Come gather round people, and hear the Good News!

[Nikolai1]

I am a double graduate of the sciences, an erstwhile Clinical Psychologist, an ardent student of Western Philosophy, an existentialist , a one-time nihilist and current practitioner of Zen and mindfulness meditation.

 

I am no longer a seeker, but one who has found.  Despite only scant familiarity with the Bible, I proclaim myself authorised to teach in the tongue of the Christian, (although my nation's Church does not agree).  Nevertheless, good people, be pleased to hear the Good News spoken to you this day:

 

1)     You are already loved By God. Do nothing more to earn this love.  It is already there burning in your heart.  Stop, be still, and feel it.  Feel it, and let it kindle and glow.  The embers have never gone out, and will never go out.

2)     You are not in Sin, and you have never sinned.  Sin is a figment of your imagination.  Your inability to believe this is the only Sin that God would consent to call that name.  To refuse the gift of Love is sin.  To believe you need to earn Love, is sin. To believe you need to rid yourself of sin, is sin.

3)     When the Apostle Paul told you that Jesus atoned for your sin, it was a benevolent lie for your childish minds.  If a child believes there is a spider in their bed, we must tell them that we killed the spider, though we could not find it because it was not there.

4)     Jesus was a human like you.  The only difference is that he understood points 1 and 2, whereas you do not.  Your elevation of Jesus is nothing other than a perverse attachment to your idea of being a sinner.  Were he to meet you, he would despair of the infantile worship you show him.  He would see you as a Pharisee.  He would lament that there is nothing new under the sun.

5)     Your Christianity is a grievance to Jesus. Repent Ye, for the Love of God is ever at hand.

 

Go in peace etc.

Edited May 27, 2015 by Nikolai1

[Marblehead]

Well, we already knew you are a Christian, didn't we?

 

Thanks for the uplifting words and thoughts.

 

(I will remain a Taoist though.  Hehehe.)

[Nikolai1]

Burn in hell, heathen thou!

[Edward M]

Nikolai, you might be interested in the works of Lewis Keiser.  He has gotten to the core of Yeshua's teachings through proper translation etc  he also holds apostolic succession in authentic gnostic lineages through Yeshua's disciples as well as orthodox apostolic succession. 

 

 

His HomeTemple training allows one to have the apostolic succession handed to them and include teachings from other traditions, be it shamanism, daoism, buddhism etc.

 

Edward

[3bob]

not all bad but you need to see a shrink...

[Marblehead]

not all bad but you need to see a shrink...

You talkin' to me?

[3bob]

nope, the op with the loose antlers

Edited May 27, 2015 by 3bob

[Nungali]

Burn in hell, heathen thou!

 

 

Oh ... can I be cast into hell by declaration too ?  There is a conversation I have not finished with Marblehead yet, its winter here and getting a bit cold ....

 

... we could chat and keep warm ... and watch the show 

 

 

[Cheshire Cat]

Today, science tells us that the essence of nature is being.

 

We heal, we live, we are reborn. We exist as electromagnetic resonance.

Throughout history, humans have been interacting with the quantum cycle via frequencies.

Consciousness consists of a resonance cascade of quantum energy. “Quantum” means an awakening of the sublime. You and I are warriors of the nexus. The goal of molecular structures is to plant the seeds of wonder rather than bondage.

Nothing is impossible. By deepening, we exist. To embark on the quest is to become one with it.

This life is nothing short of a refining oasis of primordial wellbeing. Serenity is the driver of energy. Complexity is the nature of non-locality, and of us.

The planet is full of ultra-sentient particles. Grace requires exploration. Interconnectedness is a constant.

You will soon be recreated by a power deep within yourself — a power that is intergalatic, zero-point. Through feng shui, our chakras are immersed in ecstasy. As you self-actualize, you will enter into infinite will that transcends understanding.

[Aetherous]

I'm sure most of the forum isn't interested in getting into a Christianity discussion, and your post was mostly playful rather than of a serious and direct nature...but here is a definite inconsistency...

 

2)     You are not in Sin, and you have never sinned.  Sin is a figment of your imagination.  Your inability to believe this is the only Sin that God would consent to call that name.  To refuse the gift of Love is sin.  To believe you need to earn Love, is sin. To believe you need to rid yourself of sin, is sin.

 

4)     Jesus was a human like you.  The only difference is that he understood points 1 and 2, whereas you do not.

 

Anyone who reads Jesus' words in the Bible knows that he didn't consider sin to be a figment of the imagination. It's also not one of his teachings in any way to say that "the only sin is believing there is sin", or that "believing you need to earn Love is a sin", or that "believing you need to rid yourself of sin, is a sin". None of these ideas have to do with Jesus.

For instance, here are some of his actual words...

 

“Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’ Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’ - Matthew 7:21-23 NIV

 

So that is an example showing how Jesus spoke of obeying the Law (other translations say lawbreakers instead of evildoers), or the Will of the Father...which is to say, not sinning. And that if you do "sin", you won't achieve success in his teachings, even if you use his name (for instance if you call yourself a Christian but then rape and murder people or something...it's missing the point entirely).

 

If you have your own teaching to share based on your personal experience, then that can be a good thing. But here you were putting words in the mouth of someone who isn't going to correct you, unfortunately...and actually, words which contradict what that person said and the core of their teaching.

Just pointing this out in the spirit of adding to your knowledge...not trying to be argumentative or something. Maybe you won't want to associate yourself and your philosophy with a teaching that directly contradicts what you think.

[Nungali]

Thats all rather theological .....  

 

Look ... do me and Marbles get to watch the cheerleaders or not ?  ... that's what I want to know ! 

[Aetherous]

Thats all rather theological .....  

 

I was hoping it wouldn't come off that way, and would just come off as being about not misquoting teachers.

 

Look ... do me and Marbles get to watch the cheerleaders or not ?  ... that's what I want to know ! 

 

I hear they like to dance to this tune...

 

[idiot_stimpy]

Thats all rather theological .....  

 

Look ... do me and Marbles get to watch the cheerleaders or not ?  ... that's what I want to know ! 

 

 

[idiot_stimpy]

not all bad but you need to see a shrink...

 

He already is one that can't prescribe meds.

[Nikolai1]

Hi Aethereous

 

You are right that this thread is mostly a work of satire, but it's new and fun to become a Christian exegete for a while, so I will defend myself...Jesus says:

 

“Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 

You then interpret doing the will of the father as not being a sinner...

 

So that is an example showing how Jesus spoke of obeying the Law (other translations say lawbreakers instead of evildoers), or the Will of the Father...which is to say, not sinning.

 

So what is sin? Well one thing that Jesus made very clear throughout his short ministry is that sin has nothing to do with breaking the Law of Moses.  He was quite prepared to break the law as he saw fit. Breaking the law,for example, by healing on the sabbath, is how everyone else around him thought of sin, but not him.  He had something else in mind.

 

Did he have a new different set of rules and commandments?

 

No, his only requirement is the rather vague suggestion that we 'love God with all our heart and all our soul and all our strength and all our mind.

 

So how do we 'do the will of our father?'

 

Doing the will of the father is putting yourself in such an attitude of surrender, that you are able, on a moment by moment basis, to know what is required.  When such surrender is possible for you, you no longer need any rigid guidance engraved on tablets of stone.  The law is engraved upon your heart and you are a law unto yourself, which is being a law unto God.

 

To do the will of the father is pure wu wei, and this is what Jesus taught to his uncomprehending followers.

 

Specific ideas about sin, are the lot of the unregenerate.  Only those who do not love and trust God will preoccupy themselves with what is and isn't sin.  

 

The one who is beloved of God will adhere to the Law of his people and break the Law as he sees fit.  In the words of Jesus: 'I come not to destroy the Law but to fulfill it'

 

Wu Wei is the Law that all the world's laws try to capture. By not capturing the law Jesus captured it, taught it, and lived it.

[Marblehead]

I hear they like to dance to this tune...

I would enjoy watching that!

[Marblehead]

 

Wu Wei is the Law that all the world's laws try to capture. By not capturing the law Jesus captured it, taught it, and lived it.

... and died by it.

[Nikolai1]

... and died by it.

Yesterday afternoon I spent a pleasant hour mooching about the website of Lewis Keiser - thank you Edward M for the suggestion.

 

I read the Gospel of Judas Iscariot, once a widely read Christian scripture but since deemed non-canonical.  So the ancient idea was that Judas' betrayal was Jesus' plan.  Judas was the only disciple whose vision was broad enough to see that the death of Jesus's body was no loss, but a necessary gain.

 

Early Christianity is interesting by anyone's standard. This is of particular interest to the Daoist mind.

Edited May 28, 2015 by Nikolai1

[blue eyed snake]

well, i'm decidedly no christian, and never was

but i seem to remember that it was prophesied that jesus  would enter Jerusalem shortly before pesach on a young donkey and then die. So methinks he just followed the prophecy? and needed someone, Judas, to help fulfill his destinied death.

 

so that doesn't seem ' news' to me...

[Nikolai1]

So Jesus is a simple case of planned and assisted suicide!

 

Man, this whole website will burn in hell!

[Apech]

So Jesus is a simple case of planned and assisted suicide!

 

Man, this whole website will burn in hell!

 

 

Or the end of an alchemical process.

[Brian]

I was hoping it wouldn't come off that way, and would just come off as being about not misquoting teachers.

 

 

I hear they like to dance to this tune...

 

The Zippers are absolutely fantastic in concert, BTW. I would encourage everyone to take the opportunity to see them if you ever get the chance. (Yeah, I've seen them a few times -- my favorite was a New Year's Eve show...)

 

This version captures them better:

[Ya Mu]

Yep, Listening and Wu Wei; the process I call "Dancing in the Wu Wei". For it is not a simple following, but a true Dance of intertwining energetics. Doing this is the essence of all the internal teachings and a mind blowing trip of synergistic harmony. The Will of the Light, God's Will, the Breath of the Great Mystery, the Harmony of Creation, the Ebb and Flow of Tao between Heaven and Earth - a "sin" to not follow as the "sin" is not being one's true-self.

Don't believe anything - just do, attempting at all times to be in harmony with the mysterious ebb and flow. paddling along with Creation instead of paddling upstream. What an interesting ride!

 

...

 

Doing the will of the father is putting yourself in such an attitude of surrender, that you are able, on a moment by moment basis, to know what is required.  When such surrender is possible for you, you no longer need any rigid guidance engraved on tablets of stone.  The law is engraved upon your heart and you are a law unto yourself, which is being a law unto God.

 

To do the will of the father is pure wu wei, and this is what Jesus taught to his uncomprehending followers.

 

...

[Brian]

Yep, Listening and Wu Wei; the process I call "Dancing in the Wu Wei". For it is not a simple following, but a true Dance of intertwining energetics. Doing this is the essence of all the internal teachings and a mind blowing trip of synergistic harmony. The Will of the Light, God's Will, the Breath of the Great Mystery, the Harmony of Creation, the Ebb and Flow of Tao between Heaven and Earth - a "sin" to not follow as the "sin" is not being one's true-self.

Don't believe anything - just do, attempting at all times to be in harmony with the mysterious ebb and flow. paddling along with Creation instead of paddling upstream. What an interesting ride!

This has been a most eye-opening and life-changing practice for me.

 

EDIT: "Practice" isn't quite the right word here -- it has been a paradigm shift and a profound alteration of/at the core of my perception.

[3bob]

for every Jesus said this context, there is also a Jesus said that context....

 

Btw, without sin how could anyone learn non-sin...?  I'd also say or believe that no spiritual master would take back such hard lessons that ended up with their learning.