Marblehead Posted June 21, 2015 and if there really is no mystery? No mystery no fun. Right? That's all it boils down to, as I see it. Some people feel compelled, for whatever reason, to fart around with things, just to keep their minds occupied before their expiration date arrives, I guess. You said that in a very strange way (for me) but I agree with you.  Yes, it is good to "know" some things. But it is also exciting to not know and not even know the correct questions to ask. (And that applies at so many different levels.) 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
soaring crane Posted June 21, 2015 You said that in a very strange way (for me) but I agree with you.  Yes, it is good to "know" some things. But it is also exciting to not know and not even know the correct questions to ask. (And that applies at so many different levels.)  bam! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Yasjua Posted June 21, 2015 (edited) and if there really is no mystery? No mystery no fun. Right? That's all it boils down to, as I see it. Some people feel compelled, for whatever reason, to fart around with things, just to keep their minds occupied before their expiration date arrives, I guess. Haven't been following your posts in this thread, but some people generally refers to a part of yourself that currently doesn't assimilate into your ego's model or coping mechanism for dealing with the world at present. I don't buy into a world model with no "I don't know" - that sensation is the essence of mystery if we honor it and understand its implication. Our education tells that part of ourselves to shut it's fucking mouth and assimilate consensus, whether religious, social, or scientific. Most of us our embarrassed on some deep level about our ignorance, and society shames the idiot for his innocence. A post back you said we're just hosts for billions of microorganisms. Yes, we host. And rational biocentric reductionism is a profuse, delicious, complex and solid model of the world to stand on. It is updated, underrated, holistic and powerful as an orientation to life. But the way ego uses it to gain leverage, stability, grounding, relaxation, to cover its confusion, is just a matter of pragmatism, not reality, and conflating the two is ignorant. I think we have to be able to weigh the evidence of our knowledge and the evidence of our spirit - where there are contradictions we have virginity, innocence, mystery - certainly not qualities a "man" of the 21st century wants to embody or assimilate, but they're part of the truth. They're integral to an honest assessment of our nature, which is at least partially infused with a big glob of "I really don't know, and I don't know why I don't know," and that sensation, at its essence (not its material-biological reduction) is evidence of mystery. Edited June 21, 2015 by Yasjua Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted June 21, 2015 I think I like your post but I'm not sure yet.  How about we all become Apathetic Agnostics? We don't know and we don't care. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Songtsan Posted June 21, 2015 And you know this how...? Â I've had a few brief experiences when involuting and ending the permutations. It is mentioned in Patanjali's Sutras, Buddha's Sutras, etc. etc....not trying to prove anything. Ending the permutations is not as special as some think, though a difficult endeavor. Whether there be fabrications or not, the awareness experiencing the fluctuations is untouchable. When it ceases to identify with them, and follows itself to itself, the permutations cease....I can try to find specific passages, but I have experienced it for a few seconds here and there... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FraterUFA Posted June 21, 2015 I've had a few brief experiences when involuting and ending the permutations. It is mentioned in Patanjali's Sutras, Buddha's Sutras, etc. etc....not trying to prove anything. Ending the permutations is not as special as some think, though a difficult endeavor. Whether there be fabrications or not, the awareness experiencing the fluctuations is untouchable. When it ceases to identify with them, and follows itself to itself, the permutations cease....I can try to find specific passages, but I have experienced it for a few seconds here and there... Â The sutras was a particular interest of mine for almost a decade. It is a book intended for adepts. It will not produce the described results for an ordinary individual. Â UFA Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Songtsan Posted June 21, 2015 Books don't produce results, co-originated beings do. The books are mind objects. Buddha Mind is available to everyone at all times, books are not required. It is simple, in that others figured it out during a time when there was no writing. When someone writes something down, it does not indicate they are special. Empty mind can bring all things. Those who are desireless and empty, will experience all they need to. No books, culture clubs, leaders, gurus, teachers required. Empty vessels are the purest forms. Names, faces, traces of egos, ethics, morals, dogmas are of mind, and are nothing special. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nungali Posted June 21, 2015 and if there really is no mystery? No mystery no fun. Right? That's all it boils down to, as I see it. Some people feel compelled, for whatever reason, to fart around with things, just to keep their minds occupied before their expiration date arrives, I guess.   he did it !  he found the purpose !  1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nungali Posted June 21, 2015 I think I like your post but I'm not sure yet.  How about we all become Apathetic Agnostics? We don't know and we don't care.  2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nungali Posted June 21, 2015 Books don't produce results, co-originated beings do. The books are mind objects. Buddha Mind is available to everyone at all times, books are not required. It is simple, in that others figured it out during a time when there was no writing. When someone writes something down, it does not indicate they are special. Empty mind can bring all things. Those who are desireless and empty, will experience all they need to. No books, culture clubs, leaders, gurus, teachers required. Empty vessels are the purest forms. Names, faces, traces of egos, ethics, morals, dogmas are of mind, and are nothing special.   ... aside from the fact that your are no 'ordinary individual'  Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
3bob Posted June 22, 2015 (edited) I'd say that the true Self is not "empty" of True Self, thus more than just potential or an empty stage type of connotation (or clean slate mind ) Edited June 22, 2015 by 3bob 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted June 22, 2015 (edited) I'd say that the true Self is not "empty" of True Self, thus more than just potential or an empty stage type of connotation (or clean slate mind ) That's called potential, isn't it?  Interesting, your comment about "clean slate mind". Edited June 22, 2015 by Marblehead 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
3bob Posted June 22, 2015 (edited) To put my last post into different terms; Mystery is not empty of or without Mystery nor can the fact of indestructible Mystery be nailed down in any normal way, including with the term or concept of "empty". Also Mystery is not potential in the sense of something that may or may not develop or come to exist... for it has always and will always exist right under our noses (so to speak), although and again not per any normal or worldly definition of an existence that has the potential to be here one day and gone the next.  A "clean slate mind" is not unlike a clear memory chip that has the potential to take, hold and work with new data or new programing, while a full memory chip can not do so unless it clears out space for such. Edited June 22, 2015 by 3bob 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted June 22, 2015 Yes, the "clean slate mind" is empty but yet full of potential. (But different sized memory chips have different potentials.) (Yes, I know, this touches on a difficult concept.) 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
3bob Posted June 23, 2015 (edited) umm, not exactly difficult as a given... for Mystery is perpetually manifest in a way when or if such is known and seen by and through Mystery, thus knowable and seeable in that way. As for mind and various states or realms - such are totally dependent upon Mystery as Source to manifest and not the other way around. Edited June 23, 2015 by 3bob Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted June 23, 2015 Thanks for getting me out of that one. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
3bob Posted June 23, 2015 who me? I can't prove anything to anyone... 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted June 23, 2015 who me? I can't prove anything to anyone... Yeah, we, the individual, either believe it or we don't. Proof generally don't mean too much for most people. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
