Split from Awakening versus enlightenment

[Orion]

Hi Orion,

 

I agree with all this, but I'd like to add a few things:

 

1) Once the witness state is seen as 'somewhere to go', the emotions do continue to arise (as they always have) but our engagement with them is much more detached.  Things don't escalate because the witness state removes energy from them. We might notice our anger at another driver, but it is noticed instantly and with a kind of irony.  This removes the energy from the anger and we do not find ourselves slamming our horn and shouting expletives.  This just stops happening and our lives becoes smoother, mellower and less angry.

 

So, this idea that life goes on as normal is slightly misleading.  Shit does stilll happen, but in a very much milder form.

 

2) I've noticed that there are lots of people who are very fond of this 'we still feel anger after awakening theory'.  These are people who are stil getting riled about a whole range of stuff, still quite neurotic, still very concerned about how they appear to others etc.  They may have had one or two genuine non-dual experiences, but rather than carry on practising to deepen on, they prefer to think that their anger is all very healthy and awakened and pure and spontaneous.

 

3) The other side of the coin is those who think that they must demonstrate their aakening by always being very peaceful and mellow.  They suppress their anger because they think that's how it should be.  And because suppression works for a while they claim success in their awakening...and every now and then they explode.

 

So yes, I get what you're saying but I'm also sure that others will totally misread you.

 

Those are all really good points, thank you. A couple of defining features of the awakeness I have experienced is that I'm not attached to what arises. I'm not trying to peaceful, or righteous, or anything. There is no trying involved.

 

The second part is that, as you described, when emotions arise, I easily pull back to center.

 

The third part though is that, whatever arises, it's not me doing it because there's no "me" in here. What I mean by that is, in addition to being the witness, there is also no part of me that wishes to critique whatever arises. One minute it's there, and the next it's gone. If I get angry, I don't spend days analyzing it after the fact, and feeling bad about it (I used to be that way). Whatever's happening, is happening. I feel great love and compassion, more than I did before, for myself and others, but even that compassion... I can't take responsibility for making it happen. It doesn't mean no accountability or no consequences -- I'm not sure how to describe what I'm experiencing in this regard.

 

I realize that people in this thread will parse my words and look for incongruities, and that's fine. I'm not as big of a wordsmith as I guess I could be if I read a lot more about awakeness and began to try communicating it more accurately. But this thread has been helpful for trying to formulate words that until now I was content to keep non-verbalized, or just couldn't. So thank you!

Edited September 23, 2015 by Orion

[Bud Jetsun]

This moment of Now is all that is Reality-full.  It defines our human moment of perception (oneness), or if one prefers to use deity(s) labels, it encompasses perception of the divine creation. 

 

Appreciation of this moment of Now that encompasses the summation of all that can be Real to a humans ability to know it requires no books, no words, no language, no laws or rules of man, no preference or bias, no chants, no ceremonies, no special uniforms, no special magic words, no requirement of decades of sitting, no requirements of thinking needed at all. 

 

All those things are not Divine (creation/oneness provided), not Real (beyond human constructed belief choices that don't exist beyond the realm of the individual human mind).  

 

The choice to dwell in or cling to the non-Real is the choice of ensured futile suffering to imagine/construct within the limits of the mind what can inherently not be contained within the confines of the mind (Reality).  Over many millennia, folks have manufactured many processes and techniques for this continued ensured futile choice to suffer attempting to merge closer with the unlimited bliss of Reality by creating mentally constructed elaborate arrays of self-delusion to drive them further from simple perception of Now.  

 

If one wishes to experience pointless suffering in an imperfect and inherently subjective human-constructed mind game, continue replacing all that is Real with ones own bias laden thoughts and interpretation and analysis. 

 

If one wishes to experience what the nature of Reality has to offer a human, it requires the cessation/surrender of the pointless grinding loops of mind. 

 

Unlimited Love,

-Bud

[3bob]

Bud, I'd say that's all a delusion about delusions... for there is no where or time (which you mis-label as delusion) that "God" is not now, including "now" - per seeing and knowing the whole kit and caboodle

[Bud Jetsun]

Bud, I'd say that's all a delusion about delusions... for there is no where or time (which you mis-label as delusion) that "God" is not now, including "now" - per seeing and knowing the whole kit and caboodle

 

Your choice of belief in any and all alternative descriptions of the indescribable are always welcome.

 

Unlimited Love,

-Bud

Edited September 25, 2015 by Bud Jetsun

[seekingbuddha]

 

I like your contribution here, more clarity regarding these states and various stages could only improve understanding. Please feel free to expand on this.

 

I agree that the PATH is the real point

 

Bindi, 

    As you wish, let us explore  these terminologies further, just for the sake of  understanding theory, though it will contribute little to one's determination   to  reach Arhantship.   All these stages unfold in a continuum;  a continuum of development of the mind, into various states/stages.  This is why you find different awakened people  describing their experiences in different ways  OR  emphasizing one (or some) attribute(s) of Awakening,  which maybe different from what others emphasis/define  as their awakening.  

 

For example, one person may emphasis on Now (or fully experiencing present moment reality),  whereas another person  might describe more about Awareness as the predominant factor in their awakening experience.  But the reality is that both of these awakened people will  enjoy (to varying degrees)

• the experience of  NOW(being in the present moment),  
• the experience of   higher level of Awareness.  

The difference is simply because of the fact that one awakened person chooses to enjoy/focus on the bliss of NOW, whereas the other person chooses to enjoy/focus on the bliss of  ever-increasing Awareness of 6 senses.   This is simply human;  varied human minds have varied preferences/proclivity  and that shows up in the awakening experience also. 

 

These states in which mind can dwell in, are not only a continuum in Awakening stage,  but also a continuum in the other two words of choice (Liberation & Enlightenment).   Note:   even though  train track is a continuum,  there are also  train stations - ie.  stages  that one can clearly recognize.  For example Buddha talked of 8 stages within  Liberation.   Buddha also clearly  distinguished himself as "Supremely Enlightened" whereas, you might read or encounter numerous others who are  simply  "Enlightened" (like his disciples who became Arhants).   My thought process  says that, wisdom continues to expand even after Enlightenment, thus distinguishing some as more Supreme than others.  For example,  even though there were hundreds of Arhants (Enlightened)  among Buddha's disciples,  Buddha clearly tagged  Sariputta  as the most wise among all of them.   Thus, we see the distinctions within  Enlightened disciples.

 

In essence,  we can understand that all of these spiritual experiences (right from the Novice state onwards) unfold in a continuum  (like a railroad track).  If you are a believer in  further lives,  you can imagine  that your PATH  will unfold in a continuum into your next life also,  so long as your rebirth continues.   But, for the sake of human communication/knowledge/understanding/talking/language,  the highest teachers of humanity (Daoist/buddhist/hindu)  have   set aside  some  railroad stations  along the way.  This is for the purpose of clarifying  a student  on his progress level.   Thus,  we wind up focusing on these 3 words as the railroad stations.  But what lies between  train stations (stages)  is  an open  field  of  wisdom and experiences.

 

As long as we are continuing the journey along this suggested path, our minds continually  reach better and better levels of peace/wisdom/kindness/etc/etc.   ----  fill in all those  human qualities that are exalted by the  wise.

Edited September 25, 2015 by seekingbuddha

[manitou]

  My thought process  says that, wisdom continues to expand even after Enlightenment, thus distinguishing some as more Supreme than others.  For example,  even though there were hundreds of Arhants (Enlightened)  among Buddha's disciples,  Buddha clearly tagged  Sariputta  as the most wise among all of them.   Thus, we see the distinctions within  Enlightened disciples.

 

 

I just made my way through every word of the Avatamsaka Sutra, and there is much emphasis on the hierarchy of enlightenment.

 

 

One thing that hasn't been mentioned much on this thread is Fear.  To be in the Now, truly being able to stay there, involves the loss of fear.  At the terminal end of this is loss of the fear of death.  It is this loss that creates freedom, the freedom to be in the Now.

 

We are afraid of the Now that's coming up next.  It's a type of anxiety, even if there is nothing threatening us.  But most of us do have things that threaten us, that keep our thoughts in turmoil and fear.  Bad health, living with someone that's overbearing and fearful, financial insecurity, loss of job and not knowing where the next one will be - any number of conditions that keep us frozen in mental projection.  And that mental projection never seems to go to the highest and best.  It always seems to find the worst possible case scenario and we fritter away at that.

 

To remove that kind of fear is just done one day at a time with Awareness.  As soon as we become Aware of our mental fritterings, that they are only fritterings and as such are not real, then and only then do we have a chance of seeing them peel away.

 

One technique is to turn around and look at all the mental angst you've gone through in the past about some upcoming condition, and see that each and every time, you made it through!  You were just fine.  You've been just fine all along.  You will be just fine tomorrow.  And when you die, you will be Just Fine.

 

Because we realize Who we really Are, that there is no entity outside of ourselves (and combined Life as a whole) that is directing traffic or doing any judging at all.  There is nothing to fear.  We don't really die. we are Consciousness itself, and as such we will change forms, through deaths and lifes.

 

We can understand this loss of fear intellectually, but the challenge is to truly lose it in our bodies and our minds.  This is what takes a little intentionality - to see the fear in our reactions, to see the fear in our mental projections.  And we can start with Today.  What is it Today that you are thinking about?  Are your thoughts unkind toward someone?  Are you in a subtle competition with someone in your everyday life?  Are you living with someone that frightens you?

 

I have lived 30 years with someone that frightened me.  He's recovered now, but at the beginning he was a violent alcoholic.  I needed this in my life, for my ultimate window of freedom.  Every single day I was fearful.  This went on for years, even through his recovery.  I was afraid all the time that 'something' would set him off and he would go drink.  I was doing the 'walking on eggs' dance day after day, skirting around his moods.

 

And then I took things in hand and went to Alanon, the purpose of which is to learn to live with the alcoholic.  I was unable to get away from him - I wasn't strong enough, and the True Self inside me must have known that this is exactly what I needed.  So it became a daily process of internally 'allowing his behavior' and not buying into it.  Alanon taught me to just Be during his behavior, to let it pass, to not react to it.  They gave me the method, I had to apply it daily.

 

So just the Awareness of the fear of him was all it took to get the process started.  Once I stopped matching his dynamic with mine. I was able to step back, observe the fear, and see where it stemmed from.  It all stemmed back to my dad, of course - his way of disciplining, his way of just being.  Loud and angry.  And when I finally removed my dynamic from his drama, the drama seemed to stop.  I'm happy to say that today, this guy is a jewel to live with.

 

It's a ball of memories, that's all it is.  And those memories weave together and create our story, our illusion of what Reality is.  And each one of us has a separate illusion of Reality, until we're able to shed the story.  Once we shed the story and we're not playing the role of Victim or Perpetrator, that story of yesterday can be put to rest.  And when yesterday is dealt with, there is no fear of tomorrow.  The Now becomes visible and is a most wonderful place to live.

[3bob]

An excellent post Manitou, Thank you for sharing your experience and your personal work on it.

 

I would add that certain ideas about illusion can be tricky... for where does illusion really begin and end;  does it begin with a connection to non-illusion? - For example if non-illusion is an ocean of pure, undifferentiated - "all is one" energy/consciousness - then how could such be in any way connected to illusion? (per or as alluded to with "Tao gave birth to the One" then the One to the Three and so forth on to the Ten thousand)  In other words if we use terms like the 7th chakra how could such be connected to a lesser illusion of the 6th chakra?  Or if we used the term "7th liberation" how could such be connected to a lesser illusion of the 6th liberation?  And in further addition for our Buddhist folks, why would an already "Supremely" enlightened historic Buddha bother to go all the way back to the first through fourth Jhana's of illusion during His final moments of life (thus reinforcing such as part of his teachings) if he was already at the "beyond of the beyond" or past the 8th liberation? 

 

I'm just throwing this out there for people to consider if they want to   

Edited September 25, 2015 by 3bob

[manitou]

Thank you, 3bob.

 

Wow.  How metaphysical can we get?  illusion.

 

I would think that yes, illusion is connected to non-illusion.  Non-illusion is sheer collective self-awareness of No Name realizing itself.  All our separate dramas, attached to that, are illusion - however apparently necessary illusions for the development of No Name.  Illusion is the phenomena.  What is real, iMO, is the morphing of the SELF REALIZATION of No Name.  As is the intent for us human beings.  Self Realization.  I think we mirror the phenomena, micro to macro.

 

I'm thinking we can ask the goldfish in the fishbowl some of these questions....

[Karl]

@manitou

 

"Because we realize Who we really Are, that there is no entity outside of ourselves (and combined Life as a whole) that is directing traffic or doing any judging at all. There is nothing to fear. We don't really die. we are Consciousness itself, and as such we will change forms, through deaths and lifes"

 

Then you have not surpassed fear except by spinning a tale to sooth you. You have reached into the future and not into the now and created this story of immortality and consciousness existing without anything to be conscious of.

 

Though this belief might sustain you, it is a lie that your rational mind will not accept and it will create internal conflict. How can you possibly be 'in the now' if you have created this future 'immortal, immutable you' ? Then you have dragged this future into the present and are making decisions based on this belief. This is no different to the promises every religion makes to its followers.

 

It seems to me- and it's just an opinion-that if you believe in immortality then it creates an attachment to the component of an afterlife. SRM always said that we should not concern ourselves with thoughts of the afterlife because we get further away from truth and reality.

 

If today we worry about death, then let that be reality, do not seek to hide from it. Neither welcome it, or reject it. For you cannot reject what will come to be. Don't create a story that makes it more, or less acceptable. That way there will not be conflict and life flows.

 

Just my 10c worth :-)

Edited September 25, 2015 by Karl

[3bob]

hmm,  interesting idea of "apparently necessary illusions"... so why would or how could the non-illusionary indulge in the illusionary as it sounds like you saying?  (btw, many here profoundly state and claim there is a dichotomy between same)  Also how would or could the true Self morph itself into an illusion if it is no such thing, along with the implied fact that an untrue self does not have a power equal to morphing non-illusion into illusion.  (for if it did we would really be in a fix wouldn't we?)

[manitou]

 

 

Then you have not surpassed fear except by spinning a tale to sooth you. You have reached into the future and not into the now and created this story of immortality and consciousness existing without anything to be conscious o

 

Do you really think that losing fear of death is looking toward an afterlife?  I think that you will agree that you will die.  All fear stems from fear of death.  Once fear of death is minimized and ultimately gone - all fears are minimized and ultimately gone.

 

I do realize that mentioning death and continuing consciousness may be at odds with many other minds.  Perhaps it is looking to the future and not staying in the now.  On the other hand, we do have to have something to talk about here....

 

My idea that consciousness continues, both before and after life, is just in the reflection of nature.  Trees die, they fall, bugs enter.  Mushrooms grow on them, animals live in them - life goes on.  It doesn't die, it just transforms.  That's what I mean by that, Karl.  I'm really not one for spinning nice little stories.

[manitou]

hmm,  interesting idea of "apparently necessary illusions"... so why would or how could the non-illusionary indulge in the illusionary as it sounds like you saying?  (btw, many here profoundly state and claim there is a dichotomy between same)  Also how would or could the true Self morph itself into an illusion if it is no such thing, along with the implied fact that an untrue self does not have a power equal to morphing non-illusion into illusion.  (for if it did we would really be in a fix wouldn't we?)

 

 

Don't you find that the longer you're at this, the more you move into Love - of yourself, your brother, the earth?  The only thing I am sure of in all this, is that the plant grows toward the light.  I equate the light with love.  Underlying this morphing does seem to be a direction - a direction toward the light.  I look back at all the 'apparently necessary illusions' - the alcoholism, the inability to get away from an abusive fellow for an extended period of time - and utilizing that time to rearrange 'my' innards to get to the metaphysical point that I am today.  Enlightened?  Who knows.  I know that I no longer ask myself if I am...

 

And don't you suspect that there is a hierarchy - that our idea of Enlightenment at this phase of existence - is far inferior to another form of enlightenment that may be further into the elusive future for mankind?  For some reason, it's all unfolding within the illusion of Time - it must need to do so for some reason, although it's all happening Now.  That which we fear has already happened and played out.

 

This is just something I sense in my soul, and masters of many traditions have found to be their soul conclusion as well.  It's a dwelling place I have come to after many years of peeling the onion and studying the comparative philosophies of others.  I will continue morphing, as we will all do (unless we are one of the 'intellectual ones' on the forum who have not taken the time to look within).

[SonOfTheGods]

Where does the circle begin, and where, does it end?

[3bob]

Karl, Sounds like you are out to lunch on the point Manitou was trying to comment on?

Edited September 25, 2015 by 3bob

[3bob]

Well a hierarchy of non-illusion and illusion presents some complications and or tricks (as I've been beating around the bush about)... including the ideas of the non-manifest and manifest or even a state between the cusps of same...(depending on perspective)  There is also the idea of  God/Siva and Goddess/Shakti and those that embrace the Goddess/Mother would not call her an illusion whereas some of our Buddhist folks might even after the historic Buddha made the key point of recognizing the Truth of the Earth/Goddess as His witness at or near the moment of his battle for enlightenment...

[Karl]

Do you really think that losing fear of death is looking toward an afterlife?  I think that you will agree that you will die.  All fear stems from fear of death.  Once fear of death is minimized and ultimately gone - all fears are minimized and ultimately gone.

 

I do realize that mentioning death and continuing consciousness may be at odds with many other minds.  Perhaps it is looking to the future and not staying in the now.  On the other hand, we do have to have something to talk about here....

 

My idea that consciousness continues, both before and after life, is just in the reflection of nature.  Trees die, they fall, bugs enter.  Mushrooms grow on them, animals live in them - life goes on.  It doesn't die, it just transforms.  That's what I mean by that, Karl.  I'm really not one for spinning nice little stories.

 

You understand that consciousness is the passive constituent of active awareness ? That there will be conscious creatures before, during and after death but that none of these will be Manitou ?

 

That the body will decay and take another form is certainly true, but the body is not you, it is just flesh.

 

I have seen many here that believe their own, personal consciousness, or a singular United consciousness of some kind perpetuates. This isn't what you are meaning ?

 

[manitou]

Where does the circle begin, and where, does it end?

 

Maybe it does't.

[manitou]

You understand that consciousness is the passive constituent of active awareness ? That there will be conscious creatures before, during and after death but that none of these will be Manitou ? That the body will decay and take another form is certainly true, but the body is not you, it is just flesh. I have seen many here that believe their own, personal consciousness, or a singular United consciousness of some kind perpetuates. This isn't what you are meaning ?

 

No.  Not the personal consciousness.  the only thing I can equate my understanding to is the incredible golden tunnel experienced during an act of tantric sex.  While in the golden tunnel, there is no individual identity; only the glorious golden essence and the incredible sound of the shine.  It was such an incredible set of experiences.  One comes away from something like this knowing that that place felt like Home.  That's the closest I can get - that it Felt Like Home.  and there were no questions, nothing left unsettled.  Just sheer Love.  Undefined, unrestrained.  Just Love.

 

I'll take it.

[Karl]

No.  Not the personal consciousness.  the only thing I can equate my understanding to is the incredible golden tunnel experienced during an act of tantric sex.  While in the golden tunnel, there is no individual identity; only the glorious golden essence and the incredible sound of the shine.  It was such an incredible set of experiences.  One comes away from something like this knowing that that place felt like Home.  That's the closest I can get - that it Felt Like Home.  and there were no questions, nothing left unsettled.  Just sheer Love.  Undefined, unrestrained.  Just Love.

 

I'll take it.

 

Except there must be personal identity because you are experiencing those things. If there was no identity there would be nothing at all. It's like watching a film. You can sit and watch it, completely entertained and forgetting all about anything except for total absorption in the on screen action. It's possible to do this when driving or performing some other skill. It doesn't seem you are there at all, but all the things going on are not spurious events, you can match them even though you are not conscious of making those connections. The greater the focus of awareness-internal or external the more this happens. Still, there is personal identity experiencing those things and matching them to memory.

[manitou]

You're no doubt right, Karl.

 

But here's the thing.  That shared (and mutually experienced) place that we ended up in, caused us both to lose fear of death.  So if it's a dual illusion, it seems to serve a grander purpose, as far as I'm concerned.

 

Again, I'll take it.  I'm not going to plunge into a head trip about it  

[Bud Jetsun]

 It doesn't seem you are there at all, but all the things going on are not spurious events, you can match them even though you are not conscious of making those connections. The greater the focus of awareness-internal or external the more this happens. Still, there is personal identity experiencing those things and matching them to memory.

 

To the limit of your ability to 'know it', this is true. 

 

If you had experienced a trans-personal state (which is not easy or comfortable to achieve, yet unfathomably life enriching), then reality to the limit of your ability to 'know it' would not exclude such a states existence.

 

One can not 'recognize' 'fathom' 'see' etc what one chooses in the mind to preclude from the potential to exist in your individual unique model of reality. 

 

There is something left when mind has no memory to draw from for comparison and judgement, when one has no bias to impose human values like good/bad/ugly/indifferent, no concept of any moment every having been prior to this one and no concept of a moment ever being after this one (because that's human constructed illusion alone).  

 

Every consciousness has this innate potential and couldn't lose it if it wanted.  Nobody is more or less enlightened than anyone else, some embrace the perception of Now and some cover over it with there own construction of what they think Now to be. 

 

All that I raced/ate/drank/smoked/sexed/bought/said did not and can not invoke more than fleeting sensation. 

 

All my thinking did not quench my thirst for knowing, the thirst only expanded. (Why the path of the intellectual-philosopher is madness)

 

I know nothing. 

 

I have nothing. 

 

I need nothing.

 

My minds concerns are all inherently temporary, making them into the focus of the human experience is to forfeit embracing the Divine(Reality) in trade for some fleeting BS. 

 

Humans ejected themselves from the garden of Eden the moment they gained the "knowledge" of "good and evil".  This is the moment we replaced embracing what IS with our own bias of judging from our non-omnipotent non-knowing perspective of what IS is good/bad/ugly etc.  

 

Unlimited Love,

-Bud

Edited September 25, 2015 by Bud Jetsun

[3bob]

humans?   did nothing to eject themselves from the Garden of Eden, it was all part of "God's plan".   .  

[Tibetan_Ice]

Except there must be personal identity because you are experiencing those things. If there was no identity there would be nothing at all. It's like watching a film. You can sit and watch it, completely entertained and forgetting all about anything except for total absorption in the on screen action. It's possible to do this when driving or performing some other skill. It doesn't seem you are there at all, but all the things going on are not spurious events, you can match them even though you are not conscious of making those connections. The greater the focus of awareness-internal or external the more this happens. Still, there is personal identity experiencing those things and matching them to memory.

Karl, you are trying to drag a nonduality experience back into duality and then label the experience.

The fact is that when Manitou experienced the golden tunnel, there was no identity, but upon return from the experience, the normal personal identity resumes and then interprets and overlays its concepts over top of the experience.

Your statement that if there was no identity that there would be nothing at all is false.

If Manitou had remained at the source and never returned, dissolving her body and mind into light she would have lost her personal identity, but would have become all identities including those beyond space and time.

[Bud Jetsun]

humans?   did nothing to eject themselves from the Garden of Eden, it was all part of "God's plan".   .  

 

 

If one makes it an objective to highlight faults in arrangements of letters, one is going to be a very busy man.  For every phrase arranged, one is always free to ask, "what gives rise to that?" without end.  If one wishes to believe it's "God's plan" rather than God, one can still ask who gives arising to the plan of having God?  Is there a God factory somewhere and they order production quantities to send off to go become universes? What gives rise to the God factory and what gives rise to the materials the God stuffs are made with?  If being God includes being all 'things' at all 'times' and all 'places' what need does a God have for 'plans' when they are already are all that's ever been or will be?

 

The moment a human chooses to generate the delusion their mind was capable of grasping any aspect God, at this moment this human has just manufactured and implemented new blocks dividing them from experiencing all that is of God. 

 

If you wish to honor God/Oneness while spoiling yourself with bliss, it requires laying down the minds concepts of God you were replacing God with and instead embracing what God/Oneness made for you, this perception of the Divine Now. 

 

Only you can hold yourself back from it, only you can take yourself there.  The best gifts in life are free and always available, yet paradoxically the least treasured... 

 

Unlimited Love,

-Bud

[manitou]

Karl, you are trying to drag a nonduality experience back into duality and then label the experience.

The fact is that when Manitou experienced the golden tunnel, there was no identity, but upon return from the experience, the normal personal identity resumes and then interprets and overlays its concepts over top of the experience.

Your statement that if there was no identity that there would be nothing at all is false.

If Manitou had remained at the source and never returned, dissolving her body and mind into light she would have lost her personal identity, but would have become all identities including those beyond space and time.

 

Thanks, TI.  Couldn't have said it better myself.  You nailed it. 

 

 

 

There is something left when mind has no memory to draw from for comparison and judgement, when one has no bias to impose human values like good/bad/ugly/indifferent, no concept of any moment every having been prior to this one and no concept of a moment ever being after this one (because that's human constructed illusion alone).  

 

 

This is one of the best statements I've ever seen on this forum.  Thank you!