mopai

[sabretooth]

Has anyone here studied mopai as a student or followed the the instructions in Kosta's book's,and if so how far have you got with this training.

I think I have completed level 1 and been doing the compressing for 2.

 

                                            wolverine

[Blackfinger]

uh oh........

[MooNiNite]

Has anyone here studied mopai as a student or followed the the instructions in Kosta's book's,and if so how far have you got with this training.

I think I have completed level 1 and been doing the compressing for 2.

 

                                            wolverine

 

What sensations have you experienced to make you believe that you are done with level 1? 

Edited November 26, 2015 by MooNiNite

[sabretooth]

mooninite when you say break the rule what do you mean.

I feel heat in my lower abdomen all the time I hit door with my palm only denting it but a hole appeared on the other side.

There is a gap between the two sides.

 

                                                   wolverine,

 

 

although I call myself that I was sabretooth chang has said he can reinstate me as that again.

[MooNiNite]

mooninite when you say break the rule what do you mean.

I feel heat in my lower abdomen all the time I hit door with my palm only denting it but a hole appeared on the other side.

There is a gap between the two sides.

 

                                                   wolverine,

 

 

although I call myself that I was sabretooth chang has said he can reinstate me as that again.

 

pumping your stomach in should create the sensation of heat. before level 2 it will feel as hot as lava. Breaking the rule, I am referring to the 72-hour rule. it was mentioned in kosta's book. 

[SonOfTheGods]

Has anyone here studied mopai as a student or followed the the instructions in Kosta's book's,and if so how far have you got with this training.

I think I have completed level 1 and been doing the compressing for 2.

 

                                            wolverine

 

The "Official" Mo Pai & "Things You Might Not Know About Real Mo Pai" Thread

Started by SonOfTheGods , Jun 15 2014

 

http://thedaobums.com/topic/35217-the-official-mo-pai-things-you-might-not-know-about-real-mo-pai-thread/page-2

[sabretooth]

moonnite,hello it sounds like you study mo pai,how long have you been consistantly training.

I have just bought the book enter mo pai,I have never heard of james van gelder,but am looking foreward to reading it.

 

 

                                                      sabretooth.

[sabretooth]

has anyone here achieved level 2 and if so did the marks on your palms appear after you completed level 2 or before,and what health or any benefits have you gained.

 

 

 

                                                            many thanks

 

                                                           sabretooth.

[Neikung]

has anyone here achieved level 2 and if so did the marks on your palms appear after you completed level 2 or before,and what health or any benefits have you gained.

 

 

 

                                                            many thanks

 

                                                           sabretooth.

Sabretooth, please do yourself a favor and stop practicing the so called "Mopai" exercises obtained from the web/books.  There are so many mistakes that can really harm you.  It is WISHFUL thinking that one can practice neigong without a real teacher to check in person (i.e. DON'T believe More_pie_guy or  Kenbrace).  In fact, the "sign" of progress in in the palm you have mentioned above is actually a sign of very bad thing. In Chinese, this is called Zou Huo Ru Mo.  走火入魔。 I am posting this so that hopefully no one gets hurt.

[dayzhaze]

Sabretooth, please do yourself a favor and stop practicing the so called "Mopai" exercises obtained from the web/books.  There are so many mistakes that can really harm you.  It is WISHFUL thinking that one can practice neigong without a real teacher to check in person (i.e. DON'T believe More_pie_guy or  Kenbrace).  In fact, the "sign" of progress in in the palm you have mentioned above is actually a sign of very bad thing. In Chinese, this is called Zou Huo Ru Mo.  走火入魔。 I am posting this so that hopefully no one gets hurt.

 

Neikung,  I spoke with Morepie on skype and he says to tell you that neither he nor Ken will offer assistance to Sabertooth, due to mental health concerns.  I don't think you have to worry about that.

 

As to Morepie not knowing what he is talking about, he claims he was one of Jim's first students starting in 2006.  In my talks with him all he ever does is quote Jim and Kosta to validate what he is saying.   I believe he does indeed know what he is talking about.  Furthermore he has never asked for any compensation at all. 

 

I kindly ask you and your group stop dragging his name through the mud for your own enjoyment.

Edited November 16, 2015 by dayzhaze

[KenBrace]

Sabretooth, please do yourself a favor and stop practicing the so called "Mopai" exercises obtained from the web/books.  There are so many mistakes that can really harm you.  It is WISHFUL thinking that one can practice neigong without a real teacher to check in person (i.e. DON'T believe More_pie_guy or  Kenbrace).  In fact, the "sign" of progress in in the palm you have mentioned above is actually a sign of very bad thing. In Chinese, this is called Zou Huo Ru Mo.  走火入魔。 I am posting this so that hopefully no one gets hurt.

 

Yes, there is a chance that you can hurt yourself in Mo Pai. The only way to stop this is to be cautious and follow the instructions carefully. Pretty much any notable accomplishment in life requires some sort of risk. Mo Pai is no exception.

 

But a legit method that involves risk is still better than a phony method that accomplishes very little or nothing at all.

[Neikung]

Neikung,  I spoke with Morepie on skype and he says to tell you that neither he nor Ken will offer assistance to Sabertooth, due to mental health concerns.  I don't think you have to worry about that.

 

As to Morepie not knowing what he is talking about, he claims he was one of Jim's first students starting in 2006.  In my talks with him all he ever does is quote Jim and Kosta to validate what he is saying.   I believe he does indeed know what he is talking about.  Furthermore he has never asked for any compensation at all. 

 

I kindly ask you and your group stop dragging his name through the mud for your own enjoyment.

 

The point that I asked him not to believe is that one can progress in neigong without a real teacher.  There are so many subtleties that can't simply be taught over the net (even through skype). Remember that Jim didn't progress without a teacher.  Putting a web site that encourages people to practice Mopai on their own is irresponsible.

[KenBrace]

The point that I asked him not to believe is that one can progress in neigong without a real teacher.  There are so many subtleties that can't simply be taught over the net (even through skype). Remember that Jim didn't progress without a teacher.  Putting a web site that encourages people to practice Mopai on their own is irresponsible.

 

After providing the instructions, the only John really did was gauge Jim's progress every so often. The training doesn't require that you be constantly monitored by a teacher.

[dayzhaze]

The point that I asked him not to believe is that one can progress in neigong without a real teacher.  There are so many subtleties that can't simply be taught over the net (even through skype). Remember that Jim didn't progress without a teacher.  Putting a web site that encourages people to practice Mopai on their own is irresponsible.

 

John Chang was a real teacher, Jim was his top western student.  Morepie was one of Jim's earliest students. So far all Morepie has done is quote Jim and Kosta directly, and does not try to establish himself as some authority.  I have absolutely no doubt he was one of Jim's first students, and that he genuinely cares what Chang actually taught Jim and Kosta. 

 

Again I ask you to stop dragging Morepie's name through the mud here, as he was banned by the biased administration and moderation teams for no reason whatsoever and can't defend himself.

Edited November 16, 2015 by dayzhaze

[tongkosong]

After providing the instructions, the only John really did was gauge Jim's progress every so often. The training doesn't require that you be constantly monitored by a teacher.

 

Ken, this statement you made is actually wrong. Throughout Jim's training under John Chang, he had made numerous trip to see John Chang. Sure, gauging Jim's progress was one of the reasons he made those trips, but, the other big reason was for John Chang to look at his training; to see if there's anything that Jim was doing that needed corrections or advice on the training itself. I'm not going to disclose anything specific, but, remember that neigong is a powerful product of the training, so you should assume that the training itself has to be done correctly to avoid deviating from the correct technique, and any deviation from the correct technique can be deadly. Sure, the first few levels sound pretty easy and simple. However, one small mistake done numerous times for numerous years will be quite devastating to the body of the practitioner.

 

The reason how we know is because it had happened many times to a number of Mopai students, even those who had access to John Chang. Many times these students think that they are pretty smart and knowledgable about Qi and/or its theories and training methods. They tried to "improve" their training without asking for guidance. First, it's a small deviation of movement that felt more "comfortable" than how they were taught. Next, they "felt" their Qi and "know" how to guide it. Pretty soon, they will experience what we call Zou Huo Ru Mo. What Sabretooth is talking about is exactly the result of someone experiencing Zou Huo Ru Mo. Someone, a few years back, did have a mark in his palm after practicing incorrectly for quite a while. John Chang and another elder checked his condition and found that student to be in that state of Zou Huo Ru Mo. In that person's case, it was almost to the point of life-threatening. I, sincerely, hope that Sabretooth is no where close to that. The only thing to do is to stop whatever he is doing at once and get help.

 

We know that it's not realistic to ask Mopai enthusiasts to stop practicing "Mopai". I'm not going to argue the credibility of those techniques, and I have read them. I'm not going to argue that those techniques are actually identical to what John Chan taught Jim. We are adults and have to take responsibility to our actions. Our, Neikung and I, reason to comment on this forum is to remind you guys the pitfalls of training without REAL guidance from a REAL authentic Mopai teacher. i wish you guys well and be safe.

[dayzhaze]

Ken, this statement you made is actually wrong. Throughout Jim's training under John Chang, he had made numerous trip to see John Chang. Sure, gauging Jim's progress was one of the reasons he made those trips, but, the other big reason was for John Chang to look at his training; to see if there's anything that Jim was doing that needed corrections or advice on the training itself. I'm not going to disclose anything specific, but, remember that neigong is a powerful product of the training, so you should assume that the training itself has to be done correctly to avoid deviating from the correct technique, and any deviation from the correct technique can be deadly. Sure, the first few levels sound pretty easy and simple. However, one small mistake done numerous times for numerous years will be quite devastating to the body of the practitioner. The reason how we know is because it had happened many times to a number of Mopai students, even those who had access to John Chang. Many times these students think that they are pretty smart and knowledgable about Qi and/or its theories and training methods. They tried to "improve" their training without asking for guidance. First, it's a small deviation of movement that felt more "comfortable" than how they were taught. Next, they "felt" their Qi and "know" how to guide it. Pretty soon, they will experience what we call Zou Huo Ru Mo. What Sabretooth is talking about is exactly the result of someone experiencing Zou Huo Ru Mo. Someone, a few years back, did have a mark in his palm after practicing incorrectly for quite a while. John Chang and another elder checked his condition and found that student to be in that state of Zou Huo Ru Mo. In that person's case, it was almost to the point of life-threatening. I, sincerely, hope that Sabretooth is no where close to that. The only thing to do is to stop whatever he is doing at once and get help. We know that it's not realistic to ask Mopai enthusiasts to stop practicing "Mopai". I'm not going to argue the credibility of those techniques, and I have read them. I'm not going to argue that those techniques are actually identical to what John Chan taught Jim. We are adults and have to take responsibility to our actions. Our, Neikung and I, reason to comment on this forum is to remind you guys the pitfalls of training without REAL guidance from a REAL authentic Mopai teacher. i wish you guys well and be safe.

 

Jim was the top western student, short of training under Chang himself we cannot hope for better instruction.  Jim's words on the practice survive him. Morepie was one of his first students.  Jim was a real teacher.

Edited November 16, 2015 by dayzhaze

[JinlianPai]

Zou Huo Ru Mo is qigong deviation. A imbalance in the chi due to incorrect practice. My suggestion is to try another art with a teacher who can fix you if need be.

[KenBrace]

Ken, this statement you made is actually wrong. Throughout Jim's training under John Chang, he had made numerous trip to see John Chang. Sure, gauging Jim's progress was one of the reasons he made those trips, but, the other big reason was for John Chang to look at his training; to see if there's anything that Jim was doing that needed corrections or advice on the training itself. I'm not going to disclose anything specific, but, remember that neigong is a powerful product of the training, so you should assume that the training itself has to be done correctly to avoid deviating from the correct technique, and any deviation from the correct technique can be deadly. Sure, the first few levels sound pretty easy and simple. However, one small mistake done numerous times for numerous years will be quite devastating to the body of the practitioner. The reason how we know is because it had happened many times to a number of Mopai students, even those who had access to John Chang. Many times these students think that they are pretty smart and knowledgable about Qi and/or its theories and training methods. They tried to "improve" their training without asking for guidance. First, it's a small deviation of movement that felt more "comfortable" than how they were taught. Next, they "felt" their Qi and "know" how to guide it. Pretty soon, they will experience what we call Zou Huo Ru Mo. What Sabretooth is talking about is exactly the result of someone experiencing Zou Huo Ru Mo. Someone, a few years back, did have a mark in his palm after practicing incorrectly for quite a while. John Chang and another elder checked his condition and found that student to be in that state of Zou Huo Ru Mo. In that person's case, it was almost to the point of life-threatening. I, sincerely, hope that Sabretooth is no where close to that. The only thing to do is to stop whatever he is doing at once and get help. We know that it's not realistic to ask Mopai enthusiasts to stop practicing "Mopai". I'm not going to argue the credibility of those techniques, and I have read them. I'm not going to argue that those techniques are actually identical to what John Chan taught Jim. We are adults and have to take responsibility to our actions. Our, Neikung and I, reason to comment on this forum is to remind you guys the pitfalls of training without REAL guidance from a REAL authentic Mopai teacher. i wish you guys well and be safe.

 

Well yes, this is understandable. The teacher needs to makes sure that the student is staying true to the correct method. 

 

But that doesn't mean that you MUST have a teacher to practice the method. Just be cautious and make sure that follow the instructions carefully. If Jim did this then Chang wouldn't need to critique his method and get him back on the right path, because he would have stayed on the right path. If we do this then there's no reason for Chang to critique our method regularly either.

Edited November 16, 2015 by KenBrace

[Neikung]

Jim was the top western student, short of training under Chang himself we cannot hope for better instruction.  Jim's words on the practice survive him. Morepie was one of his first students.  Jim was a real teacher.

Jim couldn't be a real teacher because in Mopai, one can't be a teacher if he can't check the students' progress. Jim made up some signs like intense heat that supposedly show completion of level 1 but those were completely false.  No Mopai students ever had those "signs".

Edited November 16, 2015 by Neikung

[soaring crane]

2) to leave the circle of reincarnation?

 

Thank you very much,

 

Wells

 

This is always interesting to me. One the one hand, the MP'ers make the case that only their practice has ever been scientifically tested and proven to work. It is the bedrock of their belief, and the mountain they perceive themselves standing on while throwing boulders at all other practices.

 

Does that sound about right?

 

Well, I'd like to see the scientific proof of reincarnation, a thing that you all apparently accept as fact even though you've never met a person who has witnessed its occuring. This seems like a real conundrum to me. A contradiction. How do you all reconcile it?

 

I'm actually interested in this. I'm not trolling you.

[sabretooth]

Dazyhaze,maybe people don't read my post properly,I have it in writing that somthing was poured into my fuel tank,I do not have mental health problem's.

In Kosta's second book he describes the mark's on his palm;s appearing and doctors monatering him.He got these mark's as he completed level 2.I cannot see how that is some sign of incorrect practice if it was he would have said so in his book.

 

 

 

                                                                    sabretooth.

[flowing hands]

Lets look at this clearly without the blinkers that the likes of more pie and his associates have acquired. The Asian teachers have traditionally never trusted western 'gwei lo' and in actual fact they never trust anyone! The likelihood of Jim receiving the true teachings is miniscule. The vast majority of Asian teachers test and re-test any potential students even at the lowest levels. I did the same and chucked out of my own school, at least two people who were entirely unsuitable to be taught martial art let alone anything else. One has held a grudge against me ever since and has posted abuse at me because I sieved him out early on in the process as being completely unsuitable.

I myself have been tested and retested by my own Masters and at each stage the master needs to be completely sure of the student before he commits his time and some very secret information and techniques to another. This process takes a great deal of time; many, many years in fact, there's no 'hippy cool man' I just reveal everything to you because you've become interested in what I teach. If this was the case, John Chang is a complete fool and a fraud and I don't believe that he is really that stupid. For to give away that which he most values as easy as that would be foolhardy at the very least.

[Neikung]

Dazyhaze,maybe people don't read my post properly,I have it in writing that somthing was poured into my fuel tank,I do not have mental health problem's.

In Kosta's second book he describes the mark's on his palm;s appearing and doctors monatering him.He got these mark's as he completed level 2.I cannot see how that is some sign of incorrect practice if it was he would have said so in his book.

 

 

 

sabretooth.

That is why you can't treat Kostas' books as your bible! Edited November 16, 2015 by Neikung

[Neikung]

Well you are correct about the first part, no one in the west is qualified to be a teacher. They cannot gauge their students qi. 

 

However, intense heat, is not false, i personally have had that sign. and so have many others. The sensation of heat is not even isolated to those who train Mo Pai. This tells me that you do not have much training experience. 

You may have intense heat but it has nothing to do with completion of level 1 in Mopai.

[MooNiNite]

You may have intense heat but it has nothing to do with completion of level 1 in Mopai.

 

Why say that no Mo Pai practitioners have experienced this sensation?