Fear of death leads to an early death

[Songtsan]

This axiomatic statement, while surprisingly simple and honestly cliche, is of, well, obvious or axiomatic importance.

 

Ways to limit fear:

 

1) Carbon dioxide: Getting a cylinder of CO2 and pairing it with a tank of O2 at the correct % (see the research on it for more detail). Essentially, what happens is that the CO2 level in the blood produces a reaction in which one feels like one is suffocating and about to die, when actually the body is fine. Experiments have shown that this puts one in an altered state of consciousness. Similar to NDE? Don't know, never tried it (but I will I think).

 

2) Skydiving: self explanatory.

 

3) Dirt Coffin: Manitou knows all about that

 

4) progressive exposure therapy: Don't like snakes, rats or spiders? Get a pet snake, rat, or tarantula....you get the point.

 

5) Surrender to Death at all times in your heart region. This is what all true masters do.

 

That's my way I suppose...what I m working on at least.

[MooNiNite]

This axiomatic statement, while surprisingly simple and honestly cliche, is of, well, obvious or axiomatic importance.

 

Ways to limit fear:

 

1) Carbon dioxide: Getting a cylinder of CO2 and pairing it with a tank of O2 at the correct % (see the research on it for more detail). Essentially, what happens is that the CO2 level in the blood produces a reaction in which one feels like one is suffocating and about to die, when actually the body is fine. Experiments have shown that this puts one in an altered state of consciousness. Similar to NDE? Don't know, never tried it (but I will I think).

 

2) Skydiving: self explanatory.

 

3) Dirt Coffin: Manitou knows all about that

 

4) progressive exposure therapy: Don't like snakes, rats or spiders? Get a pet snake, rat, or tarantula....you get the point.

 

5) Surrender to Death at all times in your heart region. This is what all true masters do.

 

That's my way I suppose...what I m working on at least.

 

transcending fears and constantly evolving. Buddha says, "abandon shelter, rely on noone and no thing."

in my opinion most people's fears are letting go of what they rely on.

 

5) Surrender to Death at all times in your heart region. This is what all true masters do.

can you elaborate?

[Tennoryou]

I dunno. I used to dream a lot about being being eaten by animals as a child. It never happened. I've had some pretty violent things happen to me, people trying to take my life. Definitely have PTSD from it. I don't think my irrational fear of death, which isn't so irrational after all considering the circumstances, is going to cause me to have an early death. Smoking and coffee and eating like shit and living in this "society" on the other hand, well that just might. But, we all know that already.

Edited August 12, 2014 by Tennoryou

[GrandmasterP]

Garrison Keilor tells a story about a guy who was killed by his fear of death.

Seems that the guy was such a hypochondriac he thought that every little thing wrong with him was a terminal illness.

One day the guy woke up with a sore throat so he jumped in his car to drive to the Hospital was hit by a gravel truck on a blind bend and killed outright.

Edited August 12, 2014 by GrandmasterP

[Tennoryou]

I'm not saying fear can't be self-fulfilling, especially if it becomes all consuming. Just that it isn't always, or even most of the time. Obviously. Otherwise there would be a TON more plane crashes in this world.

[GrandmasterP]

Dwelling on death can get to be a tad gloomy though.

Death's inevitable anyhoo so there's really no point stressing about it at all.

In a Bavarian Trappist monastery refectory there's a huge mural of 'Death' as a skeleton with his scythe and cowled robe astraddle the exit door.

His right bony finger points down towards those using the exit and there's a text banner beside the finger reading ( in German)

" Perhaps Tonight."

To my mind a few images of Lolcats up on that wall would have been cheerier but every interior decorator has their own preferences.

Edited August 12, 2014 by GrandmasterP

[Nungali]

Seems to make sense, considering my experience with the reverse.

 

I have had 4 incidents of 'immanent death' the first one I was - Oh well , I have had a great run; even If I died at 40 I would have considered myself a winner, with what I had planned to achieve and what I have achieved this life. By the forth I was probably far too casual about it. But even that didnt seem to matter.

 

I'm still here. Sometimes it reminds me of the story of 'The Old Man and the Bear'.

 

But the end is something I am assured of ... I certainly wont be getting 'ripped off' with that one

Edited August 13, 2014 by Nungali

[Nungali]

This axiomatic statement, while surprisingly simple and honestly cliche, is of, well, obvious or axiomatic importance.

 

Ways to limit fear:

 

1) Carbon dioxide: Getting a cylinder of CO2 and pairing it with a tank of O2 at the correct % (see the research on it for more detail). Essentially, what happens is that the CO2 level in the blood produces a reaction in which one feels like one is suffocating and about to die, when actually the body is fine. Experiments have shown that this puts one in an altered state of consciousness. Similar to NDE? Don't know, never tried it (but I will I think).

 

2) Skydiving: self explanatory.

 

3) Dirt Coffin: Manitou knows all about that

 

4) progressive exposure therapy: Don't like snakes, rats or spiders? Get a pet snake, rat, or tarantula....you get the point.

 

5) Surrender to Death at all times in your heart region. This is what all true masters do.

 

That's my way I suppose...what I m working on at least.

 

6) Find a nice quiet undisturbed space.

 

Take 200 mg of good ol fashioned 100% pure clear light.

 

Work out the kinks with some hatha yoga.

 

15 minutes of prana yoga.

 

Visualise going to and watching your own autopsy (it might help if you have ever been to one , easy for me as back then it was part of one of my jobs ).

 

... worked for me !

 

Got to that part where they make a cut across the forehead and down the temples and pull your face off ...

 

 

that did it ! POW!

 

straight out the top of my head I went !

 

I remember looking at the fully autopsied Nungali corpse lying there ; "Well, no chance of going back to that then ! "

 

So I went somewhere else. . . . for about 6 hours.

[silent thunder]

death has no teeth for me

dying however... that could suck for a bit, but death, na, nothing to fear.

[Songtsan]

 

transcending fears and constantly evolving. Buddha says, "abandon shelter, rely on noone and no thing."

in my opinion most people's fears are letting go of what they rely on.

 

5) Surrender to Death at all times in your heart region. This is what all true masters do.

can you elaborate?

 

I think that fear usually radiates from the chest area - like when you almost get in a car crash, or have anxiety or panic....so I believe this to be like the prime emotional center...I try to relax the tension which is automatically generated in times of stress or anxiety by a symbolic and energetic act of baring my chest to the world, as if to say, 'I am ready to die. Stab me in the heart if that is your way!.' Although of course I imagine that my body would spontaneously abort such attempts - as long as I don't interfere with my Shakti. Staying relaxed at all times, allowing nondoing, one grasps at nothing, and one does no counteractions to the nondoing actions....Chest stays relaxed, heart stays loose and fearless - vulnerable, yet protected by the Tao itself..

Edited August 13, 2014 by Songtsan

[Songtsan]

What are the physiological side effects of fear? Tension, catecholamines, all kinds of stuff..

 

Google: 'physiological effects of fear on the body'

 

and you will see why I believe that it will result in an untimely demise if it is constant.

 

I speak from the point of view of one who has a tendency towards hypochondria, paranoia, hyper-ruminative excess, etc.

 

These are probably over-expressions of functions.

 

Since I am of this nature, I intend to approach fearlessness.

 

Not in a bravado way - trying to be some kind of bad ass - just in a heart warrior way - the way of non attachment.

 

I value the fear response for what it is. I seek to curtail the echo that exists because of the mind's tendency to hold onto and repeat sensations and events over and over.

 

So perhaps I should clarify between the physiological event (a protective one), and the mental/ruminative one (a self-destructive one).

 

"I must not fear.
Fear is the mind-killer.
Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration.
I will face my fear.
I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path.
Where the fear has gone there will be nothing.
Only I will remain."

 

-from Dune

 

The initial response is what it is: NOT to be labeled by 'those who know' - fear is the mind's continuation of the initial response - which can be labeled as mind wishes, it is the circular, repetitive resistance to reality - i.e. "This is going to happen...oh no!" OR " This could happen! It might happen" OR "What if this happens!?" - this is what brings us to an early death.

 

I could always summarize by saying that it is the fabrications of the mind that cause suffering...

 

That is a direct and utter cure for all ills.

 

What I am doing here is micro-focusing on a particular area of the death cycle...that which is fear based..

 

I won't have to do kind of stuff when I directly end mind fabrications...

 

this is a mind fabricated tool to deal with mind fabricated illness.

 

It generates the release from the killing effects of fear, by over-riding the fear function...it is 'replacement therapy.'

 

Yet it is still a fabrication and thus contrary to the Way, which involves non-fabrication.

 

It's not ideal.

[Stosh]

_{Not entertaining the difference between ones life or death , well then theres no perspective on which to base "early" or late.}

_{Yet fearing death , one would always have a perspective of ----' Whoa ! Not so fast there Reaper!' the number of years not withstanding.}

[Songtsan]

I don't fear pain so much as I fear loss of self, by which I mean all the assumed ego gains I could have made were I to stay alive and achieve them.

 

Phillip Kapleau, author of the Three Pillars of Zen, once said: "If you don't die, before you die, when you die, you still won't die."

 

The meaning is pretty obvious, but I like to remind myself that I have eternity, and that I am simply in grasping mode - I want my cake, and I want it now!

 

One who relaxes, gains realizations faster.

 

The tendency to clench and fear, actually overrides the positive functions of the heart region - it is an energy stopper.

 

Fear is born of attachment. Attachment is born of ignorance. Only the ignorant have fear then. Time will erase all doubts, fears, and ignorances.

 

The I-maker, wanting this or that, fears lost opportunities or dissolution of the perceived 'owned' objects, such as the body vehicle, through which attainments are possible.

 

Drop the bodymind as an object that is owned, and one should have no fear, I imagine.

 

Then one is merely the seer - watching reality unfold endlessly.

 

The way to fearlessness is basically the way to all good things - nondoing with open dharma eye.

 

I keep thinking up practices (methods) and then almost immediately realize that I don't have to practice anything...just do nothing, know nothing.

 

Sometimes I wonder why I even try!

 

I think I am just fascinated with the mind self and its games.

 

Its no better or worse than being fascinated by any other object out there - gold, jewels, powers. Even power is an object.

 

However, from a pragmatic perspective, I do intend to limit the effect of fear on 'my' bodymind by doing various practices, not only because it makes sense, but because it sounds fun.

 

So I will bury myself in a dirt coffin, go skydiving, etc etc.

 

Buying a tarantula soon...maybe a giant centipede as well - stay around scary things often enough and they are no longer scary...

[Stosh]

I don't fear pain so much as I fear loss of self, by which I mean all the assumed ego gains I could have made were I to stay alive and achieve them.

 

Phillip Kapleau, author of the Three Pillars of Zen, once said: "If you don't die, before you die, when you die, you still won't die."

 

The meaning is pretty obvious, but I like to remind myself that I have eternity, and that I am simply in grasping mode - I want my cake, and I want it now!

 

One who relaxes, gains realizations faster.

 

The tendency to clench and fear, actually overrides the positive functions of the heart region - it is an energy stopper.

 

Fear is born of attachment. Attachment is born of ignorance. Only the ignorant have fear then. Time will erase all doubts, fears, and ignorances.

 

The I-maker, wanting this or that, fears lost opportunities or dissolution of the perceived 'owned' objects, such as the body vehicle, through which attainments are possible.

 

Drop the bodymind as an object that is owned, and one should have no fear, I imagine.

 

Then one is merely the seer - watching reality unfold endlessly.

 

The way to fearlessness is basically the way to all good things - nondoing with open dharma eye.

 

I keep thinking up practices (methods) and then almost immediately realize that I don't have to practice anything...just do nothing, know nothing.

 

Sometimes I wonder why I even try!

 

I think I am just fascinated with the mind self and its games.

 

Its no better or worse than being fascinated by any other object out there - gold, jewels, powers. Even power is an object.

 

However, from a pragmatic perspective, I do intend to limit the effect of fear on 'my' bodymind by doing various practices, not only because it makes sense, but because it sounds fun.

 

So I will bury myself in a dirt coffin, go skydiving, etc etc.

 

Buying a tarantula soon...maybe a giant centipede as well - stay around scary things often enough and they are no longer scary...

I can actually agree with a lot of that Ss, Id say for my own opinion,

that is not that you cant or shouldnt do or know anything ,

quite the reverse,

its that you could or may know and do stuff ,

this is the life youve got to do and know such as you are now.

The I that you consider you

IMO is just not ever going to be the same when you ( or I ) go on.

The slings arrows and errors of this go -round

shall be as gone as gone can be,

and that strikes me as a lovely thought,,

Ill get to make a whole fresh new set of mistakes ,

get hit with an entirely new set of circumstances and entirely fresh clean slate

Which to me certainly beats the idea of reincarnation of the same me over and over again ! HANDS DOWN.

[KenBrace]

In this aspect of life I think that fear is a healthy thing. For the same reason that you should he afraid of deep water as a baby, you should also be afraid of death. That is... unless you've developed yourself and learned to swim.

[Songtsan]

Its ok to feel and acknowledge the fear, but to let it affect one adversely other than that direct seeing seems inefficient.

[Nungali]

In this aspect of life I think that fear is a healthy thing. For the same reason that you should he afraid of deep water as a baby, you should also be afraid of death. That is... unless you've developed yourself and learned to swim.

 

No, fear is not a healthy thing ..... caution, care and being prepared for a situation are healthy ... a baby should not be be afraid of deep water, it is better ... as you say , one can learn to swim ... I have seen babies thrown into the water, come up and paddle to the edge ... they love it !

 

One should be equally cautious of untimely death and protect one's 'vehicle', but one should not fear the inevitable, but rather, here too, prepare oneself and practice for it.

 

There are 3 great 'natural' mysteries'; birth, life and death (all to be met without fear) - which we all assured of experiencing - it would be be amiss to neglect any of them.

[Infinity]

5) Surrender to Death at all times in your heart region. This is what all true masters do.

 

'The mind has all the questions the heart has all the answers' - someone

 

On another note but the same piece of music came across this last night and thought she was spot at the first half but meanders a little later.

 

Its a tricky subject when you are with some one who is dying but she is brutally honest and that to my mind is liberating.

 

 

What she does not talk of is the death of the physical body which presumably is where her consciousness is currently located, She is seeing out of those eyes, talking with that mouth. Will her awareness be conscious after the body dies? It seems to me from my limited reading that the Taoist and the Buddhists all have different ideas about this? 'I' have experience what 'I' understand to be non dual awareness but only from the perception through my 'eye' viewpoint. Off course this only matters to me who is an idea or concept I guess! :-)

 

Browsed some of her other video as well, interesting...

 

∞

Edited August 16, 2014 by Infinity