Low energy after Osho meditation and energy work

[NazunaFlower]

I've been doing some energy work for almost two months following the advice of Robert Bruce (aproximately 1 hour a day of spinal bouncing, chackra stimulation, etc) and I've started the Osho kundalini meditation a week ago. I feel more centered and relaxed, a lot more stressed than before but I've also noticed that I feel I have low energy: I sleep more and feel a little less energy and enthusiasm in my daily matters. Robert Bruce advises in his books that low energy could happen as a result of increased energy usage but this effect is supposed to be only temporary and cease after a couple of weeks - in my case nearly two months have passed...

Anyone had similar experiences or can offer some advice?

[Songtsan]

Energy work engaged in to produce effects is just that. It's like burning wood. What's the point of your practice? If you are just creating body effects, without actually having a goal, you will invigorate the bodies energy, make some sparkles and get some heat. Energy, once produced, should be put to work, otherwise it will just be spent.

 

Take this with a grain of salt.

[Aetherous]

Different practices have differing effects. If you do zhan zhuang, or else some sort of lower dantian method, you'll likely experience increased energy...best to do them in the morning, so that you won't be wide awake when bedtime comes around.

[Songtsan]

Kundalini practices can easily result in anhedonia, apathy, and so forth. Spiritual work, while beneficial, also taxes resources just like any other work. Make sure to live a balanced life, eat right, exercise and all that jazz...awakening kundalini uses resources. When it 'wakes up,' becomes sentient per se, it will prove fruit. Until then, it is an investment of your energy.

[soaring crane]

The Osho exercise is shaking/dancing/stillness/lying or so, isn't it?

 

It's heavy medicine that goes into the deepest recesses of your body and your subconscious mind, and I think it's important to know how actively you do the shaking/dancing.

 

Without seeing you do it, I don't think it's really possible to accurately say what to do differently or where your problems could be coming from. But, that said, I suggest not 'shaking' per se but rather gentle, rhythmic bouncing, predominantly from the ankles. And in the dancing phase just see it as an extension to the bouncing i.e. bring a little arm and torso motion into it, free it up, but don't go crazy.

 

Truth be told though, I'd like you to try Zhan Zhuang for a while and see how you feel. You can use the bouncing as a warm-up.

[cheya]

Hi NazunaFlower,

Done a fair amount of Osho's Kundalini meditation myself, although not recently.

Are you using Osho's music CD for it?

At the ashram, it was a late afternoon practice, not morning, not night.

Wake you right up from a desk job!

 

Bruce's spinal bouncing is an internal practice, right?

His NEW energy technique really woke me up to internal energy work.

I don't use his stuff specifically now, but all internal point work started there for me.

[NazunaFlower]

Thanks for your replies!

Yes, soaring crane, the Osho kundalini meditation is shaking/dancing/stillness/lying; I do it perhaps a little more 'shaking' than it's meant to be but I feel like 'I should follow the music' which is quite frenetic... also during the dancing part I move a lot, but it feel liberating: do you think it's better to be a little more restrained?

cheya, I use the Osho's music cd but I do it in the morning because it's really difficult for me to find a suitable time during other periods of the day..

All in all I feel like my energy low is caused by the energy work following Bruce's practices because it was a problem I began to feel something like a month ago and I began doing Osho kundalini meditation only two weeks ago... but I think that practice also had some positive results because, when I began Osho meditation, I could feel, already from the first session, my prana rising through the chackras from the belly to the top of the head

[joeblast]

sometimes the basement storage needs a re-stock as well as the cupboard

[RiverSnake]

Make sure your not rubbing your noodle out every night....IME....it can really deplete you energetically and leave you feeling exhausted. Best of luck.

 

My 2 cents, Peace

Edited September 1, 2014 by OldChi

[Songtsan]

Try taking some adaptogens, as well as some 5-HTP, L-DOPA, L-Tyrosine, B-vitamins, and other nutritional support. Those who play hard should be prepared.

[soaring crane]

also during the dancing part I move a lot, but it feel liberating: do you think it's better to be a little more restrained?

 

for now, yes, I think that would be a good idea (but that's just my feeling). In your situation, I would try to be more gentle and allow the level of intensity to increase gradually over a period of many months. It sounds to me like you're experiencing what we call in the barefoot running world "TMTS" which means "Too Much Too Soon". And the only countermeasure that really works is lowering the mileage i.e. intensity of the practice.

 

I should mention that I am generally against this appproach to meditation because of the high risk of a) false positives and b ) real negatives. So, I'm biased to begin with.

 

And I would really be interested to see how you react to a totally different approach, something like Zhan Zhuang.

 

edit: just learned that you can't write b and ) next to each other -- it makes the sunglass smiley! :-)

[Sebastian]

Second Soaring Crane's opinion of incorporating a standing practice like Zhan Zhuang.

 

Generally speaking, anything standing related, with bent knees, for about 30 minutes a day will do a lot to build kidney energy, your energetic base so to speak.

 

If you continuously waggle your arms, exhaust yourself through random movements without any grounding, you'll expend energy instead of building it.

 

I'm not saying these practices are bad, just that you need to charge yourself up well if you're going all out in them. You need energy to expend before you expend it.

 

Additionally, combining multiple energy systems can take a toll on the body. Not sure how many you are doing, but this can also be a factor.

 

Just my two cents, but I thought this might help a bit

[Songtsan]

You came here seeking teaching I assume? Be careful what you wish for...there are many zealots here who practice stuff that makes them fantasize themselves magicians (like me? you don't know who I am), and they would tell you things that would certainly work to create great shifts in your life, but you could end up going into interesting places.

 

First of all:

 

Calm down, center yourself

 

Identify your over-arching goal

 

Break it down into sub-objectives..

 

Proceed slowly, carefully, increment changes a little bit here, a little bit there..

 

If you rush in too fast, you will end up in a crazy carnival ride of an experience, and even send yourself into a Dark Night of the Soul...

 

Build your discipline from the ground up...you wouldn't want to have shaky legs as you attempt to climb Mount Everest.

 

Body First...attain a solid base.

 

Fix all imbalances firstly!

 

Don't attempt to awaken Kundalini through perseverance without having established a solid center.

 

Make sure that your physical, mental, emotional, causal bodies are in balance.

 

Start with the architecture:

 

In shape?

 

Muscles balanced?

 

Any physical issues getting in your way?

 

This is the area to start with...

 

Next:

 

Clear meridian channels first...if you awaken kundalini without having cleared them, you will have a hell-ride as she clears them for you. If this happens you will have to learn to enjoy suffering (not so hard).

 

Are you disciplined?

 

Have you practiced Asana, Pranayama yet? How are your Savasana skills? If you can't relax your being entirely, then don't awaken the kundalini until you have learned to completely limit all efferent signals to the nervous system. If you awaken her and you get in her way, you will experience some backlash...

 

P.S. The reason I am posting so 'interestingly' is because I suffer from what is known as Qigong Illness to some...I post here as a warning to you, to be careful, because you could end up like me - a little twerked! Kundalini does interesting things to her masses of forms, yes she does! There are many outliers like me, we are cast adrift in her net (but she will always take care of us - so don't worry!)

Edited September 1, 2014 by Songtsan

[soaring crane]

Generally speaking, anything standing related, with bent knees, for about 30 minutes a day will do a lot to build kidney energy, your energetic base so to speak.

 

I didn't want to be overly specific but yes, that's exactly what I was thinking :-)

 

There really are a lot of useful linguistic correlations to running, it seems. In that world, we talk all the time about 'base building' (and" too much too soon") and that's something that I feel is missing in many of the cultivation dialogues I see and hear.

[GrandmasterP]

I've been doing some energy work for almost two months following the advice of Robert Bruce (aproximately 1 hour a day of spinal bouncing, chackra stimulation, etc) and I've started the Osho kundalini meditation a week ago. I feel more centered and relaxed, a lot more stressed than before but I've also noticed that I feel I have low energy: I sleep more and feel a little less energy and enthusiasm in my daily matters. Robert Bruce advises in his books that low energy could happen as a result of increased energy usage but this effect is supposed to be only temporary and cease after a couple of weeks - in my case nearly two months have passed...

Anyone had similar experiences or can offer some advice?

Some of the Osho cultivations do seem to be quite draining.

Bio-Danza in particular.

I've been to Tantra week at Osho-Leela ( working, not as a participant) and by the end of each day's sessions many of the attendees are totally washed out.

Not saying it's bad cultivation but if you leave off the Osho bits and stick with the rest then check out your energy levels after a while, you'll be able to tell if it was the Osho work that was causing your fatigue.

If you are knackered after cultivation then eventually you'll have to stop anyhoo so aim for a balance and be kind to yourself.

All success to you.

 

Edited September 1, 2014 by GrandmasterP

[NazunaFlower]

for now, yes, I think that would be a good idea (but that's just my feeling). In your situation, I would try to be more gentle and allow the level of intensity to increase gradually over a period of many months. It sounds to me like you're experiencing what we call in the barefoot running world "TMTS" which means "Too Much Too Soon". And the only countermeasure that really works is lowering the mileage i.e. intensity of the practice.

 

I should mention that I am generally against this appproach to meditation because of the high risk of a) false positives and b ) real negatives. So, I'm biased to begin with.

 

And I would really be interested to see how you react to a totally different approach, something like Zhan Zhuang.

 

edit: just learned that you can't write b and ) next to each other -- it makes the sunglass smiley! :-)

I'll try to slow down a bit the vibrations and dancing... Zhan Zhuang seems interesting but I don't want to mix too many things at the same time: Osho, energy work - also on the phisical part I go rock climbing, which I think is good for staying somewhat 'down to earth' since I have constant touch with the earth.

however, as I said in my previous post, I think this low energy could derive probably from Bruce energy work, since I felt a little drained before beginning Osho kundalini. Bruce says that energy levels should reequilibrate after two weeks or so but this doesn't seem to happen...

When you wrote of false positives were you referring to Osho kundalini? or active meditations in general?

[NazunaFlower]

Are you disciplined?

 

Have you practiced Asana, Pranayama yet? How are your Savasana skills? If you can't relax your being entirely, then don't awaken the kundalini until you have learned to completely limit all efferent signals to the nervous system. If you awaken her and you get in her way, you will experience some backlash...

I was attracted to Osho work because the practices he suggests don't force the body and mind to stay still but instead they make them want to stand still after intense activity. So I haven't practiced asana and pranayama because I felt these practices belong to another approach to meditation and I din't want to mix up different things... I also thought that Bruce energy work could be complementary to Osho kundaini since the spinal bounce and chakra stimulation could be useful to clean the meridians and facilitate prana flowing: what do you think about it?

[Jetsun]

The Osho dynamic meditation is part catharsis like Primal Therapy so it is meant to be draining. It is debatable how useful such methods are though, I tried them for a while but don't do them any more.

[Songtsan]

I was attracted to Osho work because the practices he suggests don't force the body and mind to stay still but instead they make them want to stand still after intense activity. So I haven't practiced asana and pranayama because I felt these practices belong to another approach to meditation and I din't want to mix up different things... I also thought that Bruce energy work could be complementary to Osho kundaini since the spinal bounce and chakra stimulation could be useful to clean the meridians and facilitate prana flowing: what do you think about it?

 

It is simply that training the base layers produces a sustainable fount for spiritual practice work. I generally go by Iyengar methods, who bases his system of what is essentially Raja + Hatha Yoga..

 

"He who has conquered his mind is a Raja Yogi. . . . .It is generally believed that Raja Yoga and Hatha Yoga are entirely distinct, different and opposed to each other, that the Yoga Sutras of Patanjali deal with Spiritual discipline and that the Hatha Yoga Pradipika of Swatmaramadeals solely with physical discipline. It is not so, for Hathy Yoga and Raja Yoga complement each other and form a single approach towards Liberation.

As a mountaineer needs ladders, ropes and crampons as well as physical fitness and discipline to climb the icy peaks of the Himalayas, so does the Yoga aspirant need the knowledge and discipline of the Hatha Yoga of Swatmarama to reach the heights of Raja Yoga dealt with by Patanjali." ~B.K.S. Iyengar -Light on Yoga, p. 23.

 

The more easily demonstrated and perceivable disciplines of the physical lead to a better ability to see and generate the higher level disciplines that rely on subtle awareness. They also build and maintain said power base.

 

Think of a pyramid - the physical as the base, followed by emotional, mental, spiritual...lack of discipline in one area will reflect in all levels.

 

Can you maintain calm within one storm, you should be able to maintain calm within another. The different areas are not so separate, but weaknesses in one area will detract from others....those who cannot control their mind, often cannot control their body, and vice versa.

 

With Kundalini, of course, it is not necesarily an issue of control, as Ma Shakti provides structure through spontaneity, yet 'God helps those who help themselves.' The meeting of control + surrender is the mergence of the Shiv-Shakti aspects.

[soaring crane]

 

When you wrote of false positives were you referring to Osho kundalini? or active meditations in general?

 

When I wrote that, I had cathartic, shamanistic, high-energy practices in mind, but not Osho specifically. There are a lot of ways to decipher it but my most basic take on it is that you open the stop-gaps to your subconscious mind (physically and mentally) and allow a flood of deeply-seated information into the light of awareness. That's the goal, and it sounds good, and it can feel good for a while. But there can be a lot damaging information in that flood, stuff that belongs behind the dyke, so to speak.

 

The same can happen when taking any practice to an extreme, of course.

[Songtsan]

Would you consider stopping the Osho meditation for a couple of weeks and see how you feel? Don't read him nor think of him either ,during that time. Basically, clear out your thoughts to him. See what changes might appear.

 

Simple walking might be nice to let any energy flow as it will.

 

 

 

Best to you.

Osho certainly isn't the purest of souls, I agree...his methods are based on trying to create 'spiritual fireworks' in people through a variety of questionable methods that lack a real solid, well studied base. The 'lineage,' so-to-speak, is a slap dash, ego filled crazy train. I don't say this to scare you off, just to alert you to the fact that the methodology you follow is led by one who has not fully removed the veils of ignorance...any system whose teacher is held by fetters of lust and greed should be carefully observed. I would never throw the baby out with the bathwater, however...be selective.

[Songtsan]

Songtsan,

 

The only way to test it out IS to throw the baby out with the bathwater.

 

Besides, I only suggested two weeks. After those two weeks are up, he could then invite the Osho baby back in. (But I wouldn't recommend it.)

I agree with that. I was conjecturing in terms of permanence, I.e. not permanently rejecting, which I always associated with the 'throwing out' process- as in, the garbage man takes the baby away forever..but also what I was infering was that some of the practices, when separated from the dross of the Osho archetype, could be useful on their own, when approached skillfully. However, I agree completely with your premise.

 

I also recommend the OP track daily variables such as nutrition, sleep quality, levels of: anxiety, anhedonia, lethargy, irritability, and so forth...keep a short-term spreadsheet and correlate it with: amount of exercise, meditative practices, workload, etc.

 

This is an empirical technique which is about observing trends and trying to identify correlations.

 

If one keeps track of things, usually rating them on a scale, such as 1-10...

 

If Nazuna be interested, I can expand my explanation, no prob...

Edited September 4, 2014 by Songtsan

[C T]

I agree with that. I was conjecturing in terms of permanence, I.e. not permanently rejecting, which I always associated with the 'throwing out' process- as in, the garbage man takes the baby away forever..but also what I was infering was that some of the practices, when separated from the dross of the Osho archetype, could be useful on their own, when approached skillfully. However, I agree completely with your premise.

 

I also recommend the OP track daily variables such as nutrition, sleep quality, levels of: anxiety, anhedonia, lethargy, irritability, and so forth...keep a short-term spreadsheet and correlate it with: amount of exercise, meditative practices, workload, etc.

 

This is an empirical technique which is about observing trends and trying to identify correlations.

 

If one keeps track of things, usually rating them on a scale, such as 1-10...

 

If Nazuna be interested, I can expand my explanation, no prob...

Its my opinion that most of the time, being simply aware that one is not aware is good practice. To take things to a very technical level, in this regard (of spiritual cultivation), there could arise a possibility of losing natural awareness in favour of contrived awareness, if you know what i mean. Natural awareness is ultimately a more preferred 'state' of freedom, and often, cannot be accessed while one is too focussed on 'trends'. Perhaps developing a good balance between focus and nonconceptual resting of the mind in simple awareness, alternating the practice of each, might help to create a better spiritual environment for progress to be smooth.

[Songtsan]

Its my opinion that most of the time, being simply aware that one is not aware is good practice. To take things to a very technical level, in this regard (of spiritual cultivation), there could arise a possibility of losing natural awareness in favour of contrived awareness, if you know what i mean. Natural awareness is ultimately a more preferred 'state' of freedom, and often, cannot be accessed while one is too focussed on 'trends'. Perhaps developing a good balance between focus and nonconceptual resting of the mind in simple awareness, alternating the practice of each, might help to create a better spiritual environment for progress to be smooth.

 

I agree, yet think that to stack empirical science on top of this attitude is good for beginners...I don't track trends anymore in this way, but it was useful for me a few years ago....more as a mind exercise - it proves points mainly, if doubt is an issue..

Edited September 4, 2014 by Songtsan