How do Taoists handle enemies?

[woodcarver]

Confucius said "Before you embark on your journey of revenge, dig two graves"

[Marblehead]

Confucius said "Before you embark on your journey of revenge, dig two graves"

Apparently he had two enemies to take revenge upon.

[Karl]

Apparently he had two enemies to take revenge upon.

 

Apparently he also said to build an orangery and put in a hot tub.

[Daeluin]

Two graves, haha. Would that work?

 

One grave for your enemy. And in knowing your enemy's friends are wont seek their own vengeance, a grave for yourself. And perhaps in understanding the necessity of a grave for ourself, in taking upon the act of digging our own grave, we should dutifully close all connections with those who may be attached to us. Otherwise who knows how many graves would be needed.

 

If people learn to accept change, accept death as part of life, where can enemies be found?

[Marblehead]

Don't be getting too serious on us now.  But sure, you are right.  However, it sometimes releases inner tension to think of getting revenge one one who has wronged us.

[Bud Jetsun]

Don't be getting too serious on us now.  But sure, you are right.  However, it sometimes releases inner tension to think of getting revenge one one who has wronged us.

 

With respect sir, the release of tension happens when you forgive and consciously and mindfully Love your "enemy", not through torturing your own mind with negativity that makes you no better than whatever you were choosing to be upset with them about. 

 

No matter what someone is doing, even if they are hacking into you with a machete, they are doing it ultimately for the same desire for compassion and liberation from fears and suffering as anyone else.  They are just using an alternative method to your own at that moment.  If you grab your own machete and hack back at them, you set an example of reciprocated fears and violence.  

 

Embrace death, make it a display of compassion that unforgettably stirs beings and you have done more than any physical defense you could muster. 

 

The 'outcome' of events has never mattered, everyone of us pays back our fleeting loan of energy from the universe in full. 

 

Unlimited Love,

-Bud

Edited September 3, 2015 by Bud Jetsun

[Marblehead]

I have to give you credit Bud.  You just won't give up on trying to cause me to become a loving and forgiving being.

 

But I will have to stick with my philosophy.  At least I haven't been hacked to death by someone with a machete.

 

Sorry but killing someone who was trying to kill me will do me just fine.  In fact, it has happened in the past while I was in the Army.

 

And no, I really don't care too much about the other person's desire for compassion and liberation.  Once they have moved on into another realm they won't have to be tormented by those things any more.  I would have liberated them from all their suffering.

 

But please hang in there with your unlimited love.  There are a lot of people out there who have never been loved.

[Bud Jetsun]

I have to give you credit Bud.  You just won't give up on trying to cause me to become a loving and forgiving being.

 

It is the most precious gift brother, but you can only give it to yourself.   You already have much excellent wisdom, just connect the dots you already have shown you know and the pieces will fall into place with such grace you will be awestruck and forget the previous method of thinking that caused pointless suffering to yourself and others. 

 

If the thoughts you chose to have yesterday are the same thoughts you choose today, what does it matter if you have tomorrow's thoughts or not?  

 

Even if your sole concern is selfish desire for joyfulness, then still Love all beings as yourself.   Living compassion is how you spoil yourself, no amount of 'winning fights' or 'losing fights' will ever matter brother.  

 

Unlimited Love,

-Bud

[Karl]

Don't be getting too serious on us now.  But sure, you are right.  However, it sometimes releases inner tension to think of getting revenge one one who has wronged us.

 

I get that when the bacon butty guy puts tomato sauce on instead of brown.

 

"You've wronged me sir" I say, whilst slapping him liberally around the face with one half of the sauce soaked butty.

That seems to help a bit.

[Brian]

I get that when the bacon butty guy puts tomato sauce on instead of brown. "You've wronged me sir" I say, whilst slapping him liberally around the face with one half of the sauce soaked butty. That seems to help a bit.

I had to look up the word "butty."

 

Speelchucker wanted to change it to "nutty" (go figure...)

 

[Karl]

I had to look up the word "butty."

Speelchucker wanted to change it to "nutty" (go figure...)

 

Bring down the pain on its ass. Take revenge on speelchucker and its software ilk.

[Karl]

It is the most precious gift brother, but you can only give it to yourself. You already have much excellent wisdom, just connect the dots you already have shown you know and the pieces will fall into place with such grace you will be awestruck and forget the previous method of thinking that caused pointless suffering to yourself and others.

 

If the thoughts you chose to have yesterday are the same thoughts you choose today, what does it matter if you have tomorrow's thoughts or not?

 

Even if your sole concern is selfish desire for joyfulness, then still Love all beings as yourself. Living compassion is how you spoil yourself, no amount of 'winning fights' or 'losing fights' will ever matter brother.

 

Unlimited Love,

-Bud

Your are giving me an overwhelming desire to kick puppies and steal babies comforters. I feel the madness coming on. Arf arf ahh oooow

Edited September 4, 2015 by Karl

[Rocky Lionmouth]

I had to look up the word "butty."

Speelchucker wanted to change it to "nutty" (go figure...)

It is not an adjectivisation of butt?! Gotta google.

 

Edit: saw the light. Chop bread and carry stuff between them.

Edited September 4, 2015 by Rocky Lionmouth

[Karl]

It is not an adjectivisation of butt?! Gotta google.

 

It's our colloquial word for a sandwich. Hence referred to as the 'butty' because it's buttered bread with some filling, but usually it's a common thing such as cheese, fried egg ( known as the banjo butty because when you bite into it the egg runs down the tie followed by a banjo action to try and remove the offending hot yolk), bacon, jam, spam, ham. Posher fillings such as cream cheese and smoked salmon wouldn't be referred to in that way of course.

[Rocky Lionmouth]

Any enemy i ever had used to be a friend before some major event of really twisting whatever knife they chose to plant in my back so i've told them how they hurt me and why this meant they had to get out of my life and never speak to me again. Worked like a charm every time.

TBH i cant recall it happening more than two times after my 20th birthday, i guess i dont really do enemies. I know nazis and the like consider me an enemy and might litterally stab me given opportunity but i haven't had a run in with those in a decade or so.

Any violence in the last decade i've discouraged verbally and i refuse to accept the terms that men always can resort to fisticuffs i tempers arent controlled. Most potential enmity of the slugger sort is usually sourced out of drunken foolishness and i'm a sucker for the discreet tai chi dodge-and-shove followed by a "oh man, are you ok, you fell pretty bad there, need a hand up?"

Last time someone tried to sucker puch me the poor guy (i had banned him from the bar where i and his ex worked, he was harassing her regularly) was so drunk he telegraphed it so early i just had to tense my stomach, his wrist was so poorly held he basically deflected the strike himself and actually left in shame.

 

Yeah, i'm sheltered as f""".

Edited September 4, 2015 by Rocky Lionmouth

[Rocky Lionmouth]

 

It's our colloquial word for a sandwich. Hence referred to as the 'butty' because it's buttered bread with some filling, but usually it's a common thing such as cheese, fried egg ( known as the banjo butty because when you bite into it the egg runs down the tie followed by a banjo action to try and remove the offending hot yolk), bacon, jam, spam, ham. Posher fillings such as cream cheese and smoked salmon wouldn't be referred to in that way of course.

X'D banjo butty explanation is just too funny, thank you for that!

Edited September 4, 2015 by Rocky Lionmouth

[shanlung]

Your are giving me an overwhelming desire to kick puppies and steal babies comforters. I feel the madness coming on. Arf arf ahh oooow

 

Correct approach if you desire to extend your natural life without all the efforts of dantien breathing and wheezing like asthmatic dragons and meditations.

 

You know only the good die young.

 

So if you do not do evil things, think evil thoughts at the very least.  Like tripping that darling old lady when she crosses at traffic lights or putting a wheel lock on the wheelchair when the old guy not looking.

 

Guaranteed you live longer as you no longer good and less danger of dying young.

 

 

 

Idiotic Taoist with desire to extend life

[topaz]

 

 

Well I'm no a Taoist, but ...

 

I am following the path of taoism, so maybe you can do me the favor of not responding to my threads since we are not on the same path. 

Edited September 5, 2015 by topaz

[Marblehead]

Hi Topaz,

 

That was said jokingly.  Remember tolerance? 

[topaz]

Confucius said "Before you embark on your journey of revenge, dig two graves"

Where did you read that? I don't remember that line from the Analects. 

[topaz]

With respect sir, the release of tension happens when you forgive and consciously and mindfully Love your "enemy", not through torturing your own mind with negativity that makes you no better than whatever you were choosing to be upset with them about. 

 

No matter what someone is doing, even if they are hacking into you with a machete, they are doing it ultimately for the same desire for compassion and liberation from fears and suffering as anyone else.  They are just using an alternative method to your own at that moment.  If you grab your own machete and hack back at them, you set an example of reciprocated fears and violence.  

 

Embrace death, make it a display of compassion that unforgettably stirs beings and you have done more than any physical defense you could muster. 

 

The 'outcome' of events has never mattered, everyone of us pays back our fleeting loan of energy from the universe in full. 

 

Unlimited Love,

-Bud

I don't think I have heard a more idiotic statement in a long time. 

 

Are you saying even if they are in the act of trying to kill me, I should accept it and die?  How about showing compassion by hacking back repaying the loan of energy to the universe by sending a wayward soul back?

[topaz]

Hi Topaz,

 

That was said jokingly.  Remember tolerance? 

What I said was also a joke. 

[topaz]

 

 

If your behavior has been good in the past, don't worry, wu wei, do nothing.  Or just speak your truth and walk away.  No plots, no schemes..  If you take no offense, then no defense is needed.

Nice theory but does not work in practice.

 

A master sees infinite possibilities whereas a fighter just sees a fight. 

The fighter will also not see a master but only an enemy. The enemy may be really only a projection of the fighter's delusions but the fighter will still try to legitimize his existence by destroying the illusory enemy.

 

This is the allegorical role many of us are forced to play for each other in life.

 

I would prefer not to suffer while others make their mistakes, making the dubious assumption, as I am, that physical life should be prolonged because it has a mission which should be accomplished.

Edited September 5, 2015 by topaz

[Marblehead]

What I said was also a joke. 

Well, Okay.  Excuse the hell out of me.  Belly laughs.

[Marblehead]

Nice theory but does not work in practice.

 

 

Yeah, ain't that strange about life?  The book theory doesn't work too well in real life.  The book has predictability; the human animal does not.