Highest most pure state of wei wu wei?

[Everything]

I wonder what the highest most pure state of wei wu wei is. And what the best Way to achieve it.

 

I'm not sure, so the best thing I can come up with is worship. Cause in worship you surrender all effort, strive and action, naturally. What is left is a natural flow of appreciative expression, if the state of worship is maintained. You don't try to accomplish anything, because you feel already complete, and so whatever expression follows next is a natural expression of completion and is also in alignment with completion. Doing nothing and leaving nothing undone. Unless you risk worshipping a relative thing. In which case you leave allot of things undone.

 

What do you think? what is the most high and pure state of wei wu wei and what is the best most direct path to the achievement of it?

 

With my current understanding of wei wu wei, I would think wei wu wei is the most direct path to the accomplishment of wei wu wei.

Edited April 7, 2015 by Everything

[Spotless]

The best way will be for each a different path.

 

It is not in not doing - it is not being in inertia.

 

It is not in retreating, but no pattern will endure, your story is dead unless you wear it as a prisoner in his cell.

 

enjoin with your body but do not let the mind take the reins - it is nothing and has no clue.

 

Yes - be grateful - in worship be sure to worship yourself in all.

Edited April 7, 2015 by Spotless

[Jeff]

I wonder what the highest most pure state of wei wu wei is. And what the best Way to achieve it.

 

I'm not sure, so the best thing I can come up with is worship. Cause in worship you surrender all effort, strive and action, naturally. What is left is a natural flow of appreciative expression, if the state of worship is maintained. You don't try to accomplish anything, because you feel already complete, and so whatever expression follows next is a natural expression of completion and is also in alignment with completion. Doing nothing and leaving nothing undone. Unless you risk worshipping a relative thing. In which case you leave allot of things undone.

 

What do you think? what is the most high and pure state of wei wu wei and what is the best most direct path to the achievement of it?

 

With my current understanding of wei wu wei, I would think wei wu wei is the most direct path to the accomplishment of wei wu wei.

 

Worship implies that there is something "separate from you" to worship and hence not the natural (or most pure) state.

[Marblehead]

Worship implies that there is something "separate from you" to worship and hence not the natural (or most pure) state.

Yes, I had that same problem when reading the OP.

 

My mind went to empty-minded meditation.

[mostly_empty]

I am certainly unqualified and too unaccomplished to have much of an opinion about the highest state of wu wei. However, I do have some opinions about the idea of "surrender" and "letting go". When I first read TTC and related texts I thought that I would relax, stop resisting life and go with the flow. Accordingly I can now blame the fact that I am old, fat and lazy more or less on Lao Tzu! When consulted, the I Ching later confirmed that I was an idiot!

 

Actually going with the flow requires sensitivity that I didn't even recognize then and now strive for. It is very easy to translate ideas about surrender/worship into a passive inaction that corresponds to your unconsciously programmed attachments. If surrender and worship mean to be comfortable where you are, then you are going to go nowhere!

 

Consider Krisha in the Bhagavad-Gita - you are going to play your part! Consider the Buddhist reflections on karma - what you will see (and try to surrender to...) is self-constructed. So consider the preferred daoist metaphor of "cultivation". If you want wu wei beyond what you can currently observe in your life, you may actually need to change.

 

Me too!

[Everything]

What is wei wu wei to you guys.

 

Share your perspective.

[Everything]

Worship implies that there is something "separate from you" to worship and hence not the natural (or most pure) state.

No, I know. That's the tricky part, as I said. When you worship something relative like an object or your own physical being, you leave allot of things undone. It's not a complete act of non action. The goal is to leave nothing undone, right?

 

That's why I ask, what is to wei wu wei to you guys. Cause I find that completion means endedness, and endedness cannot be. How tormenting to reach for something that doesn't exist.

 

Perhaps I am misunderstanding what is ment by wei wu wei. Could you guys elaborate?

[Jeff]

No, I know. That's the tricky part, as I said. When you worship something relative like an object or your own physical being, you leave allot of things undone. It's not a complete act of non action. The goal is to leave nothing undone, right? That's why I ask, what is to wei wu wei to you guys. Cause I find that completion means endedness, and endedness cannot be. How tormenting to reach for something that doesn't exist. Perhaps I am misunderstanding what is ment by wei wu wei. Could you guys elaborate?

 

Yes, on the leaving nothing undone on a relative level. Or, you could also describe it as there are no issues, fears or past karma that obscure (or indirectly effect) your actions.

 

At a practical level, it is easiest to think of it as one is totally focused in the moment. No mental background noise or worrying about the past or thinking/projecting into the future.  If you are ever daydreaming or emotional about something, it is definitely not "it".  More like you just naturally "do" and don't ever think about the "doing".

 

Hope that helps.

[Everything]

Yes, on the leaving nothing undone on a relative level. Or, you could also describe it as there are no issues, fears or past karma that obscure (or indirectly effect) your actions.

 

At a practical level, it is easiest to think of it as one is totally focused in the moment. No mental background noise or worrying about the past or thinking/projecting into the future. If you are ever daydreaming or emotional about something, it is definitely not "it". More like you just naturally "do" and don't ever think about the "doing".

 

Hope that helps.

Yeah that helps greatly. Thanks. Edited April 7, 2015 by Everything

[Nikolai1]

A really good article on this subject. In fact this writer is pretty awesome in general.

 

http://ccbs.ntu.edu.tw/FULLTEXT/JR-PHIL/loy3.htm

[Everything]

I am certainly unqualified and too unaccomplished to have much of an opinion about the highest state of wu wei. However, I do have some opinions about the idea of "surrender" and "letting go". When I first read TTC and related texts I thought that I would relax, stop resisting life and go with the flow. Accordingly I can now blame the fact that I am old, fat and lazy more or less on Lao Tzu! When consulted, the I Ching later confirmed that I was an idiot!

 

Actually going with the flow requires sensitivity that I didn't even recognize then and now strive for. It is very easy to translate ideas about surrender/worship into a passive inaction that corresponds to your unconsciously programmed attachments. If surrender and worship mean to be comfortable where you are, then you are going to go nowhere!

 

Consider Krisha in the Bhagavad-Gita - you are going to play your part! Consider the Buddhist reflections on karma - what you will see (and try to surrender to...) is self-constructed. So consider the preferred daoist metaphor of "cultivation". If you want wu wei beyond what you can currently observe in your life, you may actually need to change.

 

Me too!

Hi, thanks for sharing your perspective. If I stop resisting life, and go with the flow, I am alowing of dynamic experiences.

 

It may seem like you're old and passing away, but you are infact simply going with the flow. Growing old is part of that. Most people don't wanna grow old, but you can't do anything about that. The stream of life wants to take you places. This experience you are having now is part of that journey. And you don't have to be young, cause you make people young. With old people around, young people feel extra young, but sometimes, young people feel old if the older person is actually feeling very young. Being old It is a unique state of being. And if it's not enjoyed, it is probably irrelevant to what you are really all about. In that case, Old doesn't define you. You may be younger and more active and full of life. Like I know many old people to be.

I personally don't count the years, unless I am doing it in the present moment. So I bless this moment that allows me to do all these things I wanna do. And I thank every older person for just being who they are, cause if they made it through, it means we have a good example. Isn't that helpful?

And I know people older than me who are ten times more dynamic and physically active. Being full of life is easy. Even for old people. I have seen it over and over again. Many examples of old people who are full of life that I know about.

 

And when it comes to death, I believe it is part of that journey, like walking through a door. A shift that takes place, surely, unknown to us, perhaps it is wei wu wei who knows. 

Edited April 7, 2015 by Everything

[Marblehead]

Wei wu wei - doing without doing.

 

Taht doesn't mean not doing.  It means we do whatever needs be done as soon as we realize something need be done and then there is nothing bothering our mind.  Then we can return to empty-minded meditation until the next need for our attention arises.

 

Basically living spontaniously.  If nothing needs be done then relax, build up reserve energy.  (But not so much that it turns to fat.  Hehehe.)

[dawei]

At a practical level, it is easiest to think of it as one is totally focused in the moment. 

 

I might say you are the moment; no separation from it.

 

There is no contemplation of moment or separated from moment; there is only one unity with moment... and yet, no moment except as we ponder the point.

 

When a bird glides on high... and the wind lifts it upward to soar and glide effortlessly... there is neither thought nor flapping of wings... there is a sense of being carried in a stream of energy.

 

That stream of energy is the manifest world.  That gliding is beyond space/time.

[Everything]

Wei wu wei - doing without doing.

 

Taht doesn't mean not doing.  It means we do whatever needs be done as soon as we realize something need be done and then there is nothing bothering our mind.  Then we can return to empty-minded meditation until the next need for our attention arises.

 

Basically living spontaniously.  If nothing needs be done then relax, build up reserve energy.  (But not so much that it turns to fat.  Hehehe.)

Yeah if I meditate I feel good. Then when I feel good, there's so much stuff I wanna do. I enjoy life to the fullest, naturally, as I go with the flow. It's easy that way. Infact, thinking about it, I wanna meditate right now! Hehe. My natural state of being feels good to me. Don't even need to think, and I'm inspired automatically, like a kid doesn't need to think so much about what's the next most fun thing. There's an endless stream of inspiration for them. When I meditate, it happens so aswell. The present moments brings all those fun things with it automatically. Like the newness of each moment. I just enjoy it for what it is, cause I know I will always get it again and again. New moment again. This moment is new again. And this one aswell. Again and again. Always new.

 

Sometimes we don't like the moment we are given. Bad cards can be dealt. Doesn't mean end of the world. It just means there's allot of variety. Maybe it's not the best thing for us we wish the experience, but atleast we can know what we don't want and what we do want and have those personal preferences. It is helpful to know what we want in life. Especially when it comes to peace and contentment, for me personally, I always enjoy those. And when the opposite is there, it just reminds me how much I do enjoy it. That is helpful to me. I like to be reminded of what I'm really all about. 

Edited April 7, 2015 by Everything

[Stosh]

Status quo, dynamic equilibrium, homeostasis, preservation of paradigm, balance, reciprocation, peaceful coexistance , harmony ...you can add your favorites. Of the many bright guys that put their two cents on the issue, there is not concensus! So logically , they could all be wrong, they could all be right, or some right and some wrong,,statistically though if any single person was right, that person would be heavily outnumbered. Now if I or thou, were to place ourselves as judge of which one was right, then it would be the student picking the example to fit the answer supplied. I am willing to do that ,but do see the upside down nature of the act.

So anyway the most humble and reasonable answer encompasses the broad array of perceptions rather than expects a single meaning of www. There may actually BE no precise definition ,and one needs to feel their way along trying to keep to the basic overall principle ,I see as equilibrium or balance.

Edited April 7, 2015 by Stosh

[Everything]

Status quo, dynamic equilibrium, homeostasis, preservation of paradigm, balance, reciprocation, peaceful coexistance , harmony ...you can add your favorites. Of the many bright guys that put their two cents on the issue, there is not concensus! So logically , they could all be wrong, they could all be right, or some right and some wrong,,statistically though if any single person was right, that person would be heavily outnumbered. Now if I or thou, were to place ourselves as judge of which one was right, then it would be the student picking the example to fit the answer supplied. I am willing to do that ,but do see the upside down nature of the act.

So anyway the most humble and reasonable answer encompasses the broad array of perceptions rather than expects a single meaning of www. There may actually BE no precise definition ,and one needs to feel their way along trying to keep to the basic overall principle ,I see as equilibrium or balance.

I could work with that. Peace and equilibrium sound good. Thing is, I would like to see more of it. But there isn't as much as I would want it to be there. So it feels like the world is a scary and chaotic place at times. When it is going to improve, I don't know. Atleast people like you make it a better world. There's plenty of good stuff to go around, I know. Improvement is a gradual thing. I guess it has an equilibrium. Who would've known. A better world must be already on its way. And if not, we will always do our best to make the best out of it. Guess we're born to be good in that way. I am curious what the future holds.

Obviously the internet is part of that equilibrium of peace. I think it will continue to do so much good as it already does. Connection allows good acts to reach further. Very contagious. Love it.

[Stosh]

Things that happen around me, also look chaotic, im finding that accepting the way those things are, may just be the best folks can do individually and collectively.

Since my sentiments are mine,,or in me ,,or due to my so called illusion of self, the extent that I can be at ease with it all,,,,well ,,,the easier I am with it.

Everything seems so damn important ! But if you can ,step outside your own opinion for a second. Tao doesnt give a sht , its ok if the cat eats the mouse ,or its ok if the mouse gets away. My distress arises if I take sides, and things dont go the way I want.

I dont think the classical authors were suggesting we should sit in place rotting while the world turned. But in order to move we have to make decisions,those depend on our ideas. Whats right and whats wrong, as well as what is easiest comes into play. If one aligns their ideas with that which is harmonious, well then our lives should work out to be the best we can make them. Some of those wise decisions, may be generally true. We want other folks to like us, we want to be comfortable and healthy, we want to fulfil our roles ,care for others , and so forth. I think they felt that it was best for everyone ,for an individual to be able to accept easily the slings and arrows of living, accept themselves and others for the somewhat ignorant meatbags ,I am, maybe we , are. if we get drawn into the chaos ,freak out and get upset ,even though we feel we know what is good, we stop being the force of harmony ,we are then taking sides, which may not be all that bad ...we may restore a better balance.. but it also may be working uphill, or just make things worse. Your life ,your call, its all Ok as far as Tao is unconcerned.

Edited April 8, 2015 by Stosh

[3bob]

Well there is T.T.C. chapter 51 in regards to worship:

.

51.
TAO gives them life,
Virtue nurses them,
Matter shapes them,
Environment perfects them.
Therefore all things without exception worship Tao and
  do homage to Virtue.
They have not been commanded to worship Tao and do
  homage to Virtue,
But they always do so spontaneously.

It is Tao that gives them life:
It is Virtue that nurses them, grows them, fosters them,
  shelters them, comforts them, nourishes them, and
  covers them under her wings.
To give life but to claim nothing,
To do your work but to set no store by it,
To be a leader, not a butcher,
This is called hidden Virtue.

[Marblehead]

Hi 3bob,

 

I am being picky here:

 

Henrick's translation of that line reads:

 

Therefore the ten thousand things venerate the Way and honor virtue.

 

The translation you quoted was likely by a religious person, probably a Christian.

[3bob]

it's interesting (so to speak) that little birds chirping to the sun in the morning follow the Tao more than we humans often do...

[Marblehead]

it's interesting (so to speak) that little birds chirping to the sun in the morning follow the Tao more than we humans often do...

Hehehe.  That has never been a question in my mind.

[Everything]

it's interesting (so to speak) that little birds chirping to the sun in the morning follow the Tao more than we humans often do...

That's true, but birds can't think and focus like humans can tho. So there we have our advantage.

And if we are able to have best of both worlds, chirp like a bird and focus like a human in all the specific directions of our free choosing of our capable and powerful mind, amazing experiences to be had.

The potential for humans are very high. And whoever doesn't fulfill their potential, it doesn't matter, they still have a reasonably good life. I can't speak for others, but I see most people pretty relaxed in life, just going about their business. And often allot of joy and smiles and laughter takes place aswell in public places in the city life. The great majority of life seems to be ok.

Occasional hick ups here and there. Some people experience discomfort, sadness or fear, but they don't have to. It is not necessary. It is far easier to just let life be ok as it already is. Whatever ways of looking at life they are used to, perhaps those are causing discomfort, and it is also a process to let go of that and allow new ways of looking at life and living it. Everyone has their process and way of evolving.

 

Exploring life from all the perspectives that we can, is fun. It is valuable. That's what makes up variety.

The "bad" variety, really, is usually just those hick ups I was talking about. People who are supose to be in their full value, but are used to focus in ways that blocks them from being who they really are. It is very temporary and insignificant in the greater scheme of things.

 

Cause as you have already said, and we know, there are more birds out there. And I bet the life of one bird is amazing enough to be really appreciated by us. A bird can inspire us to live our life more fully, and if one bird can do that, just wait till we see the rest this world has to offer.

In that sense, things are definitely always working out for us. If we only let ourselves open up to that being already so. We'll be able to see it more that way and allow it to enrich us with more inspired living. In the way. Of life and being. All things natural, made out of being good, moving forward, as we are always all moving forward, in life, naturally, and the journey keeps on going, it has no destination, so we enjoy the ride.

 

And whatever is on our path, we can be rest assured, it is part of that never ending journey and if we exist on that journey of ever moving forward, whatever comes on our path, we know, we will make it through. The suprise is, how we will make it through. Cause we'll always have new ways of moving through that journey.

 

Choices are many, and every choice is valid. Else they woulden't exist. So we know it has a point. Eventually we will discover the point of them. Like the journey, it has a gradual evolvement.

 

The ocean of knowledge has no bottom. So I love every second of discovering new things. Amazing is life, in that way.

 

Wether we are a bird, an ant or a human. The giant symphony holds many harmonies. And together we play.

Edited April 9, 2015 by Everything

[4bsolute]

I wonder what the highest most pure state of wei wu wei is. And what the best Way to achieve it.

 

I'm not sure, so the best thing I can come up with is worship. Cause in worship you surrender all effort, strive and action, naturally. What is left is a natural flow of appreciative expression, if the state of worship is maintained. You don't try to accomplish anything, because you feel already complete, and so whatever expression follows next is a natural expression of completion and is also in alignment with completion. Doing nothing and leaving nothing undone. Unless you risk worshipping a relative thing. In which case you leave allot of things undone.

 

What do you think? what is the most high and pure state of wei wu wei and what is the best most direct path to the achievement of it?

 

With my current understanding of wei wu wei, I would think wei wu wei is the most direct path to the accomplishment of wei wu wei.

 

It is beyond analysis, so thoughts wont bring you there. You wont really find answers anywhere in the form of information.

 

The most potent and "external way" would be through individuals who have directly experienced it and then being able to transmit this energy.

 

The only and last thought that there is, is that thought itself keeps oneself in the mental layer. Experiencing this state of existance is beyond the mental layer. That means, all what you think and therefor feel to be right now, will be down to zero. Your mind wont handle this, because it dies. Or it thinks it dies.

 

Therefor it is a gradual process. Also known as trancendence. Transcending this mind into a state of possible "constant channeling" the All-mind.

 

Your heart is this center. Inner Heart, Spiritual Heart. A couple of terms exist. This is the entry point of light with which you perceive your reality inside your being as energy and around you through your perception.

 

Generally one does practices like Shikentaza to still both emotions and thoughts. And to re-enter nothingness. For your mind: By thoughts and emotions being still, you will not perceive this world anymore.

 

Usually then one finds that it is not fulfilling to just do nothing. Because we are creators and we then go out into the world and "live" nothingness inside a created world. We dont just sit there and dissolve. We integrate it all. Maybe you can already imagine what joy this then is.

 

I puzzle this together, currently, because my experience goes so far, that I can enter states of feeling no emotions (calm) and having no thoughts (rare). While the environment continues to exist and not in isolation. No thoughts mean you have no concepts, nothing. All is. Sounds beautiful, but there are also no feelings connected to it. Because their interpretation ends, which happens through thought.

 

When you enter it conceptionally from the mind (which is ironic since this place is free from thought so every thought gets killed), I assume you feel "empty". And this empty is not pleasant. It has the notion of not wanting to be here, dying, no purpose.

 

That is why there also comes a "feeling" up that is greater than emotions. This feeling / knowing, expresses itself as being connected to everything, being able to do anything, being accepted by everything. A state of pure potentiality, so to speak.

 

I assume, I had a glimpse of it. Though it was very short, but it was so uplifting that I needed nothing else in that moment.

 

Essentially that is life, I believe from my short recollection "this" life: That life is pure potentiality wanting to be expressed, wanting to be expressed by you. You already know this when it comes "back online". And when you attempted to "reconnect to your childhood" somewhere in your life, it gets obvious because you have been there. You know you can do everything, the question is How. Not really why. But How.

 

And of course once you're in there and no other human with his or her concepts can stop you, you know yourself to be free again. Because who else has ever stopped you from anything? It was the belief system of this world, given by humanity. You can do this and you cant do that.

 

And now, coming out of this primordeal state more frequently and with consciousness, you then clearly know that You Yourself can formulate what You can do. You are the creator of Your beliefs and that they hold exactly equal power than mass consciousness. You might just feel an energetic difference between many individuals expressing a certain belief (mostly unconscious following) and your single - it all comes down to how Truly You know that You are Your center.

 

And when you have rediscovered Your center, through these practices and through understanding, then the explosion of mankind is near you, around you and it does no longer affect you. For you have tasted freedom again. And freedom is all there is. The Universe. God. You.

 

But you and I (ultimatelly only I in many shapes and forms, like "you" ) came here to experience just that. And that is the human experience. Limitations. All others shook their spiritual head Why would one ever downgrade onself in such a manner, where all is truly one... and here we are doing it to come out of it even greater.

 

It is such a joy to experience negativity, have it around you.. and be no longer affected. It is just like a breeze in the wind. When you can feel this, you are able to let the world be as it is.

 

A prime example because many of you have issues since childhood and sooner or later flee from their parents instead of coming on common ground with them. They see themselves in a better future when they live "alone" by themselves. But all they would have experienced with their parents, is coming from their own subconsciousness. This subconscious mind continues to play itself out, where ever you are. It is here for presenting you "accidental" experiences, that are not "accidental" at all. It is all webbed together through the subconscious mind.

 

Being free of the subconscious mind, is part of this experience you seek. It is not about changing it, because ultimatelly it cant be changed. Because change itself means that you are in resistance to it, which again, creates it further. That is why it is said Karma is eternal. Karma can never be uncreated. Karma = subconscious. But it can be lowered, drasticly. By being in a state of purity you speak of. Free from almost all desires. Because free from desires would then also mean that you as your soul no longer holds interest to be human

 

Imagine your own mother is standing near you and yells at you, while you write your text here. And you do not care, you simple let it be as it is... you are content you know that you are allowed to do anything. Now you can picture yourself what I just did. I was not even able to write a clear line with her words trying to "push" into my mind. I was answering her, my headphone curbing her loud and negative output and I noticed that it was just fanning the fire, regardless of what I said. Even and what I always do in such situations, being positive. It just brings it forward. So I stopped and just went back to center. I came back into me and focused gently on what I wanted to write. And sooner or later it became fluently, while she continued to speak. And then, because her words caught no further attention, there was no feedback. So basicly she talked to herself. Which of course makes her (usually) even more angry. Which is natural. Nobody to vent, you are yelling at yourself. And then it disappeared and my emotions are so silenced that I barely feel them any further. Silenced... call it purified. Freedom.

 

You are allowed to be. In any circumstance.

 

You are allowed to still these emotions, you are allowed to still these thoughts. And go beyond. You might see no one around you performing this task, because it is really, really rare (from my experience). But people will notice you and they will ask questions. And at one point you will share your experience and the wonders of living this way.

 

You are consciousness, crystallized through focusing into this human form. You can re-learn how to expand this consciousness. This consciousness has no root, no anchor point. Consciousness is everywhere, so you can be everywhere. And in this human form, I believe (and I hope so). Possibly I am just creating this experience yes I actually know I do, right at this moment. I can come "back". Being in all locations and then being and living in / as this body again.

 

Combining it all. Life agrees and allows. Because I am no different to Life. I feel reconnected to a far greater extend. And who has re-established this connection? Who is writing with all of you in this forum? I am. I do, consciously.

 

 

And I am, you. I am not speaking from a personal me. I am speaking from an "able" me. I am able (to). Come to a state of feeling yourself (more and more) as purely "I am". Am. State. And this ability to be is natural. And equal. So you can be whatever you want to be, coming out of this "I am". What has limited you and stopped you previously, was your surrounding.

 

And this idenfitication with your surrounding is necessary to experience yourself "in between" the forms. But of course we let go off extremes. And extreme has become that "I go out there to fill a hole in me" and that "I eat this form, so I feel complete". It is about feeling more and more complete by yourself. Autonomous. Full power. Freedom.

 

We will all get there. We are all doing this, regardless of what other I's currently think and what short-term desires they have "they" is also an illusion. It is, all. Not even using the term "one" any longer, because that implies duality and seperation.

 

 

I wish I could keep these pair of earbuds/earphones on the entire day, because Sound affects us so much. I feel it affects me more than seeing.

 

Practice looking between the objects, to "increase" the space element in your consciousness. And practice hearing silence between sound. I am currently figuring out how to do the latter. These are such beautiful tools to "dim" the noise in this world and live peacefully. An important tool for a possibly louder future the more we focusing, the more we become "that".

 

 

Do more of what you want to do. It is personal and it lets you truly be who you are. Grab a headphone, listed to meditative music, if you have no opportunity to "blind out" externals - and create something. Feel how you get "fuller" inside. In my experience, this leads to deeper meditations. A paradox. I am me all the time and in meditation I suddenly become everything. While on the contrary when focusing outside of oneself, I am apparently everything all the time and want to control because I feel I cant control and then I am experiencing stillness either forced or through exhaustion and I can not bear it, because I want to control there also.

 

 

Writing this was fun! Hope reading is also Thank you for the opportunity.

 

αΩ

Edited April 8, 2015 by 4bsolute

[Stosh]

Hi 3bob,

 

I am being picky here:

 

Henrick's translation of that line reads:

 

Therefore the ten thousand things venerate the Way and honor virtue.

 

The translation you quoted was likely by a religious person, probably a Christian.

I'd bet money , that the second to last line is backwards since conventional ideas about leadership vs menial labors bestows virtue on the leader, and so the hidden virtue ,would have to be that of the butcher, who isn't claiming the honors.

So I am agreeing this translation may have been made by a person with conventional 'christian' attitudes.

Edited April 8, 2015 by Stosh

[Everything]

It is beyond analysis, so thoughts wont bring you there. You wont really find answers anywhere in the form of information.

 

The most potent and "external way" would be through individuals who have directly experienced it and then being able to transmit this energy.

 

The only and last thought that there is, is that thought itself keeps oneself in the mental layer. Experiencing this state of existance is beyond the mental layer. That means, all what you think and therefor feel to be right now, will be down to zero. Your mind wont handle this, because it dies. Or it thinks it dies.

 

Therefor it is a gradual process. Also known as trancendence. Transcending this mind into a state of possible "constant channeling" the All-mind.

 

Your heart is this center. Inner Heart, Spiritual Heart. A couple of terms exist. This is the entry point of light with which you perceive your reality inside your being as energy and around you through your perception.

 

Generally one does practices like Shikentaza to still both emotions and thoughts. And to re-enter nothingness. For your mind: By thoughts and emotions being still, you will not perceive this world anymore.

 

Usually then one finds that it is not fulfilling to just do nothing. Because we are creators and we then go out into the world and "live" nothingness inside a created world. We dont just sit there and dissolve. We integrate it all. Maybe you can already imagine what joy this then is.

 

I puzzle this together, currently, because my experience goes so far, that I can enter states of feeling no emotions (calm) and having no thoughts (rare). While the environment continues to exist and not in isolation. No thoughts mean you have no concepts, nothing. All is. Sounds beautiful, but there are also no feelings connected to it. Because their interpretation ends, which happens through thought.

 

When you enter it conceptionally from the mind (which is ironic since this place is free from thought so every thought gets killed), I assume you feel "empty". And this empty is not pleasant. It has the notion of not wanting to be here, dying, no purpose.

 

That is why there also comes a "feeling" up that is greater than emotions. This feeling / knowing, expresses itself as being connected to everything, being able to do anything, being accepted by everything. A state of pure potentiality, so to speak.

 

I assume, I had a glimpse of it. Though it was very short, but it was so uplifting that I needed nothing else in that moment.

 

Essentially that is life, I believe from my short recollection "this" life: That life is pure potentiality wanting to be expressed, wanting to be expressed by you. You already know this when it comes "back online". And when you attempted to "reconnect to your childhood" somewhere in your life, it gets obvious because you have been there. You know you can do everything, the question is How. Not really why. But How.

 

And of course once you're in there and no other human with his or her concepts can stop you, you know yourself to be free again. Because who else has ever stopped you from anything? It was the belief system of this world, given by humanity. You can do this and you cant do that.

 

And now, coming out of this primordeal state more frequently and with consciousness, you then clearly know that You Yourself can formulate what You can do. You are the creator of Your beliefs and that they hold exactly equal power than mass consciousness. You might just feel an energetic difference between many individuals expressing a certain belief (mostly unconscious following) and your single - it all comes down to how Truly You know that You are Your center.

 

And when you have rediscovered Your center, through these practices and through understanding, then the explosion of mankind is near you, around you and it does no longer affect you. For you have tasted freedom again. And freedom is all there is. The Universe. God. You.

 

But you and I (ultimatelly only I in many shapes and forms, like "you" ) came here to experience just that. And that is the human experience. Limitations. All others shook their spiritual head Why would one ever downgrade onself in such a manner, where all is truly one... and here we are doing it to come out of it even greater.

 

It is such a joy to experience negativity, have it around you.. and be no longer affected. It is just like a breeze in the wind. When you can feel this, you are able to let the world be as it is.

 

A prime example because many of you have issues since childhood and sooner or later flee from their parents instead of coming on common ground with them. They see themselves in a better future when they live "alone" by themselves. But all they would have experienced with their parents, is coming from their own subconsciousness. This subconscious mind continues to play itself out, where ever you are. It is here for presenting you "accidental" experiences, that are not "accidental" at all. It is all webbed together through the subconscious mind.

 

Being free of the subconscious mind, is part of this experience you seek. It is not about changing it, because ultimatelly it cant be changed. Because change itself means that you are in resistance to it, which again, creates it further. That is why it is said Karma is eternal. Karma can never be uncreated. Karma = subconscious. But it can be lowered, drasticly. By being in a state of purity you speak of. Free from almost all desires. Because free from desires would then also mean that you as your soul no longer holds interest to be human

 

Imagine your own mother is standing near you and yells at you, while you write your text here. And you do not care, you simple let it be as it is... you are content you know that you are allowed to do anything. Now you can picture yourself what I just did. I was not even able to write a clear line with her words trying to "push" into my mind. I was answering her, my headphone curbing her loud and negative output and I noticed that it was just fanning the fire, regardless of what I said. Even and what I always do in such situations, being positive. It just brings it forward. So I stopped and just went back to center. I came back into me and focused gently on what I wanted to write. And sooner or later it became fluently, while she continued to speak. And then, because her words caught no further attention, there was no feedback. So basicly she talked to herself. Which of course makes her (usually) even more angry. Which is natural. Nobody to vent, you are yelling at yourself. And then it disappeared and my emotions are so silenced that I barely feel them any further. Silenced... call it purified. Freedom.

 

You are allowed to be. In any circumstance.

 

You are allowed to still these emotions, you are allowed to still these thoughts. And go beyond. You might see no one around you performing this task, because it is really, really rare (from my experience). But people will notice you and they will ask questions. And at one point you will share your experience and the wonders of living this way.

 

You are consciousness, crystallized through focusing into this human form. You can re-learn how to expand this consciousness. This consciousness has no root, no anchor point. Consciousness is everywhere, so you can be everywhere. And in this human form, I believe (and I hope so). Possibly I am just creating this experience yes I actually know I do, right at this moment. I can come "back". Being in all locations and then being and living in / as this body again.

 

Combining it all. Life agrees and allows. Because I am no different to Life. I feel reconnected to a far greater extend. And who has re-established this connection? Who is writing with all of you in this forum? I am. I do, consciously.

 

 

And I am, you. I am not speaking from a personal me. I am speaking from an "able" me. I am able (to). Come to a state of feeling yourself (more and more) as purely "I am". Am. State. And this ability to be is natural. And equal. So you can be whatever you want to be, coming out of this "I am". What has limited you and stopped you previously, was your surrounding.

 

And this idenfitication with your surrounding is necessary to experience yourself "in between" the forms. But of course we let go off extremes. And extreme has become that "I go out there to fill a hole in me" and that "I eat this form, so I feel complete". It is about feeling more and more complete by yourself. Autonomous. Full power. Freedom.

 

We will all get there. We are all doing this, regardless of what other I's currently think and what short-term desires they have "they" is also an illusion. It is, all. Not even using the term "one" any longer, because that implies duality and seperation.

 

 

I wish I could keep these pair of earbuds/earphones on the entire day, because Sound affects us so much. I feel it affects me more than seeing.

 

Practice looking between the objects, to "increase" the space element in your consciousness. And practice hearing silence between sound. I am currently figuring out how to do the latter. These are such beautiful tools to "dim" the noise in this world and live peacefully. An important tool for a possibly louder future the more we focusing, the more we become "that".

 

 

Do more of what you want to do. It is personal and it lets you truly be who you are. Grab a headphone, listed to meditative music, if you have no opportunity to "blind out" externals - and create something. Feel how you get "fuller" inside. In my experience, this leads to deeper meditations. A paradox. I am me all the time and in meditation I suddenly become everything. While on the contrary when focusing outside of oneself, I am apparently everything all the time and want to control because I feel I cant control and then I am experiencing stillness either forced or through exhaustion and I can not bear it, because I want to control there also.

 

 

Writing this was fun! Hope reading is also Thank you for the opportunity.

 

αΩ

Yeah reading that was allot of fun

 

Regarding control, I'm glad I don't have to control everything.

 

I enjoy having a stable platform on which we can relate and create. The potential for satisfying experiences are high, the way things are expressing in creation in the particular way it was created. It is a continuous stream of evolvement that is very stable at its core and very expansive as a result.

 

The Earth spinning in its orbit, to such great precision. I bless the one who created these things. May their name be exalted.

 

Some people say Jesus made everything, some say God made everything. I don't know, but I really appreciate people are often trying to find out too, and looking for the One aswell.

 

Certainly, I don't believe in worshipping people.

 

I know Jesus said, the kingdom of heaven is within you, go forth and seek Joy.

 

So I trust that whoever or whatever created us, is right with us, every step along the way. Even closer then we are close to our selves. Even more knowing, then we know ourselves.

 

Whatever our Source is, however we may call it. It leaves nothing undone, so it will not leave us undone either.

 

I believe every thing and every one will eventually come into their full value. No matter how they may go about doing it, it will happen. I just think it will, else creation would not last so long and be so big and work out so well as it does. I believe there's a point to all of it. Even if only to allow us to give it a point.

Edited April 9, 2015 by Everything