Windows 10's 'built-in keylogger'?

[Lois]

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2014/10/07/windows_10_data_collection/

 

Is it really impossible to stop ???

[Miffymog]

We play on computers - that means we may have to play by their rules ...

[Leif]

two-step process to stop it:

1. format hard disk

2. install Linux

 

Because, the thing is, what's most scaring, the publically known part of the monster (eg. typing monitoring you mention), the spying part that is not officially discussed (not confirmed, but not improbable either....like possibility of backdoors for government agencies), or the fact that it already has tens of unknown bugs that talented hackers (working for Chinese, US and other governments, or on their own) are working on to find out and utilize...

 

(That said my main PC is still on Windows,  W10 even, I got nothing to hide before MS, CIA, FBI, etcetera...nothing that they don't already know by spying on internet traffic, Google and Facebook use,....)

[Marblehead]

 

(That said my main PC is still on Windows,  W10 even, I got nothing to hide before MS, CIA, FBI, etcetera...nothing that they don't already know by spying on internet traffic, Google and Facebook use,....)

Same here but I still use Tune-up Utilities to clean everything that is cleanable before I shut down the computer and my temporary data is uploaded to Windows.  And yes, I do have Win 10.  Free upgrade from Win 8.

[leth]

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2014/10/07/windows_10_data_collection/

 

Is it really impossible to stop ???

 

 

Simply just uninstall Windows 10.

[dawei]

Keep googling... on how to stop it...

[Nungali]

Same here but I still use Tune-up Utilities to clean everything that is cleanable before I shut down the computer and my temporary data is uploaded to Windows.  And yes, I do have Win 10.  Free upgrade from Win 8.

 

I keep getting those damn messages offering it . 

 

If its free  ... I am suspicious .   A bit like a free scarf from ASIO ... with hidden microphone included.

[thelerner]

from an earlier post of mine- http://thedaobums.com/topic/38730-software-junkies/?p=639087

 

Microsoft’s Windows 10 is a privacy nightmare. Here’s how to protect yourself http://www.slate.com...h_all_dt_em_bot by David Auerbach

 

quote-"

Windows 10 is the operating system Microsoft needs. In other words, it’s not Windows 8, a Frankenstein’s monster of a tablet-plus-desktop OS that alienated everyone from PC manufacturers to corporate users. Instead, Windows 10 is an incremental improvement on Windows 7, one that is faster, slicker, and has some new bells and whistles, like virtual desktops and functional tablet support. One of Windows 10’s leaps, unfortunately, is straight into your personal data.

 

Apple and Google may have ignited the trend of collecting increasing amounts of their customers’ information, but with Windows 10, Microsoft has officially joined that race. By default, Windows 10 gives itself the right to pass loads of your data to Microsoft’s servers, use your bandwidth for Microsoft’s own purposes, and profile your Windows usage. Despite the accolades Microsoft has earned for finally doing its job, Windows 10 is currently a privacy morass in dire need of reform..

 

It uses some scary broad strokes:

 

Finally, we will access, disclose and preserve personal data, including your content (such as the content of your emails, other private communications or files in private folders), when we have a good faith belief that doing so is necessary.

Some have spun conspiracy theories out of that language. I’m more inclined to blame vagueness and sloppiness, not ill intent. With some public pressure, Microsoft is likely to specify how and why it will share your data. But even that won’t excuse Microsoft’s ham-fisted incursion into users’ data, nor how difficult it is restore the level of privacy back to what it was in Windows 7 and 8. Apple’s and Google’s privacy policies both have their own issues of collection and sharing, but Microsoft’s is far vaguer when it comes to what the company collects, how it will use it, and who it will share it with—partly because Microsoft’s one-size-fits-all privacy policy currently applies to all your data, whether it’s on your own machine or in the cloud. As Microsoft puts it:

 

Rather than residing as a static software program on your device, key components of Windows are cloud-based. … In order to provide this computing experience, we collect data about you, your device, and the way you use Windows."

 

The article also shows the Byzantine labyrinth of moves you'll have to do to make the settings more private.

Edited October 17, 2015 by thelerner

[soaring crane]

Don't use the express installation when installing /upgrading. You can unclick about ten boxes that pertain to privacy issues. And also select your own default programs. Changing all of those after the fact is a PITA.

[leth]

I don't really understand why someone would pay for a product that inherently works agains the user.

[dawei]

I don't really understand why someone would pay for a product that inherently works agains the user.

 

IMO, there really is no option for most. 

[leth]

IMO, there really is no option for most. 

 

Why is there no option, I don't really understand this. There are alternatives out there, and some of them are even gratis.

[thelerner]

Damned if you do, damned if you don't.  I use a mac; in apple we trust , and I use Google and Firefox .  There are at least a half dozen other necessary programs and addons I have that pretty much include in there Agreement statement I must drop my pants and show the camera.  

 

One cannot expect privacy on the web.   The best hope is we're simply too small a fish to be noticed.

 

When doing anything financial, I set the highest safety switches, have the institutions text me notifications or use cards that change up the passwords randomly.  Credit card transactions while vulnerable can be questioned and reversed pretty easily.  You can get free credit reports each year from each of the 3 big credit agencies.   Plus there are free credit sites, I use CreditSesame and so far so good. 

 

 

To clean up Windows 10 excesses this article is very good: http://www.slate.com/articles/technology/bitwise/2015/08/windows_10_privacy_problems_here_s_how_bad_they_are_and_how_to_plug_them.html?wpsrc=sh_all_dt_em_bot

Edited October 18, 2015 by thelerner

[dawei]

Why is there no option, I don't really understand this. There are alternatives out there, and some of them are even gratis.

 

Well then, tell the masses... and let's see how practical the advice is.

 

If nobody really embraces it, you ultimately have to ask why...  it is a probe into the human psyche but it is rather a simple exploration. 

[leth]

Well then, tell the masses... and let's see how practical the advice is.

 

We do.

 

If nobody really embraces it, you ultimately have to ask why...  it is a probe into the human psyche but it is rather a simple exploration. 

 

Yes, agreed. Which also explains why telling the masses doesn't really work well to change the problem at large.

 

Why people trust anyone that has a monetary interest in a subject however is beyond my understanding. Well that too is ignorance, but I don't really understand why society still systemtically indoctrinates plutocracy. We should know better.

[Owledge]

Seriously, this is so obvious. Microsoft of all corporations wants to give you an operating system upgrade for free, even nags you to take it by sneaking nagware onto your OS by labeling it as important security update.

Certain hardware vendors will give you a discount if you buy a PC with Windows 10 on it.

 

How naive must one be to not know what that entails?

Definitely more naive than this common thought:

 

 

I got nothing to hide before MS, CIA, FBI, etcetera...

 

Let me enlighten you:

YOU do not decide whether you are guilty of hiding something from the authorities. If you allow madmen to run the show, you cannot expect sanity.

[Marblehead]

Well, what less can we expect from a company that wants to make money from advertisers?

 

I got my first ad from the system yesterday.

[Owledge]

Well, what less can we expect from a company that wants to make money from advertisers?

They're adholes. (Sorry for the language.)

[Apech]

Well, what less can we expect from a company that wants to make money from advertisers?

 

I got my first ad from the system yesterday.

 

 

You shouldn't go googling penis enlargement

[Leif]

YOU do not decide whether you are guilty of hiding something from the authorities. If you allow madmen to run the show, you cannot expect sanity.

 

I'm not quite ready for deeper level of debate and arguments this would require, but would sum my view up that it's not only which OS do you use, but also how do you use it and for which reason.

 

(I'm writing this on W10, ughh, but Android and iOS gadgets next to me, and with my legs comfortably placed over the top of a Linux machine ...  and in the end, the government backed spying software likely occupying some of the network nodes that the traffic goes through, doesn't quite care which one I'll use.... NSA supposedly can sniff even SSL connections since couple years ago.... what else can they do that we don't know?

I don't feel that much more secure on Linux box, from that point of view. From other POVs yes but they feel less important in my particular case. )

 

As long as majority of politicians are willling to do anything to "protect us" from every imaginable threat (sniffing internet traffic and phone calls, cameras on the street here anywhere, "getting naked" on every airport, my ISP was I believe required by law to keep log of my internet traffic same as mobile operator - don't know current status of this legislature though,.......), that worries me actually much more. (And governments of US, China, Russia, and less so other countries, backing up armies of digital warriors.)

[Marblehead]

You shouldn't go googling penis enlargement

Thanks buddy.

 

Actually, it was a search for a water flow meter so I could gauge how much of my water usage is going to the fish ponds.

 

Haven't ordered one yet.

[leth]

You shouldn't go googling penis enlargement

 

I recommend not using google at all.

[leth]

I'm not quite ready for deeper level of debate and arguments this would require, but would sum my view up that it's not only which OS do you use, but also how do you use it and for which reason.

 

Yes. And an OS that taks it into practice to report you is inherently less secure than one which needs active breaching to pull that information out of. Breaking into a computer is also illegal in most jursidiction as oppsed to getting information sent to you by consent. (atleast in the legal sense, most people wold probably not agree to the terms of using such an OS because it requires your consent to propagate this information)

 

(I'm writing this on W10, ughh, but Android and iOS gadgets next to me, and with my legs comfortably placed over the top of a Linux machine ...  and in the end, the government backed spying software likely occupying some of the network nodes that the traffic goes through, doesn't quite care which one I'll use.... NSA supposedly can sniff even SSL connections since couple years ago.... what else can they do that we don't know?

I don't feel that much more secure on Linux box, from that point of view. From other POVs yes but they feel less important in my particular case. )

 

Well, cryptography does make things harder, and even though NSA has some supposed way of more or less easily sniff ssl, the more it is used the more active and direct the gathering of information must become. And that is one of the many reason to why we should premier encrypted transmissions before unencrypted. Secondly the more widespread crptography is the easier it is for those in jursidiction that does not allow freedome of expression to express themselves freely. By premiering cryptography when living in a country were we do have freedom of expression we not only prevent that freedom of expression to be suppressed in thos places but also help people in places that lack freedom of expression to be opressed. As an example the use of https over http and the fact that ssl i widely spread is one of many factors that allow people to leap over the great firewall.

 

As long as majority of politicians are willling to do anything to "protect us" from every imaginable threat (sniffing internet traffic and phone calls, cameras on the street here anywhere, "getting naked" on every airport, my ISP was I believe required by law to keep log of my internet traffic same as mobile operator - don't know current status of this legislature though,.......), that worries me actually much more. (And governments of US, China, Russia, and less so other countries, backing up armies of digital warriors.)

 

You do realise that the major way they do this is to have contracts with big companies to collect data for them? In a sense you're describing the very core of the problems with operative systems that reports the users activities.

[soaring crane]

To the point of MS giving away the update for free, I'm pretty sure that was a business decision, and a reluctant one at that. Win8 was a huge dud and they had to be proactive to win back their customers.

 

And now they have the only truly cross-platform OS. The new phones are going to replace PCs and notebooks. I suspect they're aiming at the business sector.

[Owledge]

To the point of MS giving away the update for free, I'm pretty sure that was a business decision, and a reluctant one at that. Win8 was a huge dud and they had to be proactive to win back their customers.

 

And now they have the only truly cross-platform OS. The new phones are going to replace PCs and notebooks. I suspect they're aiming at the business sector.

Vista was like 8. One could start to think they intentionally release a screwed up OS in order to drive people towards the next one. And new OS versions are being released in quicker succession it seems. Not unlike what Blizzard does with their crappy World of Warcraft and expansions. It's a corporate pattern. Part of the old structures going more nuts in the face of practiced solutions.