What do you guys think of this tai chi video?

[grabmywrist4]

 

He talks about turning the waist instead of the knees, hips, ankles, upper torso. When I use to practice I was probably twisting the ankles, knees, hips, mostly, and ended up with pain in my legs. So this is interesting. but when I try to practice by twisting the waist without the knees, ankles, hips, it seems to stir up some problems in my lower back.

[Marblehead]

Good advice, I think.  One of the Army's primary physical training exercises is designed to specifically exercise the waist.

[idquest]

If somebody wanted to ruin their knees, they would turn/twist them. This is actually what quite a number of 'retail' taiji do - they don't explain safety of the knee, ankle, and lower back - people take taiji classes and hurt themselves.

 

People are different, but I'd say that for a majority of middle aged and older, turning from the waist is pretty advanced technique. As a minimum, muscles of the back and psoases should roll over freely. That is I agree that at a good level taiji will require waist turning, and somebody in their 20th could perhaps do this without second thought, but older folks should be very careful not to injure themselves.

 

Good theory explanation of all this in BKF's 'Opening Energy Gates' book.

[opendao]

He talks about turning the waist instead of the knees, hips, ankles, upper torso. When I use to practice I was probably twisting the ankles, knees, hips, mostly, and ended up with pain in my legs. So this is interesting. but when I try to practice by twisting the waist without the knees, ankles, hips, it seems to stir up some problems in my lower back.

 

right, because it's not what you're supposed to do: you shouldn't twist anything including waist, you should use "kua" properly. Ask your teacher to show it to you, as well as how to adjust the lower back. Without all that the body is not aligned and separated, and it'll hurt.

 

Here is a video for "robots"  , but it illustrates my words a bit:

 

[Gerard]

Yes, Ian is right in what he discusses in that video but there is a lot more to it, obviously since it's just a video not a full training program. Please refer to the following field notes which somewhat provide more in-depth details (Chen Xiaowang>Chen Yingjun lineage):

 

http://brisbanechentaichi.weebly.com/skill-knowledge.html

 

Hope this helps.

 

Edited January 2, 2016 by Gerard

[Aetherous]

One of the primary means of injuring the lower back is applying force when the lumbar spine is rotated. Doing little waist twists on their own is probably a good means of internal massage of the fascia in the area, but applying it martially isn't good.

[Michael Sternbach]

Good advice, I think.  One of the Army's primary physical training exercises is designed to specifically exercise the waist.

 

Interesting... Could you explain this exercise, please?

[Marblehead]

Interesting... Could you explain this exercise, please?

Let's see how well I can explain this with words.

 

The exercise is called "Turn and Bounce".  

 

(If my memory serves me well.)  (I looked for a Youtube video and found one but the guy was doing it wrong.  Hehehe.)

 

Starting position:  Attention

 

Place left foot to the left so that feet are shoulder width apart

 

Raise arms so the they are horizontal with the ground with palms up

 

(It is an eight count exercise)

(Movement is at the waist keeping the hips forward as much as possible)

 

One:  Turn upper body briskly to the left and allow a slight bounce back

Two:  Again to the left with slight bounce back

Three:  Again to the left with slight bounce back

Four:  Return to front forward

Five:  Turn upper body briskly to the right and allow a slight bounce back

Six:  Again to the right

Seven:  Again to the right

Eight:  Return to front forward

 

That was one repetition.

 

Normal is between ten and twenty repetitions.

[gendao]

Can he do/explain what Li Chugong (from Hong Junsheng) does?

[opendao]

Can he do/explain what Li Chugong (from Hong Junsheng) does?

 

He does FaJing 發勁 )) It's impossible to explain it, the only way to understand it is to learn it from somebody who can do the same.

[Marblehead]

It is a concentration of power and energy.  Normal people can sometimes do this when put into a crisis mode to where the conscious brain stops working and instinct takes over.

[shanlung]

Can he do/explain what Li Chugong (from Hong Junsheng) does?

 

One aspect that must be considered is that Li Chu Gong was very gentle with all those that you have seen.  He exerted probably a fraction of the fah jing that he would be capable of doing.  You can see those shots were kind of impromptu taken in parks and public environment on very hard ground and concrete surfaces.  Unlike that of aikido done in dojo on tatami mats, where bodies can be slammed dramatically on the tatami.

 

Master Li  was not likely to fah jing in force or anger , or to impart twisting , and damage those lucky enough to have hands on experiences with him.  

 

Take a look at this old shots of Ueshiba.

 

Great dramatic throws were possible and made onto tatami mats.  Noticed also some of the shots had him sitting down on the ground.  How much sinking of weight could he had done sitting down on the ground. Like how much of sinking of weight my Master done when he sat on a chair at home and fahjing at me.

 

Unlike many of that fantasies expressed that fah jing is caused of sinking of weight. and beautiful diagrams of how the legs anchored to ground etc etc etc.  By guys who never fah jinged in their lives and know so much about the mechanics and the whys and the ifs of fahjing.

 

Let us assume some stuff are real even if we do not know now how those were done.  I think enough collaborating evidence on Master Li Chugong and Ueshiba , and the legacies they left behind that they knew, and did things you could not do.

 

Of real fahjing and not the hocus pocus of Yanagiryuken the Kiai Master.  Who got badly smashed up and last seen lying in fetal position.

 

Not even to you and others, I could not explain coherently to my very own son what is fah jing and how to do fah jing.  So maybe I should asked him to come over to taobums to read for himself the eloquent arguments and diagrams here on fahjing.

 

Not that I could execute fahjing at will.  I said that at about my peak,  about one in 3 times, I could do that.  Perhaps it was a perception from me that those 2 in 3 times that fahjing was not do-able, that the alignment was not right to do that.  In some cases, out of puerile curiosity I did try fahjing knowning that was not suitable and the fahjing did not occur.  Which again might well be self induced as I felt then fahjing should not be done and yet I tried to do that.

 

In the tuishou with my Masters, I felt to my amazement that a few times I was in the position to fahjing at him but dared not do that.  And was then scolded for not doing that as he deliberately introduced a weakness in his position to allow me.  But in my cowardice and thinking that was a gambit from him, I dared not seized that chance.

 

When I fa jing as when against fellow students and outsiders in matches, I never felt fahjing to be an explosion of exerted energy.  In that the more exertion of energy from me, the greater the distance I throw him.  That moment was entirely a feeling of the heart-mind, that he and I were one , and he will go where I want him to go.  In that environment in Taiwan and martial arts where we were not out to hurt each other, it never was the intention to fahjing with hurt in mind.  Enough to push him a couple of meters away, without any perception I used force on him to do that.  Since I never used that in earnest, I never knew. (the only time I used that in earnest was when I was sending that other guy to the center of the earth with a hai di jen, and obviously he did not went there)

 

Fahjing must come from Tingjing  聽 jing.  Very weakly translated as listening to energy .  Where when you touch on the other person, you listen  to his energy and his intentions and flowing with him in unison.

 

Ting jing will lead to dong jing  懂 jing.  Very weakly translated to knowing/comprehending jing .

 

Those are just terms.  No division in my mind as to where ting ends and dong began even if my Masters tried to explain to me.  When you can get to ting jing, you are already halfway into dong jing.

 

After in depth groundings and thrown abouts by my Masters, I managed to discard all those shit about weight shiting , weight sinking , chi here and there, and vectorial forces from waist and heels.

 

When I touch hands, with Masters, I felt I touched hands with a wreath of smoke and unable to feel them, until they want to be felt.  When I touch hands with students and others, they felt so nice and solid to me and all their movements, and future movements telegraphed to me and I knew that move before they moved.   So easy to lead them on, or to induce movements that they will then counter for me to set in place the consequences of their movements.

 

And if the ducks were lined up and stars in right alignment, do a fahjing to send them a short distance away.

 

 

 Taoistic Idiot on peng li ji ann

[Doc]

Nice videos. If you are thinking can I or can't I....you won't. You're just getting in your own way.

 

The thing that is unexplainable is so, because you shouldn't be explaining it. You should feel it.

 

When you felt the opening your master gave you, you thought about, should or shouldn't I. You got in your own way.

 

How can you explain, get out of your own way to people.

 

The Dao of getting out of your own dao.

[Wells]

.

Edited May 10, 2016 by Wells

[Michael Sternbach]

Body mechanics, no neijin.

 

Body mechanics and neijin should be used in conjunction. But the former are a prerequisite for proper chi flow.

[Wu Ming Jen]

Turn the waist over the weighted and rooted leg. Emptied leg / foot should turn with you so the knee is centered over the bubbling well of the empty foot.then the weight can be placed to change direction or knee, kick, whatever

 

The waist is like a large gear that moves the smaller gears.

 

If we talk about the energetic properties of proper body mechanics and how the root, resistance can create force and lead chi to any part of the body we are dealing with neijin the application of creating force or manipulating, interrupt, borrow, swallow, force of another.