Help out a skeptical beginner..

[Harmonious Emptiness]

I suggest starting with this warm up:

 

 

"shake the tree" helps to unblock stagnation and the flow of qi.

"swing arms, twist waist" helps to get the chi moving, and also loosen up the waist which is an important junction of chi flow.

"holding the chi" will then be more effective and should get you started in sensing a bit of warmth, or at least a nice pleasant sensation, in your dantien.

 

Be sure that your mind is clear and patient before beginning. You may want to sit down with some green tea before hand to ensure that you can deal with "doing nothing" for a while. Don't look for results. Just enjoy the journey.

 

I'd suggest doing the entire Five Treasures form, as it's very well designed in it's simple efficacy. It's a bit like a short form of Hunyuan qigong, and Five Animals qigong combined, or at least appears to be borrowing from these styles but patterned for a particular direction.

 

I find Chia's stuff to be a bit more of the "finishing" details. It's easier to detail the statue after the basics are taken care of, so, best to start simple.

 

good luck

[Bearded Dragon]

Don't try and feel chi flowing through the meridians. I somehow fluked that one time but it has never happened again in that manner. Go for more general feelings that are brought upon by the most simple thought constructs.

 

After about 4 years I can fill up my arms pretty well. It's like a expansive feeling with a bit of a buzz. Very little happens in the arms though. This is why it's important to have a teacher. Stuff like relaxing the hips to have more chi flow into your arms is not obvious. The reason I mention the arms is because it's easiest to feel there.

[Spotless]

Find a teacher.

 

Even with a teacher standing right in front of you, you will not mimic the movements correctly because you do not know the many little details of your posture that are holding you back. A teacher will easily see these things and guide you when the time is right.

 

In sitting meditation a teacher will help direct the pace, he/she will help you to stay awake and move through denser states.

Breathing will be introduced properly.

 

For the basics a relatively basic instructor will work out very well, obviously a very high quality teacher is something to seek.

Often the larger groups have a very good teacher master at the head and offer many options, avoid "sport yoga" and other fitness oriented parodies of real practice.

 

Try out several groups/teachers and find what fits you initially.

 

The west now has many very good teachers - and many exceptional students - we live in an age that is extraordinary.

Do not pass over your interest in this endeavor - the self has brought you to this and it will continue to do so always until you hear it.

Edited October 2, 2014 by Spotless

[dc9]

having a lot of trouble meditating more than 20min... jesus. this is fucking hard how am i supposed to reach 5+ hours.

 

How do I find a teacher? How do I find qigong classes or yoga classes that will help me with this and aren't just for fitness/stretching/flexibility?

[Spotless]

You may wish to tell us where you are on this planet so we might help you find something - and don't worry about 5 hour goals - that is putting the cart way before the horse - and there is no reason to beat the horse with all this angst.

 

You have a computer - most teachers are in a search for an area - like "meditation in the Chicago area"

 

Things can be super difficult or super easy - no points for either - one is just much more direct and does not blast energy out the window.

Edited October 3, 2014 by Spotless

[Horus]

having a lot of trouble meditating more than 20min... jesus. this is fucking hard how am i supposed to reach 5+ hours.

 

How do I find a teacher? How do I find qigong classes or yoga classes that will help me with this and aren't just for fitness/stretching/flexibility?

Relax man.

 

When you learned to get around as a baby, how did that go?

 

You rolled around and cried a few times coz your arms and legs were f'n crazy like?

Then you fell on your face countlessly, slobbering and licking the floor, hell, probably eating some of the dirt.

Then you learned to roll over.

Then you cried more coz you couldn't get back up.

 

A teacher is just going to tell little john that he just needs to put his feet down and see he's really in shallow water - it takes time to know it.

 

It takes time to acclimatise and build habit energy that carries an inertia with it - momentum.

 

Some need a teacher, some don't some need one for a while, some a whole life - make this your path, what do you want to create with it?

[dc9]

I'm in the bay area. I did google and saw there are some classes near me.

 

I have been to one class that used a method that claimed to be able to unlock your kundalini very quickly.

 

http://www.sahajameditation.com/ have you guys heard of this? Anyway, we did a visual/energy feeling meditation, and then near the end the teachers and helpers hovered their hands over our body, claiming to unblock our chakra and help our energy flow. I didn't feel anything the whole time even though they claimed that my chakra was blocked at some location in my body and they helped unblock it or something. I didn't really have an urge to go back because it made me too skeptical and made me feel delusional since I didn't feel anything.

 

But I will keep trying...

 

I do have a fear/doubt that I will keep doing this, and I won't receive the result that I desire. No altered states of mind, no dramatically improved concentration/willpower, no supernatural experiences, no feeling of energy, no kundalini activation. I hope that doesn't happen.

[Horus]

I do have a fear/doubt that I will keep doing this, and I won't receive the result that I desire. No altered states of mind, no dramatically improved concentration/willpower, no supernatural experiences, no feeling of energy, no kundalini activation.

 

I have compassion for you

 

You need to make friends with doubt and fear through Faith.

 

Now, religion has given Faith a bad name (for many).

 

Faith is not about religion, God, Allah, Buddha, whatever religion - it's not.

 

Faith is it's own energy, it's own dimension if you will.

 

IMO (though many will/might disagree) - Faith is an energy, a Virtue, a virtue of the Pericardium - the protector of the Heart.

 

I had to go through years of what you've stated above - and you've hit the nail into the very first door to liberation.

 

I won't receive the result that I desire.

 

The first stage of liberation is about calming the mild. You can't really calm the mind directly - you can't really touch it to do that right? You need a handle of some kind to manipulate it into calm. Make patience, consistency, and dogeared determination that handle, and add stillness with gentle focus at the tip of your nose.

 

If you just keep doing that, in time the mind will settle and as the mind settles the body will settle, and as the body settles the mind will settle.

 

Grab an empty bottle of coke, fill it with soil and water - then shake it.

 

Now try and see through the bottle...can you see through it? Nope.

 

That's the position you are in now. Your coke bottle and soil body and mind are clouded my movement - movement of thought, nerve impulses from physical movement, tensions creating more movement...the list goes on.

 

Now take that coke bottle and make it meditate.

 

Sit it in a suitable position - it's got you beat for technique I promise that. It has a nice upright posture, and it has no mind to destroy the stillness you are trying to create by sitting it down to "meditate".

 

But watch the master coke bottle do its thing. It will beat you past 10, 20, 30 mins no problem. Then as time goes bye, as all the movement has been reduced to nothing - it can't respond to the noise of the movement and move itself - so all the soil slowly calms, all the water momentum comes to a slow - the mud sinks, all the smaller particles settle - and in time the mud sinks to the bottom - the water above the mud begins to clear. Leave it longer and it will be very clear.

 

Look at the coke bottle then - you see straight through it - clarity, liberation of perspective.

 

Let your mind model that stillness that a coke bottle has no choice over, no free will.

 

But you can't model it directly with the mind - that will create more movement.

 

You need a handle - discipline.

 

Take that mastery the coke bottle has, then add free will, then add discipline...then just keep going.

 

100% commitment with 0% attachment - a simple coke bottle can do it - can you?

 

A coke bottle has zero desire - what does that tell you to do with your desire?

A coke bottle has zero fear - what does that tell you to do with your fear?

A coke bottle has zero doubt - what does that tell you to do with your doubt?

A coke bottle has zero hope - what does that tell you to do with your hope?

 

[Ya Mu]

I've decided to return mantak chia's book.. because it really doesn't make sense that he's telling me to feel and move chi through my body when, according to you guys(which i believe), i'm at least years away from being able to do that...

 

I guess I will simply do stillness for a very long period of time everyday, or at least make that a goal. Then i'll see how I'm feeling after doing that for a while..

 

thanks guys

 

 

I'm in the bay area. I did google and saw there are some classes near me.

 

I have been to one class that used a method that claimed to be able to unlock your kundalini very quickly.

 

http://www.sahajameditation.com/ have you guys heard of this? Anyway, we did a visual/energy feeling meditation, and then near the end the teachers and helpers hovered their hands over our body, claiming to unblock our chakra and help our energy flow. I didn't feel anything the whole time even though they claimed that my chakra was blocked at some location in my body and they helped unblock it or something. I didn't really have an urge to go back because it made me too skeptical and made me feel delusional since I didn't feel anything.

 

But I will keep trying...

 

I do have a fear/doubt that I will keep doing this, and I won't receive the result that I desire. No altered states of mind, no dramatically improved concentration/willpower, no supernatural experiences, no feeling of energy, no kundalini activation. I hope that doesn't happen.

Ah...I personally think you did a good thing by not trying the energetics exercises you quoted in your first post. My experience is that the better approach is qigong movements; they are easy and productive.

 

The truth is that there are a small percentage of people who simply can't feel qi initially but can with proper training. And an even smaller percentage who say they can't feel at all. But the good news is this is an extremely small portion of the population and I bet you can feel qi inside 30 days. And not only feel qi but feel alive with an expanded awareness.

 

Here is my offer if you want: You PM me your address and I will send you Gift of the Tao I DVD. You practice 20 minutes a day minimum, every day. If at the end of 30 days you don't feel qi and don't have an expanded awareness of energetics then just give the DVD to someone else and pay me nothing. If you do then feel free to pay me and keep practicing!

[Songtsan]

Your burning zeal to experience these paths will take you far; don't let skepticism and disbelief derail you. Yes, an advanced teacher will be good. Isn't B.K. Frantzis near the Bay area? Continually practice and improve your relaxation technique for starters - learn to shift into a theta brainwave state at will...maybe study autogenic inhibition techniques for starts...it won't hurt to go in lightly and look around the energy body including the MCO circuit IMO, just don't do intense focus - -start traveling around the property as if you are a tourist, develop your feeling ability, don't depend on visualizations too highly - look for direct perceptions of what is actually there first, then you can look at shaping the energy later...I think if your intent is to simply observe, there is no harm in traveling the path of MCO, as long as you keep a light attitude.

 

The intent you hold during meditation is important...if you have this obsessed urge, backed by subconscious desires to attain siddhis and build Rome in one day, note that and back off...This is a project of years...Cultivate an equanimous, confident yet relaxed attitude of an Immortal and you will one day be that.

 

Meditation need not be difficult - it should be fun and exploratory...like you are taking a walk around your property and getting out of your room, where you spend too much time staring at the TV or computer....

 

In the body, the equivalent would be getting out of the eyes and ears...

[Trunk]

 

http://www.amazon.com/Healing-Light-Tao-Foundational-Practices-ebook/dp/B004J4WM6S/ref=sr_1_3?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1411977312&sr=1-3&keywords=mantak+chia

 

I recently purchased this book, and reading through it fills me with 1) desire for the benefits of the practices in the book and 2) a lot of skeptcism.

 

Healing Tao cautions.

[dc9]

I am going to follow aypsite.org's instructions. I read the first dozen articles and it resonates with me a lot. I know there's certain members on this board who are very against that site, but everything that i've read so far makes a ton of sense and doesn't contradict with anything else i've read in the past.

 

wish me luck and thanks to everyone. I hope I feel something soon. I don't even care if it's a bad feeling, as long as it's something. Feeling negative effects would honestly drive me even harder. The only thing that will drive me away is if I don't feel anything and I dismiss all of this as a fantasy or the wishful thinking of a guy who watched too many movies and wishes he has superpowers.

Edited October 3, 2014 by dc9

[PLB]

The only thing that will drive me away is if I don't feel anything and I dismiss all of this as a fantasy or the wishful thinking of a guy who watched too many movies and wishes he has superpowers.

Superpowers would be great. Flying through space and throwing out balls of energy would make life really interesting. The work you are considering taking on may lead to that. I don't know.

I do know that there are all kinds of good experiences available to you even if you don't acheive the level of power you imagine can be had through the practice.

So it is possible that you have predetermined a set of boundary conditions that will interfere with beginning the work.

This is not unusual. I certainly started with a lot of ideas that I cannot even articulate any longer.

.

[Songtsan]

Curiosity will lead to fruition. Fixation on the end goals without having the spirit of interest in understanding the terrain will result in frustration. A calm, centered approach, like a person who is on a train ride excited to see the countryside, will get you faster results.

[Brian]

 

 

Ah...I personally think you did a good thing by not trying the energetics exercises you quoted in your first post. My experience is that the better approach is qigong movements; they are easy and productive.

 

The truth is that there are a small percentage of people who simply can't feel qi initially but can with proper training. And an even smaller percentage who say they can't feel at all. But the good news is this is an extremely small portion of the population and I bet you can feel qi inside 30 days. And not only feel qi but feel alive with an expanded awareness.

 

Here is my offer if you want: You PM me your address and I will send you Gift of the Tao I DVD. You practice 20 minutes a day minimum, every day. If at the end of 30 days you don't feel qi and don't have an expanded awareness of energetics then just give the DVD to someone else and pay me nothing. If you do then feel free to pay me and keep practicing!

dc9,

 

You have received a number of outstanding responses in this thread from some serious practitioners.

 

I would like to personally call your attention to THIS offer from Ya Mu.^^^

 

I will enhance that offer by offering to share with you, via PM, some of my own experiences with Ya Mu and with the jingdonggong (Stillness-Movement) system/lineage and/or answer questions, if you would like. Of course, Ya Mu (Michael Lomax) can do a FAR better job of both -- and is VERY approachable -- but I have learned some people feel more comfortable asking a junior student "stupid questions."