Lead to gold - any guide books out there?

[Nungali]

Vorticity and helicity are strange and wonderful things.

 

I am embarrassed to admit that I thought a vortex was an expression of a helix      ... am I a genius or do I change my avatar pic ?

[Nungali]

Will you take a check?

 

I bet you can transmute a paper check into a rubber one . 

[Brian]

 

I am embarrassed to admit that I thought a vortex was an expression of a helix ... am I a genius or do I change my avatar pic ?

Strictly speaking, helix is a vortex translated along its axis -- a vortex is two-dimensional and a helix is three-dimensional. In common usage, though, the distinction tends to be blurred.

 

It is difficult to discuss without using the language of mathematics but Wikipedia has a decent starting point.

[Rara]

Lead to gold - any guide books out there?

I have such a book. I am willing to lend it out for 1.25 Trillion dollars in gold or lead.

Sounds like a rental to me. I'll pass, that's a bit steep...I don't have nearly enough lead.

[Nungali]

Strictly speaking, helix is a vortex translated along its axis -- a vortex is two-dimensional and a helix is three-dimensional. In common usage, though, the distinction tends to be blurred.

 

It is difficult to discuss without using the language of mathematics but Wikipedia has a decent starting point.

 

 

Then this is a helix and not a vortex ?

 

 

[9th]

[nine tailed fox]

you know i might help you

 

i belong to india, and as my family legend goes, my grand grand father was a astrologer and also magician, or something like tantra practitioner

 

he did write his wisdom on paper but someone from my family sold all his papers for some money  (i wish i could get those papers)

 

but few days ago my grand father gave few remaining papers to my father, and guess what, whats in it , its the method of making gold

 

i will see if i can retrieve the method, because the papers are in bad condition, i will have to put them together, and understand what he is trying to say

[Brian]

Then this is a helix and not a vortex ?

 

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Magnetic_deflection_helical_path.svg

 

Well, there's some gray area related to a rotation projected onto a closed surface, and there is a tendency in the field of meteorology to play fast & loose with terminology but yes. While either word is generally acceptable, "helix" would be more proper and more descriptive.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Magnetic_deflection_helical_path.svg

[Michael Sternbach]

So I guess Schauberger's famous "vortex" is actually also a helix, rigorously speaking.

 

 

Edit: Not really going OT here, since some believe that Schauberger's implosion repulsine could be used for transmuting chemical elements.

Edited June 14, 2015 by Michael Sternbach

[Rara]

you know i might help you

 

i belong to india, and as my family legend goes, my grand grand father was a astrologer and also magician, or something like tantra practitioner

 

he did write his wisdom on paper but someone from my family sold all his papers for some money (i wish i could get those papers)

 

but few days ago my grand father gave few remaining papers to my father, and guess what, whats in it , its the method of making gold

 

i will see if i can retrieve the method, because the papers are in bad condition, i will have to put them together, and understand what he is trying to say

I would be very interested in what these note have to say

[ralis]

Chapter 14 will tell you everything you need to know regarding transmutation of lead to gold. I found Shah's book while wandering through the myriad of used book shops on Telegraph Ave. in Berkeley back in 1989.

 

http://www.amazon.com/Oriental-Magic-Idries-Shah/dp/0140194649/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1434300388&sr=1-1&keywords=oriental+magic

[ralis]

This guy claims he can transmute base metals to gold using yeast and a little heat.   

 

 

[Nungali]

My supply of bismuth just arrived .  Not alchemy ,,, but a lotta fun ! 

[Michael Sternbach]

My supply of bismuth just arrived .  Not alchemy ,,, but a lotta fun ! 

 

Bismuth is believed to be the most suitable matter for the Great Work by some. May I ask: What are you using it for?

[maldor]

Have people forgotten what a "metaphor" is ?

 

Lead into gold ... Seriously?

[FraterUFA]

Have people forgotten what a "metaphor" is ?

 

Lead into gold ... Seriously?

 

Are you claiming that elemental transmutation isn't possible?

 

UFA

[LAOLONG]

Chinese Inner alchemy is not the way ( Tao ).

[maldor]

Are you claiming that elemental transmutation isn't possible?

 

UFA

 

I am stating that people have a horrible habit of taking things too literally. 

 

Its raining cats and dogs outside, gotta go!

[Michael Sternbach]

I am stating that people have a horrible habit of taking things too literally. 

 

Its raining cats and dogs outside, gotta go!

 

Why shouldn't transmutation of chemical elements at low energies be possible?

 

True, mainstream scientists haven't incorporated them into their world view yet, but neither do they acknowledge psychic phenomena, or even the existence of non-physical aspects of living beings.

 

Talking about living beings, they perform transmutations all the time.

 

http://www.life-enthusiast.com/biological-transmutations-a-1271.html

[FraterUFA]

I am stating that people have a horrible habit of taking things too literally. 

 

It is difficult to respond constructively to such a vague statement but I will attempt to do so anyway.

 

I believe the first point that you are making is that the alchemists spoke in metaphors. This is undenably true. We find many quotes along the following lines supporting it:

 

"I will open my mouth in parables, and declare things hidden from the foundation of the world ." - Sophic Hydrolith

 

Where I believe you are being led into error is in believing that you understand the meaning of these metaphors and more specifically, that they do not refer to literal physical substances and processes. To be fair, the intent of the metaphorical language is to mislead people into making precisely this error (among many others). 

 

There are four groups of alchemical researchers who we can turn to for guidance.

 

First, there are the academic researchers who are AFAIK in unanimous agreement that a literal, physical interpretation of alchemy is correct.

 

For instance, we find at the Isacc Newton project a well-compiled glossary of his terms and their meanings (http://webapp1.dlib.indiana.edu/newton/reference/glossary.do)

 

Another good read is Ferrario's, "Understanding the Language of Alchemy", a short paper published in 2009.

 

The alchemical substances described in the dictionary are divided in bodies – i.e. metals, spirits, stones and compounds.14 (slides 5-7) The stones are in their turn divided in two groups: those that contain spirits and those that do not. The list of metals includes: gold, silver, iron, copper, white lead, black lead and mercury. For each of these metals the dictionary gives a number of synonyms (Decknamen) that varies from fifteen to fifty names.

 

I consider this point to be so self-evident that I would be wasting my time in providing further resources and will leave it to you to do a bit of searching to your satisfaction.

 

Next, we have the serious esoteric researchers such as Manly Hall and A.E. Waite. The latter devotes about 280 pages to this very subject in his work, "Lives of Alchemystical Philosophers", giving it the exhaustive treatment it deserves.

 

That it is concerned with transmutation is granted, but with the transmutation of metals, or of any physical substance, into material gold, is strenuously denied by a select section of reputable students of occultism.

 

This book is mandatory reading on alchemy as far as I am concerned, but the short story is that he comes to a similar conclusion: the alchemists were dealing with physical substances for the purpose of spiritual transmutation.

 

Our fourth group are what I call casual or mainstream spiritual practitioners, who undertaking no true research of original sources on their own, are blindly duped by mainstream authors into erroneous conclusions, such as alchemy being mere chemistry, alchemy being a psychological practice, or that alchemy refers to some type of internal energy practice (almost always borrowed from Yogic or Taoist traditions).

 

A.E. Waite's book is helpful in correcting this misperception as well. However, I will tell you my theory which is based on research of texts spanning the period 1400-1920. Alchemy reached its peak in Europe in the 17th century, after which, researches steadily devolved into mere chemistry which was pursued primarily for industrial purposes. I find the last worthwhile alchemical text in this period to have been written in the mid-19th century and it was practically unknown. In lieu of genuine information (remember, the Internet was not available at this time so these works were difficult to come by), Atwood and Hitchcock published the first works asserting that alchemy was merely a cryptic spiritual or moralistic metaphor and these erroneous views were greedily absorbed and evolved by other authors, to this very day.

 

Interestingly, we have since found evidence that the Golden Dawn possessed genuine alchemical manuscripts which they had somehow gained possession of from an authentic body of working adepts but apparently did not understand their meaning.

 

Anyway, on to our fourth group: working alchemists.

 

It is a small group, perhaps a couple of hundred at most worldwide and there are several ways of categorizing them. For the purpose of this discussion, I will divide them up into two groups, those who subscribe to the Albertus school and those who have been initiated into the authentic teachings of the ancient alchemists.

 

The Albertus school includes many well-known and popular authors. I will not deny the much-needed attention that Albertus, Dubuis and others brought to the alchemical tradition. However, I personally define this school as subscribing to three viewpoints (which I consider to be provably erroneous). First, that ethanol is the universal vegetable mercury. Second, that astrology is required in any manner in the practice of alchemy. Third, a general notion that somehow the lab work is connected to inner states of consciousness, but no true insight into what this connection is (for instance, we find a vague framework by Dubuis which equates the vegetable work with Yetziratic states of consciousness and the mineral with Briatic states).

 

Of those initiates of the old ways, I will simply say that their ways differ.

 

UFA

 

Edit: typos.

Edited July 9, 2015 by FraterUFA

[maldor]

Why is it called the "philosophers stone" ?

[FraterUFA]

There are many reasons for this, though if any can be said to be authoritative, I don't know.

 

One of my favorite explanations is that Stone in Hebrew is spelled ABN. AB means "Father" and BN (Ben) means "Son". Thus the Stone is the union of the Father and Son, the full conscious awareness of Unity found within a human being.

 

I don't know if this is historically accurate but it very well may be, as the word "Stone" is frequently used in the Bible.

 

The stone is also said to be incombustible in fire as it is a perfect union of the three principles (Sulphur, Mercury and Salt), four if you count Paracelsus' principle of Glass, which is said to give it hardness.

 

There are many other explanations but in the end, they are all just signs pointing the way towards a deeper truth.

 

UFA

[Michael Sternbach]

Why is it called the "philosophers stone" ?

 

Simply because the Alchemists have always been philosophers of nature.

[noonespecial]

And the building of the wall of it was of jasper: and the city was pure gold, like unto clear glass. Rev 21:18

[noonespecial]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P_o65B1JTiw