Interpreting a Casting

[Astral Monk]

Hi all,

 

Is there a way to interpret a casting without making reference to the Yijing and its various commentaries?

 

We pose a question, cast six lines, and get a hexagram. How does one go about line by line interpreting the answer? Are we looking at 6 dimensions of the problem? Or could we just separate into trigrams and analyse the relation between each element in their relative positions?

 

Thoughts?

 

8)

[Andrei]

Yi Jin Jing has commentaries on each line, so why would you not use them? Also the commentaries analyse the hexagram as two trigrams that relate to each other.

[Daeluin]

Sure.

 

Just use the trigrams.

 

The trigrams are like elemental forces. The Yi is a study of one elemental force interacting with another.

 

Elemental forces are subtle things. In other words, there is more to them beneath the surface than appears on the surface. The better one is able to understand these subtleties, the better one understands the message being sent when looking at a hexagram. The Yi covers many different paradigms, and to understand them all thoroughly one needs the ability to see from multiple perspectives.

 

The commentaries help one to do this. The longer one studies, the more one understands why some commentaries are so strange. When one is able to use any hexagram line as a principle to be matched to multiple real-life situations, one has graduated from the need for commentaries.

 

Also, there are many ways of divining a hexagram for purposes like this. The number of words a person says in a conversation, paired with their demeanor. The number of knocks on the front door paired with the time of day. Thinking of a random multi-digit number and compressing it. Look into Plumb Blossom Numerology for more info. The more one practices such techniques with sincere intent, the more these can grow into a potent kung fu.

[Astral Monk]

Yi Jin Jing has commentaries on each line, so why would you not use them? Also the commentaries analyse the hexagram as two trigrams that relate to each other.

 

Well, a commentary is one persons read, immortalized. And each of these needs interpreting to apply. I'm wondering if there is a more direct way for the outback caster with no books around.

 

8)

[Daeluin]

Well, a commentary is one persons read, immortalized. And each of these needs interpreting to apply. I'm wondering if there is a more direct way for the outback caster with no books around. 8)

 

This is a good point.

 

However, we need to remember how ancient the Yi is. Zhou Dynasty, maybe Shang? The commentaries on the lines and the Yi as a whole are records (back when keeping records was rare) over time. These records are a type of technology - like a map - of how far these peoples had been able to read into the Yi. These records were added to over the ages, expanding and refining the map.

 

There is always bias, everywhere. How does an un-initiated person's bias compare to an entire lineage of effort?

 

One can come to learn a great deal about the Yi, but it does take time and effort for the subtleties to unveil themselves.

 

But if one isn't interested in getting to the root, it is simple enough to get the general idea from a thorough understanding of the trigrams.

 

Heaven and Earth are like Yang and Yin, made up of layers. The primordial ingredients of the Universe. Something and Nothing. Full and Empty.

 

The heart of every trigram is the middle line, even though that is not always the dominant line. A yang trigram is one with a single yang line. A yin trigram is one with a single yin line. Why? Because those single lines tend to be a dominant force in the resulting dynamic.

 

So when we take the heart of heaven and the heart of earth, and switch them, we get fire and water. Why?

 

Well fire is a yin line surrounded by two yang lines. Like a candle flame, there is something to see around the edges, but it is clear in the middle. Or like consciousness, which is empty and clear in the middle, until it fills with thoughts. The two surrounding yang lines are the false yang, and the middle yin is the true yin. False and true designate things that are mundane vs celestial; contrived vs primordial. The true is often embedded within the false, just like when we take something and create something new, the original is embedded within the new manifestation. Creation upon creation upon creation creates a lot of noise, and fire likes to create, to fill the deep and quiet emptiness with manifestation. This is why people have monkey minds that cannot stop thinking. In stillness, the noise eventually goes away, and clarity ensues. A light that is bright and clear is easier to navigate by than one that flickers. Thus fire is known as clarity and illumination, and also wildness and impatience. In harmony it brings warmth to what is cold, softens what is stiff, expresses only that which needs to be heard.

 

Water is a single yang line surrounded by two yin lines. The true yang surrounded by the false yin, making it easy to reach for the true, yet end up in the false. Like crossing a great river, one does not just swim across. One carefully plans, perhaps crafting a vessel, and even then is likely to get wet. Just as Fire represents consciousness, Water represents the subconscious. Great wisdom is held within water, and intuition is required to access it. It is easy to get lost in the dark; one must be sincere and stick to what is true in one's heart, in order to find the true light within water. Water represents depth and poignancy, danger and the abyss, and yet contains the true heart of yang from Heaven.

 

Thunder has one yang line under two yin lines. This first solid line is like the spark of something, a powerful CLAP in the silence. It easily arouses things into motion, as those two yin lines are happy to invite all manner of creation based on that initial burst. Thunder represents action, movement, the intentional use of energy.

 

Mountain has one yang line above two yin lines. This top line is like the solid outline of a mountain, and the two yin lines underneath it are contained and hidden from view. Mountain is a container, sealing and providing stability. When that top line remains firm, and the mountain is still, it receives the celestial energy of the heavens upon it. When that top line is weak, the container leaks out what it was holding under pressure within.

 

Mountain and Thunder, stillness and movement, are each contained within the other. One may learn to act when one needs to and become still when one does not need to act, returning within.

 

Wind has a single yin line beneath two yang lines. It represents that which penetrates and stirs things up, blows things about, and is a medium for change. While Thunder is a yang force of activity, Wind is a yin force. Wind is only created as a change between forces of different temperament. When these forces create wind, it can be used as a pressure, to drive something forward, or to spread something out.

 

Lake has a single yin line above two yang lines. It represents the state where firmness has built up beyond the half-way point, such that one feels joyous in one's possession, be that of health or wealth. And while the dynamic of Lake, or Swamp, is to allow things to continue to settle and build, the joyous feeling often causes one to spend what one has. Lake is related to feelings of sensation, and of the balance between instant gratification and delayed gratification. When one is still and allows the settling dynamic of lake to unfold, this is like non-doing, and transformation ensues.

 

Heaven represents firmness of energy. This energy can easily become forceful, using its power with strength rather than flexibility. When people do not know how to be firm and contain the fullness of their energy, it often bursts out unconstrained, like on the full moon. When heavenly energy is held together it can be a powerful creative source to fuel a project. When nourished within it can preserve one's life force.

 

Earth represents adaptability and receptivity. Space and time allow all things to unfold within them. The planet earth allows it's soils and minerals to be shaped and used to support life. In its receptivity it can also be a force to draw one's energy into creation. The old saying when walking in the woods of leaving only footprints applies here. It is sometimes difficult to avoid littering when the host does not complain. Things exist so we shape them. But do we need to?

 

-----

 

So putting it all together, you might get a hexagram like:

• Heaven under mountain. The heavenly creative energy is being contained and compressed beneath the mountain. Power that is harnessed, assuming the mountain's seal holds its integrity.
• Water under lake. The lake here represents a pool of water, or substance, that is positioned over an abyss, something much bigger than the lake. Thus exhaustion is likely.
• Lake under thunder. Internal sensations that control the external actions.
• Fire over mountain. Firm foundation below that presents multiple routes for the fire to travel, but once it reaches the top where will it go? Traveling and transience.
• Thunder under Fire. Action before illumination. If one is able to still one's actions until illumination arrives, one might be able to get somewhere.

And so on. I've only been studying for a few years now, and I'm only beginning to find the logic in some of the connections between the trigram images and the commentary meanings. But all of it is deeply poignant.

 

Good luck!

[Diaitadoc]

I'm actually studying this very topic.

 

The trigram wuxing method that is being described here comes from a method known as "Mei Hua" or "Plum Blossom" divination.

 

There's another method called the "fire pearl forest method" (火珠林法). It is a way to interpret hexagrams line by line according to their wu xing values. Although the received texts are song Dynasty, they refer back to a Han Dynasty text, which in turn claims to have received the original oral tradition of divination that was used to actually write the Zhou Yi.

 

It's the one I'm practicing right now.

 

I can give an example reading if you like, just submit your question and casting, along with the date of the casting.

[Daeluin]

Thank you, Diaitadoc! I would be interested in learning more about this. I've read about Mayi Daozhe in Seeking the Spirit of the Book of Changes, and A Companion to Yi Jing Numerology and Cosmology merely describes the Fire Pearl Forest Method as the invention of the 3 coin casting technique, often attributed to his student Chen Tuan.

 

What you are describing sounds similar to Jing Fang's Wen Wang Gua. I've studied this a little from Jack Chiu's excellent book. Personally I find this system quite complex, rolling several techniques into one system based on principles that are not entirely clear to me. It does however offer great depth of interpretation.

 

Personally I believed Mei Hua was more about the numerical techniques used derive a hexagram than the interpretation. To me the interpretation of the hexagram based on the component trigrams precludes and informs all traditional hexagram interpretations. The mystery, for me, lies in comprehending how the inner and outer lines of a trigram interact with another trigram, as the inner and outer operate on different principles. So when they are combined, it is not as simple as seeing lake under heaven and thinking of joy subordinant to authority, but of understanding the influence line 3 in ☱ has within its own dynamic, and then how that influence uniquely applies to the lines of another trigram it meets, and vice versa. It is still as simple as looking at one elemental force combined with another, but holds to a deeper understanding of the principles that make each elemental force tick. The received interpretations never deviate from meanings found in this way, and perhaps reveal that great depth had been reached in utilizing this method.

 

I am happily open to the further exploration of any of these topics!

[Diaitadoc]

Indeed, Fire Pearl Forest Method IS Wen Wang Gua. Another name for it is Liu Yao Yi Gua (Six Lines, One/Changing Gua). Yes, Jack Chiu's book is excellent but difficult to grasp without a background in Chinese cosmology, metaphysics and especially Calendrics. My background in acupuncture and Bazi have been immensely helpful in this regard.

[Daeluin]

Indeed, Fire Pearl Forest Method IS Wen Wang Gua. Another name for it is Liu Yao Yi Gua (Six Lines, One/Changing Gua). Yes, Jack Chiu's book is excellent but difficult to grasp without a background in Chinese cosmology, metaphysics and especially Calendrics. My background in acupuncture and Bazi have been immensely helpful in this regard.

 

My main unanswered queries are related to the 8 house system and the six celestial figures. I can understand how the trigram wuxing values could carry over to the doubled trigrams, but that doesn't explain why this particular sequence of line changes from house to house was chosen over another method, or why the branch assignment is the way it is. And there seems to be a long history involving the six celestial figures, but little available information on it in english. Especially the Curved Array and Flying Serpent seem to have an interesting role to play, yet I haven't been able to find anything on why the Snake was shown to entwine the Tortoise in the northern sky.

 

I've come to realize that any system we put into practice will bear results, and that is fine. But if a particular system operates on principles that reach deeply into the root, then practicing without understanding why seems likely to yield somewhat obfuscated interpretations. So in my studies I am not looking for what is right or wrong, but looking to connect more deeply. Developing a background in Chinese metaphysics has been incredibly rewarding, especially when the various branches begin to converge upon the root.

 

So I've been continuing to study various schools of thought in hopes that I will be able to make these connections better. In particular I found Briefing Leaders and The Imperial Guide to Fung Shui & Chinese Astrology incredibly helpful in reaching more deeply into these things. It is possible the answers are right in front of me and I simply haven't realized it yet.

[Diaitadoc]

The Imperial Guide is definitely a helpful tool, however I think it is through this particular compendium that some confusion can arise vis-a-vis the eight chambers.

 

In section 2, two variations of the eight chambers are described - the lesser and greater roaming year sequences. Their transformations involve just one half of the trigram, and they emphasize that it doesn't matter which trigram is the one to change - the upper/outer or the lower/inner - as long as the changes continue within that particular trigram. Both the lesser and greater sequences use the same pattern of change, however they name the generations differently. Furthermore, they use the same terminology, which makes it a bit difficult to decipher.

 

Wen Wang Gua uses the same terminology for the eight chambers as well, which makes things even more confusing, and since the sequence of change involves BOTH the inner/outer hexagrams, it leaves room for contemplation, to say the least. Jack's explanation of how Jing Fang developed his sequence helps a lot, though... he developed it from the Shi Er Xiao Xi Gua (the 12 enhancing and diminishing trigrams), so it's different than the 8 chamber sequence used in the Feng Shui schools.

 

Like you, it's something I'm exploring. When I cast, I do two readings - one using Jing Fang's chambers, and one using the Feng Shui chambers - I'm interested in seeing what, if any, difference results, and whether there is more resonance with one method or the other. As things currently stand, Jing Fang's chambers have brought greater accuracy than the Feng Shui chambers. I'm not surprised, given the fact that the Feng Shui school's chambers are also known as "Mountains", and refer to space more than time... whereas Jing Fang's chambers are based off of the 12 monthly trigrams, which refer to time more than space. I think something we as English speakers (or even modern chinese speakers) might be missing is that the term "chamber" can represent both a spatial aspect (on earth) and a temporal aspect (in the sky - think of astrological "houses").

 

So Jing Fang's chambers are the ones to use for divination, IME.

[Daeluin]

Ah, thank you for this detailed explanation. I haven't made it very far into section two yet... I feel like I still need to draw out and explore more deeply the implications of the nayin system.

 

What I've studied of feng shui so far has revealed a great deal of complexity that I haven't tried to digest yet. So many layers. I look forward to studying section two and will keep your suggestions in mind as I do so. In just a few pages of the intro I felt I learned more about the subject than several other books combined. The merging and unfolding of time and space seems core to much of this. Having spent while looking at time, perhaps the study of space will be helpful.