Effect of cold bath on the body

[Pietro]

In the gym, here at the Uni there is a 5-person jacuzzi. It is quite something. Now just next to it, on a small room 3 tanks of freezing water are kept. I mean, freezing with ice floating on it. Really cold!

 

The university has some serious athlets over here. People who actually go to the olimpics, were in japan just this summer, and so on. Well, what many of the athlets over here do is, after training they would get their legs (they are runners) in the ice water. Up to the beginning of the belly (ouch), stay there for a few minutes, then come for a few minutes in the warm jacuzzi (they make the water all cold, aargh!). Then go back to the cold water, and so on. They do it three times, and after the third cold bath they don't come back in the jacuzzi.

 

I am no chinese doctor, but this just does not sounds right. I mean what has their kidneys done to them to be punished in that way?

 

They say it is done for the muscle, as it helps dissipate the "acido lattico" that gets formed.

 

Anyone here knows what is the official position from chinese medicine on this practice?

 

Many thanks,

Pietro

[MASTERforge]

I understand that Boxers also use this technique so there must be something in it.

 

If anyone can explain it properly I may incorporate it into my training.

[Yoda]

The exiled Ron Jeremy praised the practice of cold water immersion up to the navel (but not above that) for the stimulation of sperm power and hormone release.

 

It's a common practice amongst athletes.

 

Contrast showers are popular on dragondoor.com

 

That's all I know.

[Taomeow]

My mother-in-law has been a winter swimmer for many years (and still is, in her 70s). She would immerse completely in a hole in the ice in a frozen lake, just like that, no jacuzzi, no running, no athletics of any kind. The practice is well-known in Russia and there's a special name for people doing that, the Walruses. (When John Lennon sang "I am the Walrus" he obviously didn't know what he was talking about! )

 

Well, the Walrus is a fat, fat animal, you need to store fat to insulate your organs if you're going to splash about in icy cold water. Perhaps if you combine it with exercise, you will convert the would-be fat into muscles, who knows -- but my mother-in-law never exercised, so she's fat. No diet ever helped her lose any weight, not even complete fasting. Perhaps the body got the message to hold on to that fat real tight as the result of the practice. She is very shut down and numb emotionally, so I guess it's her way to feel something -- it has to be this intense to get through her thick skin and all that fat. I believe very involved athletes, bodybuilders, etc., are more often than not people of the same predicament, in need of intense stimuli so as to feel something because subtle ones are not getting through.

 

Healthwise, this practice pretty much eliminates one's ability to catch a cold and in general primes one's immune system against External Pernicious Influences to the max. It doesn't do anything for chronic, degenerative, deep-seated Yin disorders. The Kidneys hate cold.

 

Chinese medicine in general frowns on many Western athletic and "healthy" practices, not just this one, specifically because most of them deplete the Kidneys. Here's doctor Stephen Chang's example:

 

each Kidney has a pulse that normally corresponds to half that of the heart rate, i.e. if your heart rate is 64, your kidneys each do 32 beats per minute, taking turns, to a total of 64 to match the heart. When you do "aerobic exercise" or go jogging or some such, you raise your heart rate considerably but the Kidneys can't keep up, and the inner harmony and organ cooperation is busted. You effectively "exercise" your heart muscle at the expense of your Kidneys, which means your kidneys proper, your reproductive system, hypothalamus, pituitary, and all their hormonal and metabolic functions. In the Wuxing cycle, the Kidneys are the "grandmother" of the Heart, so it's like taking your grandmother jogging with you on a leash to force her to keep up. Neither one of you will ultimately benefit, even if you do grow big muscles as a result of running while dragging your grandmother on a leash!

 

An alternative scenario is drinking the "minimum of 8 glasses of water" Western practitioners are so fond of suggesting to everybody and his dog. Your Kidneys are supposed to know how much water they need; if you enforce a higher intake, you will make them work harder and pulse faster -- then the Heart can't keep up and the pulses are again mismatched. So you drink that water and think you're "detoxing," but in fact you are creating another unhealthy imbalance. It is never wise to ignore the overall relationships in the body no matter what you do. The beauty of "internal" arts like taijiquan (e.g.) is that you get all your organs and systems to work at a higher energy level without taking this energy from one organ to divert it to another. I can never stop marveling at the fact that after a practice I'm flushed crimson and drenched in sweat as though I've been running for an hour -- but my heart rate and respiration rate are the same as when I've started, as though I've been sitting in a comfortable chair knitting or something. That's the kind of sweat that really detoxifies! and I have never seen my teacher carry a water bottle around, or drink anything during the practice for that matter. Students rush to drink every time there's a break, he doesn't... so I don't either, monkey see monkey do.

Edited September 27, 2007 by Taomeow

[karen]

Hi Pietro,

 

As with any practice or medicinal substance, it's always about understanding the energetic mode of action, not only the end effects. You can look at all the hormones that are released from such a practice, and think, "What's wrong with that?" But the physical effect isn't the right place to look. Someone might feel invigorated by the hot/cold bathing, but it might be depleting them energetically.

 

So you'd want to know what are the individual's energetic patterns of imbalance, and does a particular practice or substance help to balance it or exacerbate the existing imbalance. For example, stimulating herbs or practices might be indicated for some people, at some times, but are often contraindicated for deficiency conditions, etc.

 

-Karen

[Bum Grasshopper]

My understanding of a "contrast bath" is that warm water will dilate capillaries and the cold will shrink them. This forms a milking action to speed circulation and force out nasties like lactic acid.

 

Doctors will frequently prescribe it for stubborn swelling in areas such as hands and feet.

[rain]

,,,,,,,,,,,,

Edited April 17, 2008 by rain

[karen]

Yes - but these are all material explanations - talking in terms of the end effects on capillaries and blood circulation. There's more to the picture.

 

Detox is often done with a very superficial idea of "getting rid of bad stuff," without being mindful of the very complex biochemical and biophysical processes that are being affected. You can't reduce that complexity down to a simple concept of stimulating the system to get rid of lactic acid - that may be one thing that is happening, but it's not a good idea to ignore all the rest.

 

Also what isn't commonly known is that warm water has a different effect from hot water - warm water has a warming effect, as you'd expect. But hot water is an extreme that actually does the opposite, because the body reacts with a counter-action. So you may actually get constriction and exacerbation of a cold condition. That's why dose and potency are so important, because the action of a substance or practice changes dramatically depending on those factors.

 

So with hot and cold water, the effects that a particular person gets would depend on the dose (the length of exposure and how extreme the temperature), and the energetic imbalances that the person has to begin with.

 

-Karen

[rain]

............

Edited April 17, 2008 by rain

[karen]

Hi rain,

 

I think I'll start a new thread to reply to your questions about homeopathy, coming soon...

 

-Karen

[mantis]

i take cold showers for two reasons. one, sperm production and two being that it makes you feel energized after.

[VeeCee]

i take cold showers for two reasons. one, sperm production and two being that it makes you feel energized after.

 

Okay - someone explain to me why you would be interested in sperm production if you're trying to be celebate? Do you mean decreased sperm production?

[mantis]

more sperm = more energy to be drawn up. the idea isn't to kill your libido imho as i'm still sexually active i just don't ejaculate.

[Bum Grasshopper]

I do the sauna thing ( 10 min 120F sauna, then a cold dip in the pool or a cold shower) whenever I get the opportunity. Makes me feel relaxed, refreshed, and very clean. Also seems to increase my tolerance to the heat and cold.

[Pietro]

Thanks to all for the answer. If I can summarise what I understood:

a) it is individual so you really need to check each person

yet

chinese medicine is often not ok with many western methods. When you train for a dash is different then training for a marathon. Chinese medicine is to get you to old age healthy. Western athletic medicine is to make you super fit now. The two might not work together.

c) it can increase sperm production

d) it is done in various countries around the world in various form

 

thank you to all.

 

Cheers,

Pietro

[Spectrum]

I do the sauna thing ( 10 min 120F sauna, then a cold dip in the pool or a cold shower) whenever I get the opportunity. Makes me feel relaxed, refreshed, and very clean. Also seems to increase my tolerance to the heat and cold.

 

Same here. No colds or flus when I do this at least once a month during winter.

[Fusion]

I do the sauna thing ( 10 min 120F sauna, then a cold dip in the pool or a cold shower) whenever I get the opportunity. Makes me feel relaxed, refreshed, and very clean. Also seems to increase my tolerance to the heat and cold.

 

 

Wonderfully balanced summary. This thread is very informative.