Yi Chuan demonstration

[Green Tiger]

 

Demonstrations like this make me wonder how much student cooperation is going on.  Is he genuinely resisting?  Would this demonstration not go so smoothly if it was done on some random martial arts students? 

[SonOfTheGods]

Demonstrations like this make me wonder how much student cooperation is going on.  Is he genuinely resisting?  Would this demonstration not go so smoothly if it was done on some random martial arts students? 

 

The problem with online video is, it can never be trusted.

 

Sometimes agenda, is the primary motive.

 

However, that being said- internal martial arts are very real

 

The Yang Heaven flows down, around and through the practitioner/nexus

 

The Yin Earth flows upward, around and also through the practitioner/nexus

 

The surrounding grid of counter-flows, creates an electromagnetic field = similar to a shield

 

Any opposing counter-energy can easily be warded off

 

I speak from experience, as I can do this as well.

 

But like I said prior, no one should be taken as face value, because video can not be trusted.

 

The best way, is to practice yourself, then all illusion and doubt shall be forever removed

[SonOfTheGods]

 

Edited June 9, 2015 by SonOfTheGods

[JinlianPai]

The problem is that the above video is just pure nonsense its not even correct bs.

 

That demo isnt inner power not even close.

 

The real test for distance power is breaking a object like a break from a distance.

 

If you cant break a brick or a stone or board from a distance then you dont have distance power its very simple to understand.

 

You actually have to progress and it takes of literally hard work and in the meantime there is test you have to pass to test your inner power.

 

The reason why this isnt known is the fact there is literally bs all thru this chi development community.

 

So this means that every and I mean every video like this is fake. Its not distance power.

 

What there doing will never and let me repeat never stop a real enemy.

 

Its f'ing selling snake oil to the masses as they upload their bs videos to youtube with a link to their website utterly disguesting!

 

There are real ways to test your inner power and its not by aura pushing the enemy your internal power is suppose to be strong enough to explode their internal organs thats power.

 

Its not something you test on buddies and students.

Edited June 8, 2015 by JinlianPai

[JinlianPai]

Listen there are breaks done like this and this is done by sending your chi done to break the desired brick.

 

 

Then there is a higher level break where you dont hit the top brick and still have to do the same break.

Edited June 8, 2015 by JinlianPai

[tumoessence]

I would say he is cooperating in that the one receiving the force is maintaining their frame so that the result of the energy applied can be seen for the sake of demonstration.  This would correlate I would think to those moments in a real situation where a skilled person would cause the attacker to lock into a frame for a brief moment to then execute internal power. Or if they're less of a skilled fighter they will always be in a frame into which internal power can work.

Jinlian Pai why do you assume that internal power is always distance power?  Surely there are stages of internal power where touch is essential eventually leading up to distance power.  

Edited June 8, 2015 by tumoessence

[SonOfTheGods]

Not taking sides- the video might be real or not

 

But the critical components and the basic mechanics are:

 

Leverage, speed, body placement of self and opponent, and internal power.

 

The performance was done in slow motion

 

The teacher is using his arms in a 'swimming fashion', as if to move the WeiQi Field - gathering, pushing and pulling at his invisible matrix

[JinlianPai]

I would say he is cooperating in that the one receiving the force is maintaining their frame so that the result of the energy applied can be seen for the sake of demonstration.  This would correlate I would think to those moments in a real situation where a skilled person would cause the attacker to lock into a frame for a brief moment to then execute internal power. Or if they're less of a skilled fighter they will always be in a frame into which internal power can work.

Jinlian Pai why do you assume that internal power is always distance power?  Surely there are stages of internal power where touch is essential eventually leading up to distance power.  

 

Yes there are stages of progression.

 

I was commenting on the op.

 

There are pure energy breaks. They exist. That has always been the test for distance power.

 

The taoist sects and temples have breaking but it was to test your inner power and they had different types of breaking to test this.

 

What happen to martial arts is that this breaking tradition was not understood and in most cases not passed on.

 

This is where part of the problem begins.

 

Breaking was always to test your internal power. Now the meditations and so forth to go with that in most cases have been lost.

 

So there just isnt static seated and standing meditations they have 2 man drills to develop the delivery of this as well.

 

So its just not correct at all.

[Silent Answers]

Lol... his qi literally came through the screen of my phone and fried my mind's bs capacitors.

[JinlianPai]

Lol... his qi literally came through the screen of my phone and fried my mind's bs capacitors.

 

I know right.

 

If this was being done correctly he would go out to a field pick up a rock and hit it with his fist and reduce it to a cloud of smoke.

 

and then.

 

Do it again without touching the rock....

Edited June 8, 2015 by JinlianPai

[RiverSnake]

Just my opinion as an amateur, but it seems like his arms are disconnected from his root. 

[Chang]

Kong Jing (Empty Force). This comes up on the forum every now and then and generates both interest and debate.

 

I have never experienced the effect of Kong Jing nor have i met a martial artist who has done so. Whilst I do have an open mind and would not be prepared to say that it does not exist, I am of the opinion that most videos supposedly demonstrating the practitioners ability in this art are delusional.

 

But wouldn't we all love to find a Teacher who does have this ability?

[Bearded Dragon]

The opponent is rather theatrical, that's for sure. In any case I have felt what true emptiness feels like. Firstly, as you apply a force to someone empty it will not even enter their body and bounce straight back. This feels like pressing against a wall of air. There is nothing there yet you can't get past it. Normally you can have someone stand on some scales and see that as a force is applied the weight goes up, but in this manner the weight does not change therefore one can say that the force doesn't enter the body (which seems to defy classical physics). That effect can be added to by spiraling out energy. On one occasion I felt one arm spiraling one way and the other spiraling the other way, and that spiraling energy also felt like pressing against air. It tore me in 2 directions and I completely lost my balance. There is absolutely no way to defend against this unless you can match their emptiness. No techniques, nothing.

 

If your body doesn't take in the opponent's force and you can issue your own force then nobody can stop you and you will therefore hit your opponent every time. This is all you need. Not some idiotic waste of time projecting energy at a distance. Anyone who wastes their time on that deserves to get nowhere.

[Green Tiger]

I thought this seemed like it was bordering on an example of empty force, but not quite.  He is at least making contact, however light.  I think Yi Chuan practitioners have some creepy-strong root strength, but I've never met anyone who could apply it like this.  I've met some Aikido practitioners who could throw you with small movements, but this looks like almost no movement.  

[Silent Answers]

It's all in the legs...and the over-acting...and the groans/orgasms.

 

But seriously this is some amateur WWE wanna-be stuff. Look at his legs bend before each jump. There's only one way to pull off those "throws", it involves the filling of an opponents 钱包.

[windwalker]

There are lots of examples of this type of force being used on the net, the clip shown was a demo or part of their training.  How it would be used against someone else is not the same, there would be no time for the other to react with what they felt.

 

The groans, or sounds are involuntary reactions to the the persons center being affected.  

 

 

some clips showing some of the same process's in use in a  non martial way, focusing on the principals involved.  Its important to note when it dosent work, and when it does.  This will help in understanding why it does.

 

This clip also  shows the processes by which the students learn, understand and correct themselves, though this understanding.    

 

a good site that explains many of things demoed using physics.

http://www.chuckrowtaichi.com/ChengCh.7.html

 

 

 

 

 

"its not intuitive"    many things shown on the web relating to IMA can be explained, even in person feeling it being used it may not be understood what happened or how,   "its not intuitive" 

Edited June 12, 2015 by morninglight

[Bearded Dragon]

I like that video. It's kinda where I'm at. Not using too much gross muscle, but still relying somewhat on body structure.

[MooNiNite]

There are lots of examples of this type of force being used on the net, the clip shown was a demo or part of their training.  How it would be used against someone else is not the same, there would be no time for the other to react with what they felt.

do you know why they are stomping on the ground in the video?

[Bearded Dragon]

It's usually an attempt to regain balance. It depends which direction the force is going and where it is issued from but usually when people do it to me my top half stays and the bottom half floats backwards.

[Green Tiger]

 

There are lots of examples of this type of force being used on the net, the clip shown was a demo or part of their training.  How it would be used against someone else is not the same, there would be no time for the other to react with what they felt.

 

The groans, or sounds are involuntary reactions to the the persons center being affected.  

 

some clips showing some of the same process's in use in a  non martial way, focusing on the principals involved.  Its important to note when it dosent work, and when it does.  This will help in understanding why it does.

 

This clip also  shows the processes by which the students learn, understand and correct themselves, though this understanding.    

 

"its not intuitive"    many things shown on the web relating to IMA can be explained, even in person feeling it being used it may not be understood what happened or how,   "its not intuitive" 

 

Awesome!  thanks for sharing. 

 

Scott Meredith recently wrote a blog post that covers this topic really well.  He says, 

 

The real Tai Chi "push" does not use any physical force beyond the 4-oz "nudge" that I talked about in JUICE. If you want to call that a physical push I guess you can, but the key distinguishing point of real Tai Chi is that the physical force of the nudge gesture is in no way adequate to directly account for the physical reaction of the target person. That's the hallmark of real Tai Chi. The guy's own tension blasts and moves his own body.

 

How do you do that?  According to him, it is a simple, 4-step process. 

 

So, without using yin/yang concepts and meridians (which actually are operating but hard to realistically conceptualize) I explain the way the process feels as the TILT model:

 

TOUCH (various places on him, lightly, Tailor's Touch, until you...)

 

IDENTIFY (his tension)

 

LOCK (his tension with your energy)

 

TRIGGER (his tension with your energy)

 

Note that this does require physical CONTACT (it's not ling kong jing) but NOT physical force. I understand it's a hard distinction to grok.

 

You can read the full post here.

 

EDIT: to remove videos and add emphasis via bolded lines.

Edited June 16, 2015 by Green Tiger