All right, you don't believe in astrology...

[agharta]

Mmmkay, first, the four pillars are a newer form of Chinese astrology. To get your own personal chart, go to this page. That system is actually a newer system, in a sense. The older version of Chinese astrology, which is based directly on planets, stars, etc. , is not used anymore, that I know of. Then, there's Purple King astrology, which I haven't delved into.

 

Taomeow, I'm going to have to say that my Chinese chart is not as accurate as my Vedic. Both together, however, are more accurate that either alone. MUCH.

 

If you'd like to do my chart, I'm open.

[thelerner]

I love the Chicago China town. If I was to have a reading. What should I look for in an astrologer, which style? What is considered a good style of answer? How long should it take? I know where I was born and the time, but I don't know time other then morning. If its just a few bucks I would be more then happy to find a chinese astrologer to do a reading.

 

 

From the point of view of believers, if an astrologer says you'll have 4 kids, is that real or junk astrology? What makes the difference?

 

 

Michael

 

 

P.S. the intolerance lines were mostly nonsense to lighten up the conversation, at least the 2nd and 3rd ones were

[Taomeow]

I love the Chicago China town. If I was to have a reading. What should I look for in an astrologer, which style? What is considered a good style of answer? How long should it take? I know where I was born and the time, but I don't know time other then morning. If its just a few bucks I would be more then happy to find a chinese astrologer to do a reading.

From the point of view of believers, if an astrologer says you'll have 4 kids, is that real or junk astrology? What makes the difference?

Michael

P.S. the intolerance lines were mostly nonsense to lighten up the conversation, at least the 2nd and 3rd ones were

Sorry, you can't get a good astrological reading if you don't know the time of your birth. The first sign of a good astrologer will be that he or she will refuse to do it.

 

However, as Mal rightfully stated, there's many other methods that are as accurate in gifted AND trained hands. You can get a face reading from a descendant of face readers. Ask for lineage proof. You can get a back reading from a Dragon Gate taoist. This used to be considered the most precise method but one of the emperors ordered confiscation and destruction of all back-reading maps (as well as, at different points in history, a few more of them, I mean emperors, mandated, under penalty of death for disobedience, confiscation and destruction of all taoist books on geography, navigation, biology, physics, biophysics, math, agriculture, astronomy and, yes, astrology -- which is why much of the body of knowledge, the single biggest ever in existence on earth even if only written documents are counted, known as taoist sciences, was taken out of circulation and only remained as secret lineage knowledge preserved by those few who managed to take it and run.) You can get your pulse, tongue, nails, breath, smell, sound of your voice, posture, demeanor, earlobes, irises, bathroom habits, etc., analyzed by a very good OMD who will tell you as much as a good astrologer, more in some areas, less in others. A "very good one" is a rarity, all good things are rare. Look for one trained primarily in TCM (not an MD with TCM on the side and not a "licensed acupuncturist"). Look for one who will be able to tell you at a glance whether you can or cannot sit in full lotus, and whether there's mold in your basement, and whether your bathroom drain is slow, and whether windows in your home are dusty, stuff like that, stuff that will convince you that he or she really sees YOU, not a Rorchard ink blot. I can do some of it, not all of it. I can tell how someone was born, e.g., but not when. A more experienced astrologer than me can figure that out too, but you are not likely to just meet one in Chinatown.

[宁]

I didn't belive in astrology when I was a little younger

When we grow a little older, we start seeing things repeating in our lifes.

Sometimes we see them repeating in cycles.

Simply, when we are younger, our awareness and our experience is too shallow to see this.

Then we turn to the Chinese sense of time. They see it in a cyclical fashion.

And, start it from there... you can get to Taomeow's conclusions...

 

As Lin stated, we are not free, there is no free will.

When we are young, we have huge amounts of life force, and it seems we are on top of the world.

As we get a little older, we move a little slower, and, wow... we start to notice more things...

 

Maybe this is a valid definition of awareness... you notice more.

 

Thank you

[Taomeow]

Do you have a source for this?

Joseph Needham, "Civilization and Science in China."

This sounds absurd. This is a classic rhetorical device: you take a criteria, elevate it to the point where its required to belong to an elite class (in this case, Taoists), and condmen those who disagree with you to a non-elite status. It sounds to me that just because *you* like astrology you elevate it to a point where people who don't agree with *you* aren't real taoists but *fake* taoists.

This is the ultimate test: does it work? I suppose most people have not had a Chinese astrology reading done by an expert, and thus, most of us will be unconvinced.

Jesus tap-dancing Christ. Elite? Well, you're elite to me if you can write a computer program then, or fix the toilet, 'cause I can't. Your criterion for "elevating to elite class status" seems to be "knowing something" and "being able to do something" that "I" don't know and can't do. Last I checked, knowing something and being able to do something better than the random next guy/gal didn't make anyone into that, but it did make him or her into someone different in that respect from anyone who doesn't know and can't do. Should it aggravate anyone, it is easily (or not so easily) remedied by learning whatever it is. And by no other method. Accusing knowledge of elitism is not gonna turn an honest seeker into a self-aggrandizing fake, nor a defensive ignoramus into an honest seeker. Seek and you shall find, it ain't elitist, it just requires honest work and a divine spark of curiosity -- like everything else.

[Taomeow]

Oh, and about predicting four children... that's BS. Astrology is a probabilistic science and it deals in odds and chances. Just like the universe it is patterned on.

 

It can predict that you're capable of having four children though, or that you are unlikely to father any. It can predict how you will relate to your children. It can predict whether they will struggle or thrive. And it can teach you how to correct some of the imbalances, while others will be accepted when you see the whole picture, and will no longer upset you. After all, if I dislike being controlled by Metal but find out I have no other source of Water (which Wood direly needs) than what Metal will generate, I will learn to value Metal people in my life who used to aggravate me, because I will know they can't stop trying to control me anymore than they can stop making money!

Edited October 21, 2007 by Taomeow

[lockpaw]

Joseph Needham, "Civilization and Science in China."

 

Jesus tap-dancing Christ. Elite? Well, you're elite to me if you can write a computer program then, or fix the toilet, 'cause I can't. Your criterion for "elevating to elite class status" seems to be "knowing something" and "being able to do something" that "I" don't know and can't do. Last I checked, knowing something and being able to do something better than the random next guy/gal didn't make anyone into that, but it did make him or her into someone different in that respect from anyone who doesn't know and can't do. Should it aggravate anyone, it is easily (or not so easily) remedied by learning whatever it is. And by no other method. Accusing knowledge of elitism is not gonna turn an honest seeker into a self-aggrandizing fake, nor a defensive ignoramus into an honest seeker. Seek and you shall find, it ain't elitist, it just requires honest work and a divine spark of curiosity -- like everything else.

 

You're decontextualizing. You're on Taobums supporting Chinese astrology. Many people have said they don't believe in astrology. You said, and I quote:

 

"In other words, a taoist can't reject taoist astrology and still consider herself a taoist anymore than a Christian can reject Jesus Christ and still consider herself a Christian."

 

In other words, Taomeow is the Taoist and everyone else is a poser if you don't believe in Chinese astrology like Taomeow.

[Spectrum]

Taoism is based on observation of nature.

 

Astronomy might be more in line with your current belief boundaries.

 

Spectrum

[lockpaw]

Taoism is based on observation of nature.

 

Astronomy might be more in line with your current belief boundaries.

 

Whatchyou talkin about Willis?

 

Have you been following along with this or are you just jumping in the end? I said many of us aren't buying into Chinese astrology because we haven't seen it work. The only "belief boundary" is in buying into something you don't have any experience in. Are you just going to believe everything you hear because it has a Taoist label?

 

I guess I'm confusing Taoism with Buddhism: i.e don't believe it just because everyone else does, or some fancy schmancy sutta says so, etc. You believe based on your personal experiences.

[Spectrum]

Whatchyou talkin about Willis?

 

....

 

You believe based on your personal experiences.

 

 

I believe the moons gravitational field has an effect on the water on this planet. Why? Fact.

 

Everything else I use discernment, based on my personal experience. Sometimes I run across systems or believes or ancient technology which supports my endeavors at inquiry into the unknown.

 

Spiritually I suppose some people might treat it like forecasting the weather.

 

 

Spectrum

Edited October 21, 2007 by Spectrum

[Japhy Ryder]

If we're asking whether astrology (Vedic or otherwise) "works," it's essential to ask "Works for what?"

 

Personal experience hasn't yet shown me whether astrology works for predicting specific circumstances in the future. But based on the work of cultural historial Richard Tarnas, astrology does seem an incredibly elegant tool for understanding past historical events and personal experiences.

 

I read Tarnas' latest book on this subject, Cosmos and Psyche: Intimations of a New World View awhile back. It freakin' blew me away.

[lockpaw]

[snip]

 

So, no, I can't feel your headache, but I can sympathize with you

 

Food for thought...er, I mean non-thought?

 

I can get a glimpse of what you mean, though.

 

 

 

 

I believe the moons gravitational field has an effect on the water on this planet. Why? Fact.

 

Everything else I use discernment, based on my personal experience. Sometimes I run across systems or believes or ancient technology which supports my endeavors at inquiry into the unknown.

 

Spiritually I suppose some people might treat it like forecasting the weather.

Spectrum

 

You could accept science on faith, but then, you could investigate. You can study gravity just by being on the earth. You could study the phases of the moon and the tides. You could get telescopes, learn deep math, and find out all sorts of things.

 

Some scientists, on the other hand, tell us things I find ridiculous; i.e. consciousness is a product of a materialistic brain; animals don't have emotions, etc.

 

Forecasting the weather...Good analogy!

[Ohm-Nei]

Thank you for your post, very interesting. I didn't expect you to incorporate the macrocosmic picture into our seemingly microcosmic reality. I liked it, thank you.

[mat black]

Its not that one is controlled by anything. Its that we are all part of everything out there in the Universe. Since this is true, every change up there is a change down here. The stars move and so do we. The energy changes and so does ours.

 

Nothing is separate, so how is there a controller?

The idea that is is freewill is false. People think they exercise freewill because they make decisions. But they make decisions based on past experiences about them. Therefore its not freewill, it is conditioning. Like a credit card. Its a credit card if you don't use it, but a debt card the moment you do. Its freewill if you are not basing your decision on previous experiences. It is conditioning if you do.

The fact is people have become too individualized, and claim for their own; my car, my house, my wife, my husband, kids, etc. My pain, my anger, my headache...lol And they point the finger at others without responsibly looking at themselves. People are taught to keep separation as a base for their daily living. That perception supports government, and corporations. It is a false perception taught to the masses.

Peace and Blessings,

Lin

Wonderful Lin.

[Ninpo-me-this-ninjutsu-me-that]

I should warn you before you read this that my post will go from reasonable to crass..... but...will remain on topic to some degree

 

Years ago I studied astrology(western), self taught I should say, I taught myself how to cast a chart from the birth time and interpret it based on the results. There was a clear correlation between certain characteristics in people and their birth data, having said that, it could be put down to being subjective also. The mind see's what it wants to see sometimes, that is also true....in my experience anyway.

 

As for interpretations of progressions(predictive astrology)I never went too deep into that, but it does show possible energies involved in a persons life at certain times, and I will say there is an uncanny correlation with certain aspects and people showing up in your life that, sometimes, exactly represent the archetype that is strongly aspected. Syncronicity? Possibly.... but then we have to get into what exactly is fueling syncronicity.

 

Now for the somewhat crass... feel free to stop reading here(I know you wont ).

 

From a more down to earth view point I have found that the best lovers in the bedroom department are absolutely Librans.... and this comes from my own in-depth study with blinds and and controls I'm not joking actually. I have 'done' the zodiac sorry. By rights it should be Scorpio, yet I have found they have way too much self repression going on(pluto)to really let rip. Venus is the planet of the 'love arts' after all. BUT I should add...... if you can find a Libran with scorpio/pluto or the 8th house prominent then oh my God your in for something amazing....I'm talking 'porn star'(I did tell you it would go crass).

 

I can only comment on the female Librans, someone else is gonna have to do the study for the males, it's just not my bag. I would like to add one further point, perhaps even more crass....but...I might add, still related(to some degree)to the topic under discussion, Libran females often have an oral fixation...... by that I mean...... do I really need to explain...well....I'm gonna..... in my experience no other can seriously get off on it.... giving I mean...... all of the ones I've known anyway

 

I did warn you it would go crass.... I apologise... but... this is a gem I have 'gleaned' from looking into astrology from a somewhat 'deeper' level, there are others, but definitely not as interesting(in my opinion)as that one.

 

Use the information 'wisely', get some birthdates and an ephemeris and go hunting! Libra with Scorpio/pluto 8th house prominent. You'll thank me for it one day

[lino]

I should warn you before you read this that my post will go from reasonable to crass..... but...will remain on topic to some degree

 

Years ago I studied astrology(western), self taught I should say, I taught myself how to cast a chart from the birth time and interpret it based on the results. There was a clear correlation between certain characteristics in people and their birth data, having said that, it could be put down to being subjective also. The mind see's what it wants to see sometimes, that is also true....in my experience anyway.

 

As for interpretations of progressions(predictive astrology)I never went too deep into that, but it does show possible energies involved in a persons life at certain times, and I will say there is an uncanny correlation with certain aspects and people showing up in your life that, sometimes, exactly represent the archetype that is strongly aspected. Syncronicity? Possibly.... but then we have to get into what exactly is fueling syncronicity.

 

Now for the somewhat crass... feel free to stop reading here(I know you wont ).

 

From a more down to earth view point I have found that the best lovers in the bedroom department are absolutely Librans.... and this comes from my own in-depth study with blinds and and controls I'm not joking actually. I have 'done' the zodiac sorry. By rights it should be Scorpio, yet I have found they have way too much self repression going on(pluto)to really let rip. Venus is the planet of the 'love arts' after all. BUT I should add...... if you can find a Libran with scorpio/pluto or the 8th house prominent then oh my God your in for something amazing....I'm talking 'porn star'(I did tell you it would go crass).

 

I can only comment on the female Librans, someone else is gonna have to do the study for the males, it's just not my bag. I would like to add one further point, perhaps even more crass....but...I might add, still related(to some degree)to the topic under discussion, Libran females often have an oral fixation...... by that I mean...... do I really need to explain...well....I'm gonna..... in my experience no other can seriously get off on it.... giving I mean...... all of the ones I've known anyway

 

I did warn you it would go crass.... I apologise... but... this is a gem I have 'gleaned' from looking into astrology from a somewhat 'deeper' level, there are others, but definitely not as interesting(in my opinion)as that one.

 

Use the information 'wisely', get some birthdates and an ephemeris and go hunting! Libra with Scorpio/pluto 8th house prominent. You'll thank me for it one day

 

I still don't get what's so crass about "pornstar"

[Ninpo-me-this-ninjutsu-me-that]

I still don't get what's so crass about "pornstar"

 

 

Me either brother! Me either!

[Kali Yuga]

Me either brother! Me either!

LOL. I actually think the world needs more lovers like that.

 

 

But anyway I never really believed all that much in astrology until yesterday. I was reading Witch's section on her personal cultivation and she said that one the best sites on the web to go to for astrology was astro.com. I decided to see what all that was about and it literally blew me away. Those free tests had my total personality pinned down to the dot! I was pretty darn shocked and almost had a breakdown because it brought to light all the things about myself that I'd been repressing that I'd known to be true.

 

Just try it. See how it fits you.

 

Kali

Edited November 2, 2009 by Kali Yuga

[Vajrahridaya]

i don't know if its a question of not being real or not.. to me and most its a question of free will. most people don't like the idea of their fate being controlled by God, the cosmos, or whatever.

 

although i remain open minded about the whole deal, i'm still skeptical. i got a free vedic astrology reading done and it was very accurate, but at the same time the readings are usually so broad and general that i'm sure if i put in different dates it still would've appealed to me.

 

how do you suggest I learn about this and discern truly whether its real or not? what convinced you?

 

It's all just causes and conditions, gravitational pulls, working on your water element, both physically and subtle level... You know... "Bam", which connects with the other elements.

 

The water element is very powerful in the physical world as it's actually most of the physical world on Earth so we are very effected by gravitational pulls even on a very subtle level.

 

Enlightenment is basically making all the positive aspects of our signs manifest, and why not... a little transcendence too through seeing with the eye of "shunya"...

Edited November 2, 2009 by Vajrahridaya

[witch]

LOL. I actually think the world needs more lovers like that.

But anyway I never really believed all that much in astrology until yesterday. I was reading Witch's section on her personal cultivation and she said that one the best sites on the web to go to for astrology was astro.com. I decided to see what all that was about and it literally blew me away. Those free tests had my total personality pinned down to the dot! I was pretty darn shocked and almost had a breakdown because it brought to light all the things about myself that I'd been repressing that I'd known to be true.

 

Just try it. See how it fits you.

 

Kali

 

I'm pleased!

 

That's what astrology has given me too. It's like finding the manual to your car or something. It makes things easier, for example I know there's one day a month where I'm going to be a little down, off my game, and I can plan ahead and be nice to myself on that day..

 

BTW, female Libra suns are the gay man trapped in a woman's body sign of the zodiac, just like male Scorpios are the lesbians trapped in a man's body sign of the zodiac. The book Sextrology goes into that sort of thing in depth, if anybody is interested.

[lino]

 

BTW, female Libra suns are the gay man trapped in a woman's body sign of the zodiac, just like male Scorpios are the lesbians trapped in a man's body sign of the zodiac. The book Sextrology goes into that sort of thing in depth, if anybody is interested.

 

w0w

 

way to spoil the visuals

[witch]

 

I should mention I also orgasm from giving a blowjob despite being a Capricorn, but then I orgasm from eating a strawberry, so that's not saying much!

[Ninpo-me-this-ninjutsu-me-that]

I'm pleased!

 

That's what astrology has given me too. It's like finding the manual to your car or something. It makes things easier, for example I know there's one day a month where I'm going to be a little down, off my game, and I can plan ahead and be nice to myself on that day..

 

BTW, female Libra suns are the gay man trapped in a woman's body sign of the zodiac, just like male Scorpios are the lesbians trapped in a man's body sign of the zodiac. The book Sextrology goes into that sort of thing in depth, if anybody is interested.

 

Oh man........ so you mean to tell me I've been having sex with a gay man inside a womans body!!!! Now I know why a few people I have met have said 'you can't beat a ladyboy', still, I'm sticking with the Librans! If female Librans are gender confused I say "let them be"!!!

 

 

w0w

 

way to spoil the visuals

 

 

 

True that.... but don't worry Lino, most are pretty hot, venus goddess of beauty and all..... I promise you, you can't see the gay man trapped inside the body!!!! However I'm gonna have to be careful what I think the next time I get oral fixation!

 

 

 

I should mention I also orgasm from giving a blowjob despite being a Capricorn, but then I orgasm from eating a strawberry, so that's not saying much!

 

ohhhh.... maybe I need to extend my research! I would wager though you have scorpio/pluto or the 8th house prominent, what with the sex thing and your attraction to the mysteries. Maybe there is a hidden 'holy blow job grail' aspect that hasn't been identified yet. Further research is most definitely in order!!!

[witch]

Libra moon here. Also prominent eighth house of course.

[Ninpo-me-this-ninjutsu-me-that]

Libra moon here. Also prominent eighth house of course.

 

 

There we go, Libra/pluto type...behold........ THE holy grail of Blow Job types.