Any info/experiences with the Online School of Chi Energy?

[simonpi]

I came across this school quite by accident when I was looking for something else.
I stress I am not trying to secretly promote it. As you will see I have some fairly sharp criticisms of what i’ve found. But its also very interesting and approaches energy work in a way i’ve not seen before. I’m somewhat intrigued but also torn by their material.

 

http://www.chienergyheals.com/

I tried doing some research on them but these guys seem almost unknown. The head honcho ‘situ’ Rob jones claims to have trained in martial arts for over 40 years and was involved in a previous site - chi power.com. He no longer affiliates himself with that site and considers its methods no longer up to date in the light of further research. (personally that chi power site is the sort of thing i'd usually run a mile from. Horrible presentation. But maybe I have to look past it being marketed like diet pills...)

 

Outside the site itself i’ve found no independent opinions on the chi energy heals school (it seems to have a few different names) yet it claims a 90% retention rate. On TB forum there only seems to be a couple of indirect references to Rob Jones which don't give much away but actually sounds pretty positive.

There’s much more that could be said about their material. But the salient points of the school's method are:

- making use of modern research into biomagnetic research.
- main exercise is in building up nerve fibres throughout the body rather than any approach which concentrates on energetic structures in the body - i.e. lower Dantien.

- focus on building stable energy that becomes very tangible.
- no preoccupation with building heat in the body as a sign of chi development. Students learn precise temperature control of the body to avoid damaging glands. Something called the ‘tri concept’ is used to keep energy development in balance.
- working with bioelectricity and biophotons as opposed to affecting hormones in the body which many energy work methods do (apparently). Claimed that systems that work with the body’s hormones can cause problems that most of us associate with ups and downs or ‘healing crises’ of cultivation work.



PRO

- from the outline of their 3 year course it has some amazing sounding stuff that might genuinely come at energy work from a new empirical angle. They provide a full course catalogue of what to expect in the training.

I’ve done a little research on biomagnetism and the work of people like Dr Robert becker, James L. Oschman and some of the work of the French physical radiastheesia researchers lke Chaumery. Its enough to know that when they talk about ‘bioenergy’ and bio-phtons’ the school is not just making up a load of 'new age' psuedoscience. There can actually be some basis to this.

- The fee structure is transparent and pretty reasonable. About $950 for a year of training - which includes some mentoring.

- overall the presentation of the school is quite low key.


CON

- no matter how cleverly they dress it up all of their open door material amounts to ‘our system is better than everyone else’s’. This wold normally cause me to dismiss something quickly. Its a big no no.

- this means a student is asked to stop doing other forms on energy work when doing this one. This seems an unfair request when the student doesn’t know at the start whether this system has any worth.

- related: For all the material they have on their site they are very effective at not giving away a single practical technique to try. They seem to imply this is for safety of the student as even the first nerve fibre building exercise is strong.

- they lump ‘qigong’ into one thing as if all 9000 styles were the same. They also use the word ‘chi’ and lots of nice pictures of Chinese bridges etc in their marketing and yet essentially seem to reject traditional approaches to cultivation. The is what pushed me closest to ignoring them outright.

- they invoke quantum physics. Its a big red flag. There are very divided opinions on whether quantum physics demonstrates anything one way or the other about esoteric matters.

…and yet there is something in the material which suggests they might just be onto something.


I’m not about to change my practise over night - but neither will I fight to defend what i currently do just because i’m emotionally invested in it. Ultimately if these guys really do have a valid scientific approach to energy work then i’ll listen and adapt.

Thoughts, experiences…?

[Chang]

I am afraid that you will probably be disappointed should you buy into this. Buy being the operative word.

 

My advice would be to find a good teacher whose classes you can attend and who can give you hands on instruction in Qigong.

 

If you are unable to locate a decent teacher and still want to train in Qigong then I would recommend working your way through the Chinese National Chi Kung Institute Correspondence Program which can be found here for free http://www.scribd.com/doc/135842655/Chinese-National-Chi-Kung-Institute-Correspondence-Program

 

Follow this faithfully and it will lead you through a proven time honoured system for opening the energy channels of the body.

 

Steer clear of the mumbo jumbo salesmen who promise you the world.

[BaguaKicksAss]

Hm 3 posts, hope you aren't from that school trying to promote it.

 

Yes online isn't really useful, need in person training to really get anywhere.

[GrandmasterP]

Sounds like an advert.

Time will tell.

Edited August 10, 2014 by GrandmasterP

[BaguaKicksAss]

Hold on a sec, you trained with the Jerry Alan Johnson folks, and now you are falling for some brand new likely no real lineage, likely made up , online qigong system???!!!

[GrandmasterP]

Ssshhhhh BKA.

I'm selling him London Bridge via PMs

Edited August 10, 2014 by GrandmasterP

[Spotless]

If this is attracting you then I would suggest an online course in acupuncture/acupressure. I am assuming one is out there.

Or - attend a brick and mortar in your area - definitely better.

 

As you graduate from an acupuncture school you will immediately have an understanding of the language and tools that have been used for thousands of years and a whole group of other people who will speak in that language and with which you can grow and collaborate and have interchange with. After having learned the fundamentals you can always look into this stuff.

 

I remember looking into some of this stuff years ago and it has merit but if you have higher goals for yourself entering into a complete teaching first and then venturing into side studies will bring to you a bigger sense of community and make for a broader range of clients and studies.

 

We (Qi Gong class) have a woman that spent over 10 years with a teacher learning his healing techniques - she is unable to talk to any of us with clarity about what she learned and all of her clients are from a very small circle of friends. It is not because she is inarticulate.

It is because it was from a small school with all new language, much of the stuff the site you have offered up teaches, and everything she offers to us on occasion is suspect - because when she does it is deferred to those in the "know" about energy work and our methods are not only known to be effective but some of us can actually "see" the efficacy as it happens and in the broader picture.

Edited August 10, 2014 by Spotless

[simonpi]

Hold on a sec, you trained with the Jerry Alan Johnson folks, and now you are falling for some brand new likely no real lineage, likely made up , online qigong system???!!!

 

first, lets be clear we are talking about www.chienergyheals.com not chipower.com.

 

Secondly I'm not 'falling for it'. I just said i'm interested in it. (It was one of those clever philosophers who recomeneded being able to hold an idea in the mind for a while without outright accepting or rejecting it). One of the reasons I signed up to TB is to try and elicit some opinions about this system because I can't find them anywhere else. Its certainly not the only reason I came here though.

 

Whilst I respect lineage and Jerry Alan Johnson - by itself I don't don't care about appeals to authority and whether someone is a 'master' or whether something is online versus bricks and mortar. What I am interested is if is something works...

 

My initial reaction to the material on that website was indeed similar - extreme skepticism mixed with some feelings of defensiveness about my existing practices which it seemed to criticize. And both of those remain.

 

However some ideas interest me such as exercises to build up nerve fibres rather than the traditional approach of opening the lower gate /working with the lower dan tien. (traditional route works on a specific area df the body, this method works on nerve fibres throughot the body.)

 

What i'm interested to hear from is people who have looked beyond a glance at this method or who have actually trained with the school. Including people who trained in it and were disatisfied.

 

Maybe we will get some of those responses in time...and i realise doing this may give indirect publicity to the school but i'm not sure how to get around that..

[simonpi]

If this is attracting you then I would suggest an online course in acupuncture/acupressure. I am assuming one is out there.

Or - attend a brick and mortar in your area - definitely better.

 

As you graduate from an acupuncture school you will immediately have an understanding of the language and tools that have been used for thousands of years and a whole group of other people who will speak in that language and with which you can grow and collaborate and have interchange with. After having learned the fundamentals you can always look into this stuff.

 

I remember looking into some of this stuff years ago and it has merit but if you have higher goals for yourself entering into a complete teaching first and then venturing into side studies will bring to you a bigger sense of community and make for a broader range of clients and studies.

 

We (Qi Gong class) have a woman that spent over 10 years with a teacher learning his healing techniques - she is unable to talk to any of us with clarity about what she learned and all of her clients are from a very small circle of friends. It is not because she is inarticulate.

It is because it was from a small school with all new language, much of the stuff the site you have offered up teaches, and everything she offers to us on occasion is suspect - because when she does it is deferred to those in the "know" about energy work and our methods are not only known to be effective but some of us can actually "see" the efficacy as it happens and in the broader picture.

 

Thanks for your response. That is indeed what I am doing - training under a solid Jerry Alan Johnson Medical Qigong School and have no intention of suddenly cutting my training short to rush off to this.

 

I'm not actually looking for career/training guidance and what I should/shouldn't do. I really am looking for informed discussion of THIS system- people who have trained in traditional qigong cultivation and then switched to nerve fibre building excercises - and how they compare. Its a bit of a long shot but thought i'd try at least...

Edited August 13, 2014 by simonpi

[Spotless]

In the initial video which I watched for all of 40 seconds the woman holds her arms incorrectly while asking us to try feeling the energy with our palms. Little things like this stand out. Perhaps it was just an oversight.

 

However - I think the free course that was recommended above:

http://www.scribd.com/doc/135842655/Chinese-National-Chi-Kung-Institute-Correspondence-Program

 

Is something to really look into!

 

Edit: I posted the above post just prior to your response.

It seems you are already on a good solid path and that you are seeking a fairly deep commentary on this particular school. So with this in mind I have to bow out and say I do not know much about this school.

Edited August 10, 2014 by Spotless

[Chang]

I really do have grave reservations regarding this organisation. See below the cost of training.

 

First Year classes: $ 97.00 per mont

Second Year classes: $197.00 per month

Third Year classes: $297.00 per month

Instructor Year classes: $379.00 per month

 

I am also completely unimpressed by all this talk of nerve fibre building.

 

Caveat Emptor.

[Zhongyongdaoist]

I went to the site that you mention, I don't have time for a long discussion, but I did find this interesting:

Chi Energy and Human Light Photons

I am not finished with it, but I do find it interesting, especially the idea of bio-light as being more coherent and emissions in the UV spectrum. None of this is too outrageous, infrared light emissions as 'body heat' are taken for granted and the basis of a lot of current technology. I realized a long time ago that there is quite literally a 'body of light' that permeates our 'physical body', if these people can harness it that could be worth pursuing.

In another thread I posted this:

 

If you would like a really interesting read try:

Physics in Mind, Werner R. Lowenstein

Two separate links above by the way. Here you can read about information arrows, quantum sensation and about how Maxwell's demon found work designing quantum molecules, that cleverly exploit the relationship between entropy and information, which Lowenstein calls 'Demon Molecules'. I always knew there was a place for him somewhere in quantumville.





Edit: Corrected spelling of molecules and added phrase about entropy and information.

If you are not familiar with this book, you may find it an interesting read, especially its discussion of information arrows, the importance of quantum physics in light perception, and quantum mechanics in consciousness.

This is just a preliminary note, I have not had time to dig deeply into the site. Thank you for pointing it out.

[simonpi]

 

I am also completely unimpressed by all this talk of nerve fibre building.

 

Caveat Emptor.

 

 

Be interested to hear specificaly why you are unimpressed by it.

 

Nerve fibre building happens naturally in the body as a proccess of repair but its often not that efficient. One thing that would be interesting is whether anyone has managed to find a way to consciously leverage this in the way Yogis have managed to take control of autonomic nerous system procceses including the heart.

[silent thunder]

in my experience the two things that are beyond compare:

 

1 a real, live, in person teacher who you resonate with.

2 practicing every day at the same time, with a clear, open heart.

[GrandmasterP]

Thanks for your response. That is indeed what I am doing - training under a solid Jerry Alan Johnson Medical Qigong School in UK that doesn't charge the astronomical prices of the IIMQ. I won't be done with therapist certification until next year and have no intention of suddenly cutting my training short to rush off to this.

 

I'm not actually looking for career/training guidance and what I should/shouldn't do. I really am looking for informed discussion of THIS system- people who have trained in traditional qigong cultivation and then switched to nerve fibre building excercises - and how they compare. Its a bit of a long shot but thought i'd try at .

 

.....

Edited October 21, 2014 by GrandmasterP

[Chang]

Be interested to hear specificaly why you are unimpressed by it.

 

Nerve fibre building happens naturally in the body as a proccess of repair but its often not that efficient. One thing that would be interesting is whether anyone has managed to find a way to consciously leverage this in the way Yogis have managed to take control of autonomic nerous system procceses including the heart.

 

The only way to find out if this system works is to pay your monthly instalmants, complete the course and then report back to this forum with the result. I wish you well.

[simonpi]

 

 

I keep a smaller percentage of my attention available for 'experimental' approaches. This is due to my conviction that qigong needs innovation and scientific rigour if it is to progress. I've come to agree with those to argue a lot of the supposed research done on qigong on China is not up to scratch at all... My experimentalism may get me into trouble but i've learnt by now its not going to stop so there's no point trying to shut it down - only manage it.

 

Anyway - Maybe this thread will show up on Google in time and we may get comments from someone who has actually had experience with the school. Which was what I really wanted.

Edited August 13, 2014 by simonpi

[BaguaKicksAss]

More like $500 for weekend (which are 3-4 days long) workshops by JAJ's various disciples.

 

JAJ doesn't drive a fancy sports car, though nicer than average one.

 

The point is still taken though, pricey stuff. Sometimes one lucks out and finds a qigong master who teaches in the park for next to nothing .

 

I still recommend in person over online, it's like night and day. If you like those folks, ask about in person classes would be my recommendation (though I'm still convinced you likely run the school )

[Nungali]

The point is still taken though, pricey stuff. Sometimes one lucks out and finds a qigong master who teaches in the park for next to nothing .

 

 

Arrrrgggggh ... posting that smilie wiped out my whole post in front of it

 

f7^%X@! you *VX&%$# !!!!!!

[BaguaKicksAss]

*gives Nungali a really big consolatory QI HUG!

[Nungali]

I've calmed down a bit now ... thanks (thats some grip ya got there ! )

 

What disappeared was a story about how the 'free teacher in the park' disappeared ... maybe he was reading this ?

 

 

he might be gone by now.

 

Worked with a guy that practiced an unusual (to me ) Chinese form, said he got his teacher by watching this old chinese guy in the park and decided to hide in the distance and imitate him. Then after a bit he tried to do it without watching, then looked up and the guy was gone. So he walked out into the open to see where he went and

 

<tap tap> on shoulder "Its is rude to hide and copy. You want to learn, I teach you properly."

 

He said he could never figure out how old dude got from 'over there' to behind him

 

(now .... carefully hit post button and dont go anywhere near that ... )

Edited August 13, 2014 by Nungali

[tao stillness]

Last night I stumbled upon the School of Chi Energy website and spent some time listening to their podcast advertising and a few of their videos. I was impressed with the findings from the J.B. Rhine Institute, or whatever it is called these days. Dr. Rhine gave a presentation at our university sometime in the 1960's and I was impressed how they tried to use the scientific method for paranormal research. Now they have computers and complex instruments for measuring energy. The researchers on this video were really impressed with the energy this head instructor from the Schollof Chi Energy was giving off according to their instruments. It was way beyond what they had seen before in the past 30 years. I think for me the only way to find out how legit their claims are is for me to fork out $30 for Eric Isen the medical clairvoyant to test it. He has saved me a great deal of time and money over the last several years by finding what is effective chi kung and not effective at all chi kung methods for me. Anyone can claim anything, and Eric's abilities to literally see what something will do for a person even before they try the method is the litmus test for me. However, the fees for their teaching is outrageous, in my opinion, especially since my income is Social Security retirement. If you choose to actually listen to their podcast advertisements, I warn you that Rob Jones repeats the same points endlessly and thus really stretches it out. If you want to work on improving your patience is a virtue, then try to listen to his discourses to the end. I was unable to and found his repetition to be frustrating. In fact, I dozed off. His number one teacher while undergoing testing at the Rhine Institute claims to have merged with her photons or energy and left the testing room to go into the room where the researchers were watching the instruments and then she said she was able to go outside of the building via this energy. I am going to email them today to see if they have any research and I will also give feedback about Rob Jones' redundancy. Something that turns me off about them is whenever Americans add Sifu to their name. Sifu Chang sounds natural. Sifu Jones sounds like matching stripes with checks in clothing, you look like a clown.

Update: I recently had my medical clairvoyant test this system and he found that it is a good one for mind and body but it will not send he energy high enough to reach the upper chakras and therefore it is not a holistic method. I had him compare this one to the one I already am doing, Purple Petal Plum Kidney Breathing Chi Kung by Eddie Chong and he found the Purple Plum does much more.

So once again the advertisement is full of hype that is not real. 

Edited December 12, 2017 by tao stillness
to embelish

[blackdragon]

Hey. I used to do this training. The guy sifu Rob. He is real strict. So I think if you like someone telling you. Don't do this or don't do that. Kind of micro manegizing you. Then maybe the training will work for you. 

 

I did his training for two years back when I was young man. Like 19 years old when I started it.  After awhile people told me I like like a child. 

 

And people did good things for me too when I never asked for it. So I assumed it was because of his training. 

 

But when I had him on the phone I could feel his energy causing problems with my energy. 

 

And when he talked with his voice it felt negative. So he is at a high level I assume but in a really negative way. 

 

I know so many people that have left him and his training. 

 

So I wanted to share.my feelings on it. 

 

And by the way he says Criss angel bought his program back in the 80s. 

 

So all the " magic tricks" are really tai chi powers in action. That there are other guys behind the scenes putting their energy together to make Criss angel fly and so forth. 

 

 

 

 

[Morrako]

Hmmm. Yeah, I feel it's important to give my experience as well with these people.

 

I was originally a part of this school until I was put into a vulnerable position in meditation with one of the founders (Cindy Cicero) and realized that this place is a cult.

At this time the website/homepage STILL looks to be of Asian influence. It has shinto tori gates, zen photography, and japanese characters. No mention of Jesus. The head people are Rob Jones and Cindy Cicero.

 

I work as a life coach but since I left the school I haven't really been able to work. Every time I have tried to access a good feeling, the data that they put in me tells me its Jesus. I can't expand with my clients and help them because I cannot in good faith tell them that that expansive feeling that they have is Jesus Christ. I have been on Anti-depressants since December of 2019. I am seeing a psychologist that specializes in cult deprogramming as well.

 

A little background on me before I go into my experience with the school - My Dad was a Methodist Minister for over 40 years. I grew up going to Church every week until I was an adult and the belief system of the Bible was never thrust upon me in our household. In the mid-west, this is a very common way to be raised and the beliefs are very exclusive. I grew up incredibly sensitive to the universe and see Jesus as a part of a greater whole that includes other belief systems and philosophies. We are all searching for avenues that will take us higher. I've spent many years in Asia studying martial arts, philosophies, and energy.

I started this school at the end of 2016 with optimism as I was looking for a way for increase my energy and connect with the Universe. At the start I was welcomed with open arms by Cindy into the school. I was not asked what I believe in regarding religion/spirituality.

 

Each month I you have a phone call to catch up on your progress. Literally every time it was with Cindy... after I had expanded with the energy form I was asked, "Do you feel the love of Jesus Christ now?" At first I thought this was weird because at no point from their homepage to the online classroom was their mention of that, but was willing to let it go because 

A. I thought if I said no enough that she would eventually get the point
B. Because it's an instructor and I was trying to be respectful.
C. Because I wanted to learn.

 

After a while I said I didn't agree and that I don't believe in that. I was told that wasn't a problem. But, still had to be told how this power is Jesus Christ and it really didn't matter how many times you told her that you don't believe in it. She would still insert her own stuff into your chi field regardless. 

 

Let me tell you how some of this works. The energy is electricity. They are called Biophotons. These particles hold memory in them. It's how you build them up - with good feelings, cool temperature, and low intensity. When you are talking with another instructor you can get amplified and also amplify them because their is an energetic exchange between the two of you. If the person you are working with is open and respects you then you will both walk away from the exchange happier and full of joy. If they are not open then you are opening yourself up to their own ego and manipulation.

 

I was then paired with an advanced instructor who only wanted to help me and respected my position in the Universe. They allowed me to grow and see the universe and that's exactly what I wanted.

 

I had to leave the school for about a year but came back at the end of the summer in 2019. I was building up a lot of energy and was feeling really good about it. I gave my monthly report in email and was asked by Cindy to do a call in to check up. My intuition told me no... I should have listened. I got onto the call and chatted with her for a few minutes to catch up on the year. I trusted her to not do what she did... We expanded into my circle of energy and amplified it. At this point I had never felt so open to the universe. I was free and vulnerable. I had never felt such a thing. 

 

That's when I heard, "Do you feel the power of Jesus Christ now?" I immediately shrank from my circle and closed off. It felt wrong that someone was trying to dictate my space in the Universe. Instead of letting me have my own experience she put her own stuff into it. Before It was always safe and with the other instructor. I was then told the following thing...

 "Other people with other philosophies and religions have come into the school and haven't gotten very far because they didn't believe in Jesus" (Fear tactic and also completely not true)

I was then lectured for 10 minutes on Jesus and how it's important for me to accept it and how it's my choice to accept the book of life. That the swift wind comes for the just and the unjust. Then I was told, "Oh, but I'm not trying to convert you." Yeah, right.

I wish it ended there but the rest of November and December were absolute hell. I couldn't access the chi anymore because of the data that was exchanged by the founders of the school through conversation.

 

I reached out saying I was having problems and that my temperature was overheating and I was having bad side effects. I was called by Rob Jones- Founder of the school. He is basically what people who have left the school describe him: Someone who talks over you, doesn't listen and isn't interested in anything other than what he wants to say. During the "talk" I was told that there are no other Universal truths other than Jesus Christ. I wasn't listened to and I wasn't attacking Cindy for her beliefs. I just wanted to be heard and that I didn't think it was okay for me to work with someone who forced her beliefs on me. I was told that I'm probably not going to make it past the Second Year of training and that I'll most likely be able to just do the super sets at the end of that course. Which other people in the school (in and also those who have left) had every amount of faith in me that I would do well. Also, "People probably think it's weird that we're the school of Chi Energy and soon as they join we're talking about Jesus. But that's just who we are *laughs*"

 

The call ended after an hour and twenty four minutes. I felt unheard, angry, and afraid. I reached out to Cindy in Mid-December to try and reason one last time on why I felt the way I did and that I needed help. The call with her started with her saying in a kind voice," How can I help you?" What an odd thing to say to someone considering what followed.

 

I was able to get less than thirty seconds in before I was interrupted and told why she believed what she believes and why the problem has to do with me. I tried to be polite and say again, what my experience with the universe is. Then I was quickly interrupted and told that I am the only person in the school who's had a blockage with this. (Not true. Many people have left because of the way they force their beliefs on you.) I was told I was a non-believer. She then said she was not going to stop talking about Jesus with people regardless of what they believe. I was then laughed at and told, " guess you can just not work with us. I don't know what to tell you". And again, "People probably think it's weird that we're the school of Chi Energy and soon as they join we're talking about Jesus. But that's just who we are. *laughs*"

 

I told her that I'd think about it and let her know if I was going to continue training. During this entire two months I was civil with them. I was nothing but respectful in hoping I would be treated the same. The call ended and I felt even worse. I sent her a message through FB on why I thought they were wrong. The points were

A. Not once do they acknowledge what your beliefs are because they really don't care.
B. IMPORTANT---- They are doing what cults do... they bring people in under a certain guise, take them into energetic states, and make them doubt their experiences so that they can control them.
C. Told me that no one else in the school has a had a blockage like this, making me feel like something is wrong with me when several people left the school for similar reasons.
D.They both used fear to get me to convert to Christ by telling me I wasn't going to be strong enough.
E. They used terms like "non-believer" towards me (wow, super inclusive) as I don't believe in Jesus Christ. Even though on the website and many of the topics discussed are of Daoist/Zen/Shinto origin. The course material reflects this.

So they make you doubt yourself, implant their beliefs in you.

F. When you're on call, they don't take into consideration what your life path is.
G.They consistently tell you what the power is without any regard for your experience with the Universe.

 

They charge $100 a month or about 1k for a whole year to experience that.

 

This school ruined me. Even if you're a Christian, I don't know why you would want to be involved with people who are so deceitful and dangerous. Their advertising is false. I obviously do not recommend this school.