The Laozi as a Manual of Neidan

[Saoshun]

It's scary how nobody can see true meaning of this words and take them as exoteric meaning. All this interpretation is wrong. 

Edited April 13, 2015 by Saoshun

[dust]

Please, enlighten me

[Saoshun]

Please, enlighten me

 

 

The whole interpratation just spring from deviant mind, it the sense people are making out everything based on their logical mind, logical mind have no use to understand what is right, it can only understand what is wrong, [you actually logically pointed out what is wrong but you consider it as right because it's make logical sense, it's self manipulative process, people use it all the time with all their ideas in the diets, business etc.] the people is not the people you think off. That's why the spiritual traditions keep secrets because people who interpreted this way make sense to the logic mind [the people] of other deviated people who are lack of wisdom, ego-mind or the shi-shen, these ideas are products of shi-shen mostly people are shi-shen so they will grasp into that ideas because they make sense on the shi-shen level and making them more ignorant and attached to the conceptions like this. Tao Te Ching even name is self explaining, nobody seems to even recognize what it means but they took interpretation of the texts. I wish to enlight you but having mind like this it would be like trowing water on the wall, you can only make the sword when the crude is well heated and then well sharped. At this level of understanding there is no hope so you should do a lot of merit. 

 

 

You just reflected your own state of ignorance as the people who being manipulated, entanglement actual brings true answer. Think about it well. 

Edited April 15, 2015 by Saoshun

[dust]

I get the feeling you're using Google Translate or something similar to try and get some of your sentences across..? I'm not understanding everything you say. But I think I get the general idea.

 

I think that next time you want to tell someone they're wrong, you need to

 

1. have done some research into the topic at hand (in this case, the ancient text called the Guodian Laozi)

2. back up your ideas with real explanations (rather than "I can't explain because you're too stupid/ignorant to get it")

3. not be condescending; it doesn't work when the above 2 criteria aren't met

 

Otherwise, even though you might well be correct in your understanding, I'm not listening to you, and you've contributed nothing.

 

Edited April 15, 2015 by dustybeijing

[Taoist Texts]

You just reflected your own state of ignorance as the people who being manipulated, entanglement actual brings true answer. Think about it well. 

Saoshan please do not take it personally but what you say does not make any sense. Sorry again.

[Taoist Texts]

2. back up your ideas with real explanations (rather than "I can't explain because you're too stupid/ignorant to get it")

 

as a total aside normally for me that would be a reasonable explanation. I am all of the above. Just saying.

[Saoshun]

as a total aside normally for me that would be a reasonable explanation. I am all of the above. Just saying.

 

 

Yes you are to stupid and ignorant to get it, that's why you creating stupid and ignorant ideas about the texts you do not understanding as you can't face your ignorant and stupid ways. As little kid at the dinner table who will not eat food because he thinks something about it but when he taste it, he realize it's stupidity (but most people after tasting still have a problem such a stupid ignorant human-animals are)

 

If you want understand text first you must understand your low and stupid position in the world, otherwise you will just endlessly fall into the same trap even animals are not that stupid so how you can realize the Tao? 

 

"You just reflected your own state of ignorance as the people who being manipulated, entanglement actual brings true answer. Think about it well. "

 

It's means that if you can face your stupid and ignorant nature which tries to explain everything maybe you can find something in it.

 

 

"Is the carrot the cause of the chicken soup 

Or is it the chicken

Or is it the broth

Or is it the cook?"

 

You are fools like this, thinking that they working about something profound but really wasting life, I would suggest to just start live simple life or get a life firstly, because mostly of you just hide from reality in bullshiting yourself into taoism, buddhism etc. that's why 99% people fail. That what is also called "dharma decline". Spreading theories like this it's a shame and I can even see Lao Tzu facepalming on the bull.

 

Trying to cook sand to get rice. Good luck with that. 

Edited April 15, 2015 by Saoshun

[Stosh]

Shaoshun, I understand your point, you feel the intellectualization , the conscious attempt to decipher the text is misguided. It defies conclusions. I disagree though, thats all. But I am curious as to why, from your point of view, it would be written?

[dust]

OK, you've got your point across. You don't like people discussing things. You know it all, and everyone else is an ignorant child. Fair enough.

 

But as you clearly have no desire to contribute to any academic/linguistic/theoretical/historical discussion of the text, I'll kindly ask you to keep your opinions elsewhere from now on. Thanks...

[Saoshun]

I disagree though, thats all. But I am curious as to why, from your point of view, it would be written?

 

It was written but it was not for you. It the sense people took it and inverted cause as the effect and effect as the cause. People took it and take it as granted not realizing the Way. Today people can get on hold any scripture they want and take it as granted. Unless you develop clarity and insight these texts are not for you or anybody. you do not give blind people book as a present. it happens just blind people bump on such scriptures and take it as granted. 

 

What I can contribute? What else you need? Just cut off the way you approach to it, can't you see that? I gave you everything in this sentence but you still just bump your head blindly so why do you approach such texts ? That's a lack of insight, wisdom and clarity. If person with sun on his head would hear it, would marvel, but sitting in the dark you just eating but still starving, it make no sense. 

[Stosh]

It was written but it was not for you. It the sense people took it and inverted cause as the effect and effect as the cause. People took it and take it as granted not realizing the Way. Today people can get on hold any scripture they want and take it as granted. Unless you develop clarity and insight these texts are not for you or anybody. you do not give blind people book as a present. it happens just blind people bump on such scriptures and take it as granted. 

 

What I can contribute? What else you need? Just cut off the way you approach to it, can't you see that? I gave you everything in this sentence but you still just bump your head blindly so why do you approach such texts ? That's a lack of insight, wisdom and clarity. If person with sun on his head would hear it, would marvel, but sitting in the dark you just eating but still starving, it make no sense. 

So, to you , the texts make no sense? is that correct?

[Taoist Texts]

"Is the carrot the cause of the chicken soup 

Or is it the chicken

Or is it the broth

Or is it the cook?"

 

i would say its a mild disorder and will pass with age. Grandiose type: delusion of inflated worth, power, knowledge, identity . we all need help from time to time.

[dawei]

Yes you are to stupid and ignorant to get it, that's why you creating stupid and ignorant ideas about the texts you do not understanding as you can't face your ignorant and stupid ways. As little kid at the dinner table who will not eat food because he thinks something about it but when he taste it, he realize it's stupidity (but most people after tasting still have a problem such a stupid ignorant human-animals are)

 

~~~ Admin Message ~~~

 

This is a discussion forum.  Sometimes people rant or vent or get frustrated.  

 

As a newer member, maybe the setting has not taken hold yet.

 

But we welcome your ideas and discussion.

 

thanks.

 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

[Saoshun]

Texts make sense but only for those who find sense already and want change that sense into Tao. This text is not philosophical nor exoteric etc. 

 

Sentient being walking thru the forest only the trees and grass, leafs. Doctor see medicine, the text is based on your inner sense. Tao Te Ching is strict neidan text. If you think otherwise you know nothing.

 

I'm not ranting or get frustrated as nobody have privilege to disturb me but my way of speaking is very intense, sorry if someone took it as rant but it's not if you think otherwise guess what? You are... s... and i...

 

@Taoist Texts

 

Labeling people is cutting off head of chicken who drops golden eggs. 

Edited April 15, 2015 by Saoshun

[dawei]

I'm not ranting or get frustrated as nobody have privilege to disturb me but my way of speaking is very intense, sorry if someone took it as rant but

it's not if you think otherwise guess what? You are... s... and i...

 

~~~ Admin Message ~~~

 

I see at another website you post at, your posts are quite calm.    

 

For some reason, you want to claim here it is your intense side.

 

So has something here caused your intense side to 'come out of the closet' ?

 

That was rhetorical.

 

Please take time to consider your posting.   

 

I am not part of a discussion here... this is similar to a gentle warning... maybe you didn't understand an Admin text

 

Read carefully.

 

Thanks in advance.

 

Everyone carry on  

 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

[Stosh]

Texts make sense but only for those who find sense already and want change that sense into Tao. This text is not philosophical nor exoteric etc. 

 

Sentient being walking thru the forest only the trees and grass, leafs. Doctor see medicine, the text is based on your inner sense. Tao Te Ching is strict neidan text. If you think otherwise you know nothing.

.

 

@Taoist Texts

 

Labeling people is cutting off head of chicken who drops golden eggs. 

Fine,

I'm asking if you understand the texts. You personally, you speaking for yourself,  rather than the population in general.

Edited April 15, 2015 by Stosh

[Taoist Texts]

  Tao Te Ching is strict neidan text.  

ah that explaines it. we all remember neidan.

[dust]

Guys..my friends.. if you're intent on humouring him, would you mind doing it in a new topic?

I'm happy to go off-topic every now and then, but this is beyond that... he's trying to stifle discussion of any sort...

Edited April 15, 2015 by dustybeijing

[Saoshun]

Guys..my friends.. if you're intent on humouring him, would you mind doing it in a new topic?

I'm happy to go off-topic every now and then, but this is beyond that... he's trying to stifle discussion of any sort...

 

 

Mules always go there where is carrot on stick, thristy always go for the water you can't help it.

 

 

What I understand is beyond text as there is nothing to understand but to practice true understanding of the texts it's beyond the text. You can't really understand the text, that why I said you cooking sand to make a rice. Trying to understand is neurosis. 

 

If you didn't find mysterious pass it's better to hear then to read. Without ear there is no eye, without eye there is no knowledge.

Edited April 15, 2015 by Saoshun

[dust]

好，你真的很了解我。 《道德经》 内容我一点儿也不懂.... 我永远不会懂

 

这你都知道，那你这些磨磨叽叽的话有什么用？

[Marblehead]

好，你真的很了解我。 《道德经》 内容我一点儿也不懂.... 我永远不会懂

 

这你都知道，那你这些磨磨叽叽的话有什么用？

I'm sure that was well spoken.

 

I haven't said anything lately as the discussion went too far off topic.

 

TTC - The Rule of Law.

 

Not really but not wrong either.

[Taoist Texts]

Guys..my friends.. if you're intent on humouring him, would you mind doing it in a new topic?

I'm happy to go off-topic every now and then, but this is beyond that... he's trying to stifle discussion of any sort...

I concur, lets petition Dawei to split this into a new topic titled 'LZ as a neidan manual' or whatev

 

I never tire of hearing neidanists' key argument in favor of that. It goes like this:

 

The neidanist: LZ is neidan!

I: Because...?

The neidanist: BECAUSE ANYTHING COULD  BE A METAPHOR FOR NEIDAN, YOU FOOL!

[Stosh]

Mules always go there where is carrot on stick, thristy always go for the water you can't help it.

 

 

What I understand is beyond text as there is nothing to understand but to practice true understanding of the texts it's beyond the text. You can't really understand the text, that why I said you cooking sand to make a rice. Trying to understand is neurosis. 

 

If you didn't find mysterious pass it's better to hear then to read. Without ear there is no eye, without eye there is no knowledge.

Yes or no would do just fine , you understand things that arent the texts , fine ,, someone would have to know what the texts say , or they have no purpose ,  right , they would be useless , just meaningless ink on bamboo- unless someone could derive something from them .

Do you understand the texts  , ANY of them ? just say it. 

[dust]

Thank you dawei

[thelerner]

Seems like a valid subject to me.  It'd be nice to understand it better.  (if it can go beyond the 'you all know nothing' phase)  I wonder if its widely thought in China that other cultures are misreading the DDC.  Many translations were done by the Chinese.  

 

Some are way more out there then others.  They run the gamut from practical to mystical, a few alchemical.   People find a translation that rings true with them and get great benefit from it.  Its a good book.

 

Saoshun can you give an example how its misread? 

Edited April 15, 2015 by thelerner