Meditation is not the only way to Enlightenment.

[MooNiNite]

-Jus sayin

Edited June 13, 2015 by MooNiNite

[z00se]

Too right.

 

Some people try too hard and just go backwards.

 

There are really some funny characters

[Cheshire Cat]

Don't think so

[MooNiNite]

Don't think so

 

no? meditation is the only way? interesting.

[idiot_stimpy]

There is no way to enlightenment.

[Silent Answers]

There's a lesson or two here for you.

 

Why do you think your statement has so few replies? (Seriously)

[Nikolai1]

Perhaps only noobs think that formal sitting meditation is the only way to enlightenment.

 

I think all spiritual practices are just variations of meditation.

 

I also think that meditation becomes constant for the enlightened person.

 

I also think that meditation isn't the way to enlightenment, it IS enlightenment.

[idiot_stimpy]

I also think that meditation isn't the way to enlightenment, it IS enlightenment.

 

The way of no-way?

[Rara]

I see what the OP means...

 

But yeah meditation is all. Whether it's washing dishes, playing chess or sitting in full lotus for an hour.

 

Know yourself...however you get there, this is the only message, right?

[MooNiNite]

I'm basically just pointing out that meditation is not the only way to facilitate the expansion of the awareness. Know yourself, yes. 

 

A lot of people start learning and come to insist meditation is the secret key that fits into the lock opening the door of perception.

 

Many paths up the mountain... 

[MooNiNite]

There's a lesson or two here for you.

 

Why do you think your statement has so few replies? (Seriously)

 

Because people agree?

[MooNiNite]

There is no way to enlightenment.

 

Depends on your definition of enlightenment. There is most certainly a transcendental state to be achieved. 

[MooNiNite]

i wonder why so many figures from different parts of the world are depicted with the halo?

 

Jesus, Buddha, Krishna, Shiva.......

[thelerner]

i wonder why so many figures from different parts of the world are depicted with the halo?

 

Jesus, Buddha, Krishna, Shiva.......

Saints of many traditions really.  I've always thought its because the painter paints what he sees.  Saints have bigger aura's and the easiest part of an aura to see is at the top of the head which looks kind like a halo.  Later on it became formalized and canonized as a round circle at the head, but it was originally top part of the aura.  

 

as always imo after most of these sentences.  Note in some old paintings the whole body is surrounded by light, could be artistic license, but I think an artist draws what he knows, auras.  Great artists have the eye for 'em.

 

back to OP

 

I'm reminded of a the story of a samurai who scoffs at a bunch of meditating monks; yells to them that there meditation has as much chance of enlightening them as rubbing a rock will make it a mirror. 

 

I've always thought the samurai was a too hard on them.  That there's a chance the samurai also meditated and that it might be the extremely long hours he was complaining against.  You could say Bodhidharma thought the same thing and introduced moving meditation, exercise, even martial arts to monks training. 

Edited June 10, 2015 by thelerner

[Cheshire Cat]

no? meditation is the only way? interesting.

 

To meditate means to investigate our minds.

None is born skilled at that: we have to train.

The first step is sitting meditation.

 

Your question sound like "Does one really need to be able to walk in order to run effectively?"

Edited June 10, 2015 by Cheshire Cat

[Silent Answers]

Because people agree?

I cannot indulge you with a proper answer...doing so would violate the very lesson I'm pointing out, in a way. It's ego related and rooted very deep. In fact, the very thing you're mocking is the prime tool for digging it out.

 

The rest is up to you.

[Nikolai1]

It is e attitude behind the meditation that is so important. We can't judge meditation as a simple activity without taking this into account.

 

A person may meditate 24/7 for years, and if the do so with the aim of enlightenment than they will achieve nothing and their meditation is likely a block.

 

Another person, who realises that each moment is beautiful and perfect and is able to therefore live with love and impartial wisdom, may never need to sit at all. But their whole life is already the essence of meditation.

 

If you view meditation as a good technique, without also seeing that it is also quite useless, then you are holding a most unfortunate view. Nearly everyone enters this trap for a while, and those drawn to Buddhism and zen may stay in the trap for decades.

[soaring crane]

Osho makes a pretty strong case for meditation being the state/condition, not the method.

[idiot_stimpy]

Non-contrived meditation. Or in Zen, silent illumination. 

[ChiForce]

Is not the meditation leading to enlightenment or rigpa.  Is realizing samadhi, one leve after another.  This can happen in meditation or in your sleep and dream.  However, having the ability to become mindful of (concentrating on one point) is required to calm your mind...to quiet the mind.  How do you reach samadhi without being in a meditative state???  Don't talk about enlightenment or the rigpa or the nature of non-duality if you haven't realized even the first stage of samadhi.  There are supposedly either 4 or 9 levels....in each samadhi, you are to acquire transcendental wisdom of the dharma and the nature of your mind.   

[ChiForce]

Depends on your definition of enlightenment. There is most certainly a transcendental state to be achieved. 

Enligthenment isn't a definition.  Is the full reality of the mind itself.  It has always been the same thousands of years ago and up to now.  What is the nature of the mind?  A non-duality void characterized by white light.  The Clear Light Mind depiction is a good start.   

[MooNiNite]

I cannot indulge you with a proper answer...doing so would violate the very lesson I'm pointing out, in a way. It's ego related and rooted very deep. In fact, the very thing you're mocking is the prime tool for digging it out.

 

The rest is up to you.

ego never goes away. even buddha himself has ego

[MooNiNite]

Is not the meditation leading to enlightenment or rigpa.  Is realizing samadhi, one leve after another.  This can happen in meditation or in your sleep and dream.  However, having the ability to become mindful of (concentrating on one point) is required to calm your mind...to quiet the mind.  How do you reach samadhi without being in a meditative state???  Don't talk about enlightenment or the rigpa or the nature of non-duality if you haven't realized even the first stage of samadhi.  There are supposedly either 4 or 9 levels....in each samadhi, you are to acquire transcendental wisdom of the dharma and the nature of your mind.   

 

because you dont need meditation to quiet your mind.

[ChiForce]

because you dont need meditation to quiet your mind.

But for your mind to become quiet and calm, you have to be in a meditative state.    This can happen either in your sleep or in meditation.  Not when you are taking a bath or playing your favorite video games.  Besides, have you experienced any forms of samadhi yet?  Any spiritual signs, nimitta, that you are accomplishing what you think you are trying to achieve?  If not, how do you know if you know what you yourself are talking about?  For the records, I have my kundalini energy rising experience when I was 18.  I am in my late 30s.  I am way passed that blissful feeling you get from it.  I am experiencing the Clear Light Mind, rigpa, every morning.  Sometimes, I would see the rigpa in my dream, in my sleep.   

[MooNiNite]

But for your mind to become quiet and calm, you have to be in a meditative state.    This can happen either in your sleep or in meditation.  Not when you are taking a bath or playing your favorite video games.  Besides, have you experienced any forms of samadhi yet?  Any spiritual signs, nimitta, that you are accomplishing what you think you are trying to achieve?  If not, how do you know if you know what you yourself are talking about?  For the records, I have my kundalini energy rising experience when I was 18.  I am in my late 30s.  I am way passed that blissful feeling you get from it.  I am experiencing the Clear Light Mind, rigpa, every morning.  Sometimes, I would see the rigpa in my dream, in my sleep.   

 

it can happen when your doing anything connected with your soul awareness. for some it is making music... for others it is carving...for some it is singing...i know a friend who coding stock market data does it for him. the creative process can usually do it.