Why would you want to raise Kundalini?

[stefos]

Yes, the book is the one you posted...I've done the practices following the order of the book, doing only the main ones for all the chakras: during the last period I've split the routine in two parts, one in the morning and one before going to bed because it would take too much time to do all the excercises at one time (it takes me about an hour in the morning and 45 minutes at night).

Unfortunately there are no ashrams near the place I live, and my schedele is quite busy so I doubt I would be able to stay there for a suitable period of time even if there was one... :-)

 

Kundalini can ONLY be raised where there is no sense of the self or the "me whatsoever!

Are you completely selfless? I'm not.

 

What is being raised isn't Kundalini but something else my friend......Think about this:

If my Ego says "Yes, I will attain that" THAT is a selfish & arrogant statement.

 

Also, WHY do we want a "Kundalini awakening?" Good question right? Of course it is.

 

Here is what Mr. J. Krishnamurti said in regards to REAL Kundalini.........I think he's right:

 

[3bob]

interesting that Mr. J. K. was also a misinformed funny guy who hardly knew what he was talking about...

Edited January 13, 2015 by 3bob

[Captain Mar-Vell]

...

 

It's hard to escape that trap, 3bob.

 

...

[stefos]

interesting that Mr. J. K. was also a misinformed funny guy who hardly knew what he was talking about...

 

Well, you are entitled to your opinion.....which is all that it is.

 

Have you researched this man's life?

 

Have you studied what teachings came out of him?

 

I think that I were to compare you with him.....Where would YOU be ranked?

 

Humility buddy is something you lack....that statement you made was completely ungracious and full of self.

 

Stefos

[stefos]

...

 

It's hard to escape that trap, 3bob.

 

...

Ditto for you as well.

[3bob]

Stefos, Yes, I have studied his life to some degree, both through reading several of his books and from other sources. (along with your submissions like this "funny guy" feeding the groupies video) I'm not into being ranked at all. Btw, I can make that statement based on certain facts that I've been fortunate enough to come across, while his opinions are generally put-downs and denials of traditions and the people of same that have experiential being-ness and knowledge far beyond his shallow stance of being an anti-guru guru.

 

I'd add that I think he did come up with some gems at times in his writings, so I'm not against everything he said...

Edited January 14, 2015 by 3bob

[Jetsun]

Kundalini can ONLY be raised where there is no sense of the self or the "me whatsoever!

Are you completely selfless? I'm not.

 

What is being raised isn't Kundalini but something else my friend......Think about this:

If my Ego says "Yes, I will attain that" THAT is a selfish & arrogant statement.

 

Also, WHY do we want a "Kundalini awakening?" Good question right? Of course it is.

 

Here is what Mr. J. Krishnamurti said in regards to REAL Kundalini.........I think he's right:

 

 

I don't think that makes sense because the kundalini bumps up against your ego, which is why people like Gopi Krishna and many others had terrible problems when it became activated. At the core of all of our restrictions and inner conflicts is a sense of egoic separation and the kundalini can put pressure on those areas while it is moving upwards. Perhaps it can't be fully opened or flow unrestricted while there is a sense of separate me holding identity but that isn't the same thing as it not existing or being activated at all before that.

[Tibetan_Ice]

Mods, Stefos' posts are off topic.

 

The topic in this thread is "experiences in kriya yoga".

 

The topic is not "How J Krinshnamurti cast aspersions on everyone else's kundalini experiences by claiming them to be false", nor is it a discussion about whether or not kundalini only rises when there is no self (which is obviously false), nor is it "Why do you want to activate kundalini?". Nor is it an oportunity to degrade authentic gurus, like J K has done many times in the past. I consider posting J K here an afront to the traditional authentic gurus like Yogananda, Gurudeva, Saraswati, Dhyanyogi, and more

 

Could you please split them out into another thread or pit them?

 

Thanks.

[stefos]

Mods, Stefos' posts are off topic.

 

The topic in this thread is "experiences in kriya yoga".

 

The topic is not "How J Krinshnamurti cast aspersions on everyone else's kundalini experiences by claiming them to be false", nor is it a discussion about whether or not kundalini only rises when there is no self (which is obviously false), nor is it "Why do you want to activate kundalini?". Nor is it an oportunity to degrade authentic gurus, like J K has done many times in the past. I consider posting J K here an afront to the traditional authentic gurus like Yogananda, Gurudeva, Saraswati, Dhyanyogi, and more

 

Could you please split them out into another thread or pit them?

 

Thanks.

 

Wrong....The topic is "Raising Kundalini".......sorry......Reread it!

 

I would expect you with your Dzogchen bent, Tibetan Ice, to realize this fact:

When I want to awaken MY Kundalini, IT"S a SELFish act.

Does that make more sense?

Modern Buddhism acknowledges no "Self" to begin with....Also Kundalini is irrelevant completely to the Dzogchenpa.

Kundalini belongs to Tantra proper as Jnana Yog belongs to Advaita Vedanta proper.

 

Krishnamurti understood esoteric subjects but was concerned with the "emptying of the brain cells" of their content.

Which, he said, doesn't make one a vegetable but allows a person to function selflessly and efficiently.

 

When it comes to the Saraswati epithet and it's roots:

Swami Sivananda, Swami Satyananda and Swami Nityananda are part of the Dashnami order of Sannyasis.

They teach Advaita as the main point not Tantra actually.

 

Since Swami Satyananda was a Siddha, maybe Mahasiddha, he could write about this but qualified it by saying to seek a real guru, a relationship based on complete mutual trust because of selfless love for one another. You can read this qualifier clearly in his book "Kundalini."

 

Thank you

 

P.S. Krishnamurti and Choiceless Awareness or Naked Awareness as known in Dzogchen:

Edited January 15, 2015 by stefos

[stefos]

Stefos, Yes, I have studied his life to some degree, both through reading several of his books and from other sources. (along with your submissions like this "funny guy" feeding the groupies video) I'm not into being ranked at all. Btw, I can make that statement based on certain facts that I've been fortunate enough to come across, while his opinions are generally put-downs and denials of traditions and the people of same that have experiential being-ness and knowledge far beyond his shallow stance of being an anti-guru guru.

 

I'd add that I think he did come up with some gems at times in his writings, so I'm not against everything he said...

 

Understood. Krishnamurti DID in fact talk negatively about "gurus" as his definition of a guru was a person who together with another discovered truth. The book "The awakening of intelligence" discusses this in the chapter where Krishnamurti explains to a swami what he viewed as a real guru.

He wasn't a "Guru" because he said that he didn't want followers and he didn't want people's money either.

 

Studying and living out a teaching aren't the same as you know.

 

This person, who's particular "teachings" are akin to Advaita Vedanta & to Semde Dzogchen, was serious.

 

He DID state that over & over that the "empty mind" apprehends reality.

By this statement, he didn't say a Blank mind but when empty it could also properly perceive with clarity.

Hence the Emptiness/Clarity of Dzogchen (my words) and of Brahman.

 

If you read the biographical work abut him from Pupul Jayakar, Lutyens and others, you'll see that he understood a great many things but didn't discuss them because he thought they were irrelevant as people are SELFish.

 

Selfish people want things, power, etc. for Self not for other.

 

That's all I have to say.

Edited January 15, 2015 by stefos

[3bob]

until one has at least a few key understandings of what a true guru is then all of the negative connotations and stories about false, dubious or half-baked gurus can easily dominate and even be taken as truisms... which is really missing the quintessential meaning, purpose and greatness of a true guru, which is apparently (as heard in his own words) exactly what happened to J.K..

[Chang]

Moderation Message

Surely it is possible to discuss this subject without falling into the "my guru is better than your guru trap" ?

Once more participants appear to have lost sight of the wood because of the trees.

[Wells]

.

Edited February 11, 2015 by ZOOM

[stefos]

This guy's teacher, Sivananda Sarasvati, was the guy who wrote the first Kundalini Yoga book I was reading 20 years ago, in which he advises to suck first milk, then honey AND FINALLY QUICKSILVER UP THROUGH YOUR URETHRA INTO YOUR DICK TO MAKE SURE TO STAY CHASTE!!! :lol:

 

I'm sure the student's system is at least as good as his teacher's...

I actually own this book and S.S.S. no where advocates what you think he's saying.

 

Enjoyable to read how you take something and can't extrapolate the meaning yourself but make assumptive reasonings behind and past it ----> Regarding quicksilver.

 

Dont' put words into peoples mouths........Mahasiddhas don't explain to people how that stuff goes openly, hence the restrictive nature of ALL Tantric practices.

 

Zoom, just stop where you are. Unless you commit to a REAL guru (SAT guru), you're making speculations about these matters.

 

Have a nice evening!

Edited January 16, 2015 by stefos

[stefos]

 

until one has at least a few key understandings of what a true guru is then all of the negative connotations and stories about false, dubious or half-baked gurus can easily dominate and even be taken as truisms... which is really missing the quintessential meaning, purpose and greatness of a true guru, which is apparently (as heard in his own words) exactly what happened to J.K..

 

Not the case........You haven't done enough homework on this man to really know what teachings came through him.

 

Krishnamurti DID explain what a real guru is.

His definition of "guru" is to be found in the book "The awakening of intelligence."

 

Insofar as Sat Guru or True Guru or literally a THAT Guru is concerned, that is a guru who knows Brahman.

 

"The Teachings" which manifested through Krishnamurti, as he himself stated, were not about consciousness expansion as might be misexpressed by certain teachers of Neo Advaita Vedanta but rather the letting go of the self completely and utterly in the context of the brain cells being the "storehouse" of "the me." Jnana Yog is the letting go of the personal self/ego.

 

He said what he said.........If you don't like it, sorry...Oh well!

 

I'm done here.

 

Be Well!

[3bob]

Hmm, JK. often said things like that underlined below in a quote from him, along with the rest of it:

 

"You know, a great many gurus from India have come to this country, like a great many missionaries have gone to the East it is their turn to come now. And they are going to pollute your mind as the missionaries have also polluted the other minds. These gurus with their tradition, with their peculiar assertion wrought in tradition, their authority which demands obedience, compliance, conformity, and with their groups, with their ashrams, it has become now in this country a form of concentration camp. You know the word 'guru' means, amongst many other things, one who removes ignorance, one who points the way, one who relieves you of your burden. The root meaning of that word, I have been told, means weight. And unfortunately these gurus that come here give you their burden, they don't relieve you of your burdens but they foist onto you their ignorance, their problem, their systems. And unfortunately here, people are so gullible, accept something that comes from the ancient country, with their ancient culture, and their mysterious religions, superstitions, beliefs and all that ritual. And it would have been very good if you had never heard of that word, if you had not accepted anything, then you could listen afresh, then you would be able to examine the thing for itself, not what you have been told, or your own particular experience, or what you think it should be"

 

(copied from the Krishnamurti website under books)

Edited January 16, 2015 by 3bob

[Wells]

.

Edited February 11, 2015 by ZOOM

[stefos]

Hi Zoom,

 

Attacking my person will get you a visit from the moderators.

I've already sent out a report on your thread!

 

Swami Sivananda NEVER explained what he exatly meant, how much, why, etc.

 

You made a blanket statement which means nothing.

 

Take care,

Stefos

[stefos]

Hmm, JK. often said things like that underlined below in a quote from him, along with the rest of it:

 

"You know, a great many gurus from India have come to this country, like a great many missionaries have gone to the East it is their turn to come now. And they are going to pollute your mind as the missionaries have also polluted the other minds. These gurus with their tradition, with their peculiar assertion wrought in tradition, their authority which demands obedience, compliance, conformity, and with their groups, with their ashrams, it has become now in this country a form of concentration camp. You know the word 'guru' means, amongst many other things, one who removes ignorance, one who points the way, one who relieves you of your burden. The root meaning of that word, I have been told, means weight. And unfortunately these gurus that come here give you their burden, they don't relieve you of your burdens but they foist onto you their ignorance, their problem, their systems. And unfortunately here, people are so gullible, accept something that comes from the ancient country, with their ancient culture, and their mysterious religions, superstitions, beliefs and all that ritual. And it would have been very good if you had never heard of that word, if you had not accepted anything, then you could listen afresh, then you would be able to examine the thing for itself, not what you have been told, or your own particular experience, or what you think it should be"

 

(copied from the Krishnamurti website under books)

 

O.K. Great! He was VERY concerned about blunt commands from huckster "gurus."

 

Krishnamurti himself DID talk about Siddhis coming about due to Choiceless Awareness.

You can read about this in "Truth and Actuality"

 

He understood the phala or fruit of meditation.

 

Have you taken what I said to you about reading what HE meant about a "guru"?

Obviously not.

The book is called "The Awakening of Intelligence."

Please read that particular excerpt otherwise you're just randomly quoting.

 

I'm done with you not addressing what I've stated. Sorry.

 

I want to move this discussion forward and you want to cul-de-sac it.

 

Take care,

Stefos

Edited January 17, 2015 by stefos

[Tibetan_Ice]

Dear Mods...

See what happens when you let Stefos derail the topic by pushing the unpalatable Krishnamurti down the throats of fellow posters?

The topic is about raising kundalini through kriya yoga, not how Stefos can't think for himself and must rely on an intellectual anti-guru, anti yoga, hypocritical quasi philosopher with no powers or realizations... A sneering comedian and entertainer at best, that's what J. K. Is.

There are plenty of realized true masters out there, like Buddha, Jesus, Padmasambhava, Dhyanyogi, Gurudeva, Sri Anadi Ma, Tenzin Namdak, Tenzin Wangyal, Yogananda, Mark Griffin, Yogi Bajhan, etc etc, and they have their practices and teachings too. And most if not all of them have/had mystical powers and abilities with written testimony by witnesses...

 

But That Is Not The Topic Of This Thread.

Edited January 17, 2015 by Tibetan_Ice

[Chang]

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[Wells]

.

Edited February 11, 2015 by ZOOM

[3bob]

I did look up that "awakening" title at the Krisnamurti website but have not yet found the particular text you mentioned within it ... thus if you could supply a link I'll then take a look at it. Anyway, I think the quote that I submitted from his site should give anyone pause and caution considering how narrow minded and generalized it is on many counts - which doesn't mean such as he said never happens. (and of which there is also proof of with characters like Osho in Oregon, who went by a different name back then)

[Wells]

.

Edited February 11, 2015 by ZOOM