Reply

[Jim D.]

This is in part for my friend Karl. Karl, "you" statements upset people. Better to use "how is it that you feel thus and so"...more open ended...not attacking.

 

Again, I ask, how is Philosophy working for you. Show me an example. Let's talk about it.

 

I too could not leave disruptive relationships. It took a long time to figure out that I was trying to bring closure to my relationship with my mother, and somewhat with my father who did not the best they could with what they had. They did not have the resources to teach me the necessary life skills. I relied on what I saw from other dysfunctional role models.

 

I would ask these questions. Who am I? How did I get to the place I am right now? What can I change about what I don't like? What can't I change about what I don't like? And am I willing to get into action and change what I can? And am I willing to monitor myself on a day to day basis in order to keep what I changed about me?

 

Karl, you are right about Aristotle and the beginning of para-science. If I remember correctly, isn't he the one that talked about "Prime Mover."

 

Psychology/Counseling can be spiritual if it is the goal of the patient to be more spiritual. Counseling is client driven and individualized. Most people in my experience just want to feel better.

 

I use the definition of Philosophy when referring to it: "the study of the fundamental nature of knowledge, reallity, and existence, especialy when considered as an academic discipline." The last part to this definition is what I see in the comments from other Philosphers on this cite.

 

If we on this "Corner" are moe interested in the academic side of Philosophy, then I am wrong to assume otherwise. I woke up this morning thinking that the Philosophers on this Corner are just having fun discussing what is fun for them. My intents are different. I am pursuing how this all works. So far, the Philosophers on this Corner have not convinced  me that there is something in it to apply in living just for today. 

 

My impression on those that have commented on my topics are that you all are very good men who are trying to reach out and make a mark on life for yourself. You want to be noticed as a person that counts.

 

JD

[Zhongyongdaoist]

Aristotle . . . isn't he the one that talked about "Prime Mover."

Yes, he is the one who talked about "Prime Mover".

 

I have be following some of your posts and so I thought I might direct you to one of mine in which I examine the usefulness of a cross cultural comparison between Aristotle and Daoism:

 

I will take one powerful application of these ideas and apply them to modeling Daoism, since many people here have an interest both in Daoism and Western Esoteric traditions, but first I want to point out that while these Aristotelian principles are used as explanatory principles in Agrippa, in Agrippa they have been thoroughly assimilated to a fundamentally Platonist worldview, a task first undertaken by those thinkers usually categorized as Middle Platonists, whose ideas were admirably synthesized and expounded by Plotinus and his successors.

 

This was part of a discussion of Aristotle's Four Causes and I used it as an illustration.  I am using it to point out that I do have a good background in both Classical and Chinese philosophy.  I will post in a couple other of your threads as I have time.

[Marblehead]

Well, in my opinion, Nietzsche is closer to Eastern thinking than any of the other Western philosophers are or were.

[Rune]

What is the problem? I do not see it. Let Karl be Karl!

[Marblehead]

What is the problem? I do not see it. Let Karl be Karl!

Hehehe.  No, we want Karl to be passive and non-argumentive.  We already have a Marblehead.

[Jim D.]

How is Nietzche closer to Eastern thinking? Example(s) please.

 

JD

[Marblehead]

How is Nietzche closer to Eastern thinking? Example(s) please.

 

JD

 

No specific examples at the moment.  However,

 

If you read "Thus Spoke Zarathustra" the similarities can be seen.

 

While Nietzsche spoke harshly of Christianity of his day he did speak kindly of Buddhism.

 

But, his goal was not to speak of Eastern thought but rather of Western thought.  And much of what he spoke was not very supportive.

[Karl]

Yes, he is the one who talked about "Prime Mover".

 

I have be following some of your posts and so I thought I might direct you to one of mine in which I examine the usefulness of a cross cultural comparison between Aristotle and Daoism:

 

 

 

This was part of a discussion of Aristotle's Four Causes and I used it as an illustration.  I am using it to point out that I do have a good background in both Classical and Chinese philosophy.  I will post in a couple other of your threads as I have time.

Aristotle wasn't 'all that' if you follow my meaning, he also fell into Platonism, but a lot of good came from his work. Thomas Aquinus was similar in that respect and continues with the prime mover theme-obviously-but then religion is neo-Platonism. Aquinus applied logic and reason to religion, it was misguided, but not so misguided as those philosophers that wrecked religion to install collectivist subjectivism. They reversed Aristotle and declared that mans reason was unreason. Just as religion had sought to stamp out mans identity in a soft form, in the sense of a platonic heaven, later philosophers did away with that and strangled man where he lay.

[Karl]

This is in part for my friend Karl. Karl, "you" statements upset people. Better to use "how is it that you feel thus and so"...more open ended...not attacking.

 

Again, I ask, how is Philosophy working for you. Show me an example. Let's talk about it.

 

I too could not leave disruptive relationships. It took a long time to figure out that I was trying to bring closure to my relationship with my mother, and somewhat with my father who did not the best they could with what they had. They did not have the resources to teach me the necessary life skills. I relied on what I saw from other dysfunctional role models.

 

I would ask these questions. Who am I? How did I get to the place I am right now? What can I change about what I don't like? What can't I change about what I don't like? And am I willing to get into action and change what I can? And am I willing to monitor myself on a day to day basis in order to keep what I changed about me?

 

Karl, you are right about Aristotle and the beginning of para-science. If I remember correctly, isn't he the one that talked about "Prime Mover."

 

Psychology/Counseling can be spiritual if it is the goal of the patient to be more spiritual. Counseling is client driven and individualized. Most people in my experience just want to feel better.

 

I use the definition of Philosophy when referring to it: "the study of the fundamental nature of knowledge, reallity, and existence, especialy when considered as an academic discipline." The last part to this definition is what I see in the comments from other Philosphers on this cite.

 

If we on this "Corner" are moe interested in the academic side of Philosophy, then I am wrong to assume otherwise. I woke up this morning thinking that the Philosophers on this Corner are just having fun discussing what is fun for them. My intents are different. I am pursuing how this all works. So far, the Philosophers on this Corner have not convinced  me that there is something in it to apply in living just for today. 

 

My impression on those that have commented on my topics are that you all are very good men who are trying to reach out and make a mark on life for yourself. You want to be noticed as a person that counts.

 

JD

:-) I spent some time at that school too. I don't hold to it. I prefer honesty and that will always upset some people. If you want it sugar coated then you had best look elsewhere.

 

I don't know why you concern yourself about 'how this is working out for me' ?

 

You use philosophy, you have no choice about it.

 

You can choose to know the philosophic framework you use, or you can choose to remain ignorant. In any case its pointless to keep asking me questions to which only you have the answers. I can discuss philosophy and how it applies to every day life, but that's all.

[Jim D.]

Karl, I am sincerely trying to get to know you and the how of your existence. Even Ayn Rand gave living examples when she was asked to. If you want to know how it is that I apply my "philosophy," read my post today in Newcomer, on Laziness. And read my post today in New Comer on the topic of Invsible in Martial Arts. Or the post prior to that post on how I address issues without sounding that like I am defending my Ph.D.

 

My Philosophy is just keep it simple, and everything will take care of itself. Be my own person. Follow no one. Take what I want and leave the rest. Do my own thinking. Do the research. Look for definitions to words people use. See life from their point of view. Work on me. Help others. Know that like others, I am becoming and am not done yet. I don't have to defend my existence. And so forth.

 

But getting to know a person, that is a worthwhile journey, regardless of their Philosophical view points. How am I suppose to decide whether I like you or not if you will not show yourself to me?

 

By the way, I saw a lot of Ayn Rand in the thread you recommended I read. Where were you in all that? :-)

 

JD

[Karl]

Karl, I am sincerely trying to get to know you and the how of your existence. Even Ayn Rand gave living examples when she was asked to. If you want to know how it is that I apply my "philosophy," read my post today in Newcomer, on Laziness. And read my post today in New Comer on the topic of Invsible in Martial Arts. Or the post prior to that post on how I address issues without sounding that like I am defending my Ph.D.

 

My Philosophy is just keep it simple, and everything will take care of itself. Be my own person. Follow no one. Take what I want and leave the rest. Do my own thinking. Do the research. Look for definitions to words people use. See life from their point of view. Work on me. Help others. Know that like others, I am becoming and am not done yet. I don't have to defend my existence. And so forth.

 

But getting to know a person, that is a worthwhile journey, regardless of their Philosophical view points. How am I suppose to decide whether I like you or not if you will not show yourself to me?

 

By the way, I saw a lot of Ayn Rand in the thread you recommended I read. Where were you in all that? :-)

 

JD

I havent yet got to ethics and values which is the core, the rest of the work is the preamble where am I ? How do I know it ? The final part is 'What do I do?' So that includes the ethics -reason-independence-productivity-honesty-integrity-justice-pride. Not in any particular sequence and not a complete list. These are my core principles. I simply apply them to every part of life in order to maintain or gain values I desire, then I enjoy the moment or the on going pleasure of those values.

[Jim D.]

O.K. Now we are getting a somewhere...and where that can go is unknown for right now. I will tell you a little about myself. When I was in undergrade, Philosophy was a very strong minor for me. I enjoyed it very much because I understood it. I did so well, that I was invited to be in the National Honors Society of Philosophy because my grades were that good. The professor that I followed through out my four years personally offered me an Assistantship at DePaul University in their Philosophy Department. I said no to this invitation because I wanted to be a psychologist. Daaaaah! There have been times when I think that I should have taken him up on it. But I would have had only two career choices: Teaching or Lawyer. Well as it were, I have had the best of both worlds in that I was an adjunct lecturer for a University and Junior College over a 10 year period, all done part time while I worked for myself and other agencies. I taught everything from Humanities, Social Sciences, Ecology, Criminology to Career Planning and Management. Regarding practicing Law I have done it pro se, and have applied it regarding Business Law when I worked in the buiness sector in Business Management and Supervision.

 

My favorite subject was Philosoph of Law.

 

Well anyway, I have gotten this far in life to know that I want to apply what I have learned practically and Philosophically. It might be a "hodgpoge" of this and that, but I think that it is good to be flexible and intuitive. And, I want to know how others apply their Philosophies as well...because I can use something from their tool box for life, and maybe they can use something from my tool box for life.

 

Philosophy is all well and good. But to ask Philosophical questions only leads to another question, and another, and another, and so on.

But when we talk about application, that is where the meaning begins...at least for me.

 

One of the things I don't like about this site is that I have seen people copy and paste others work. It would be better if the person gave me their understanding and point of view, rather than take the easy way out and copy down something I can read elsewhere. And I am pointing to those that copy and paste other Philosophers work.

 

JD

[Karl]

Thats why I said that it's important to understand the philosophy that is held from the ground up. As you say, people do post chunks of work which supports what they believe and tend neither to critique, nor to fully understand the philosophy they are using. It's also true to say, of course, that philosophy only has meaning in its application. To quote a well known biblical phrase "you will know the tree by its fruits".