Can qi be felt by anyone?

[lessdaomorebum]

So you think that Spooky Tooth should change the title of their album too?

 

Or maybe all the words in the song "Hey Joe" should be changed?

 

So the damn thing was a joke.  Some people don't like my jokes.  Ignore my posts.  What the fuck?

 

I don't need any Moral Police watching over me.  If I violate the rules of the forum I'll accept criticism.

 

But I won't be told what I can and cannot say on this forum except for posted rules of the forum.

 

I did not insult anyone.  Apparently some were insulted.  Is that my problem or is it the problem of those who were insulted?

I think spooky tooth should go see a dentist. Jimi was telling a story which is a little different from quoting some musician I think few people have ever even heard of in a thread about chee (although it is less and less so, not that I can help that; I wish thread OPs could control their threads).

 

I don't have to ignore your posts. You could ignore mine if you like . You are using a free speech defense while telling others they can't disagree with you. Almost as odd as "BTW  There is a lot of violence in real life.  Should we not talk about that too?" which makes no sense. Clearly a wholly out of context joke, in the wrong place. There is a time and a place for everything (I said as much in different words on another thread we participated in). I think you know this too.

[Marblehead]

I think spooky tooth should go see a dentist. Jimi was telling a story which is a little different from quoting some musician I think few people have ever even heard of in a thread about chee (although it is less and less so, not that I can help that; I wish thread OPs could control their threads).

 

Damn!!!  Jimi was a musician.  Spooky Tooth were musicians.  Spooky Tooth only broke the woman's jaw. Jimi shot and killed his.

 

So yes, everyone start threads such that they can control what others say.  And I promise you that I will never post in any of those threads so no one will have to read my off topic jokes.

 

I don't have to ignore your posts. You could ignore mine if you like .

 

I would never do that.  I have never been offended by anything you or Cheya have ever said.

 

You are using a free speech defense while telling others they can't disagree with you.

 

That is totally untrue.  People disagree with me all the time and I don't get bent out of shape over it.

 

Almost as odd as "BTW  There is a lot of violence in real life.  Should we not talk about that too?" which makes no sense. Clearly a wholly out of context joke, in the wrong place. There is a time and a place for everything (I said as much in different words on another thread we participated in). I think you know this too.

 

And why does it not make any sense?  There is a lot of ugly in the world.  It should be spoken to.

 

So you didn't like my joke.  Fine.  Just let it go.  You both should be accustomed to how I relate on this forum.

 

The time was right, the place was right, what I said was right.  My opinion.  Apparently others have different opinions.  Don't be forcing your opinions on me and I promise I will not try to force mine on anyone else.

 

I already stated that I acknowledge that Cheya was offended by what I said.  There is no apology forthcoming.

 

And I have never said the Cheya and you do not have the right to say my joke was out of place, or that it was in bad taste, or any other value judgements.  All I am saying is that others, except for Admin and the Mods, don't have the right to tell me what I can and cannot say.

 

People around the world are killing innocent people.  All I did was make what some feel was a bad joke.  Let's be fair with our judgements.

[lessdaomorebum]

Yes, people are killing innocent people, therefore we will no longer worry about lesser things. I will try that if I get pulled over for speeding

 

Is it conceivable that you could be offended by something someone said in their post?

 

I do not understand how anyone has forced their opinion on you. You forced an opinion on others with your post that clearly was gratuitous. But somehow you say that what you do is a joke or an opinion, but when others disagree they are forcing their opinion on you?

 

The whole issue for me is how out of context and gratuitous it was. I can and do talk about all manner of (what some would call) unseemly things with my friends, but some things I would not share here, because it is a public forum. A mental filter is a useful thing to have because we don't need to share all our opinions with all people at all times.

 

And since I started this thread to talk about chee, I feel responsibility for this thread, even though I am not a moderator/administrator. Surely that is not difficult to understand? I want others to feel comfortable talking about chee. If they are offended by discussing chee, then I would take your tack and say too bad

Edited July 25, 2016 by lessdaomorebum

[cheya]

Okay, just have to say, sorry Jim, your "professional hat" didn't help you here, wrong on all counts....  

 

And now I'm resolutely resisting the feminatzi-istic urge to carry on with this, and instead would like to honor the OP's request and get back to his topic of feeling "chee".

 

By the way, LDMB, when you've made enough posts, you can apply for "Owner's Permissions", and then you can control your threads!  Neat, eh? You can read all about it on the home page. 

 

 

 

 

[Jim D.]

Now I will have to put on my legal hat. MH has the right to freedom of speech. He has not asked for feedback, or opinion, or judgement. Comments that were setforth by his accusers were said in an attempt to control MH, censor him, make him feel bad.  In my field, we call this projection which is a defense mechanism used to avoid personal issues the individual does not want to address. When MH asked you to let it go he was saying you are continuing to be annoying. By being annoying purposefully, you are disrespecting the feelings of MH.

 

So, I would agree with MH and "Drop the Rock." If his joke is something you can't let go of, I would recommend seeing a counselor. There is something else below the surface that is bothering you. It certainly is not MH, because as he has said, you know him and how he operates.

 

If you continue with berrating him, I would judge that to be a malicious aforethought.

[Marblehead]

Okay, just have to say, sorry Jim, your "professional hat" didn't help you here, wrong on all counts....  

 

That is your opinion only and I am in total disagreement with that opinion of yours.

 

And now I'm resolutely resisting the feminatzi-istic urge to carry on with this, and instead would like to honor the OP's request and get back to his topic of feeling "chee".

 

Yeah, some things others say we should just ignore because all it does in create disagreements and arguments.

 

And yes, let's get back to talking about Chi.

 

By the way, LDMB, when you've made enough posts, you can apply for "Owner's Permissions", and then you can control your threads!  Neat, eh? You can read all about it on the home page. 

 

​I mentioned that above.  I do not read any of them unless the thread title and thread owner is something that catches my attention but I do not post to any knowingly.  So yes, post your heart out in your very own threads so you can delete anything anyone says.

[Jim D.]

Right on Brother!!!!!

[Marblehead]

Yes, people are killing innocent people, therefore we will no longer worry about lesser things. I will try that if I get pulled over for speeding

 

Hey, if you get pulled over for speeding just accept the ticket and keep your mouth shut.

 

I have said before, everything matters but nothing matters.  That is, if you can do something about a condition that you feel should be made better then it should matter to you and you should do whatever your heart leads you to do.  But if there is a condition, such as Marblehead's personality, that you have no chance in hell of changing then Marblehead's personality does not matter.

 

Is it conceivable that you could be offended by something someone said in their post?

 

Oh, I won't negate the possibility.  It actually has happened before.  I simple returned the favor and then let it go.  Some people hold on to thing a lot longer than they should.

[Marblehead]

Okay.  There is an apology due from me.  I apologize for allowing this thread to go so far off topic.  Yes, maybe I should have kept that joke to myself.  But I didn't.  I shared it.  And then we talked endlessly it seems about individual sensitivities.

 

So yeah, who has actually felt an energy in their body that they could say it was Chi?  Raise your hand first please in order to be recognized by the thread owner.

[Jim D.]

MH, you are a man that builds bridges. Taking responsbility is a demonstration of Integrity. Now we just have to wait for the others to "sweep their side of the street."  That takes courage.

 

I was thinking that if these individuals are truly Taoists, then I would have expected them to go with the flow of life. Obviously your joke, the obstruction to their flow, was a teachable moment.

[Marblehead]

I would like to think that all who have read this inconvenient truth will have learned something from it.

 

The power of Chi will radiate from the individual into the universe.  Chi, the polarities of Yin and Yang.  The harmony of the universe.  But not always in balance.  Actually, very rarely in balance as all in the universe is constantly changing.

 

I wish I could use Chi to correct the problem in my hip that was broken but that cannot be.  Some things can't be fixed with Chi alone.

[Jim D.]

What about a hip replacement MH?

[Marblehead]

What about a hip replacement MH?

 

Not appropriate.  The breakage was actually the ball of the femur.  A lot of surgery was needed to screw and pin the femur back together.  It was the surgery, the cutting of the muscle and nerves and other stuff, that is actually the cause of my problems.  The bone is fine; the support (muscles and nerves) for it is the problem and that cannot be corrected.

 

Plus, a lot of the broken bone had to be cut away so that the two parts of the bone would have a chance to fuse back together.  The fusing worked but resulted in the leg with the broken bone to be shorter than the other leg.  I walk with a limp and that takes a lot more energy than was needed before the breakage.

[cheya]

Hey Marblehead, sorry to hear about your hip. Proteolytic enzymes like WobenzymN, Vitalzym or Serrapeptase are good for pain. They chew up damaged tissue and reduce inflammation, which can help mightily with pain. Used a lot in Europe, but oddly not so much in the states. Another thing that helps some folks with uneven leg lengths is a lift in the shoe of the shorter leg...but you have to add height slowly in stages not to freak the body out. You've probably looked into both of those, but just thought I'd throw that in.

[lessdaomorebum]

Cheya, since you are into tai chi ruler, this old book might be of interest, though you likely have already seen it.

Edited July 25, 2016 by lessdaomorebum

[Marblehead]

Hey Marblehead, sorry to hear about your hip. Proteolytic enzymes like WobenzymN, Vitalzym or Serrapeptase are good for pain. They chew up damaged tissue and reduce inflammation, which can help mightily with pain. Used a lot in Europe, but oddly not so much in the states. Another thing that helps some folks with uneven leg lengths is a lift in the shoe of the shorter leg...but you have to add height slowly in stages not to freak the body out. You've probably looked into both of those, but just thought I'd throw that in.

 

Thanks.  Both have been suggested to me before except the specific pain reduction.

 

Fortunately for me I have total freedom of activity or rest when I tire or the pain gets too strong.  I do use OTC pain medicine on days when I am going to be working in the yard.  When I go out shopping I make sure I have plenty of time so that I don't have to push myself beyond to point of unbearable pain.

 

If I live long enough I might have to take action on both your suggestions though.  I know the problem isn't gong to get well and my endurance will lessen as I age further.    

[cheya]

Wow, LDMB, this is great!

I have that book, but only the Chinese version. Your post has the translation! Thank you!

[cheya]

Baoding Balls, aka chinese Health Balls, are another fun way to cultivate chee. They are hollow metal balls that have chimes inside, and vibrate when you rotate a pair in your hands.

 

A couple years ago, I inherited two identical sets of Baoding balls. They were two inches in diameter, much bigger than the single small set I'd had for years, and I thought they would just be too big to handle. I'd been working alot with feeling energy in my chi gung practice, and when I finallly did pick them up, I was shocked at what I felt. The energy traveled up my arms to my head, down to my feet, back up to my head, back out to my hands. It wasn't a perfect circuit, and it didn't follow meridians, but it was very palpable. I was stunned. I mean, that is what the chinese say the balls do, but it just never occurred to me that the effect would be palpable! I didn't expect to be able to repeat the effect, but indeed, it happens every time I pick up the balls!

I've become somewhat obsessed with Chinese balls, and have bought many pairs on eBay, which I make available for my massage clients. Some balls precipitate the energy effect more than others. Some hints: In general, I need balls in both hands to feel the effect. The old heavier type of balls are much more effective than the new lighter balls, which hardly do anything at all. The heavier balls, having more mass, have a stronger physical vibration, it's the vibration, not the sound, that generates the energetic effect.

 

Only a few people I know feel this immediately, partly because you probably need the smooth physical manipulation skill in place before you feel the chi. I'd been playing with the one small pair for years, so that part was already in place.

 

But a couple clients have been blown away when they felt the chee from the Baoding balls I keep in my office. Utterly shocked. I love it!

 

 

 

 

 

 

[cheya]

I got so I could feel the energy within 5-10 seconds every time I started rotating the Baoding balls. Then one day I got up from an intense Sudoku session, and picked up the balls. I couldn't find the energy!  WTF!  It took me awhile to realize that I had to be in a right brain mode to feel the energy. That day, I was so deeply into the left brain, I had almost no access to energetic perception. I actually don't switch very well naturally. 

 

 Since then I have used the balls to train myself to switch back and forth between left and right brain, between analytical thinking and energy perception mode more rapidly. This has helped me tremendously in my bodywork practice, as tuning in to the energy there is essentially the same switch. Thinking about what I should do next with the client vs. feeling into the energy. Sometimes my hands actually tell my mind to "Pu-leeze butt out!" 

 

Using the chinese balls has a useful tool to enhance coordination between brain hemispheres through the corpus callousum, which I understand is a basic shamanic practice.  

 

This isn't so much about where to focus as how to focus as you look for the energy.

Edited July 25, 2016 by cheya

[lessdaomorebum]

I got so I could feel the energy within 5-10 seconds every time I started rotating the Baoding balls. Then one day I got up from an intense Sudoku session, and picked up the balls. I couldn't find the energy!  WTF!  It took me awhile to realize that I had to be in a right brain mode to feel the energy. That day, I was so deeply into the left brain, I had almost no access to energetic perception. I actually don't switch very well naturally. 

 

 Since then I have used the balls to train myself to switch back and forth between left and right brain, between analytical thinking and energy perception mode more rapidly. This has helped me tremendously in my bodywork practice, as tuning in to the energy there is essentially the same switch. Thinking about what I should do next with the client vs. feeling into the energy. Sometimes my hands actually tell my mind to "Pu-leeze butt out!" 

 

Using the chinese balls has a useful tool to enhance coordination between brain hemispheres through the corpus callous, which I understand is a basic shamanic practice.  

 

This isn't so much about where to focus as how to focus as you look for the energy.

Are there any particular balls, videos, books that you would recommend? When I tried and was not into it in the past, it could be that I had not used the right balls.

[cheya]

I checked back on my notes back when I was buying them on eBay for clients (I was obsessed   ). You're looking for balls at least 2" (50 mm) in diameter, 6.5 inches circumference, and weighing at least 13-14 oz the pair (2), without the box. (The new ones can weigh less than half that!) And then you want two sets, similar size and weight. There are some modern ones that fit those specs, but very few. The 1985 ones are pretty much all the heavy type.

 

It can be hard to get that info from sellers, but it's worth it to get Baoding balls that will really charge you up! If you get to handle the new ones compared to a pair of old ones, you will really feel the difference. They must be plastic inside somewhere, even though they do chime. 

 

Another place you can sometimes find good ones is martial arts studios. They usually sell the steel/chrome version, not cloisonné, and you have to make sure they have chimes. I keep a 3 inch pair of those around for guys, who sometimes think the cloisonné are too "pretty." If you feel the chee, those 3" steel monsters will rock you!  Disadvantage is they are much colder on your hands in the winter than the cloisonné version.

[doc benway]

It is amazing how people like Yamu, and his student Brian, and many other persons on this thread, come only to offer their opinion without addressing the concerns I have raised, often blatantly saying things that demonstrate that they have not listened (one of Michael's favorite words) to what I have clearly written (and blue eyed snake thinks my cup is full!). If I get some time, maybe I will collect these in one post. Try these (mostly) new ones:

 

Some teachers insist you must feel chee, otherwise you are wasting your time. Richard Clear in Tennessee is one of those. Their argument is how can you direct chee or heal another if you can not sense it. Many teachers say just do the exercises and who cares what you feel.

 

Many people claim to use energy, but some chee gong teachers say that they often encounter such people who can not in fact project one iota of chee. It is so easy to fool oneself, as I have explained here more than once already.

 

Many people say bone marrow washing is a must to fully save up your hard work with chee. Others don't teach it at all and talk only of the dantyen.

 

Some teachers use microcosmic orbit from the beginning, even in books and videos; others insist that it is an advanced technique and extremely dangerous if done incorrectly.

 

You folks really should try to read my posts. Offhand, I can only rememeber Cheya and Marblehead attempting to answer my actual questions/issues. Some others have offered chee exercises or general advice (which is also appreciated). Many have talked as if they are just writing their general opinion without having read what I wrote. It is bizarre as I reread the thread wondering where I went wrong to get so many odd replies. I am trying hard to see myself as the one who is in error, but people recommend, by way of analogy, that I eat more eggs when I have already said that I love eggs and eat them every day. It just boggles my mind. In fact, I have gotten zero useful information relating to chee gong on this thread (unless Cheya's tai chi ruler works for me, but that is a future project).

 

Just wanted to let you know, I'm still around.

I did read what you wrote. 

I think the problem lies in your conceptualization of Qi as I wrote before.

I won't bore you with more suggestions except one - practicing the microcosmic orbit with an experienced guide could help a great deal. Practicing from books and videos, not so much.

In addition, I think it is fine to practice taijiquan, bagua, xingyi, and qigong without "feeling Qi" at all.

Your body and mind will still benefit if your practice is skillful.

After reading through most of this thread, if you feel as if you've gotten "zero useful information" then the problem may be that you aren't open to change.

When we are too fixed in our view of the world (the story we tell ourselves) we can't change and we can't grow.

If we find a way to be more open, there is much more possibility there. 

Just a thought - I may be totally off base and, if so, my apologies.

Good luck

[Jim D.]

Chi, or that tingling sensation can be felt by anyone if they have a pure heart, and a quiet mind.

[doc benway]

I got so I could feel the energy within 5-10 seconds every time I started rotating the Baoding balls. Then one day I got up from an intense Sudoku session, and picked up the balls. I couldn't find the energy!  WTF!  It took me awhile to realize that I had to be in a right brain mode to feel the energy. That day, I was so deeply into the left brain, I had almost no access to energetic perception. I actually don't switch very well naturally. 

 

 Since then I have used the balls to train myself to switch back and forth between left and right brain, between analytical thinking and energy perception mode more rapidly. This has helped me tremendously in my bodywork practice, as tuning in to the energy there is essentially the same switch. Thinking about what I should do next with the client vs. feeling into the energy. Sometimes my hands actually tell my mind to "Pu-leeze butt out!" 

 

Using the chinese balls has a useful tool to enhance coordination between brain hemispheres through the corpus callousum, which I understand is a basic shamanic practice.  

 

This isn't so much about where to focus as how to focus as you look for the energy.

Very cool idea in bold, thanks for that. 

 

With respect to "how to focus" I couldn't agree more. 

Sometimes it is the very act of focusing that is the obstacle.

That combined with an inaccurate expectation of what we "should" be feeling and where.

For me, the recognition was a combination of being open to something new and then realizing I'd been feeling it all along but not paying the proper attention and not recognizing.

 

There's a little pocket-sized book by Waysun LIao called The Essence of Tai Chi.

In it Master Liao talks a bit about how to feel Qi for beginners and those not having success.

It may be worth reading for the OP, I've heard a few folks claim it helped them. 

[doc benway]

Cheya, since you are into tai chi ruler, this old book might be of interest, though you likely have already seen it.

Great link!

Thank you