin is -

 

its a binary universe of yang and yin .

 

anything other than that is just a cocktail mixture of the two items .

 

the execise of forming yang and yin is simply a way to sort the universe out for what it is ( truth ) and vanish the lies it contains.

 

 

get to understand the true nature of the universe and you will also understand and get to know life the creator of the universe.

 

 

i didnt read this stuff from a book or on the internet .

 

I vanished lies and illusions revealing the turth and reality

 

I didnt know any of this stuff untill last febuary and im knowing more and more as i continue to vanish lies and illusions .

 

you can too and i hope you do .

 

how?

 

do the drills . ive posted how to do them on previous threads and posts and thats all i can do for anyone .

 

but im here to help anyone too .

 

we can go back and forth like a game of ping pong until the end of the universe but until you do the drills yourself , we wont get very far with it . in fact itll just get worse.

[beyonder]

you can too and i hope you do .

No, thanks.

[LaoZiDao]

I recommend this to read
http://www.scribd.com/doc/403303/The-Revelations-of-an-Elite-Family-Insider-2005

It does get onto topics about the OP, it is a great text.

[TaoMaster]

I recommend this to read

http://www.scribd.com/doc/403303/The-Revelations-of-an-Elite-Family-Insider-2005

 

It does get onto topics about the OP, it is a great text.

Hey guys thx for the replays ,

 

Beyonder , no problem , I understand completely .

 

LaoZiDao,

 

I went to the link , thanks for including that .

 

When I got to the the guys answer where he referred to humans as " souls " I had to leave the page . It's not a bad thing . I used to be convinced of that too. And before that I didn't even know anything about spirituality .

 

Earlier this year , I had the experience to be one with all spiritual life in existence. It was amazing . It was then that I realized there's only one life , one soul, one spiritual being for all life forms , not separate would for each life form .

 

If someone were to tell me this prior to this year I would have said oh really .? Ha what a goof ball. I know I'm a spiritual being key word being the letter A , and you are a spiritual being as well. We are separate beings just like we have separate bodies.

 

There was no doubt no question .

 

Just like prior to 1982 when I had a full blown out of body awareness experience. It was like wow, I'm not my body and my thoughts and spiritual being can leave the body and return to it. Like when the body dies so to speak .

 

My son got hit by a car when he was 5 and he told me he left his body too when it happened.

Fortunately he was ok and just had a couple bruises.

 

But last Feb I went out of body and rejoined all life as in one with all life . Spiritually .

 

Life as I call it is a spiritual being , just one spiritual being for all life forms everywhere.

 

It's just another progression in my spiritual awareness. First no spirit just body , then latter it became spirits and body's and finally one spirit for all body's.

 

What's next ? I wish I could tell you . when i know i will tell you .

 

Here's a little analogy.

 

When a person walks into a room and it's dark , they turn the lights on to see. So they assume that in the beginning of creation , it was all dark and THEN there was light. Mainly because they are so used to living in the physical universe and have very little knowing of the spiritual aspects of life .

 

So like the guy who , like me at one time , has and had the understanding that each body has a individual soul, mainly because he is so used to living in the physical universe with individual bodys.

 

You'll see when your body dies, you'll just rejoin so to speak with all life again and that's that. It's the way it's always been and will always be .

 

When we dream and then wake up from the dream completely , can you go back to the dream you were just having?

 

Life outside the physical universe is no different. When we die , or our body's die , can we go back and live with the same body again?

 

Like the dream , we can go back if we don't wake up all the way but of we do then no.

Our body's are the same way . Once we die completely , no going back .

 

Some how or another , I went all the way "dead" but my body didn't die and I came back from being one with all life as if I died completely . I was doing my meditative exercise and looked at the self and others dual package and colapsed it completly .

When i did , spiritual others vanished and by the law of duality there must be two poles for a thing to exist in this universe. POOOOF ! i was back to being just self and no other or in other words self and all others too. It has been thee most amazing spiritual experience to date and at the top of the top for me .

 

The voodoo religion for example in convinced that there are three body's for each soul.

 

I don't expect anyone to just take my word for it. True reality must be experienced , not instructed. Mine included.

When i read about the three body concept I was like..... oh come on . Thats horse radish nonsence.

Well now in hindsite they are much closer to my reality than most others Ive heard to talked to .

my experience, my reality is one soul for all life forms . The 1 is very self aware too . All knowing and all the yang attributes to the fullest degree and the fullest sence of the words.

Absolute in every posible way with limitless ability and no exceptions. Thats life in the spiritual form. Im in no way refering to life forms . Those are physical forms created by life . Spiritual life has no creation . it wasnt created , its always been and will always be .

Awareness has levels. The above is the top of the top in awareness level. Thats not my awarness as i write this post but the awareness can be reachived by me when i need it to . I keep in my back pocket so to speak and pull it out when the going gets tuff.

im here now , ( and i know this sounds spiritually narcissistic ) but im here to have conversations with ant like life forms and the best way to do that is to become an ant. Only the ants are human. Please dont take this the wrong way . Im a human too .

Have you ever tried communicating with an ant ? good luck with that .

If you stomp on their ant hill or nest, youll have communicated with them as youll notice they are moving allot faster in a panic to survive. Its like the admiral sounded general quaters on a battle ship.

Im in the same boat now with humanity and i know stompimg is not the best way to comunicate from my experience.

In many ways its like talking to myself. Or playing a game of ping pong by myself. Theres only me and others who are also really me .

Insane? not to me but to others? oh very insane. So be it . I know what I know . I knd of view others who dont know what I know as the insane ones but I dont dislike anyone.

I pose my questions in a retorical way yes. Its just a way to start a conversation . No harm really.

Sanity ( yang ) and insanity ( yin ) are just two poles of the same item . Life can choose which side it prefers at any given time.

Then be on it .

Or sit nicly between the two poles like it can and does with any other pole it choses. " It " being life, the creator of all things.

Read all my posts and threads. There arnt that many . When you do youll get a much better understanding of who I am and why im here . Or not, its your choice.

I can show you a way to becoming one with all life but if youre not interested or consider me a lunatic or both then thats fine too

This is why i say I totally understand. Because I do .

[Harmonious Emptiness]

What is both real and illusion?

 

The illusion that normality is reality

[goldisheavy]

"What is" blinds the mind toward "would could be."

[Marblehead]

"What is" blinds the mind toward "would could be."

I do agree with this. I have spoken before of our potential capabilities and capacities. But then, there are many who are satisfied with their "what is" and don't want to be bothered with "what could be".

 

Is it the security with "what is" or is it the fear of failure with the search for "what could be"? Probably both, I think.

[TaoMaster]

What is both real and illusion?

 

The illusion that normality is reality

the illusion and whats real are both perceivable by life. They are both " things "

 

even if the illusion is a thing that is not real its still perceivable by life and that makes it real . a real illusion .

 

Let me ask you this

 

Can you see an illusion ?

 

Can you see a real thing or something real ?

 

both of them ?

 

are they both, not real ?

are they both, real ?

[Marblehead]

... a real illusion ...

No, no, no.

 

It is real to only the person who imagines the illusion. It is not real to anyone else. (There are exceptions to this, of course.)

[TaoMaster]

No, no, no.

 

It is real to only the person who imagines the illusion. It is not real to anyone else. (There are exceptions to this, of course.)

reality >< Illusion are two poles of the same thing

 

the reality comes first , its the truth and then the illusion that says its the true reality when its not . Its the lie.

 

if an illusion is real then every thing that is real ( everything ) is also an illusion.

 

The only thing ( and its not actuallty a thing ) that is real is life , the creator of all things . Everything else.......... ( which is everything in the universe ) is the illusion.

 

Life ( yang ) comes first , then Yin, lifes creations.

 

Life IS all of the yang attributes and Yin is created by life to oppose itself .

Edited August 14, 2014 by TaoMaster

[Rara]

I've not had time to read the whole thread but I get the jist...

 

May I respond with the following?

 

If I stay away from all media and by some miracle, miss all of the info, are ISIS still tormenting/ terrorizing innocent alternative religious groups in Iraq?

[Rara]

My understanding of the koan is to aid those learning to live in the present moment and to not become attached to what came before/what may happen. Speculation, worry and assumptions are unhealthy components within the Tao.

Edited August 14, 2014 by Rara