Do midland americans have an accent?

[MooNiNite]

I was told that midland Americans accent is rather a lack of accent. 

 

been thinking about it.

 

is there a right way to say words? Do midland Americans stick to the books?

[MooNiNite]

For instance many Canadians say Beg instead of Bag. It is their accent. 

 

Could one go as far as to say that they are saying it wrong?

 

It is easy to say that everyone has an accent. But, that eliminates the possibility for their to be a proper way to pronounce a word correctly.

[Michael Sternbach]

And the correct way to pronounce and spell the words of a language would be defined by what or who?

 

Languages are in a state of flux over space and time. You could say that all the different accents/dialects of a language are variations over a common prototype or "Archetype". It is being expressed according to local cultural particularities. But, as Jung explained, Archetypes per say remain invisible, they can only be observed via their various manifestations.

 

In a sense, they are the sum of all their existent and possible manifestations, in another sense, they are independent from them, outside space and time.

Edited August 15, 2015 by Michael Sternbach

[soaring crane]

Everybody has an accent.

[thelerner]

As a Midwesterner I speak Normal.  Everyone else speaks funny. 

 

From the vantage of national broadcasters, the Midwest speech tends to be most emulated.   Don't know why.  In Chicago in the mid 1800's and 1900's we were a huge railroad hub, so we had much cross pollination from the coasts.   In the face of different lingo's I wonder if we evolved a middle path?

[MooNiNite]

Everybody has an accent.

That is what I originally thought. But I have begun to question that. 

 

Considering language is a creation, there is most likely a proper way to adhere to the creation. 

 

Similar to following the rules while playing monopoly.

[MooNiNite]

As a Midwesterner I speak Normal.  Everyone else speaks funny. 

 

From the vantage of national broadcasters, the Midwest speech tends to be most emulated.   Don't know why.  In Chicago in the mid 1800's and 1900's we were a huge railroad hub, so we had much cross pollination from the coasts.   In the face of different lingo's I wonder if we evolved a middle path?

 

Well I wonder why the language quiz I took that encompassed all the accents (for the English language) would classify the mid western accent as a "lack of accent."

 

 

When thinking of major cities or places where accents are strong, their could also be a lack of intelligence. Often times when large groups of people come together they lose intelligence. However, farmer folk arn't known for their intellect. So a middle ground aka the midwest could foster a correct way of speaking. 

 

Chicaaago

[Apech]

As the language is called English I'm tempted to say that the 'correct' way of speaking is standard British English - BUT actually some American accents are closer to the original form - so in the end variety is the spice of life.

[thelerner]

Well I wonder why the language quiz I took that encompassed all the accents (for the English language) would classify the mid western accent as a "lack of accent."

 

 

When thinking of major cities or places where accents are strong, their could also be a lack of intelligence. Often times when large groups of people come together they lose intelligence. However, farmer folk arn't known for their intellect. So a middle ground aka the midwest could foster a correct way of speaking. 

 

Chicaaago

Yes, its been widely postulated that our lack on intelligence, allows us perfect dictumtion

 

by the way it's Chicawgo, my-ng home town.  Old timers, like my dad had the odd habit of adding strangely inappropriate -ng 's to the back of words, turning 'mine' into my-ng.    Many arguments were won that way as the listener hesitates to argue back, there mind turning over 'where did that ng come from?'

Edited August 15, 2015 by thelerner

[MooNiNite]

As the language is called English I'm tempted to say that the 'correct' way of speaking is standard British English - BUT actually some American accents are closer to the original form - so in the end variety is the spice of life.

 

From my understanding Americans have more of the original English accent that the English people in England. The reason being that the majority of the poor population came to america while the royal class stayed in England. The royalty were known to have their own special way of speaking. 

[MooNiNite]

Yes, its been widely postulated that our lack on intelligence, allows us perfect dictum.

 

by the way it's Chicawgo, my-ng home town.  Old timers, like my dad had the odd habit of adding strangely inappropriate -ng 's to the back of words, turning 'mine' into my-ng.    Many arguments were won that way as the listener hesitates to argue back, there mind turning over 'where did that ng come from?'

 

I dont know if the theory that large populations cause people to have less intelligence is true. However, I believe some sort of personal space is important 

 

"Those that live alone are either beasts or gods."

Edited August 15, 2015 by MooNiNite

[soaring crane]

From my understanding Americans have more of the original English accent that the English people in England. The reason being that the majority of the poor population came to america while the royal class stayed in England. The royalty were known to have their own special way of speaking.

But that only covers the England/USA split. If you go back further, you find that English started life as a Germanic dialect, from the area of today's East Fresia, which is part German, part Dutch.

[zerostao]

http://www.quora.com/What-is-the-difference-between-an-accent-and-a-dialect

[MooNiNite]

But that only covers the England/USA split. If you go back further, you find that English started life as a Germanic dialect, from the area of today's East Fresia, which is part German, part Dutch.

 

That makes sense to me, it seems very structured. 

[MooNiNite]

http://www.quora.com/What-is-the-difference-between-an-accent-and-a-dialect

 

Are you postulating that letters have multiple ways of being pronounced?

[Brian]

Are you postulating that letters have multiple ways of being pronounced?

Indeed they do.

[MooNiNite]

Indeed they do.

 

True, but only in a certain sense that could possibly deviate from the original creators intention.

 

If i rewrite Hamlet, is it still Hamlet?

[Spotless]

It is interesting to see how the personality of a region forms the peculiarities of the accents.

 

In the USA the Southern accents are heavily personality layden and slow - in fact if you have this type of accent and you move to another part of the country in an executive position you are often urged or required to seek professional help in getting rid of that particular accent - to the rest of the country it feels "dumb" like you are not working with all oars in the water.

 

Many of the Eastern accents feel terse to the rest of the USA - terse, crude and gummy - like road tar - there are many variations in the east - and these too need to be eradicated for the most part if you wish to move to other parts of the country in company positions.

 

In Northern Minnesota the people from there would say "diron" range when referring to "the iron range" and their accent merges with the Canadian nearby.

 

Interestingly geographical differences effect the types of religious practices that come about - human sacrifice and animal sacrifice is endemic to relatively hot areas - they are not found in Northern / cold climates unless imported and then still rare.

 

Or how people of another language take on a new language and what residual forms remain from the old in the new. How some cannot say certain sounds but their children can - it is obviously not a genetic impasse but for those from "the old country" certain new sounds are not going to happen.

Edited August 15, 2015 by Spotless

[MooNiNite]

 

Interestingly geographical differences effect the types of religious practices that come about - human sacrifice and animal sacrifice is endemic to relatively hot areas - they are not found in Northern / cold climates unless imported and then still rare.

 

 

Possibly in an overly hot environment, when sacrificing animals and humans, one is creating a tipping point. Sending all of that yang upwards is creating a shift to yin or water/rain. 

 

In a cold environment, sending yang upwards would do nothing. 

Edited August 15, 2015 by MooNiNite

[Apech]

From my understanding Americans have more of the original English accent that the English people in England. The reason being that the majority of the poor population came to america while the royal class stayed in England. The royalty were known to have their own special way of speaking. 

 

Royalty are a very few and quite a lot of them were German not English.  Most of the English were poor and stayed in England.

[Brian]

True, but only in a certain sense that could possibly deviate from the original creators intention.

 

If i rewrite Hamlet, is it still Hamlet?

If you read Hamlet once, you have read it, regardless of whether you knew how to pronounce bodkin, fartles or contumely. How you pronounced the words, however, may or may not have changed the meaning, though -- as in that first sentence above. Ghoti may be pronounced the same as fish but the fruit doesn't seem to care whether you call it "toe-may-toe" or "tom-ah-tah."

[Spotless]

I recently had a great conversation with an extraordinary friend relating his experience in New Zeland:

 

While my friend is Greek by ancestory he looks a bit like he is Maori - he can also be taken as a Southern light skinned Black and also Hispanic.

In New Zealand his English had little accent that would differentiate him from the general area - and so he was treated by the locals as "a lowly Maori" (treated like shit particularly at stores).

 

Finally at one store where he bought some groceries the lady putting his products in the bag put the eggs in the bottom and milk on top of them and when she was done very clearly banged the sack down and presented it to him. Being extremely intelligent and taking no offense but being fully aware of what was taking place - he immediately dawned the accent of a Texan and explained In a friendly manner that he was from Texas - she immediately removed his bag and re packed another one properly with new eggs and nothing was mentioned of the incedent between them.

 

In another store where he was being treated in a similar manner where he needed help but the three store clerks we doing nothing but glowering at him and speaking in offensive undertones between themselves he dawned a deep American Southern accent and they lit up like Santas helpers upon hearing that he was not one from whom they thought but instead an American.

Edited August 15, 2015 by Spotless

[zerostao]

are we nudging closer to a speech talk theory vs semiotics type of thing here searle vs derrida

i am more in the semiosis/poiesis camp myself. written and spoken word energies

edit>>of course spoken with my hillbilly dialectic

Edited August 15, 2015 by zerostao

[soaring crane]

Royalty are a very few and quite a lot of them were German not English.  Most of the English were poor and stayed in England.

 

There are a few articles on the net about the earlier English dialects being exported to the new world. I remember it as BBC (or posh, or RP?) English coming into vogue in England and eventually becoming the de facto standard, but BBC/RP/Posh was a relatively new form of English, coming from the public school system. So, whatever is considered standard British English today is simply not as old as other regional dialects, including those that ended up in *Massachusetts, New Hampshire, etc.

 

Interestingly, there about one and half to two billion English speakers in the world, and only about three hundred thousand native speakers. So, who's right when it comes to accent?

 

Btw, I make the bulk of my meager living helping non-native speakers communicate with other non-natives. They couldn't give a toss about accent or grammar, they just want to understand and be understood accurately.

 

*I double-checked my spelling of that word, and was surprised to see that I'd got it right the first time, lol.

[Apech]

There are a few articles on the net about the earlier English dialects being exported to the new world. I remember it as BBC (or posh, or RP?) English coming into vogue in England and eventually becoming the de facto standard, but BBC/RP/Posh was a relatively new form of English, coming from the public school system. So, whatever is considered standard British English today is simply not as old as other regional dialects, including those that ended up in *Massachusetts, New Hampshire, etc.

 

Interestingly, there about one and half to two billion English speakers in the world, and only about three hundred thousand native speakers. So, who's right when it comes to accent?

 

Btw, I make the bulk of my meager living helping non-native speakers communicate with other non-natives. They couldn't give a toss about accent or grammar, they just want to understand and be understood accurately.

 

*I double-checked my spelling of that word, and was surprised to see that I'd got it right the first time, lol.

 

 

Did you mean 300million?

 

I have read that the power of English as the modern lingua franca is that you can mangle the grammar without destroying the meaning - so as a language of trade people who only pick up a smattering of English can still deal reliably with each other without too many blunders.