Is personality unique to humans?

[shanlung]

Is personality unique to humans?

 

 

I have seen how different Riamfada was from Tinkerbell.

And the differences between the cats in my life.

 

Now this article from BBC. And below taken from that article which might give you folks food for thoughts.

 

 

•  Individual animals display different personalities across a range of species, including mammals,fish, birds, insects and mollus
•  These personality traits control whether individual animals are leaders or followers, bold or shy, aggressive or passive, for example. As with people, some animal's personalities change as they age

 

What fascinate me was that those researchers found that even so-called low life forms like insects and molluscs have different personalities.

What more with parrots more intelligent than the great apes and dolphins.

 

 

Kind of ludicrous that folks can think they know so much of parrots in general because they go through a behaviourlogyaeiou course/courses and therefore not only they know all but can tell all what their birds are like and should be like

without seeing or knowing their birds. That no need to listen to your birds, just listen to them as they know all that is to be known.

 

 

Reminded me of Victorian scientists who just gotten toe hold in analytical science and proud that their laboratories can refine substances and test substances to 99.99% purity.

Should a computer silicon chip be given to them, they will test it and declare they know all that is to know about it and that the purity is 99.99% and strut around petting themselves on their back.

 

They would not realise the purity of silicon in chip is 99.999999% and that it is the 0.000000001% impurity of less than made the silicon chip more than just silicon and gave it soul and brains.

 

Above was written by me into birdie forums.  And as said before, I injected enough Tao into those forums without folks there even realising I was hitting them over the head

with Tao.  So in view of love of plagiarisers of works of other people, I felt I might as well plagiarise my writings into here too to show I can plagiarise as well as their favourite plagiarisers.

 

Might even be a convenient point for my enemies and claimers of mantles of Quanzheng to hit out at me and to put the fear into me of their pointy elbows and crooked shoulders.

Even if to accuse me of not toeing the Tao , as if they are arbiters of what is Tao.

 

Your Taoistic Idiot

 

 

[soaring crane]

You're bloody brilliant :-)

[Geof Nanto]

I've read Shanlung's post twice and still have no idea of his position on the topic. Of course, there's no reason why he should have a position, or even write something I find comprehensible. Anyway, making sense is greatly overrated - I know I personally put far too much effort into it.  

 

I live surrounded by wildlife and it's obvious the animals have different personalities within the same species. There's an interesting book by Virginia Morell called Animal Wise: The Thoughts and Emotions of Our Fellow Creatures. And yes, an African gray parrot called Alex proved to be pretty smart.

Edited March 22, 2015 by Darkstar

[dust]

Anyone who's spent time around more than 1 dog, or cat, or rat, or parrot, or any other animal, should be very clear that they have different personalities.. my experience with dogs and cats reveals extraordinary differences in behaviour..

 

 

Shows just how special we think we are that someone feels the need to ask the question...

[Marblehead]

In answer to the thread title question:  No.

[Lth]

what about crows? they relay information to one another within hundreds of kilomoeters of distance, they see time, they can plan in the future, maybe they are even more spiritually advance than humans for their small size. so obviously every crow is a leader, because they have a crow internet for me it seems there is no sense to have a dictatorship

and crows act so weird sometime, like they know more then you do! from the side it doesnt look like they are very organized, but they are actually spying you all the time !

they so mysterious...

other birdies like sparrows are cute and they like you if you like them. i once helped bury a dead sparrow and they loved me, played with me and their songs while, accompany me wherever i go. even when i change cities that same day the little sparrows followed my car and were singing on top of my car, they even helped with some dried leaves on the windshield. that was so cute and they are so cheerful

but with crows there is something different. so with crows no i have not made friends. THEY made friends with me

Edited March 23, 2015 by Lth

[Geof Nanto]

Kind of ludicrous that folks can think they know so much of parrots in general because they go through a behaviourlogyaeiou course/courses and therefore not only they know all but can tell all what their birds are like and should be like

without seeing or knowing their birds. That no need to listen to your birds, just listen to them as they know all that is to be known.

 

 

 

I’m no fan of some aspects of scientific research and appreciate what you’re implying about science denying reality because it can’t currently (or possibly ever) be measured.  However, many animal behaviour researchers are totally dedicated and spend a great part of their life with animals. For instance, researcher Irene Pepperberg spent over 20 years on an almost daily basis working with the African gray parrot she named Alex.  In her book Morrell writes “Nearly all the scientists I met for this book wished they could talk to their animals…….Many of them had dreamed that they talked to their animal and he or she talked back. They envied Doctor Doolittle.” When Alex died Pepperberg grieved for him as a friend.  She wanted to remember Alex as her buddy, a pal full of life and mischief, amazing the world of science for doing so many things a parrot was not supposed to be able to do.

 

BTW I have many conceptual problems with the kind of research these people are doing because, to my mind, their work is based on a flawed model of consciousness, but that’s beyond the scope of what I'm writing here. I also think for this type of research the scientist would better be equipped to understand the minds of animals if they were to work on improving their intuitive abilities by, for instance, undertake full mind/body training such as Daoist based praxis (amongst many other types).  

Edited March 23, 2015 by Darkstar

[Lth]

is worth noting that only humans have negativity (or animals in contact with humans). so an animals personality is not formed by life situation or environment in nature.

they know what they have to do. or they know because they are in communion with nature. humans have a choice. free will. do every singal animal have a free will? or some animal species free will is based on a collective free will?

[Marblehead]

they know what they have to do. or they know because they are in communion with nature. humans have a choice. free will. do every singal animal have a free will? or some animal species free will is based on a collective free will?

I think that is going to vary amongst species.  Whatever "level" would be unique to that specific species.

 

An ant, for example, is pure instinct, but I have seen animals like Orcas (in documentaries) doing things where it is obvious that they have varying personalities.

 

And in the other great apes, besides humans, different personalities can easily be seen.

[Lth]

I think that is going to vary amongst species.  Whatever "level" would be unique to that specific species.

 

An ant, for example, is pure instinct, but I have seen animals like Orcas (in documentaries) doing things where it is obvious that they have varying personalities.

 

And in the other great apes, besides humans, different personalities can easily be seen.

 

also in the science communities there is this idea of "imprinting", where an animal learns its behaviour from its parents. there is always the physical and spiritual dimension ofcourse. but if you take a dolphin for example, you dont see an angry dolphin, there are always happy dolphins, so who knows if you are communicating actually to a dolphin or an extension of nature consciousness with its unique attributes depending on the animal. until we learn to properly communicate spiritually with those beings, how can we know if an animal has a "self". maybe he does not see himself as an seperate individual, and maybe he doesn't even know that he is an animal

[soaring crane]

Anyone interested in this topic will enjoy Bernd Heinrich's books. This one is a classic:

 

Mind of a Raven: Investigations and Adventures with Wolf-Birds

(amazon link purely for the sake of convenience. Please don't shop there)

 

edit: Whoops, this is the classic book, Ravens in Winter. The other one is newer

 

[Lth]

i think crows are more intelligent than science. that is just my opinion. but this book sounds interesting nonetheless. though the truth is in the eyes of the beholder when it comes to science

[doc benway]

what about crows? they relay information to one another within hundreds of kilomoeters of distance, they see time, they can plan in the future, maybe they are even more spiritually advance than humans for their small size. so obviously every crow is a leader, because they have a crow internet for me it seems there is no sense to have a dictatorship

 

and crows act so weird sometime, like they know more then you do! from the side it doesnt look like they are very organized, but they are actually spying you all the time !

 

they so mysterious...

 

other birdies like sparrows are cute and they like you if you like them. i once helped bury a dead sparrow and they loved me, played with me and their songs while, accompany me wherever i go. even when i change cities that same day the little sparrows followed my car and were singing on top of my car, they even helped with some dried leaves on the windshield. that was so cute and they are so cheerful

 

but with crows there is something different. so with crows no i have not made friends. THEY made friends with me

 

I also have a connection with crows. 

My friend, who is Lakota Sioux, shuns them and refers to them as harbingers of trouble.

My experience is different, I find them to be valuable teachers, then again I'm not Lakota.

[Rara]

I also have a connection with crows.

My friend, who is Lakota Sioux, shuns them and refers to them as harbingers of trouble.

My experience is different, I find them to be valuable teachers, then again I'm not Lakota.

Ah, this post reminds me of my favourite film - The Crow

[Rara]

And no, to the question too.

 

I'm not proud of it, but one time I sprayed a load of ants infesting my house. As several died, I witnessed survivors running back to try and wake their dead friends up. Failing, they picked them up on their backs and took them away.

 

If that's not personality, then what is?

 

Disclaimer: That moment changed me forever and I have not (consciously) hurt a living thing since.

[voidisyinyang]

 

This is a very amazing documentary on "Animal Odd Couples" - animals of different species befriending each other for seemingly unknown reasons.

 

These relationships demonstrate individual personality traits aligning together - across specie lines.

[shanlung]

My starting post here was lifted from a series of postings in birdie and beastie forums and therefore might not be comprehensible to darkstar.  Not that those who read me over the last decade and more in those context comprehend me either.  And to set the record straight, I am not inneundoing I comprehend what I wrote either so darkstar is in good company.

 

For those who do not know of my birdie and beastie, they should not google but a quick click or 2 on my webpage and the photos that will come out will tell them more as photo (and I assure you none of them photoshopped) speak more than a thousand words and what about many photos as against a mere photo.

 

What I took to be normal relationship between me and my birdies and beasties were exclaimed as weird and not normal in forums with folks there asking how I trained them as if I am a trainer with secret knowledge getting my birdies and beasties to respond with military precision.

 

I found it impossible to tell them that I was the mere trainee and it was my birdie/beastie that were the real trainers.

 

All that I did was to talk to them, and most important of all, to listen to them in the first place.  As if you do not bother to listen to them, why should they bother to listen to you?

 

Maybe this explain better

Tinkerbell Legacy - - Rant 03 (a flighted parrot mentality) & Understanding the mind of your grey

 

I was normally shouted down by people who were experts or attended courses conducted by experts which make me even more convinced I am truly the Idiot.  

 

That experts seemed so fixated on their expertise that they know all to be known.  And like that tree that fell in the forest did not fall if no one heard the tree fall, knowledge will not be knowledge  until an expert wrote on that and thereafter, can fit square pegs into round holes or holes of any size and shape.

 

I nearly burst with laughter when no less expert than Irene Pepperberg came along to declare to the world that Alex understood the concept of Zero with the world singing hosannas to Irene (just a note I do have immense respect for Irene and Alex.  The work she did was one of the catalyst of my entwining my life with Tinkerbell)

 

 

 

My birdie Yingshiong demonstrated he knew zero and I described that in

 

 

Yingshiong on my shoulder and concept of zero

 

(extract from above)

 

Recently Alex the CAG got into news with what was claimed that he understood the concept of zero.

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=alex+parrot+zero&btnG=Google+Search

Wow! I do like Alex, but the way those researchers went ape that Alex knew zero was so funny to me like they never realised that probably even amoeba might know the concept of zero.

In any case, YS demonstrated very clearly he also understood the concept of zero when he was digging in the milli box when perched on my shoulder. When he ate all the millis, he knew there were zero millis left. Instead of pecking forlornly into an empty box, he flew off my shoulder to the door perch.

He would wait for me to move that milli box from its state of zero to its dozen of millis before he responded to my recall, and that hopping up routine to my shoulder. He then demonstrated he understood zero when he flew off after he emptied that box. He showed that 4 times this morning.

So folks, Alex is not the only bird that knew zero. YS knew too. If you check your birds, I am sure they all knew zero. Do they peck and peck in an empty bowl not realising the bowl is empty?

I am sure even amoeba knows too. If it ran out of food in its vicinity, the amoeba will ooze on to another spot when it can find food.

 

An ant, for example, is pure instinct

 

It is indeed the privilege of Marblehead to believe what he want to believe.

 

Long long time ago, I used to have  marine aquarium tanks.  Never mind the fishes in there who shown to me they have got different personalities.

 

One of my favourite creature i  was a green carpet anemone.

Those wanting to know what they are need only to click below

https://www.google.com.sa/search?q=carpet+anemone&sa=X&espv=2&biw=1920&bih=1017&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&ei=yRcVVeTSIYjiUeyFgdgJ&ved=0CB0QsAQ

 

I feed that about once a week.  Yet it seemed to know when I was in the room and even if I did not feed it, would swell up in size and undulate in a beautiful display.  Anyone else who entered that room would not get that response unless they went in with me.

 

At least the ant got a brain.

 

The anemone did not have a brain.

And yet it was more intelligent and more sentient than some humans I do know.

 

 

Idiot who might not have brain either

[Marblehead]

It is indeed the privilege of Marblehead to believe what he want to believe.

Well, that should be a given, should it not?

 

At least the ant got a brain.

No argument with you there.  I never implied such.

 

The anemone did not have a brain.

Although it has a nervous system that serves its function of a brain.

 

And yet it was more intelligent and more sentient than some humans I do know.

But then, that's a different story.

Edited March 27, 2015 by Marblehead

[voidisyinyang]

amoebae - actually this is discussed in Hunt's book on consciousness.

 

Hold.....

 

https://books.google.com/books?id=1V44ZbeTqakC&pg=PA99&lpg=PA99&dq=amoebae+hunt+consciousness&source=bl&ots=kSfpJIrILU&sig=9ZQ0Mzwku9uP7-zp7giQsRN5GDE&hl=en&sa=X&ei=zt4VVZPPMsmWNrjAgpgN&ved=0CCwQ6AEwAg#v=onepage&q=amoebae%20hunt%20consciousness&f=false

 

Yeah there it is....

 

googlebook link.

 

 

Fascinating - a larger amoeba eating a smaller one which subsequently escapes and is pursued by the larger who eats the smaller again. After several more escapes the larger gives up....

 

Another report shows premeditated planning by the amoeba. Fascinating!

 

"...sentient life-worlds are emergent at the level of the protozoa....the most general categories describing the pattern of their behaviors also describes ours."

 

Neurons could be considered as protozoa....

 

using the same electrochemical potentials for memory, movement, etc.

[Stosh]

Concept of zero means zero has value as a mathematical placeholder and numerical situation.

This is not the idea of something being absent, which isnt math, its a direct assessment of a situation.

There is no such existant thing as negative oranges, or zero oranges, those are conceptual creations.

(There are no zebras either,but thats different)

 

[Marblehead]

But Zero exists.  He posts here regularly.

 

That too might be a different story.

 

Are we still talking about personality amongst the various animal species?

 

Believe it or not, there are actually people who have no personality.

[Stosh]

Well since animals arent persons, just machines fit for eating ,like plants... no they have no personality. Yeah they wiggle around but that just means they are live systems. One might as well suppose mushrooms have personalities. So the answer requested is yes, only humans have personalities.

[zerostao]

very good stosh. only a person could have a personality with your strict restriction on word usage.

i looked up animality, and the definitions i found, do not fit either, regarding the op question.

 

here is what animals do have>>individuality

[Stosh]

very good stosh. only a person could have a personality with your strict restriction on word usage.

i looked up animality, and the definitions i found, do not fit either, regarding the op question.

 

here is what animals do have>>individuality

Do they now? How is it they arent just carbon copies , mindless automatons? If I was the size of a mouse, why would my cat eat me?

[zerostao]

Do they now? How is it they arent just carbon copies , mindless automatons? If I was the size of a mouse, why would my cat eat me?

some cats are better mousers than others. some are sweeter than others. some are loners, some prefer company. some are more aggressive than others. some are mischievous and jokesters, while others are not.some are even more curious than others. when they are meowing, is it only because they want fed? they can meow for many reasons, they have a highly developed language set. sometimes they just want conversation. i am not even a cat person and i am aware of this.

 

why does a wolf pack have a leader? why do some wolves submit to others? why do some jackals choose to hunt in pairs, while other jackals choose to hunt alone?

 

why is it that the same canine handler will have differing results from dogs of the same breed? from the same litter?

 

"mindless automatons"?  i used to live on a small dairy farm. only 18 heifers, all holstein. after about a month of meeting up with the cows each day for milking, i could tell the differences between cows, not only by their physical traits, but by their individual traits. excuse my use of the word; but their personality. i knew which ones, if they were having a grumpy morning, might try and kick me. i knew the ones that never would try that. apparently you have never been cursed out by a holstein heifer. 

 

bluejays have different individual traits also. 1% will eat robin eggs. some are prone to the Jay! Jay! type of speech and  others are much more versatile. some can mimic you. 

 

i have mentioned about when i lived in florida (2000-2004, nonchalant) i would go hang out in a live oak in the front yard and each day , without fail, 5 quaker parrots would come hang out and visit with me in that tree. they were each individuals, acted as individuals, had their own unique traits. one would laugh more than the other 4, and one would act a clown more than the other 4. etc  it wasnt like every quaker parrot that flew past that tree while i was in it landed and visited. why these 5?

 

edit>>to answer your question; my guess is, your cat would likely eat you because of your stubborn objectivity. 

Edited April 2, 2015 by zerostao