Is the crown chakra ,shen .

[MooNiNite]

Thanks SOTG, for bringing some reality to the discussion.

 

Are you SOTG talking to himself? Just curious. 

[voidisyinyang]

the top of the head pulsates - much like SOTG showing for his middle tan tien - although that looks more like muscle flexing.

 

Anyway there's "yin shen" and "yang shen" and so yeah it's a process that is all connected.

 

yin jing builds to yang jing (yin qi) which builds to yang qi (yin shen) which builds to yang shen (yin jing).

 

So when you get yang shen you get physical transformations - and the energy cycles like that.

 

So to build up shen you first has to build up qi - and the jing-qi-shen is the alchemical pill that can be transmitted out of the pineal gland - in different variations of intensity - but the energy has to be unified on some level. The Emptiness is this eternal process of complementary opposites.

 

So the ultimate complementary opposite is the yuan qi on the right side of the heart building up the yuan shen on the left side of the heart - in prenatal state they are unified but after birth the yuan shen manifests out of the eyes and the yuan qi manifests out of the pineal gland.

 

So with yuan qi focused on reproduction it then causes the yin jing to deconvert to generative fluid whereas if yuan qi is focused on Emptiness it sublimates the yin jing into yin qi.

 

That is how the Ocean of Qi is built up - the conception vessel - of the yin heel channels.

 

So then as the yin qi builds up it activates the Cavity of Spirit-Vitality which is the lower tan tien as the unification of qi and shen.

 

So only after the yin qi is built up is the lower tan tien really activated and then you have to convert that yin qi into yang qi - this is the first stage of alchemy called converting jing to qi.

 

Most qigong practice doesn't even get to the first stage since the yin qi never gets built up in the first place.

 

If you do beging converting jing to qi then finally the pineal gland begins to open up - which means the Cavity of Original Spirit of yin shen manifests as the first half of enlightenment - the Lunar Dragon energy or heart's fire energy - it is the Cavity of the Dragon of the lower tan tien filling up and then manifesting as a third eye opening up - it is the Tai Chi manifesting.

 

If you can keep storing up your energy - then you really achieve a god like level - but in either case after the Tai Chi manifests then you see light outside your head and light around other people's heads and so you have permanent contact with the shen reality. At this stage the top of the skull softens up and pulsates with qi and the center of the skull opens up again.

 

If you can fully fill up the lower tan tien with yang qi then the real astral travel kicks in and much stronger abilities - any bit of yang qi or yuan qi energy activated is gonna have strong abilities.

 

But if you get attached to the power than it creates disharmony as the shen is right brain dream state trance vision while attachment is the left brain language intention of the ego.

 

So that's why shen is the sattva or pure mind state of the Emptiness - the Wu Chi as female formless awareness.

 

If the shen leaves the body without enough qi surrounding it - then there is a spacetime vortex of dizziness. I had this happen to me - but it's only explained in chapter 11 of Taoist Yoga: Alchemy and Immortality. I didn't think I had made it that far in the book so it took me a few years to figure out what had happened to me. In the mean time I had stopped practicing and the energy channels closed up and then I used up my yuan qi energy.

 

But if the third eye really opens up then you can see dead people as spirits - as I did when they were hovering around the original qigong master in full lotus doing healing.

 

So the Cavity of Original Spirit (the upper tan tien) is actually from the Yuan Qi manifesting its "wondrous light" which it doesn't do until the lower tan tien is really activated after filling up the yin qi energy.

 

This again is a Tai Chi experience which means it is Oneness as nonduality - so it's not in any location in the body - it is an Emptiness spacetime experience of deep bliss awareness which then increases the shen light. The more Yuan Qi energy you build up the more Yuan Shen energy it creates - that is detailed in the Taoist Yoga book.

 

The key is you can't see the Emptiness and so shen isn't the final answer but you use spirit-light to guide the qi as shen is the holographic visionary information field that guides the qi.

 

So that is what is meant by focusing on the Emptiness - turning the light around since when we close our eyes then the Yuan Shen goes down to the liver as the Green Dragon which then builds up the yin qi energy energy and converts the yin jing of the kidneys, via the True Intention of the spleen/pancreas and the White Tiger of the lung deep slow breathing - to build up the yuan jing energy into more yin qi.

 

 

 

 

[Spotless]

Thanks SOTG, for bringing some reality to the discussion.

ALL dantiens act as a "cauldron" at some point of the process. You know when it happens. There are
actual physiological changes that occur, as SOTG shows in his YT videos.

Leaking LDTs? SERIOUSLY? Who comes up with this stuff?! LOL!!

You can lose energy/flux from the usual suspects. But leak? Ummm..NO.

My MDT has "activated", like SOTG's. Not at the level his has yet (he's putting in 3x the practice time I'm able to at present),
but I can feel it, and see it, and more importantly, other people can feel, and see it. My skin is noticeably darker around the area. The Qi pumps/vibrates very strongly there. Toasty heat.

I breathe from the MDT, and nostrils at this point. As I build more flux, this just gets stronger.

Theory will only take you so far. You've GOT to put the time in, to get actual, tangible results.

This is the ONLY way to KNOW. Other than that, it's belief.

BELIEVE NOTHING. Not even what I'm saying. Do the work, and find out for yourself.

Other than that, it's all just blah, blah, blah.

Cheers!

This stage of pulsation will be fleeting if practice is regular and the actual feeling of the release of the refined energy from a dan tien can be quite specific if you happen to be awake when it occurs (actually Awakened or just daytime awake).

In the latter stages large columns of astounding energy will build in addition to the MCO becoming very pronounced and extending outward to some 2.5 feet.

At some point the separated columns of energy will join - as in the golden Buddha pictured above. If you happen to be conscious at the time it is a very fine release again as all columns and systems gently merge within a few seconds.

At this time and for some time after the process unfolds into a very different awareness - in my case the higher heart expanded greatly but not for some weeks / months. The entire spine is electrified and fully connected to the great magnetic centers - the whole head is one - the crown extends some 5-8 feet upward and out.

It is not necessary to do anything in the entire process - but if one wishes to slow down the process - one can engineer to their hearts content. Practice is all that is needed and the less interference the better. The energies that are transformed will rise and fill and rise again. No doing is necessary. If you find this difficult to hear then this is your greatest block. If you find this difficult to understand - that is fine - it is hard to understand.
A great deal of practice in Qi Gong will result in the fine points of practice coming to you - the way in which your fingers and hands are orchestrated, the palms of your feet flat on the floor. Attention to the LDT.

Don't make this stuff pie in the sky and outrageously complicated - it is not helpful to do so. Labeling and thinking you have figured it all out - the what and where of what goes where and how it happens and who said this and that - clear your mind and practice as the baboon in you knows absolutely nothing but how to keep you asleep with complex diagrams of BS.

Even the great teachers will tell you everything they say is BS - some of you just must hear it or you will die - so it is written for you and it is indeed somewhat guiding and somewhat misleading at the same time. This mix of mixed guiding is there to trip you on purpose - to help you snap out of the "guru" worship and get to real growth that brings with it a separation and a ones ness at the same moment.

To much flexing of muscles often takes place in discussions such as this - not born of much experience but born of quotes and recitals of processes. So far the conversation has been mundane and pretty much straight from the dictionary.

Some one said "Shen is a process" - it is not a process - it is a refined energy - the steam of the cauldron - it is the result of a process. Pulsating if you have it should be a very fleeting sensation and not what one would call a healthy sensation - hopefully it will not take you long to move past it. Edited July 15, 2015 by dawei
Admin: Fix broken quote

[SonOfTheGods]

the top of the head pulsates - much like SOTG showing for his middle tan tien - although that looks more like muscle flexing.

 

http://thedaobums.com/topic/34127-minor-death-in-longmen-pai/page-2#entry535606

 

 

Marks of Glory, on 22 Mar 2014 - 01:50, said:

 

the 'mysterious female aperture' is mentioned in the tao teh ching. On Long Men Pai it is said that this "aperture" is found half way between the Heart (representing Heaven here) and the Navel / Kidneys (Representing Earth).

 

i.e. the mysterious female aperture is localized on the solar plexus, on the stomach area. If I'm not mistaken there a stage on the practice in which the adept must hold his intent and qi higher than the navel but lower than the heart, until the qi will spontaneosly enter into this cavity.

 

 

 

 

 

All very real, and not allegory.

 

Mine protrudes about 1.5 inches, and is round.

I can make it pop in and out, very easily, over and over.

 

 

When I put focus on my lower Tan Tien, immediately the flow surges into it, Shanzhong heats, Vagus nerve on right side of neck pulsates, my lower lip goes numb/tingles and my false and true (and middle) 3rd eye/Niwan starts to swell.

 

Lingtai, BaiHui pulses and Laogong, Daling Points heat and ignite all the way to Yong quan/Bubbling Springs.

 

Huiyin, Qihai, Wei lu, Mingmen throbs and Tan Tien MCO reverses.

 

Few minutes later the energy sublimates and little death visits.

 

 

 

 

 

[ChiForce]

Hehehe...yeah, shen is as much as energy (higher and more refined energy) as your chi and your jing.  The crown chakra is a cauldron, or an energy meridian point.     

[SonOfTheGods]

Are you SOTG talking to himself? Just curious. 

 

http://thedaobums.com/topic/38454-what-results-do-people-here-have-from-training/page-4#entry631871

 

 

vonkrankenhaus, on 23 Jun 2015 - 12:35, said:

 

It would be interesting if people were also to include photos or videos of any relevant part of their training - or maybe even actual demonstrations of effects of their training (where relevant).

 

I know I have enjoyed very much seeing photos and/or video of other people on Dao Bums when they have posted them.

 

I'm working on making some photos/videos like this too.

 

 

-VonKrankenhaus

 

 

That can put a target on your back

 

Nevertheless, it's in my Signature

[Infolad1]

Are you SOTG talking to himself? Just curious. 

LOL! Wow, I just GOT here, and this is the response I get?

 

You can read my bio. I'm based In Philadelphia.

 

I'm as real as anything is, in this simulation!LOL! 

 

Cheers!

[Infolad1]

Well, SOTG said that some of the members of his forum would merge into one being in the future---I don't know who exactly they were so, even though I'm inclined to say "no", I might refrain from deciding.

I just answered this a moment ago. I'm an actual persona, based In Philadelphia (the fact that I 

have to respond to this, speaks volumes to the level of discourse on here).

 

Is this a forum for spiritual cultivators, or 4Chan?

 

I have close to 20 years of actual experience in cultivating, nutrition, gongfu,

Qigong, & fitness.

 

I'm here to help anyone looking for real, practical advice on their training, & discussions

with peers of comparable experience on finer points.

 

If that's not what TTB is about, then I'll keep busy with other work.

 

I wish you the best In your training, and all of your life endeavors.

 

Cheers!

[MooNiNite]

I have close to 20 years of actual experience in cultivating, nutrition, gongfu,

Qigong, & fitness.

 

Through all this training, You dont see the lower dantien as a container? Why then do you suppose it becomes hot? The traditional theory is that the heat is caused by the friction between the moving yang energies. 

 

I'm an actual persona, based In Philadelphia (the fact that I 

 

I just came across your comments in the past and they were all associated with SOTG and representing his website forum, so I had to ask. 

[Infolad1]

the top of the head pulsates - much like SOTG showing for his middle tan tien - although that looks more like muscle flexing.

 

Anyway there's "yin shen" and "yang shen" and so yeah it's a process that is all connected.

 

yin jing builds to yang jing (yin qi) which builds to yang qi (yin shen) which builds to yang shen (yin jing).

 

So when you get yang shen you get physical transformations - and the energy cycles like that.

 

So to build up shen you first has to build up qi - and the jing-qi-shen is the alchemical pill that can be transmitted out of the pineal gland - in different variations of intensity - but the energy has to be unified on some level. The Emptiness is this eternal process of complementary opposites.

 

So the ultimate complementary opposite is the yuan qi on the right side of the heart building up the yuan shen on the left side of the heart - in prenatal state they are unified but after birth the yuan shen manifests out of the eyes and the yuan qi manifests out of the pineal gland.

 

So with yuan qi focused on reproduction it then causes the yin jing to deconvert to generative fluid whereas if yuan qi is focused on Emptiness it sublimates the yin jing into yin qi.

 

That is how the Ocean of Qi is built up - the conception vessel - of the yin heel channels.

 

So then as the yin qi builds up it activates the Cavity of Spirit-Vitality which is the lower tan tien as the unification of qi and shen.

 

So only after the yin qi is built up is the lower tan tien really activated and then you have to convert that yin qi into yang qi - this is the first stage of alchemy called converting jing to qi.

 

Most qigong practice doesn't even get to the first stage since the yin qi never gets built up in the first place.

 

If you do beging converting jing to qi then finally the pineal gland begins to open up - which means the Cavity of Original Spirit of yin shen manifests as the first half of enlightenment - the Lunar Dragon energy or heart's fire energy - it is the Cavity of the Dragon of the lower tan tien filling up and then manifesting as a third eye opening up - it is the Tai Chi manifesting.

 

If you can keep storing up your energy - then you really achieve a god like level - but in either case after the Tai Chi manifests then you see light outside your head and light around other people's heads and so you have permanent contact with the shen reality. At this stage the top of the skull softens up and pulsates with qi and the center of the skull opens up again.

 

If you can fully fill up the lower tan tien with yang qi then the real astral travel kicks in and much stronger abilities - any bit of yang qi or yuan qi energy activated is gonna have strong abilities.

 

But if you get attached to the power than it creates disharmony as the shen is right brain dream state trance vision while attachment is the left brain language intention of the ego.

 

So that's why shen is the sattva or pure mind state of the Emptiness - the Wu Chi as female formless awareness.

 

If the shen leaves the body without enough qi surrounding it - then there is a spacetime vortex of dizziness. I had this happen to me - but it's only explained in chapter 11 of Taoist Yoga: Alchemy and Immortality. I didn't think I had made it that far in the book so it took me a few years to figure out what had happened to me. In the mean time I had stopped practicing and the energy channels closed up and then I used up my yuan qi energy.

 

But if the third eye really opens up then you can see dead people as spirits - as I did when they were hovering around the original qigong master in full lotus doing healing.

 

So the Cavity of Original Spirit (the upper tan tien) is actually from the Yuan Qi manifesting its "wondrous light" which it doesn't do until the lower tan tien is really activated after filling up the yin qi energy.

 

This again is a Tai Chi experience which means it is Oneness as nonduality - so it's not in any location in the body - it is an Emptiness spacetime experience of deep bliss awareness which then increases the shen light. The more Yuan Qi energy you build up the more Yuan Shen energy it creates - that is detailed in the Taoist Yoga book.

 

The key is you can't see the Emptiness and so shen isn't the final answer but you use spirit-light to guide the qi as shen is the holographic visionary information field that guides the qi.

 

So that is what is meant by focusing on the Emptiness - turning the light around since when we close our eyes then the Yuan Shen goes down to the liver as the Green Dragon which then builds up the yin qi energy energy and converts the yin jing of the kidneys, via the True Intention of the spleen/pancreas and the White Tiger of the lung deep slow breathing - to build up the yuan jing energy into more yin qi.

You seem to have gotten something a little different out of "Taoist Yoga", than I did, over the 15 years I've utilized it.

 

But everyone's different, regarding the details of manifestation, so it's possible.

 

But I politely disagree with you on a number of points, on the core sequence, from my personal experience.

 

I also like to keep the archaic terminology gymnastics to a minimum, so newer folks can grasp the fundamentals.

 

You've outlined your understanding of the process (from direct experience?), now I'm going to outline my understanding, from what I've experienced so far. From the Beginning.

 

In a nutshell, everything comes from no thing - 0 (Wuji/Amen/Ain Soph/Nirvana). 

 

No Thing did this to have experience.

 

No thing (composed of unmanifested Consciousness/Will, & unorganized Energy/Matter) created itself first (1).

 

The now manifested Consciousness/Will, & organizing Energy/Matter then split into (2) modalities:

 

Yin- Centrifugal force (Magnetic)

Yang-Centripetal force (Electric)

 

This process of differentiation (the only way to have experience, when every thing is you) continues

(2,4,8,16,32,64,etc.).

 

Phenomena (molecules, atoms, leptons, mesons, etc.=Energy/Matter), are a result of noumena (mind=Consciousness/Will).

 

Thus, undifferentiated ChAos ("A" is the indeterminate) differentiates into Kos ("Cosmos").

 

Man is a microcosm of this process.

 

Qi is Spirit. Spirit is from the Latin Spirare, which means "to breathe".

 

So your Qi body is your breath body. Known as the Guph, in Canaan (Ugarit), Khaibit in 

Ancient Egypt, Astral/Etheric body, in Western Occultism, etc.

 

So there's nothing "Woo, Woo" about the Spirit, the Qi. It's Physical. It's ALL physical, up to "0".

 

As a crude analogy, it's movement in the body is like a car battery:

 

Tu Mai = + Channel

Jen Mai = - Channel

Chong Mai = Neutral Channel

 

These energies circulate in the body on a 90 minute cycle. They oscillate.

Left nostril is negative Ionic energy (Yin), Right nostril is positive Ionic (Yang).

 

You can prove this to yourself by taking a small mirror, and breathing into it.

More air comes out of one nostril, than the other.

 

EXCEPT in the middle of this 90 minute cycle, when both nostrils "even out".

 

At this point, + -, man & woman join, and travel up the central channel, chong mai.

 

At this point we have "Tai". Peace. This energy travels through various nexus points,

called "dantiens", "Elixir Fields", etc., where it both collects, and transforms. These

nexus points interconnect with the Seven spiritual (breath) bodies, that all people possess.

 

They're not "In" the gross physical body, as most people visualize them.

 

All the various "gongs" do, is increase the levels, and vibration of this energy, which

activates a process of "travelling back", from differentiation, to unity, to no thing.

 

Various systems can "kickstart" the process. Taoist Yoga does It. Laya Yoga (Maha Bandha). Meditation. Tummo.

The various Qigongs.

 

The primary determinant in ALL of them, is THE BREATH.

 

The breath is the "fire", that lights "the cauldron" (lower, middle, and upper dantians). 

 

Physical Transformations Begin At The Point At Which The Breath Changes.

 

The breath deepens, lengthens... Then seems to stop. This is Tai Hsi, known as Kevale

Khumbaka in Yoga.

 

At this point, the "Real Yang Qi" (Kundalini) comes on line.

 

Let's be clear. Qi/Spirit/Kundalini, is ALWAYS circulating In the body, at a baseline

"maintenance" level.

 

Without Qi/Spirit/ ReSPIRation...your vehicle is "dead" (ExSPIRed).

 

What these processes do, is increase the flow ("Flux"), and vibratory level of this energy.

 

Without sufficient practice time (min, 1 to 2 hrs. a day meditation, both seated, and standing),

most practitioners will just experience movement of wind Qi, from the liver, and think that's the awakening

of Yang Qi. Or worse, from bad teaching, they just imagine their Qi "spinning" around the Orbits.

 

Once Tai Hsi comes online, the Qi begins to "Pump" in the lower dantien. This is the "real" Embryonic 

Breathing.

 

This "Yang Qi Pumping" then moves to mingmen, lingtai, jade pillow, baihui, niwan, middle dantien, lower dantien,

& huiyin.

 

The Yang Qi also vibrates strongly in these areas.

 

You'll feel heat, cold, itching, electricity, magnetism, and Ching An, which feels like a Spring breeze through the body.

 

You'll also experience "The Mysterious Gate", which appears first in your peripheral vision, then In front of you, as a blinding

white light, like a "tear" in reality. Visualize putting it in either the LDT, or MDT, when it shows up.

 

While all of this is going on, Don't Attach To It. You're on your way back home. Stay focused on your goal (Enlightenment).

 

Observe, be mindful, but don't attach. Like looking at people go past your apartment window. 

 

Once niwan comes online, you'll know, due to the fact that you'll start to produce kan lu, "The Elixir of Immortality", from

not just the pineal gland, but also structures around it. This comes into your mouth, through the roof of the mouth, transforming the saliva. Depending on your organ energy system balance, it'll taste like coconut water (balanced), 

bitter, or sour.

 

Yes, you'll become clairvoyant. You'll see spirits (which look like plasma balls, unless they decide to take shape), shadow

forms, lights. Again, don't get wrapped up in this.

 

Qi doesn't "transform" into Shen. Shen is your divine consciousness. Your true form. 

 

As your Qi purifies, you become more aware of Shen.

 

You realize that you already Are Shen. You're already "The One".

 

You're removing your dirty clothes, to reveal the suit of light already there.

 

This is the stage that I'm going into.

 

What I talk about next is speculation.

 

At this point, first the Yin Shen, then eventually the Yang Shen emanation bodies come online.

 

The Yin Shen in the West is known as "The Higher Astral", and can't be seen by others.

The Yang Shen emanation body can be seen by others, but according to the ancient texts,

can do some wonderful things.

 

Basically you become Neo...For Real. 

 

I label this as speculation, because no one can see your Yin Shen body. Maybe you have it...

or maybe you're clinically insane. LOL!  You could do experiments with friends, but these still fall under

anecdotal eidence.

 

Yang Shen is supposed to be visible, so should be verifiable. I'll let you know, when I get there!  

 

The goal is to go beyond even this, get to ultimate Yin (Nirvana Nir=No Vana=Movement/Peace), manifesting

your true nature-Peace.

 

You can't experience no thing, so this Peace manifests externally as a joy, that's not dependent on externals.

An unshakeable, adamantine serenity.

 

You now function from that no thing between Yin and Yang. In the world, but not of the world.

 

And when you transition ("Die"), you don't lose your personality, & memories ("Die the Second Death"). You 

remember all of your past lives-Functional Immortality (Who wants to wear the same suit forever?)

 

AND, while you're doing all of this, you have to get rid of your conditioned, human, thought patterns, and habits.

 

This is the whole process, In a nutshell. Up until the point at which I acknowledged speculating (People need to admit this more often), I've directly experienced all of what I've written. You've got to walk the talk.

 

If you're In need of more traditional explanations:

 

• "Taoist Yoga"by Lu Kuan Yu (Charles Luk)

   

• "Tao and Longevity", "Working Toward Enlightenment: The Cultivation of Practice", & "To Realize Enlightenment: Practice of the Cultivation Path, all by Nan Huai-Chin

   

• "The Little Book of Hercules", "What Is Enlightenment", "Measuring Meditation", by William Bodri, along with his excellent site, meditationexpert.com

   

• "The Serpent Power" by Arthur Avalon(Sir John Woodroffe). A classic. All Western Kundalini books come from this one. A keeper. Read the others first, then you'll see the crossover, and be able to filter appropriately.

   

• If unfamiliar with Traditional Chinese Medicine, and Acupuncture (A must if you're serious about the cultivation path) then pick up "The Web That Has No Weaver" by Ted J. Kaptchuk. Then check out "A Manual of Acupuncture" by peter Deadman.

I've just given an outline of the Alchemical process, according to my own experience, along with books for you to study, and practice from to find out for yourself. your mileage may vary.

 

At the end of the day, don't "believe". When you say you believe, what you're saying is "I don't know".

 

Believe Nothing. Especially not anything I'm saying.   

 

Find out for yourself. Verify. Validate. Replicate with others (I have over 30 students, at present), to verify your findings.

 

Last time I checked, you now have a science, Not make believe. 

 

Cheers!

[Infolad1]

Through all this training, You dont see the lower dantien as a container? Why then do you suppose it becomes hot? The traditional theory is that the heat is caused by the friction between the moving yang energies. 

 

 

I just came across your comments in the past and they were all associated with SOTG and representing his website forum, so I had to ask. 

The dantiens are nexus points of energy across all bodies.

 

Using the word "container" makes it sound like a box. LOL! It's not. Think more in terms of

a A wormhole, or Einstein-Rosen Bridge.

 

In the gross physical body, of course you're going to feel it as heat. You have yards of semiconductive intestinal tissue compressed in that area.

 

The tissues of the body are semiconductive. these practices take them eventually into a superconductive state.

 

Physical effects include:

 

• Piezoelectricity (Electricity generated by compression of materials. In this case, collagen, muscle, & bone).

   

• Pyroelectricity (Generating heat)

   

These are the "Yang Energies", discussed in traditional theory.

 

But we can be more precise In our nomenclature these days. 

 

Please reference the work of Dr. James Oschman, for more details. I've linked to a video of his below, "Human Metabolism Meets Cosmic Metabolism":

 

 

 

Here's a link to his site, which has various research papers, and abstracts:

http://www.energyresearch.us/

 

The site's user interface is a little weird, but you'll figure it out pretty quickly.

 

"Comments In the past"? I've only been on here for about 5 days! LOL!

 

Folks that are on Lone Man Pai, are also on here. I know them already, so I gravitate towards them. Pretty normal.

 

I give everyone the benefit of the doubt, that they are who they say they are (a dangerous thing on the Internet, I know  ).

 

I extend this courtesy to everyone. I ask that others do the same.

 

If this is how you guys treat noobs to the forum, it explains a lot of what I've seen so far on here.  

 

Cheers!

[MooNiNite]

The dantiens are nexus points of energy across all bodies.

 

I would have to disagree. but it isnt exactly easy to teach. 

[MooNiNite]

Qi doesn't "transform" into Shen. Shen is your divine consciousness. Your true form. 

 

As your Qi purifies, you become more aware of Shen.

 

You realize that you already Are Shen. You're already "The One".

 

You're removing your dirty clothes, to reveal the suit of light already there.

 

This is something that connects with my experiences though. 

[Infolad1]

 

 

 

This stage of pulsation will be fleeting if practice is regular and the actual feeling of the release of the refined energy from a dan tien can be quite specific if you happen to be awake when it occurs (actually Awakened or just daytime awake).

 

In the latter stages large columns of astounding energy will build in addition to the MCO becoming very pronounced and extending outward to some 2.5 feet.

 

At some point the separated columns of energy will join - as in the golden Buddha pictured above. If you happen to be conscious at the time it is a very fine release again as all columns and systems gently merge within a few seconds.

 

At this time and for some time after the process unfolds into a very different awareness - in my case the higher heart expanded greatly but not for some weeks / months. The entire spine is electrified and fully connected to the great magnetic centers - the whole head is one - the crown extends some 5-8 feet upward and out.

 

It is not necessary to do anything in the entire process - but if one wishes to slow down the process - one can engineer to their hearts content. Practice is all that is needed and the less interference the better. The energies that are transformed will rise and fill and rise again. No doing is necessary. If you find this difficult to hear then this is your greatest block. If you find this difficult to understand - that is fine - it is hard to understand.

A great deal of practice in Qi Gong will result in the fine points of practice coming to you - the way in which your fingers and hands are orchestrated, the palms of your feet flat on the floor. Attention to the LDT.

 

Don't make this stuff pie in the sky and outrageously complicated - it is not helpful to do so. Labeling and thinking you have figured it all out - the what and where of what goes where and how it happens and who said this and that - clear your mind and practice as the baboon in you knows absolutely nothing but how to keep you asleep with complex diagrams of BS.

 

Even the great teachers will tell you everything they say is BS - some of you just must hear it or you will die - so it is written for you and it is indeed somewhat guiding and somewhat misleading at the same time. This mix of mixed guiding is there to trip you on purpose - to help you snap out of the "guru" worship and get to real growth that brings with it a separation and a ones ness at the same moment.

 

To much flexing of muscles often takes place in discussions such as this - not born of much experience but born of quotes and recitals of processes. So far the conversation has been mundane and pretty much straight from the dictionary.

 

Some one said "Shen is a process" - it is not a process - it is a refined energy - the steam of the cauldron - it is the result of a process. Pulsating if you have it should be a very fleeting sensation and not what one would call a healthy sensation - hopefully it will not take you long to move past it.

Hi Spotless. Thanks for replying.

 

I have to disagree with you on some points you made, from both my personal experience, and various traditional texts (and for the record, I experienced most of the process first, then the texts just verified, and clarified what I had experienced).

 

The Qi pulsating, vibrating, etc., happens In stages, known in traditional texts as"The Infinite Refinements".

 

It Indicates strong, healthy Energy. A milestone In your movement along the path.

 

Once this process starts, it never stops. Energy is movement. It becomes subtle at the end of revolution, then increases again, on the next level up. And the next, and the next.

 

Why wouldn't you be "awake" (beta to alpha brainwave state/waking trance state). If you're not, then you're either in a mediumistic trance state, ...or asleep.LOL! Not conducive to these processes.

 

The only caveat is at the state of non movement, "0". Thoughts are energy, movement. Can't have movement at "0".

 

How could you know what the Golden Buddha looks like, if you're not conscious?

 

What if you're not Buddhist? What then? This process is non-denominational. To say otherwise is elitist. 

 

This is available to all who sincerely seek it, irrespective of creed, culture, race, or gender.

 

Dude, did you just call me a baboon? ROFLMAO!!

 

Of COURSE all you have to do is sit down, know the correct breathing process, and let It unfold. The simplest

process. Been there, done that. STILL doing that.

 

It's just one way of many. As long as the alchemical process gets kickstarted, how you got to it isn't important.

 

No one's overcomplicating anything. I'm explaining it from both a traditional, and Western standpoint, in a straightforward

enough way for the average person to replicate it.

 

That's what a real science is. Internal Alchemy is a science (Latin "To Know"). If you can't do it, confirm your results, and teach others to replicate your results, then you just have "WooWoo".

 

Most people don't breath right. It takes some time to get them there. you can't tell the average person to "just sit there, and breath". I teach people how to do this on a weekly basis. They relate their experiences to me, with details that only an actual cultivator would know. These are average working Joes and Janes.

 

Let me be clear. I don't "quote and recite". For you to say that to someone you don't even know is an insult.

 

I treat everyone on here with respect, even in the middle of lively debate. I expect you to do the same when addressing me.

 

Everything I say is from direct experience. I absolutely know what I'm talking about, regarding the things I've directly experienced. Areas where I don't have direct experience, I make a point of saying that this is speculation, or hearsay. 

 

Shen is not the steam of the cauldron, that's Qi. One of the many definitions of Qi in Mandarin is "Vapour", "Cloud", & "Gas".

 

Shen is beyond that. 

 

Your Gross Physical Vehicle is Earth, Jing is liquid(Water), Qi is Gas (Air/Fire/Plasma), Shen is Light (Radiation).

 

This has been my experience. The Ancients said it. And modern science confirms it.

 

Your mileage may vary.

 

Cheers!

[Infolad1]

I would have to disagree. but it isnt exactly easy to teach. 

Google Powers...ACTIVATE!!

 

nex·us

ˈneksəs

 

noun

a connection or series of connections linking two or more things.

"the nexus between industry and political power"

 

a connected group or series.

"a nexus of ideas"

 

the central and most important point or place.

"the nexus of all this activity was the disco"

 

You say container, I say nexus.

 

You say tomato,  I say tomata.

 

It's all Kool and the Gang.

 

Cheers!

[Brian]

data:image/jpeg;base64,/9j/4AAQSkZ<snip>

cobi, would you please fix or cleanup this broken picture?

 

Thanks!

[JinlianPai]

In alchemy what I found is that it is more about what are you trying to develop what forces and expressions in nature are you working with and how do you safely cultivate that living force in the dao.

 

All alchemy achieves a very specific something.

 

The monks and taoist learned about the different living forces in the dao and found ways to cultivate themselves with it.

 

By doing this they learned more about the natural living forces that surrounded them.

[Infolad1]

In alchemy what I found is that it is more about what are you trying to develop what forces and expressions in nature are you working with and how do you safely cultivate that living force in the dao.

 

All alchemy achieves a very specific something.

 

The monks and taoist learned about the different living forces in the dao and found ways to cultivate themselves with it.

 

By doing this they learned more about the natural living forces that surrounded them.

Exactly!

 

"To Know Truth, You Have To Live It", as they used to say In Ancient Egypt. Most ancient 

cultures understood this.

 

The Taoists, Buddhists, & Indus Valley folks just kept VERY good notes. 

 

So did the Egyptians, but most of their books were used as firewood by the Invading muslims

 

Thankfully, they had already spread their knowledge...around, by this time.

 

Cheers!

Edited July 16, 2015 by Infolad1

[MooNiNite]

You seem to have gotten something a little different out of "Taoist Yoga", than I did, over the 15 years I've utilized it.

 

The yin shen body you were talking about, do you believe their are multiple or just one?

[Daeluin]

Cheers!

 

Infolad1, thanks for some of the info you've shared here, and welcome! It is great to hear from another well-studied bum. Too, I wonder if there is a reason for the saying: those who know don't speak. It is good to be mindful of frugality and humility, for they are integral to wuwei. Excesses and expectations can lead to subtle rifts, especially on these boards where attached but differing understandings of right and wrong abound, leading to inevitable debating over what is "right." Knowledge is endless, perspectives are endless, and there is no one "right" for everyone, a message oft lost in these discussions.

 

Shen is everywhere.

[voidisyinyang]

This is very funny because you want to use science but you have completely left out the foundation of quantum physics which is the new foundation of science for the past 100 years!!

 

This is a very common problem you have made because classical physics is taught first to people in school and so people are mind-controlled.

 

I realized this and so I didn't take physics in high school but my first year of college I did take quantum physics. haha.

 

So you say everything is physical up to zero as Emptiness - well I guess you haven't really studied quantum physics then.

 

 

Yin- Centrifugal force (Magnetic)

Yang-Centripetal force (Electric)

 

This process of differentiation (the only way to have experience, when every thing is you) continues

(2,4,8,16,32,64,etc.).

 

 

Fourier Uncertainty as time-frequency is the eternal process of change as complementary opposites (converted into symmetric math for Western analysis) - so that is the secret of the Buddhist phrase: Emptiness is Form.

 

Please don't limit yin and yang to physical energies.

 

As Pythagoras taught - all is NUmber and Harmony - and so from the 1 is 2 and from the 2 is 3 and from 3 is all of reality - that is the secret of Tai Chi but only understood as complementary opposites.

 

Classical physics is based on taking that secret and twisting it into symmetric geometry - thereby destroying the Tai Chi and replacing it with a preestablished deep disharmony.

 

 

Phenomena (molecules, atoms, leptons, mesons, etc.=Energy/Matter), are a result of noumena (mind=Consciousness/Will).

 

 

So that problem goes back to Plato and Archytas - it's a very deep mind control problem - it even goes back to the "divide and average" math of the Vedic-Brahmin ritual priests.

 

Buddhism was a reform effort - but still is based on the symmetric logic of the Vedic philosophy while Taoism is parallel to the three gunas, the oldest philosophy of India - from trance dance training of Africa based on music theory.

 

So the nonwestern music theory is the secret meaning of Fourier Uncertainty in quantum physics.

 

You want to clarify things for people by putting it into Western science terms but instead you are just repeating the same problem of twisting something that is inherently nonwestern in Western terms.

 

 

It's better that people study and learn the terms of the traditional Taoist texts since those teachers are from a lineage that knows the real answers.

 

Or you can do what I did - spend 15 years unlearning Western thought. haha.

 

 

I also like to keep the archaic terminology gymnastics to a minimum, so newer folks can grasp the fundamentals.

 

 

Traditional teachings are not archaic - they are based on biology of modern humans that has not changed fundamentally in 125,000 years - which is the last time the original human culture, the Bushmen, from were all this spiritual training comes from, split off from the other African tribes that migrated into the rest of the world.

 

And also the whole Neo Matrix thing is messed up:

 

 

You're already "The One".

 

Actually the secret of how Neo left the Matrix is because he repeatedly said to himself:

 

 

I am not the One.

 

Or as Pythagoras taught: One is not a number.

 

In other words - the source of the I-thought is that there is no mind and so number does not exist.

 

But when form does exist it resonates through complementary opposites and this is very practical information.

 

So by studying Taoist Yoga we discover the efficacy of the Moving of Yin and Yang exercise for example.

 

The left hand is Yuan Shen - the dragon channel to the left side of the heart.

 

The right hand is Yuan Qi - the tiger channel to the right side of the heart.

 

So in the Moving of Yin and Yang standing active exercise you put the left hand in front of the lower body.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v_1sPDntOTs

 

Why? because the left hand is Yuan Shen and as the dragon cavity it also is yin - while the lower body is also yin - this is because you first have to build up the yin qi.

 

That's why the Heart as shen is dragon but in the first stage of alchemy the liver is the Green Dragon because you close the eyes and the shen goes to the liver.

 

So the lower tan tien is called the Cavity of the Dragon because you build up the yin qi or the Heart's fire energy until the Green Dragon is then opened into the yang qi so that the heart's fire is turned into the Red Dragon - yang energy.

 

That is the secret of the yang within the yin - or the yuan qi manifesting out of the heart unified with the yuan shen.

 

And so for the lower tan tien as the Cavity of Spirit-Vitality - you put the right hand over the left hand to seal in the energy.

 

Why? Because the right hand as yuan qi needs to surround the yuan shen - the qi is what gives the force to the shen and as Taoist Yoga explains if you don't have enough yuan qi surrounding the yuan shen - when the shen leaves the body it causes dizziness as a spacetime vortex - that's from chapter 11.

Edited July 16, 2015 by Innersoundqigong

[Infolad1]

The yin shen body you were talking about, do you believe their are multiple or just one?

At that stage, there can be as many as you need.

 

A body (vehicle) is just a focus point for consciousness to operate from, and through.

Consciousness is both non-local, and Immaterial, so It needs a vehicle to function through

In manifested reality.

 

We are all made in the likeness of the creative force (Nebertcher, "God", "Allah", "Bob"  )

that created this simulation.

 

So like It, we can differentiate into as many vehicles as necessary, at the higher stages of cultivation.

 

Everything comes from mind, through the creative agency of the spirit.

 

Regardless of the level that you're at, life is just a continuous replication of these primordial 

processes. Think fractals, & the Fibonacci sequence.

 

Perfect analogy is your average video game. You start off at a beginner level. As you

acquire power ups, you can access higher and higher levels, that allow you to do more and more things.

 

At a high enough level, you get Infinite lives, and can play as ALL of the characters. you even find hidden ("Occult")

characters to play as.

 

The higher level characters ("Avatars") allow you to do things that bypass the different physics engines of the lower levels.

 

We are all living In "The Matrix"...for REAL.

 

Everything you need to know about cultivation can be learned from "Legend of Zelda", or "World of Warcraft". 

 

Although life on this plane is starting to look more and more like a combination of "GTA", and "The Last of Us". 

 

Cheers!

[Infolad1]

This is very funny because you want to use science but you have completely left out the foundation of quantum physics which is the new foundation of science for the past 100 years!!

 

This is a very common problem you have made because classical physics is taught first to people in school and so people are mind-controlled.

 

I realized this and so I didn't take physics in high school but my first year of college I did take quantum physics. haha.

 

So you say everything is physical up to zero as Emptiness - well I guess you haven't really studied quantum physics then.

 

 

 

 

Fourier Uncertainty as time-frequency is the eternal process of change as complementary opposites (converted into symmetric math for Western analysis) - so that is the secret of the Buddhist phrase: Emptiness is Form.

 

Please don't limit yin and yang to physical energies.

 

As Pythagoras taught - all is NUmber and Harmony - and so from the 1 is 2 and from the 2 is 3 and from 3 is all of reality - that is the secret of Tai Chi but only understood as complementary opposites.

 

Classical physics is based on taking that secret and twisting it into symmetric geometry - thereby destroying the Tai Chi and replacing it with a preestablished deep disharmony.

 

 

 

 

So that problem goes back to Plato and Archytas - it's a very deep mind control problem - it even goes back to the "divide and average" math of the Vedic-Brahmin ritual priests.

 

Buddhism was a reform effort - but still is based on the symmetric logic of the Vedic philosophy while Taoism is parallel to the three gunas, the oldest philosophy of India - from trance dance training of Africa based on music theory.

 

So the nonwestern music theory is the secret meaning of Fourier Uncertainty in quantum physics.

 

You want to clarify things for people by putting it into Western science terms but instead you are just repeating the same problem of twisting something that is inherently nonwestern in Western terms.

 

 

It's better that people study and learn the terms of the traditional Taoist texts since those teachers are from a lineage that knows the real answers.

 

Or you can do what I did - spend 15 years unlearning Western thought. haha.

 

 

 

 

Traditional teachings are not archaic - they are based on biology of modern humans that has not changed fundamentally in 125,000 years - which is the last time the original human culture, the Bushmen, from were all this spiritual training comes from, split off from the other African tribes that migrated into the rest of the world.

 

And also the whole Neo Matrix thing is messed up:

 

 

 

Actually the secret of how Neo left the Matrix is because he repeatedly said to himself:

 

 

 

Or as Pythagoras taught: One is not a number.

 

In other words - the source of the I-thought is that there is no mind and so number does not exist.

 

But when form does exist it resonates through complementary opposites and this is very practical information.

 

So by studying Taoist Yoga we discover the efficacy of the Moving of Yin and Yang exercise for example.

 

The left hand is Yuan Shen - the dragon channel to the left side of the heart.

 

The right hand is Yuan Qi - the tiger channel to the right side of the heart.

 

So in the Moving of Yin and Yang standing active exercise you put the left hand in front of the lower body.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v_1sPDntOTs

 

Why? because the left hand is Yuan Shen and as the dragon cavity it also is yin - while the lower body is also yin - this is because you first have to build up the yin qi.

 

That's why the Heart as shen is dragon but in the first stage of alchemy the liver is the Green Dragon because you close the eyes and the shen goes to the liver.

 

So the lower tan tien is called the Cavity of the Dragon because you build up the yin qi or the Heart's fire energy until the Green Dragon is then opened into the yang qi so that the heart's fire is turned into the Red Dragon - yang energy.

 

That is the secret of the yang within the yin - or the yuan qi manifesting out of the heart unified with the yuan shen.

 

And so for the lower tan tien as the Cavity of Spirit-Vitality - you put the right hand over the left hand to seal in the energy.

 

Why? Because the right hand as yuan qi needs to surround the yuan shen - the qi is what gives the force to the shen and as Taoist Yoga explains if you don't have enough yuan qi surrounding the yuan shen - when the shen leaves the body it causes dizziness as a spacetime vortex - that's from chapter 11.

 

 

...Actually, I didn't leave out "Quantum Physics" at all.

 

Quanta - Physics: the smallest quantity of radiant energy, equal to Planck's constant times the frequency of the associated                                    radiation.

 

quan·tum

ˈkwän(t)əm/

noun

plural noun: quanta

 

1.PHYSICS

   A discrete quantity of energy proportional in magnitude to the frequency of the radiation it represents.

 

2. A required or allowed amount, especially an amount of money legally payable in damages.

 

 

phys·i·cal

ˈfizik(ə)l/

adjective

 

1.of or relating to the body as opposed to the mind.

  "a whole range of physical and mental challenges"

 

   synonyms: bodily, corporeal, corporal, somatic; More

 

2.of or relating to things perceived through the senses as opposed to the mind; tangible or concrete.

   "pleasant physical environments"

   

    synonyms: material, concrete, tangible, palpable, solid, substantial, real, actual, visible

 

   "the physical universe"

 

So quantum physics has to do with Everything Physical. It's just dealing with things at a subatomic scale.

 

You: "Please don't limit yin and yang to physical energies".

 

Me: "But They Ahh Blanche, They Ahh!"LOL! (I'm sure Cinephiles here got the joke).

 

Yin and Yang are forces. Energies. Composed of Quanta. 

 

A thing is a limited (finite), defined structure in space and time. thus we Define Things (give definitions).

 

Yin and Yang are effects, the cause of which is No Thing (Original Nature, Amen, Ain Soph, etc.).

 

 

I want to sincerely thank you Innersoundqigong. This discourse is a perfect education for newcomers.

 

You've allowed me to showcase one of the major delusions In pursuit of enlightenment.

 

As Patanjali said, "One of the biggest sources of delusion, is the usage of words that have no objective reality".

 

Cultivation practices these days are extremely guilty of this. Throwing words around, not knowing the actual meaning, and context In which to utilize them, as you've just shown, and that astute readers I'm sure have picked up on.

 

Molecules are physical, subatomic particles are physical, thoughts are physical, emotions (External motions) are physical.

 

Any Thing that can be quantified, by it's very EXistence, IS PHYSICAL. 

 

Qualia (qualities) are more abstract, but nonetheless physical. As a matter of fact, qualities only exist in relation (relative) to

other things. No thing has a quality, In, and of itself.

 

This is because reality is a simulation, NOT an Illusion (get shot by a railgun, and let me know if that's an Illusion).

 

Think "World of Warcraft", or "GTA". A virtual simulation of a world, with characters(Avatars), graphics engines, physics engines, all rendered with code, to simulate a created reality for people's enjoyment.

 

Sound familiar?

 

Yin and Yang being the primordial modalities, allows anyone to utilize them to talk about every thing. Physical, And Mental.

 

When I discuss Yin and Yang, I'm talking on multiple levels, utilizing what I just said as my foundation.

 

Yin and Yang function on multiple levels, both implicitly, and explicitly. Reality as a whole functions on multiple levels,

both implicitly, and explicitly.

 

And since we're discussing quantum mechanics, which model are you talking about?

 

The Quantum mechanics model of David Bohm? Which would be the most appropriate for our purposes. He was a

ardent student of Eastern thought.

 

The Quantum Mechanics model of Niels Bohr? of Wolfgang Pauli? of Paul Dirac? 

 

The Many Worlds Interpretation of Hugh Everett, and John Archibald Wheeler, his thesis advisor?

 

The "Consciousness Causes Collapse of The Wave Function" Interpretation of John Von Neumann, and Eugene Wigner?

 

Roger Penrose's? Briane Grenne's? Hawkings? Which one, which one?

 

I'm fairly certain that I have a firm grasp of Quantum Mechanics, and the minds who laid out it's various models 

Innersoundqigong   But thanks for asking.

 

This is the major point that I want new folks to pay attention to, and research on their own.

 

Most cultivation "theories" are based on quicksand. It's the reason that hard scientists tend to laugh, and snicker when your

average cultivation practitioner starts talking about Yin and Yang, tossing around "Quantum Physics" to make it sound legit, &

reciting ad nauseum passages from "Taoist Yoga"(Not that there's anything wrong with that).

 

Look, I LOVE "Taoist Yoga". It's an amazing tome (I've had my annotated copy since 1999). But it isn't the end all, be all. 

Everything In it is NOT exact. Anyone who's done the actual practice ( Which I have) knows that.

 

Your vehicle is a Bioelectromagnetic Alternator. Doing these practices generate physical effects. Period.

 

As you've helped me show here Innersoundqigong, unfortunately, most cultivators don't know what "physical" Is.

 

Spirit is the breath. So when you're discussing spiritual matters, you're discussing physical matters, understanding that there are different levels of physical matter, some grosser, some subtler.

 

This is why most people can't take these practices seriously. Basic science can't even be expressed correctly.

 

I wasn't talking about how Neo was able to leave the Matrix, please stay on topic (And for the record, Morpheus helped him see The Matrix for what it is, and escape It. With both Morpheus', and Trinity's help, he eventually realized, through "dying" to his old worldview (classic "Hero's Journey" arc) that he was "The One", and had full control over the Matrix. Or as the Wizard told the Cowardly Lion In the "Wizard of Oz","You're Already Courageous. your problem Is due to wrong thinking".    But I digress).

 

"Emptiness is form". Right, 0=1. I've already discussed this.

 

ANY of the standing gongs will do what you talk about. You don't need "Taoist Yoga" to do that. 

 

Pythagoras learned from the Egyptians...And badly. And as someone who both does, and teaches Tai Qi Quan, that Is NOT the secret of Tai Qi Quan. The secret is the one practice that most people avoid like the plague: Wuji/MaBu/Standing Gongs.

 

Get to 30 to 60 minutes everyday for six months, to a year. With proper breathing. You'll then know what I'm talking about.

 

I ALREADY discussed the Fibonacci Sequence, which also dovetails Into I Ching, which I've used for close to 20 years.

 

"Mind and number do not exist". So I guess we're not having this conversation, and you don't need money for anything.  

Classical physics disharmonious? You wouldn't be typing on this computer without It. 

 

Yes, Yin Shen spirals out of the body sometimes, but you don't get dizzy doing It. You might not have enough energy yet.

I've never gotten dizzy doing it. But hey, everyone's different.

 

I will say that getting initial control of flying was Interesting (I was doing my best Impersonation of "The Greatest American Hero" for a minute there). LOL!

 

You seem to have slipped into a slavish dogma, regarding "Taoist Yoga". You may want to look at that.

 

Everyone wants to mindful of doing this. Your direct experience takes precedent. You can then confirm or reject

Anything that you read.

 

It's what Buddha did, and we know everything he said, and did is true. OBEY!!     

 

Innersoundqigong, thank you again, for helping me show fellow travellers where not to go wrong on the path. I appreciate

It, and you. Good fortune!

 

Cheers! 

[Infolad1]

Infolad1, thanks for some of the info you've shared here, and welcome! It is great to hear from another well-studied bum. Too, I wonder if there is a reason for the saying: those who know don't speak. It is good to be mindful of frugality and humility, for they are integral to wuwei. Excesses and expectations can lead to subtle rifts, especially on these boards where attached but differing understandings of right and wrong abound, leading to inevitable debating over what is "right." Knowledge is endless, perspectives are endless, and there is no one "right" for everyone, a message oft lost in these discussions.

 

Shen is everywhere.

Thanks Daeluin!

 

Rifts only occur due to Ego. Want the best for others, but let them find their own way. It might not be your way.

 

I'm just laying out what I've experienced. The fundamentals are the fundamentals. they're non-denominational.

 

The techniques, and ways of getting there, on the other hand,  are legion! LOL!!  As long as it doesn't bring harm to others, however you get there is up to you.

 

You'll only hear from me when people botch the fundamentals. I don't want to see new people get hurt by someone

else's ignorance, negligence, or ego.

 

Other than that, Buddhist, Taoist, Sufi, Ancient Egyptian(Kamitic), Indus Valley (Pre-Vedas), Vedic (Hindu), Yoruba, Akan, Dogon, Kabbalah, Gnosticism, Neoplatonism, Thelemic, Enochian, Mystic Christianity, Hopi, Aboriginal,  Shamanic, etc.

 

Whatever gets you there (Enlightenment) without harm to you, and others, I say go for It!

 

Cheers!

[voidisyinyang]

Your definition of quantum physics based on particles shows your bias - you say you didn't "leave it out" - I never said you left out quantum physics - I said that you did not make quantum physics the foundation of your science analysis.

 

Planck's constant is based on a materialist definition that does not address the foundation of quantum physics from Fourier Uncertainty as discovered by Louis de Broglie.

 

Namely - as light accelerates by going higher in frequency then time slows down according to  Einstein's relativity. De Broglie realized this violates a basic fundamental principle of science - the Law of Pythagoras that time as wavelength is inverse to frequency as energy. So if frequency is getting higher and bigger then wavelength as time should be getting smaller and faster but the opposite occurs in relativity.

 

So de Broglie reasoned that because relativity is real then there must be two time clocks - one that is faster than the speed of light which then goes back in reverse time and harmonizes the time in sync with frequency. De Broglie called this the Law of Phase Harmony.

 

This phenomenon explains precognition - and it also explains that energy is fundamentally a wave - not a particle - a unified wave as a nondual experience.

 

And guess what - science just confirmed this is true - that the nonlocal wave of energy is more fundamental than the photon particle that Einstein got the nobel prize for and was the basis for the "quanta" that you use to define quantum physics.

 

https://plus.google.com/113210754710939771474/posts/BMhEEXFdzEM

 

 

And since we're discussing quantum mechanics, which model are you talking about?

 

The Law of Phase Harmony has to be converted back into Western classical physics using the Poisson Bracket - so I'm not talking about any model at all. I'm saying that quantum physics rediscovered the truth of nonlocal complementary opposites (of time and frequency) as the opposite extreme of actual Taoist training.

 

Remember it is you who say you want to use "quanta" to describe yin and yang as physical matter - but time and frequency are non-local uncertainties based on non-commutative math which means that the order in which you measure them changes their value. So then consciousness in the measurement process directly is part of the "experiment."

 

So quantum physics justifies this quantum entanglement by saying the information signal is only measured "after the fact" and so that linear causality of relativity is not violated. That is true - but quantum physics logically infers the truth of a nondual reality. This is detailed in Bernard D'Espagnat's quantum physics analysis: http://www.theguardian.com/science/blog/2009/mar/17/templeton-quantum-entanglement

 

I'm fairly certain that I have a firm grasp of Quantum Mechanics, and the minds who laid out it's various models 

Innersoundqigong   But thanks for asking.

 

This is the major point that I want new folks to pay attention to, and research on their own.

 

Most cultivation "theories" are based on quicksand. It's the reason that hard scientists tend to laugh, and snicker when your

average cultivation practitioner starts talking about Yin and Yang, tossing around "Quantum Physics" to make it sound legit, &

reciting ad nauseum passages from "Taoist Yoga"(Not that there's anything wrong with that).

 

Look, I LOVE "Taoist Yoga". It's an amazing tome (I've had my annotated copy since 1999). But it isn't the end all, be all. 

Everything In it is NOT exact. Anyone who's done the actual practice ( Which I have) knows that.

 

Your vehicle is a Bioelectromagnetic Alternator. Doing these practices generate physical effects. Period.

 

As you've helped me show here Innersoundqigong, unfortunately, most cultivators don't know what "physical" Is.

 

Spirit is the breath. So when you're discussing spiritual matters, you're discussing physical matters, understanding that there are different levels of physical matter, some grosser, some subtler.

 

This is why most people can't take these practices seriously. Basic science can't even be expressed correctly.

 

I wasn't talking about how Neo was able to leave the Matrix, please stay on topic (And for the record, Morpheus helped him see The Matrix for what it is, and escape It. With both Morpheus', and Trinity's help, he eventually realized, through "dying" to his old worldview (classic "Hero's Journey" arc) that he was "The One", and had full control over the Matrix. Or as the Wizard told the Cowardly Lion In the "Wizard of Oz","You're Already Courageous. your problem Is due to wrong thinking".    But I digress).

 

"Emptiness is form". Right, 0=1. I've already discussed this.

 

ANY of the standing gongs will do what you talk about. You don't need "Taoist Yoga" to do that. 

 

Pythagoras learned from the Egyptians...And badly. And as someone who both does, and teaches Tai Qi Quan, that Is NOT the secret of Tai Qi Quan. The secret is the one practice that most people avoid like the plague: Wuji/MaBu/Standing Gongs.

 

Get to 30 to 60 minutes everyday for six months, to a year. With proper breathing. You'll then know what I'm talking about.

 

I ALREADY discussed the Fibonacci Sequence, which also dovetails Into I Ching, which I've used for close to 20 years.

 

"Mind and number do not exist". So I guess we're not having this conversation, and you don't need money for anything.  

Classical physics disharmonious? You wouldn't be typing on this computer without It. 

 

Yes, Yin Shen spirals out of the body sometimes, but you don't get dizzy doing It. You might not have enough energy yet.

I've never gotten dizzy doing it. But hey, everyone's different.

 

I will say that getting initial control of flying was Interesting (I was doing my best Impersonation of "The Greatest American Hero" for a minute there). LOL!

 

You seem to have slipped into a slavish dogma, regarding "Taoist Yoga". You may want to look at that.

 

Everyone wants to mindful of doing this. Your direct experience takes precedent. You can then confirm or reject

Anything that you read.

 

It's what Buddha did, and we know everything he said, and did is true. OBEY!!   

 

Innersoundqigong, thank you again, for helping me show fellow travellers where not to go wrong on the path. I appreciate

It, and you. Good fortune!

 

Cheers! 

 

Thanks for completely not understanding what I was writing.

 

 

Yin Shen spirals out of the body sometimes, but you don't get dizzy doing It. You might not have enough energy yet.

 

The energy that I might not have enough of yet - is the Yuan Qi energy. The reason there is dizziness is from using up too much Yuan Qi - it wasn't that I didn't have enough of it "yet" - it is because I used too much of it already doing healing on other people. This also happened to the qigong master.

 

You speak of your experiences - but you don't have any corroboration - other than posting online. The practices I did have been corroborated by the qigong masters who taught me.

 

 

Right, 0=1. I've already discussed this.

 

No again that is not what I said. Number is based on complementary opposites and I said "one is not a number." I never said that 0=1 which is again a symmetric number argument. Zero does not exist - that's why Aristotle was against zero as a "negative void" materialistic foundation of reality. The concept of zero assumes a commutative symmetric property of number analysis. It seems you have not really thought about the foundations of Western science.

 

You want to use Western science to spread alchemy training but you have not really thought about why Western science is different.

 

 

It's the reason that hard scientists tend to laugh, and snicker when your

average cultivation practitioner starts talking about Yin and Yang, tossing around "Quantum Physics" to make it sound legit, &

reciting ad nauseum passages from "Taoist Yoga"(Not that there's anything wrong with that).

 

You were the one you threw out science terms to say that you didn't want to use "archaic" terminology. I never said that quantum physics makes Taoist Yoga sound legitimate - on the contrary quantum physics is the opposite extreme of Taoist Yoga.

 

Also you claim I am reciting "ad nauseum" passages - on the contrary I am presenting information based on clarifying and arguing specifics about what the Yuan Shen is compared to the Yuan Qi.

 

 

You seem to have slipped into a slavish dogma, regarding "Taoist Yoga".

 

If you can prevent any evidence for this claim - go ahead - otherwise you are resorting to just a sophistry attack with no substance.

 

Notice how you throw out a bunch of pop science quantum "models" that you want me to consider and yet the quantum scientists I refer you to are not even in your list?

You claim to understand quantum physics but you don't. I've studied all those models you refer to but they ignore the fundamental issue at hand.

 

 

Classical physics disharmonious? You wouldn't be typing on this computer without It.

 

Your comment here demonstrates a bourgeois mind-controlled approach to technology just as you did with your shopping around for quantum models.

 

Technology is imposed as a supply-side structure by the elite using Western mathematics - I call this the trajectory of tantric technology.

 

So for example a person has to have a cell phone these days just to be considered a "normal" person - and living without a t.v. would be considered bizarre - unless you rely on some other form for watching media, etc.

 

Supply side economics is built into the logarithmic technology - this goes back to Platonic philosophy.

 

As for your Matrix comments which you try to side-step - again you brought up the metaphor.

 

I already did an Actual Matrix Plan expose based on my masters thesis research.

 

http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/ciencia/ciencia_matrix43.htm

 

As for classical physics being inherently disharmonious - that is due to the symmetric mathematical logic that is the basis for classical physics. I'm not making that up as my own opinion: Professor Brozacchini wrote a book on this called Plato's Computer. It's in Italian but I've read his music math analysis and I've corresponded with him about my own music math analysis.

Luigi Borzacchini's Home Page - Dipartimento di Matematica

 

www.dm.uniba.it/~psiche/

University of Bari

Jan 14, 2013 - by Luigi Borzacchini (Dept. of Mathematics, University of Bari, Italy) ... we can maybe reveal the deep 'preestablished disharmony' of the link ..  This idea of syntactic representation was the basis of the parallel genesis of Greek philosophy and mathematics, but ever since this beginning it was clear that, inside this relationship between those two worlds, there was a deep ‘preestablished disharmony’: words and things were not alike, neither in their being nor in their becoming, some words (being, not, true, equality) did not represent any ‘thing’, a part of a word did not represent a part of the represented thing, language represented diachronically a synchronical reality. This disharmony grounded many formal paradoxes that endure up to the present time, first and foremost ‘the liar’ [3rd and 4th chapters].

Edited July 17, 2015 by Innersoundqigong