The Abyss is the Anima Mundi

[noonespecial]

Had a strange dream, infinite black and violet waters, as soon as a form would coalesce, it would shatter into fractals of itself, moving so quickly that my reasoning faculties could not lay hold of what I was witnessing, then without notice, three lights appear hovering above the waters, a transparent impression of a triangle, almost UFO like in quality, in fact all of this is more of witnessing a state, or process rather than anything solid, now what this triangle would do is keep the coalescing forms together, selecting and choosing, controlling what would appear on the surface of the depths, the trinity of lights would switch positions, different combinations, different forms correspond to the position of the lights. I awoke to a name, silence at 2am, void, then a slight wind strikes the wind chimes outside, it is the most melodious sound. Was I granted a vision of the abyss? Is the feared abyss of modern Thelema influenced western occultism the Anima Mundi herself, upon which the spirit of the Lord hovers, that is the Supernal Triad, the triangle wherein the eye emerges, and is this is a process that is continuously occurring, and we on earth only bear witness to a fraction of what stretches infinitely in all directions, beyond direction and time.

[manitou]

It's almost like the black and violet waters were the void, out of which the forms coalesced.  Your time-experience was greatly speeded up, almost as though time were removed from the picture and you were granted the visual confirmation that all forms are similar to fractals in that all form is illusion.

 

Your 3 light thing sounded like the pointer in a Ouija game when I first read it.  But do you think it has to do with the trinity (assuming you had a Christian upbringing as I did?); or even the fact that there is a rearrangement of the positions of the lights, which could be an inference that there are any number of combinations (or religious thought, or philosophies, or life conditions) that will take us to freedom or enlightenment and loss of structure?

 

The fact that the combinations would control what was happening below the surface of the depths;  as above, so below?

 

What was the name you awoke to?  Anything pertinent to you?

 

It didn't sound to me that the abyss was the focal emotional point of your dream, or was it?

 

Your analysis goes beyond my field of understanding, when you refer to Thelma and jAnima Mundi.  But what a wonderful dream, to match your imagination - if you're the one that did the fractal-like painting in your avatar.  If that was you, I can see where you dream in fractals.  Fractals are important to you?

[Zhongyongdaoist]

Had a strange dream, infinite black and violet waters, as soon as a form would coalesce, it would shatter into fractals of itself, moving so quickly that my reasoning faculties could not lay hold of what I was witnessing, then without notice, three lights appear hovering above the waters, a transparent impression of a triangle, almost UFO like in quality, in fact all of this is more of witnessing a state, or process rather than anything solid, now what this triangle would do is keep the coalescing forms together, selecting and choosing, controlling what would appear on the surface of the depths, the trinity of lights would switch positions, different combinations, different forms correspond to the position of the lights. I awoke to a name, silence at 2am, void, then a slight wind strikes the wind chimes outside, it is the most melodious sound. Was I granted a vision of the abyss? Is the feared abyss of modern Thelema influenced western occultism the Anima Mundi herself, upon which the spirit of the Lord hovers, that is the Supernal Triad, the triangle wherein the eye emerges, and is this is a process that is continuously occurring, and we on earth only bear witness to a fraction of what stretches infinitely in all directions, beyond direction and time.

 

Was I granted a vision of the abyss? Is the feared abyss of modern Thelema influenced western occultism the Anima Mundi herself: Simple answer, NO.  The long answer can be found by reading Mather's Kabbalah  Unvieled, where you will read about the Kings of Edom "who reigned ere there was a king in Israel" and other stuff like that.  It is essential background to understanding both the Golden Dawn teaching and Crowley's interpretation.

 

In the online version I linked, read the introduction for a good overview, unfortunately the online version does not seem to have the actual subject index that the printed book does, which makes looking up passages related to the specific subject of Daath, abyss, Edomite Kings, etc., easy.

 

Happy Reading.

 

 

 

 

 

Edit: Added "that the printed book does," to the last paragraph.

Edited August 31, 2015 by Zhongyongdaoist

[manitou]

I just read a little on Anima Mundi and Jung.  I understand about the Dao (or Lord) being at the center, but with no circumference.

The fractal connection is really strange in your dream.  I see now the connection with the fractals.

 

In your understanding, when this philosophy refers to Christ hovering above the fractal world, is this within a Christian setting? (I assume not as you're posting within Esoteric / Occult)  But does this refer to the Christ Consciousness within us all, just waiting to be found?  Is there that analogy in the archetype?

[noonespecial]

Yes, I own a copy of kaballah unveiled, and I am aware of the kings of edom and the subsequent Lurianic cosmology, IMO the vision does not need to conform to any book or cosmology although I'm sure it could if I wanted it to (meaning my ruach preferred that interpretation of what I witnessed).

[noonespecial]

I just read a little on Anima Mundi and Jung.  I understand about the Dao (or Lord) being at the center, but with no circumference.

The fractal connection is really strange in your dream.  I see now the connection with the fractals.

 

In your understanding, when this philosophy refers to Christ hovering above the fractal world, is this within a Christian setting? (I assume not as you're posting within Esoteric / Occult)  But does this refer to the Christ Consciousness within us all, just waiting to be found?  Is there that analogy in the archetype?

 

Great points, it seems Christ as divine fiat (Word/Logos) would correspond to the 'word' emananting upon the waters of tohu/bohu or chaos of forms (not to be confused with the Qlippoth/Kings of Edom) from the Triune Godhead. I can't speak upon Christ consciousness as that is such a wide term, thrown around so loosely nowadays, as such it has no real substance, but if you take it to mean a unified state of being in complete equilibrium with the fiat of Godhead, that could be.

[SonOfTheGods]

Was I granted a vision of the abyss? Is the feared abyss of modern Thelema influenced western occultism the Anima Mundi herself: Simple answer, NO.  The long answer can be found by reading Mather's Kabbalah  Unvieled, where you will read about the Kings of Edom "who reigned ere there was a king in Israel" and other stuff like that.  It is essential background to understanding both the Golden Dawn teaching and Crowley's interpretation.

 

In the online version I linked, read the introduction for a good overview, unfortunately the online version does not seem to have the actual subject index that the printed book does, which makes looking up passages related to the specific subject of Daath, abyss, Edomite Kings, etc., easy.

books.google.com/books?id=4YRFAQAAIAAJ&pg=PA452&lpg=PA452&dq=Mathers+Kabbalah+Unveiled+with+subject+index&source=bl&ots=fGnZcWknBY&sig=oj6Co9fdcmTuRk-fB30rK9vEJ9E&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0CDoQ6AEwBGoVChMI65eR0b_UxwIVTNKACh2puQ-L#v=onepage&q=Mathers Kabbalah Unveiled with subject index&f=false]books.google.com/books?id=4YRFAQAAIAAJ&pg=PA452&lpg=PA452&dq=Mathers+Kabbalah+Unveiled+with+subject+index&source=bl&ots=fGnZcWknBY&sig=oj6Co9fdcmTuRk-fB30rK9vEJ9E&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0CDoQ6AEwBGoVChMI65eR0b_UxwIVTNKACh2puQ-L#v=onepage&q=Mathers Kabbalah Unveiled with subject index&f=false

 

Mathers Kabbalah Unveiled with subject index

 

Has to be copypasta for it to work for some strange reason

Edited August 31, 2015 by SonOfTheGods

[noonespecial]

It's almost like the black and violet waters were the void, out of which the forms coalesced.  Your time-experience was greatly speeded up, almost as though time were removed from the picture and you were granted the visual confirmation that all forms are similar to fractals in that all form is illusion.

 

Your 3 light thing sounded like the pointer in a Ouija game when I first read it.  But do you think it has to do with the trinity (assuming you had a Christian upbringing as I did?); or even the fact that there is a rearrangement of the positions of the lights, which could be an inference that there are any number of combinations (or religious thought, or philosophies, or life conditions) that will take us to freedom or enlightenment and loss of structure?

 

The fact that the combinations would control what was happening below the surface of the depths;  as above, so below?

 

What was the name you awoke to?  Anything pertinent to you?

 

It didn't sound to me that the abyss was the focal emotional point of your dream, or was it?

 

Your analysis goes beyond my field of understanding, when you refer to Thelma and jAnima Mundi.  But what a wonderful dream, to match your imagination - if you're the one that did the fractal-like painting in your avatar.  If that was you, I can see where you dream in fractals.  Fractals are important to you?

 

Fractals were not important to me, they became important to me due to previous expereinces of gnosis, which I do not even feel obliged to write about on a forum. I believe thats simply how it is underneath the world of appearances we move in. The picture in my avatar is actually a dome in the mosque at Esfahan in Iran, the early Islamic builders seemed to be very much tuned into this level of reality as reflected in their structures and art. Almost as if the ban on drawing the human form led to an expandsion of consciousness rather than a constriction.

 

And I do not know about the Three Lights/Triangle, if that was seeded in my consciousness through years of symbology or it is actually how it is.

[noonespecial]

The long answer can be found by reading Mather's Kabbalah  Unvieled, where you will read about the Kings of Edom "who reigned ere there was a king in Israel" and other stuff like that.  It is essential background to understanding both the Golden Dawn teaching and Crowley's interpretation.

 

In the online version I linked, read the introduction for a good overview, unfortunately the online version does not seem to have the actual subject index that the printed book does, which makes looking up passages related to the specific subject of Daath, abyss, Edomite Kings, etc., easy.

 

In my opinion, Da'ath is not the gateway to the Shadow tree, in fact quite the opposite, the gateway to the Qlipphoth, the Kings of Edom, is right here, Malkuth of Assiah, the world wherein the Serpent divides and conquers.

 

Edited September 1, 2015 by noonespecial

[Bud Jetsun]

All perception for all beings arises from the abyss, this is inescapable as an effect of ultimate reality being Nothingness.  Thoughts have a propagation time that corresponds with a beginning, middle and end, therefore a thought can't be in Now, what is in Now is the rising edge of unprocessed unrealized perception without delusion (like thought). For this reason, if you had a sense of self experiencing your fractal vision, it wasn't perception of the abyss, as there is no 'time-space-illusion' to be imaging to enable existence of self-illusion to persist. 

 

No human or animal consciousness has ever experienced being outside the abyss, however very few have experienced a state capable of perception of the abyss they have never entered nor never left. 

 

You will know you have approached the abyss when the summation of all fears is manifested and reflected back at you.  This is when the 'sane' depart to preserve the illusion of 'sanity.'  Entry to the perception can not be forced, and any struggle becomes indefeatable as whenever its your own mind you are battling, it's a stacked deck against any defense or offense you can pointlessly offer.  

 

The key to awareness of the perception is through surrender of ones own mind.  The experience is so beyond what words could describe, it's playing a fools game to even attempt.

 

What you described is more like what a tiny threshold dose of a psychedelic offers.  

 

Unlimited Love,

-Bud

[SonOfTheGods]

Liber 231

[noonespecial]

Hi Bud, thanks for contributing, Interesting I just came upon this, "The Abyss is the source of all impressions, and the storehouse, so to speak, of phenoomenon." - Israel Regardie, pg. 99 Garden of Pomegranates ~ Almost exactly what you wrote, exploring further I came upon this

 

"This 'Spiritus' or 'Anima Mundi' is, for Yeats, the repository from which all his most powerful symbols and images derive... In the notes to a poem he speaks of it as 'a general storehouse of images which have ceased to be the property of any personality or spirit."

 

WB Yeats a Critical Introduction pg.104 - Interestingly enough, he links the Abysss to the Second Coming similar to manitou's thoughts.

[noonespecial]

Liber 231

I'll check it out.

[FraterUFA]

You will know you have approached the abyss when the summation of all fears is manifested and reflected back at you.  This is when the 'sane' depart to preserve the illusion of 'sanity.'  Entry to the perception can not be forced, and any struggle becomes indefeatable as whenever its your own mind you are battling, it's a stacked deck against any defense or offense you can pointlessly offer.  

 

I do not pretend to know anything about the Abyss. What you have written here describes the serpent's gate well however... does that ring a bell?

 

Best,

UFA

[Bud Jetsun]

Buddha writes about his adventures in getting tempted by whatever was the sum of his own unenlightened minds residual fears before letting go of battling himself when he surrendered himself to his 'earth witness- the nature of reality'.

 

When nearing the abyss, remember one can not defeat oneself in chess by practicing chess and improving ones chess skills.

 

Before that realization that intellect-rooted-function could never defeat itself was made, the perception of infinite collapses of galaxies had occurred. If you mourn for everything/everyone, adventure concludes in self imposed suffering.

 

Despite being a fleeting arising, all beings minds still deserve compassion. In respect for compassion of the mind, avoid the abyss until the basics are your unshakeable rock of reality. You can typically get the basic few things from most any religious text, some more clear than others, but any who try to write of experienceing voidness can not be more than someones choice in delusional arrangement of symbols.

 

Unlimited Love,

-Bud

[Bud Jetsun]

I do not pretend to know anything about the Abyss. What you have written here describes the serpent's gate well however... does that ring a bell?

 

Best,

UFA

Apologies for my ignorance, gratefully my teachers did not share experience through words.

 

I welcome all interpretation of experiences.

[noonespecial]

You will know you have approached the abyss when the summation of all fears is manifested and reflected back at you.  This is when the 'sane' depart to preserve the illusion of 'sanity.'  Entry to the perception can not be forced, and any struggle becomes indefeatable as whenever its your own mind you are battling, it's a stacked deck against any defense or offense you can pointlessly offer.  

 

What you describe is true and part of walking the Path, having to do with the Nachash as UFA mentioned, but is now not what I would assign as being the Abyss in standard Qabalah. It is what I thought the Abyss was when I started a couple years ago, mainly due to spotty readings of questionable popular occult books out there. Are you teachers Qabalists? I saw you mentioned Buddha, thanks.

 

edit:  Also I would think the Adversary is much more clever than just trying to scare the wits out of one on the path, although surely that is but one tool in his kit.

 

⁸ Again, the devil took him to a very high mountain and showed him all the kingdoms of the world and their splendor. ⁹ “All this I will give you,” he said, “if you will bow down and worship me.”

Edited September 1, 2015 by noonespecial

[Bud Jetsun]

That example is Jesus mind fearing the potential to form material attachment (to everything he could see or whatever he was into). 

 

Buddha being visited by the 3 daughters was Buddha's conclusion of fearing his lust. 

 

Like every adventure of the mind, it is unique to the consciousness creating it. 

 

What perceives the abyss is inherently without mind, utterly indescribable.  

 

With unlimited Love,

-Bud

Edited September 1, 2015 by Bud Jetsun

[noonespecial]

I can dig it.

[manitou]

.I can't speak upon Christ consciousness as that is such a wide term, thrown around so loosely nowadays, as such it has no real substance, but if you take it to mean a unified state of being in complete equilibrium with the fiat of Godhead, that could be.

 

 

I have a slightly different vision of Christ consciousness.  And this type isn't thrown around loosely.  it's what remains after we have peeled the onion.  Not an easy task, but the essence remains.

[FraterUFA]

Apologies for my ignorance, gratefully my teachers did not share experience through words.

 

I welcome all interpretation of experiences.

 

Thanks, Bud. You are truly a light on this forum. :-)

 

Best,

UFA

[noonespecial]

I have a slightly different vision of Christ consciousness.  And this type isn't thrown around loosely.  it's what remains after we have peeled the onion.  Not an easy task, but the essence remains.

 

Cool, I would be interested to hear more, start a thread maybe?

[SonOfTheGods]

edit:  Also I would think the Adversary is much more clever than just trying to scare the wits out of one on the path, although surely that is but one tool in his kit.

 

⁸ Again, the devil took him to a very high mountain and showed him all the kingdoms of the world and their splendor. ⁹ “All this I will give you,” he said, “if you will bow down and worship me.”

 

You're the "Adversary"- that's the whole point of the Abyss journey lol

[noonespecial]

You're the "Adversary"- that's the whole point of the Abyss journey lol

 

Especially after staring in a mirror for 15 minutes.

[SonOfTheGods]

You might like Kenneth Grant's books bro- deals a lot with Qlippoth, Abyss, etc