Dumbing Down University

[futuredaze]

Kierkegaard's book "A Literary Review" sums up the spirit of mainstream consciousness quite well.  This book was written in the 1840s, in response to newspapers and printed media becoming more popular.  Of course, Kierkegaard would not see the passionless nihilist mentality flourish as it did thanks to television and film.  Still though, his insights are relevant.

 

"The present age is essentially a sensible, reflecting age, devoid of passion, flaring up in superficial, short-lived enthusiasm and prudentially relaxing in indolence. ...whereas a passionate age accelerates, raises up, and overthrows, elevates and debases, a reflective apathetic age does the opposite, it stifles and impedes, it levels.... In antiquity the individual in the crowd had no significance whatsoever; the man of excellence stood for them all. The trend today is in the direction of mathematical equality, so that in all classes about so and so many uniformly make one individual.... For leveling to take place, a phantom must first be raised, the spirit of leveling, a monstrous abstraction, an all-encompassing something that is nothing, a mirage—and this phantom is the public.... The present age is essentially a sensible age, devoid of passion and therefore it has nullified the principle of contradiction (p. 68, 84f., 90, 97)."

 

At the end of the quote, Kierkegaard is referencing how the abstract notion of "the public" can function to control people and prevent them from acting independently .  Rather than reacting to events based on individual feelings and logic, people react based on how they stand in relation to "the public," which Kierkegaard is trying to show is an abstraction.

 

Although this does not directly tie into the education system itself, I think the media and technology have a large role in why people are so uninformed and passionless.

Edited February 19, 2016 by futuredaze

[dust]

Don't think I'd call "who won the Civil War?" or "who did America win its independence from?" trivial details a student at a major US university shouldn't be expected to know but perhaps my expectations are too high...

It doesn't matter what happened in the past, or that we plan for the future. It's only necessary to consider this moment, to live in the now. Tear up the past it tells us nothing about the future. Don't worry about the future we can make it however we wish.

 

I know your comment is regarding "trivia" and perhaps directed at zerostao more than me. But I think he was joking...?

 

Anyway like I said before, I'd really expect someone to know these details simply from having been alive in the USA for the last 15-20 years, and it perhaps reflects somewhat poorly on their memory and how much attention they paid in school that they don't know.

 

But I might also ask: At what point would you suggest that people should not be expected to know these things? In another 100 years? 500? 1000? When does a long-dead war stop being relevant? Do you know all the wars?

 

Honest questions. I would suggest... specific knowledge needn't extend beyond the lives of those in (one's own) living memory.

 

 

 

How true -- if one has no knowledge of the past, one cannot tell when the present is entirely fabricated. Can't tell whether you are repeating the mistakes of previous generations when you have no clue what those mistakes were.

 

Does it really seem to you that the continued study of history has led humankind to any great realizations about not repeating the mistakes of the past?

 

All I see is people making the same mistakes that history warns us about time and again...

[Karl]

Not sure you got the sense of it. Brian was being a touch sarcastic and I was agreeing with him.....err I think.

[Brian]

Not sure you got the sense of it. Brian was being a touch sarcastic and I was agreeing with him.....err I think.

Yes. AND... It is a whole lot easier to manipulate people if they have no clue whether what you tell them is accurate (and even easier if they've been taught that it isn't something they should worry their little heads about).

[zerostao]

How true -- if one has no knowledge of the past, one cannot tell when the present is entirely fabricated. Can't tell whether you are repeating the mistakes of previous generations when you have no clue what those mistakes were.

 

Gosh! I wonder what the Kardashian family is up to today?

i think i heard where kanye (sp?) in 53 million in debt and wanting to beg on go fund me.

there happens to be a nigerian bank willing to help kanye out of debt but first kanye needs to wire some funds for the application fee.

[dust]

Not sure you got the sense of it. Brian was being a touch sarcastic and I was agreeing with him.....err I think.

 

Not sarcasm in the comment I first quoted. If he was being sarcastic, he'd be saying the opposite of what he thought (sarcasm being irony used in a mocking fashion), but I'm fairly sure he was saying what he thought, even if he wasn't being entirely serious. Your comment was sarcastic, and in agreement with Brian's sentiment, which again was:

 

"Don't think I'd call "who won the Civil War?" or "who did America win its independence from?" trivial details a student at a major US university shouldn't be expected to know"

 

I got the sense of it, I think, and amid the non-sarcasm and the sarcasm I also got the sense that you both think university students should be expected to know these things. And I neither agree nor disagree. I do think that it's worth questioning.

Edited February 19, 2016 by dustybeijing

[Karl]

I also got the sense that you both think university students should be expected to know these things. And I neither agree nor disagree. I do think that it's worth questioning.

 

Yes, I believe it's important to the process of good decision making.

[Brian]

Not sarcasm in the comment I first quoted. If he was being sarcastic, he'd be saying the opposite of what he thought (sarcasm being irony used in a mocking fashion), but I'm fairly sure he was saying what he thought, even if he wasn't being entirely serious. Your comment was sarcastic, and in agreement with Brian's sentiment, which again was:

 

"Don't think I'd call "who won the Civil War?" or "who did America win its independence from?" trivial details a student at a major US university shouldn't be expected to know"

 

I got the sense of it, I think, and amid the non-sarcasm and the sarcasm I also got the sense that you both think university students should be expected to know these things. And I neither agree nor disagree. I do think that it's worth questioning.

A student who attended schools in America and met qualifications for any credentialed university in the country has been presented with and tested on this information repeatedly, in multiple years throughout their education. They don't retain that information because they have been taught, intentionally or otherwise, that it isn't important. Increasingly, it is intentional -- and, also increasingly, it is systemic. We have more and more students entering universities and colleges who don't know that we aren't a democracy, who see no practical value in geometry or algebra or trigonometry, who can't do arithmetic without a calculator, who can't tell you the difference between two, to & two, who don't know the role of the US Senate, who can't write in sentences, who have never read the Declaration of Independence, the Constitution or the Bill of Rights, and who can't tell you what the President's job is. They do know, however, what Taylor said about Kanye and Kanye said about Taylor this week, what the latest cute cat video on the innerwebz is, that the government is your friend and anyone who says differently is a bigot (and probably a racist, sexist, homophobic terrorist, too), and how best to post selfies on multiple social media platforms -- you know, all the stuff that's needed for the next wave of voters, captains of industry and educators of the next generation.

[dust]

Indeed, I can't disagree that most of the knowledge you mention is likely to be of some use, at some point, to most Americans. And it seems entirely possible, having seen the video, that many genuinely don't know a lot of that stuff.

 

I'd like to point this out though

 

can't tell you the difference between two, to & two

 

 

 

(edited for clarity, since we're talking about bad spelling/grammar..)

Edited February 19, 2016 by dustybeijing

[Brian]

Indeed, I can't disagree that most of the knowledge you mention is not indeed likely to be of some use. And it seems entirely possible, having seen the video, that many genuinely don't know a lot of that stuff.

 

I'd like to point this out though

 

 

<grin>

 

The fact that you noticed is significant, I think. I suspect you know the difference between then & than, and that you have at least a rudimentary understanding of your own country's form of government. That's the point, you see -- we are actively teaching our children that there is no value in learning. That's not an exaggeration! I've not only raised a child who is still in the education system and have argued with teachers who said things like "my answer is correct because the answer guide says it is" when I pointed out that my son got correct answer marked wrong on an arithmetic test but I am currently an insider in higher education so I'm watching it happen first-hand.

 

It is rather sad, I think.

Edited February 19, 2016 by Brian

[dust]

Well.. again, I can't really disagree, especially as I have no such direct experience of current education, either here or in the USA. To an extent, at least, I fear you're right that learning actual solid useful things is becoming less important.

[zerostao]

under immense pressure from this thread, mizzou caves in and fires instructor

 

https://news.yahoo.com/univ-missouri-fires-instructor-student-run-ins-201056246.html?nhp=1

[Apech]

There's an endless supply of this stuff:

 

[zerostao]

a project brought to you by michigan university student   "make your way"  as an 18th century young english woman

 

http://www.umich.edu/~ece/student_projects/make_your_way/index.html

[Apech]

a project brought to you by michigan university student   "make your way"  as an 18th century young english woman

 

http://www.umich.edu/~ece/student_projects/make_your_way/index.html

 

 

I'm a six penny whore.

[Brian]

I'm a six penny whore.

Yes, but have you tried that website?

 

 

 

 

 

I'm gonna be a domestic servant.

[zerostao]

you 2 adventurers 

i stayed home , married, and tried to talk the husband to leave for france

then i chose the life of a pirate like

anne bonny

Edited March 16, 2016 by zerostao

[Apech]

Yes, but have you tried that website?

 

 

 

 

 

I'm gonna be a domestic servant.

 

A fitting role for a young wench such as thee.

[Brian]

A fitting role for a young wench such as thee.

IRL, I'm only a part-time domestic servant.

[Apech]

IRL, I'm only a part-time domestic servant.

 

I prefer the picaresque life of a poxy doxy.

[Karl]

Prostitute for me.

[Brian]

I prefer the picaresque life of a poxy doxy.

LOL

 

I had to look up "doxy."

[Apech]

LOL

 

I had to look up "doxy."

 

Really? I thought you looked up doxies on a regular basis.

[zerostao]

LOL

 

I had to look up "doxy."

what source did you look for it in?

i tried deviant art

[Brian]

Really? I thought you looked up doxies on a regular basis.

Honestly, I've never understood the attraction. Seems kinda like hiring people to come to your birthday party and give you presents you bought and wrapped yourself.

 

<shrug>

 

 

 

 

Maybe you can explain it to me?