Socialism does work

[Brian]

I took undergraduate courses in economics and finance. I will have no need in reading the book you suggest. Also I am well read on the subject. What brought down Bear Stearns was not a buying frenzy, but over leveraging with liberal margin requirements. 

I took undergraduate courses in anthropology, history, mathematics, English, German, philosophy, religion, logic, geography, geology, biology, political science, chemistry, physics, mechanical engineering, drafting, computer science, electronics engineering, women's studies, music, fencing, archery, and several more which don't spring to mind as well as graduate courses in law, finance, accounting, microeconomics, macroeconomics, human resources management, industrial engineering, business management, marketing, production management, computer science, mathematics and physics (plus a few more) -- I don't see how that would be an excuse to absolve myself from further learning.

[ralis]

I took undergraduate courses in anthropology, history, mathematics, English, German, philosophy, religion, logic, geography, geology, biology, political science, chemistry, physics, mechanical engineering, drafting, computer science, electronics engineering, women's studies, music, fencing, archery, and several more which don't spring to mind as well as graduate courses in law, finance, accounting, microeconomics, macroeconomics, human resources management, industrial engineering, business management, marketing, production management, computer science, mathematics and physics (plus a few more) -- I don't see how that would be an excuse to absolve myself from further learning.

 

Not making excuses regarding further learning. I further my learning everyday and I love it! BTW, I forgot to include physics, Russian language, chemistry, microbiology, zoology (parasitology), marketing, accounting, entrepreneurship, contract law, art, landscape architecture, computer science, philosophy/logic, Bayesian decision theory, way too much math and more.   BTW, I was a biochemistry major at one time.

Edited July 21, 2015 by ralis

[Karl]

Not making excuses regarding further learning. I further my learning everyday and I love it! BTW, I forgot to include physics, Russian language, chemistry, microbiology, zoology (parasitology), marketing, accounting, entrepreneurship, contract law, art, landscape architecture, computer science, philosophy/logic, Bayesian decision theory, way too much math and more.   BTW, I was a biochemistry major at one time.

 

and your point ?

[Apech]

I took undergraduate courses in anthropology, history, mathematics, English, German, philosophy, religion, logic, geography, geology, biology, political science, chemistry, physics, mechanical engineering, drafting, computer science, electronics engineering, women's studies, music, fencing, archery, and several more which don't spring to mind as well as graduate courses in law, finance, accounting, microeconomics, macroeconomics, human resources management, industrial engineering, business management, marketing, production management, computer science, mathematics and physics (plus a few more) -- I don't see how that would be an excuse to absolve myself from further learning.

 

Time you got a proper job

[Apech]

and your point ?

 

and yours?

[ralis]

Please stop with this 'I took an undergraduate course' Schtick. I don't care. I'm only interested in what you actually know. I won't think less or more of you so you can wind all this stuff up. We are two bozos on a forum discussing a subject. Over leveraging with minimum margin requirements. Let's try that in English. What did they do ? They loaned money to people who couldn't pay it back.

 

It was in regards to credit default swaps/derivatives in which banks can place bets on bets on bets with slim capital requirements. The newest estimate of outstanding derivatives are around 600 trillion USD. More than 10x the yearly world economy. That can lead to a worldwide economic disaster.

Edited July 21, 2015 by ralis

[Wells]

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Edited May 11, 2016 by Wells

[Wells]

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Edited May 10, 2016 by Wells

[Karl]

It was in regards to credit default swaps/derivatives in which banks can place bets on bets on bets with slim capital requirements. The newest estimate of outstanding derivatives are around 600 trillion USD. More than 10x the yearly world economy. That can lead to a worldwide economic disaster.

 

Yes, it surely will.

The default swaps disguised the risk of default by a hoarde of bad debtors.

Fiat currency is not backed by specie and it is compounded by fractional reserve banking and the ability of central banks to by and sell assets.

 

We are on the same page here Ralis. This isn't capitalism, as you rightly identified. It is crony capitalism and it means the state is involved, through the government, in providing privileges to the banking system.

 

The history of the central banks is worthy of a cloak and dagger movie.

[Karl]

and yours?

 

I'm not the one listing all the courses I have taken.

 

I've got a swimming badge does that count ?

[Wells]

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Edited May 10, 2016 by Wells

[Marblehead]

The level of your education is defined by the magnitude of informations you were able to access and memorize long term.

It has nothing to do with your level of intelligence.

I can't argue with that.  Short term memorizing I cannot do.  Long term generalized recall I can do.

[gendao]

I may not be hip to UK politics but democratic socialism does seem to work on a basic level. Here in the US enter Bernie Sanders for president he is using european countries as an example of what works like free public college, free health care and so on by taxing the wealthy at the same rate as poor and middle class earnings to pay for these programs. Also he supports a higher minimum wage and equal pay for equal work no matter what gender your spirit may have jumped into. Another hot topic is GMO food by the chemical corporation Monsantos to be illegal not just labeled all for the benefit of humans not politics.

Only the greedy would want everything truly for "free" (paid for largely by others).

 

In this case, Bernie would like to tax the wealthiest at 90%+ to provide such "free" services to everyone else (vote bribes to the majority).

Vermont Sen. Bernie Sanders, a Democratic candidate for president, thinks a 90 percent tax rate on the wealthiest Americans might not be too high.

Whereas if he were actually to apply a flat tax on them at the same rate as the poor & middle class, their taxes would actually plummet down to negative values half the time - as currently, HALF of Americans already pay NO FEDERAL INCOME TAX at all!

You may have heard the claim that about half of Americans pay no federal income tax. That’s a true fact. My Tax Policy Center colleagues estimate, for example, that 46% of households either will pay no federal income tax in 2011 or will receive more from the IRS than they pay in.

Yet, he would like to vastly make tax inequity even greater???

[Apech]

I'm not the one listing all the courses I have taken. I've got a swimming badge does that count ?

 

 

Yes of course otherwise a degree of drowning might occur.

[ralis]

Only the greedy would want everything truly for "free" (paid for largely by others).

 

In this case, Bernie would like to tax the wealthiest at 90%+ to provide such "free" services to everyone else (vote bribes to the majority).

Whereas if he were actually to apply a flat tax on them at the same rate as the poor & middle class, their taxes would actually plummet down to negative values half the time - as currently, HALF of Americans already pay NO FEDERAL INCOME TAX at all!

Yet, he would like to vastly make tax inequity even greater???

 

 

I would like to see a return to the pre Reagan tax rates on corporate income. Remove the cap on social security and bring the jobs back from China. 

[Apech]

This man is far too sensible to get anywhere in modern politics ... but he is our new hero, well worth listening to even though he sounds a little tired ...

 

[Marblehead]

I would like to see a return to the pre Reagan tax rates on corporate income. Remove the cap on social security and bring the jobs back from China. 

I don't believe it.  Ralis is imagining the unimaginable!

[ralis]

I don't believe it.  Ralis is imagining the unimaginable!

 

I doubt it will ever happen, but it is worth imagining. Also the Justice dept. needs to start enforcing the Sherman Anti-Trust Act.

Edited July 21, 2015 by ralis

[ralis]

Only the greedy would want everything truly for "free" (paid for largely by others).

 

In this case, Bernie would like to tax the wealthiest at 90%+ to provide such "free" services to everyone else (vote bribes to the majority).

Whereas if he were actually to apply a flat tax on them at the same rate as the poor & middle class, their taxes would actually plummet down to negative values half the time - as currently, HALF of Americans already pay NO FEDERAL INCOME TAX at all!

Yet, he would like to vastly make tax inequity even greater???

 

A flat tax is regressive on lower income persons. Flat taxes would take a larger portion of their income.

[Karl]

This man is far too sensible to get anywhere in modern politics ... but he is our new hero, well worth listening to even though he sounds a little tired ...

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=odks6jV_AnQ

 

Your new hero perhaps. He is odds on favourite to lead the Labour Party.

 

He's a socialist so well worth ignoring completely, then bunging in a box marked 'failed ideologies of our time' .

 

I agree with him on not bombing every bit of sand in the Middle East mind you and getting rid of our nuclear offensive weapons.

Pretty much everything else is a bust.

[Orion]

The problem isn't capitalism, it's corporate consumer capitalism and globalism. Capitalism and especially merchant capitalism worked quite well until we decided to mass produce everything with planned obsolescence.

 

If we made things to last, everyone could at some point afford them and constant replacement would not be necessary. We could then focus our collective will on other things, whether we remain capitalist or become more socialist. It would mean less people tied to usury and slavery in order to keep buying crap that's trashing the planet, and more people focused on bettering their human core and their contribution to the world.

 

And anyway, any system that does not factor the natural environment into its input costs is blindly corrupt and not worth the morals it was built upon. So far it seems like both socialism and capitalism have failed miserably at this, in the versions we have seen.

[Marblehead]

A flat tax is regressive on lower income persons. Flat taxes would take a larger portion of their income.

If the government would set a "low income" rate each year based on inflation and income below the "low income" rate not be taxed but all income above that rate taxed at a flat tax rate then that problem wouldn't exist.

[gendao]

A flat tax is regressive on lower income persons. Flat taxes would take a larger portion of their income.

Well, Wu Ming Jen claimed that's what Bernie Sanders was advocating, although I think only a flat tax rate has been proposed - by others.

 

It does raise the question of why every citizen doesn't simply pay the same tax rate, much less absolute tax amount, though?  Isn't that vastly unequal and unfair, as it is?

 

Why should the rich pay far more - especially if they draw far less government benefits? 

[Marblehead]

 

Why should the rich pay far more - especially if they draw far less government benefits? 

It's based on the ability to pay.

 

Same percentage, different amounts.

[Apech]

Your new hero perhaps. He is odds on favourite to lead the Labour Party. He's a socialist so well worth ignoring completely, then bunging in a box marked 'failed ideologies of our time' . I agree with him on not bombing every bit of sand in the Middle East mind you and getting rid of our nuclear offensive weapons. Pretty much everything else is a bust.

 

 

He's the thinking Bums new hero.