BaguaKicksAss Posted December 27, 2014 Just picking up from a PM conversation I'm having with Nungali. I studied the Pyramid Texts for a long time and reached some conclusions about this. The Duat is the inner space of dreams, after death and shamanic journeys etc. Usually translated as Underworld or Netherworld but the word actually means something like 'star realm'. Dua can mean star or door or 'giving praise'. And the 't' ending signifies a place or similar as well as being a feminine ending. So Dua-t. Early peoples found that there were natural geological sites that produced shifts in consciousness. Sacred sites. Could be caves, or rivers, or rocks, hills or even the landscape generally. After some time they began to 'enhance' these sites by deliberately placing stones, sometimes carved, sometimes natural at key points. For instance an recent BBC docu on Stonehenge showed that although the main henge is more less contemporary with the Great Pyramid (2500 BC) the wider site was used back into the mesolithic because of specific natural features. the same is true of the older Egyptian sites so there is no doubt that the Great Pyramid itself or at least the site its on goes back well towards to end of the last ice age maybe 10 or 12,000 BC. The site in Turkey/Armenia Gobekli Tepe demonstrates stone working skill existed form these early times. So the initial purpose of the pyramids was to focus and make use of naturally occurring energy features of the earth to enable certain practices. We don't have anything written down by the Egyptians till 2350BC the date of the Pyramid of Unas (Wenis) at the end of the 5th Dynasty. His was a small pyramid because Egypt was in decline having lost the economic power of the Old Kingdom through progressive poor harvests arising probably from climate change. After the 6th Dynasty it fell in the First Intermediate period of complete social collapse. But the Pyramid texts show us that the pyramid was used for a process which involved the constituent parts of a person, the body, the ka, the ba and the shade. This was a process if transformation, purification, revivification and reintegration to form an entity called the 'akh' which was seen as a luminous 'effective' spirit. 'Effective' because it was capable of action. The texts were placed on the various walls of the different chambers of the Pyramid and the whole structure forms a kind of 3D map of the Duat. By moving through the different chambers and performing magical acts the 'akh' was formed. Not just after death but in life also. Although Egypt subsequently fell into decline, the practices were preserved. Middle Kingdom tombs have copies of the pyramid Texts and some Coffins of the Middle Kingdom have maps of the Book of the Two Ways' which also map out the Duat. In the New Kingdom this idea was continued int he form the Amduat which charts the sun gods journey through the Duat. I finally found some free time to read this over again . Any recommended books for further info on this? When I was in Egypt, seeing some of the writings in person was pretty amazing! Also a bit eerie in a way for some reason. Compared with other temples, tombs, writings and etc. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BaguaKicksAss Posted December 27, 2014 I could (and will if you like) describe them but it would take a long post and its late here. They are described in the pyramid texts essentially ... although I am sure much has been lost in terms of exact procedures the basic ideas are there once you learn to read the text properly (not easy). Yes please . I like long posts... Which version/book of the pyramid texts do you recommend? I have seen some versions online, and wow, it is quite a bit to get through them all. How would one best go about reading the properly? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Apech Posted December 27, 2014 I finally found some free time to read this over again . Any recommended books for further info on this? When I was in Egypt, seeing some of the writings in person was pretty amazing! Also a bit eerie in a way for some reason. Compared with other temples, tombs, writings and etc. I would recommend looking round this site http://www.pyramidtextsonline.com/ or this book http://www.amazon.com/Shamanic-Wisdom-Pyramid-Texts-Tradition/dp/0892817550/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1419681169&sr=8-1&keywords=naydler+pyramid+texts the best translation is by James P. Allen and also R.O. Faulkner (but these are expensive and Egyptological i.e. not much in the way of interpretation). 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Apech Posted December 27, 2014 Yes please . I like long posts... Which version/book of the pyramid texts do you recommend? I have seen some versions online, and wow, it is quite a bit to get through them all. How would one best go about reading the properly? See above. I'll try to briefly go through the nine steps: 1. orientate yourself with respect to the body, gather the parts of body and integrate. OK so this has some detailed parts. first the body 'khat' is often referred to in the plural .. khaw ... which means something like 'body parts' or members or organs perhaps. Just as the person is seen as the interaction of a number of entities (ka, ba and so on) the body is a kind of community of different parts working together and under the protection of different deities. You create a kind of microcosmic mandala with your body. First is the correct orientation with respect to the outer world (the big cosmos). The standard orientation is standing facing south so your right hand is to the west and left to the east. In Egyptian the word for west and right hand are the same and so on. To make it more accurate you incline the body backwards ... by resting on a mound of sand ... so the top of your head is towards astronomical north. You can imagine this rather than actually doing it. If you position yourself like this and gaze ahead at the horizon you are looking down your nose (like standard meditation gaze) this is the lower way or gateway into the duat. If you gaze directly ahead you will be looking into the sky at the bright constellations of the south sky i.e along the plane of the ecliptic which is the upper or luminous attention point. When in the sarcophagus the posture is changed, still head in the north and feet in the south but turned on your side to face the east. This is why eyes were painted on the left side of coffins for gazing east towards the sun rise. Now you have to look internally to your body. Imagine it not as one thing but a community of parts or organs. the most important is the heart. This is the seat of your mind. Imagine it as a throne and you are the king/queen (same for men or women). The heart is connected to the rest of your body by channels. These channels are mentioned in Egyptian medical papyrii as being 22 in number and connecting the heart to the head and to the anus ... but basically all parts of the body. As ruler your body is your kingdom. You have to join it up and unite it. This is done by circulating energy. This has two phases ... upward, light, expansive, warm = Isis, and down, dark, cool, refreshing = Nephthys. In order to do this you have in addition to the heart four other organ centres which act as mini-pumps which direct the energy (called sechem) at different phases. these are the liver, the stomach, the lungs and the intestines. They are identified with deities called the Four Sons of Horus. This circulation has the following effects. Energising the body, flushing out toxins, joining the head and the body (specifically heart), coordinating the whole body. Joining the head to the body probably requires some explanation. The head is specifically related to zones of awareness e.g. the five senses. This is not really the physical head but what is called the 'head of mystery' or 'sacred head' ... so called because it was not really physical. the Egyptians would sometimes have a symbolic head to represent this ... e.g. Tutankhamun's gold mask .... is not a mask but a 'head'. What they were saying here is that you need to engage attention when you circulate energy. You have to be able to see the phases of its circulation. All living beings circulate energy but are unaware that they do ... in this process you have to join awareness to the energy. So that's really the first step .... to align yourself correctly to the outer cosmos and then circulate energy. Not particularly advanced or complicated but essential as the first step. 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BaguaKicksAss Posted December 27, 2014 I would recommend looking round this site http://www.pyramidtextsonline.com/ or this book http://www.amazon.com/Shamanic-Wisdom-Pyramid-Texts-Tradition/dp/0892817550/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1419681169&sr=8-1&keywords=naydler+pyramid+texts the best translation is by James P. Allen and also R.O. Faulkner (but these are expensive and Egyptological i.e. not much in the way of interpretation). I have acquired the Allen one, and the Wisdom of the Pyramid texts one I had bought awhile back, will put much higher on my to read list. For the Faulkner, those have been on my to buy list for ages! Do you know which volume/s this one is: http://www.amazon.com/Ancient-Egyptian-Pyramid-Texts/dp/1420929348/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1419706625&sr=8-1&keywords=faulkner+pyramid+texts I found a set of all 3 of his for $200, but... I just spent WAY too much over the holidays, so will have to wait a few months to get those.... Perhaps my local university library can help out; I have a scanner around here somewhere. Thank you for the reading suggestions . That pyramid texts site is much easier to make use of than the ones I had found years ago when I first looked! Love modern technology . Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nungali Posted December 28, 2014 Yes please . I like long posts... Which version/book of the pyramid texts do you recommend? I have seen some versions online, and wow, it is quite a bit to get through them all. How would one best go about reading the properly? Well, we could start another study thread under Agrippa 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nungali Posted December 28, 2014 See above. I'll try to briefly go through the nine steps: 1. orientate yourself with respect to the body, gather the parts of body and integrate. OK so this has some detailed parts. first the body 'khat' is often referred to in the plural .. khaw ... which means something like 'body parts' or members or organs perhaps. Just as the person is seen as the interaction of a number of entities (ka, ba and so on) the body is a kind of community of different parts working together and under the protection of different deities. You create a kind of microcosmic mandala with your body. First is the correct orientation with respect to the outer world (the big cosmos). The standard orientation is standing facing south so your right hand is to the west and left to the east. In Egyptian the word for west and right hand are the same and so on. To make it more accurate you incline the body backwards ... by resting on a mound of sand ... so the top of your head is towards astronomical north. You can imagine this rather than actually doing it. If you position yourself like this and gaze ahead at the horizon you are looking down your nose (like standard meditation gaze) this is the lower way or gateway into the duat. If you gaze directly ahead you will be looking into the sky at the bright constellations of the south sky i.e along the plane of the ecliptic which is the upper or luminous attention point. When in the sarcophagus the posture is changed, still head in the north and feet in the south but turned on your side to face the east. This is why eyes were painted on the left side of coffins for gazing east towards the sun rise. Now you have to look internally to your body. Imagine it not as one thing but a community of parts or organs. the most important is the heart. This is the seat of your mind. Imagine it as a throne and you are the king/queen (same for men or women). The heart is connected to the rest of your body by channels. These channels are mentioned in Egyptian medical papyrii as being 22 in number and connecting the heart to the head and to the anus ... but basically all parts of the body. As ruler your body is your kingdom. You have to join it up and unite it. This is done by circulating energy. This has two phases ... upward, light, expansive, warm = Isis, and down, dark, cool, refreshing = Nephthys. In order to do this you have in addition to the heart four other organ centres which act as mini-pumps which direct the energy (called sechem) at different phases. these are the liver, the stomach, the lungs and the intestines. They are identified with deities called the Four Sons of Horus. This circulation has the following effects. Energising the body, flushing out toxins, joining the head and the body (specifically heart), coordinating the whole body. Joining the head to the body probably requires some explanation. The head is specifically related to zones of awareness e.g. the five senses. This is not really the physical head but what is called the 'head of mystery' or 'sacred head' ... so called because it was not really physical. the Egyptians would sometimes have a symbolic head to represent this ... e.g. Tutankhamun's gold mask .... is not a mask but a 'head'. What they were saying here is that you need to engage attention when you circulate energy. You have to be able to see the phases of its circulation. All living beings circulate energy but are unaware that they do ... in this process you have to join awareness to the energy. So that's really the first step .... to align yourself correctly to the outer cosmos and then circulate energy. Not particularly advanced or complicated but essential as the first step. Thanks for these ... I look forward to more on this, and on the other steps to come, when you can do them It might seem brief and obscure, but when it is considered in conjunction with a whole lot of other 'Egyptian stuff', it really illuminates it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nungali Posted December 28, 2014 This step 1 is very interesting in that it seems to have a correlation to a type of psychological / magical principle, I have detected that seems important in magic, magical groups structures, psychological structures, mental health issues, the principles of Exo-psychology .... (its in an 'underground paper' (ie. not on the threads) floating around here a bit. All this is going into a big mixing pot, getting stirred ( and circulated ) , results will be forthcoming at some stage, I will let you know if interested. Busy at the moment . Thanks for posts . Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Apech Posted December 28, 2014 This step 1 is very interesting in that it seems to have a correlation to a type of psychological / magical principle, I have detected that seems important in magic, magical groups structures, psychological structures, mental health issues, the principles of Exo-psychology .... (its in an 'underground paper' (ie. not on the threads) floating around here a bit. All this is going into a big mixing pot, getting stirred ( and circulated ) , results will be forthcoming at some stage, I will let you know if interested. Busy at the moment . Thanks for posts . I don't know what exo-psychology is. I can guess but I don't know. Of course one thing that sprang to mind is that its possible to talk glibly about the body without ever being clear about what the body is. I know this sounds obscure and I don't mean to be. Its just that I spent a long time immersing myself in Egyptian thought and they had a different way of looking at things. Its possible to see the body as an object. As in oh look there's my foot and so on. But also to feel inside the body to experience it as a field of substantiated energy ... a sort of basic presence if you like. these are both body but viewed in different ways. One looking at it, another looking into it. If we could see our own autopsy then say oh look there's my liver in that bowl ... (ewwwww) or we can experience our liver functioning ... 'livering' and whatever that is in terms of energy. The Egyptians didn't really abstract things ... they didn't see a statue of a god as being different to the god for instance. So the body looked 'at' is an image of divine power, not different to divine power, the world being composed of neterw (divine powers) .... this was summed up in one long text referred to by the Egyptologists as the Cannibal Hymn (because the king hunts and eats the gods) where it says .... the king (and by extension all of us) is a power and a power among powers, the king is an image, the most sacred image of the great one. So you are energy and an image of energy. Gods have statues and people have bodies. Its much the same. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BaguaKicksAss Posted December 28, 2014 Well, we could start another study thread under Agrippa A pyramid texts study group? That would rock! Speaking of which, I'll get back to Agrippa soon.... my rituals, seeing family and work every single day thing should ease up a bit soonish.... 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nungali Posted December 28, 2014 (edited) I don't know what exo-psychology is. I can guess but I don't know. What I mean here is 'gathering the parts of the body together' implies, in my thoughts, an holistic awareness, all the parts have a function and an awareness (and our awareness can 'centre' there and then the awareness'in that part' is changed somewhat ... but also, it can have a type of autonomous function, of itself, in a different way. Exo-psychology sees these parts as a psychological map of circuits like a computer programme .... but 'circuit VI' is the 'master controller' that can enter, and re-regulate autonomous control .... .... unfortunately the master controller is often 'hidden' as well It seems inevitable that 'gather the parts together' eventually leads to ; 'who is gathering' ? What is that faculty ? Of course one thing that sprang to mind is that its possible to talk glibly about the body without ever being clear about what the body is. I know this sounds obscure and I don't mean to be. Its just that I spent a long time immersing myself in Egyptian thought and they had a different way of looking at things. Its possible to see the body as an object. As in oh look there's my foot and so on. But also to feel inside the body to experience it as a field of substantiated energy ... a sort of basic presence if you like. these are both body but viewed in different ways. One looking at it, another looking into it. If we could see our own autopsy then say oh look there's my liver in that bowl ... (ewwwww) or we can experience our liver functioning ... 'livering' and whatever that is in terms of energy. The Egyptians didn't really abstract things ... they didn't see a statue of a god as being different to the god for instance. So the body looked 'at' is an image of divine power, not different to divine power, the world being composed of neterw (divine powers) .... this was summed up in one long text referred to by the Egyptologists as the Cannibal Hymn (because the king hunts and eats the gods) where it says .... the king (and by extension all of us) is a power and a power among powers, the king is an image, the most sacred image of the great one. So you are energy and an image of energy. Gods have statues and people have bodies. Its much the same. I just harmonise with this ... for whatever reason Edited December 28, 2014 by Nungali Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nungali Posted December 28, 2014 A pyramid texts study group? That would rock! Speaking of which, I'll get back to Agrippa soon.... my rituals, seeing family and work every single day thing should ease up a bit soonish.... and then you can concentrate on your backyard pyramid building Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BaguaKicksAss Posted December 28, 2014 and then you can concentrate on your backyard pyramid building Some folks have had success with pyramids built out of copper tubing... tempting to try it out and see what happens, if anything. Stories such as food not going moldy inside them and such.... Might be a neat ritual space. if it doesn't work out, can use the tubing for other things. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Apech Posted December 29, 2014 (edited) Some folks have had success with pyramids built out of copper tubing... tempting to try it out and see what happens, if anything. Stories such as food not going moldy inside them and such.... Might be a neat ritual space. if it doesn't work out, can use the tubing for other things. Archeologists of future times will dig it up and stand in wonder, turn to each other and say "what the f%ck is that!". Edited December 29, 2014 by Apech Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Apech Posted December 29, 2014 The opposite pole in the pyramid arrangement is the 'niched' chamber which holds the gold statue (or sometimes three gold statues). As 'opposite' to the physical body this is the perfected form of being ... the self-as-a-god. In the Great Pyramid this is the so called Queens Chamber, in King Unas' pyramid it is the three niched chamber. This where you become pure ba-spirit. 'Ba' as well as meaning something like 'soul' also means a power or god. It was sometimes used as an alternative for the usual word for gods 'neterw'. Here you are a being of pure light and because the ba can appear in any form it choses ... a being of pure imaginative power ... where imagination means literally the power to create images. To get to this space the 'ba' of the person, that is the individual soul must be released from the body so it can fly across to the eastern sky to greet it's own pure form imaged as the rising sun. The rising sun is the origin of everything that is. Each morning is seen as a recapitulation of the original creation. So the vision of the rising sun is the vision of our own origin, we and the power that brought us into being become one. But before we can do this we have to prepare the ka and also dissolve the body back into void power (nun) in order to be able to release the ba. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites