Going Vipassana

[Chi Boy]

I finally got accepted into my Vipassana retreat in early August!!! For those of you that don't know what Vipassana is it's basically an ancient Buddhist ritual where you meditate for ten or more hours a day, for ten days straight.

 

I was just wondering if anyone in the forum has done this before or done anything similar so I know what to expect. Btw, I got the idea for this from an old post on Mantak Chia's stuff. The person reccomended this as a way to start a spiritual path.

[9th]

Vipassana is not a ritual - its a type of meditation that focuses on generating insight into the root causes of various personal delusions

[WisteriaWinds]

Congrats! I've noticed all truly awakened people do Vipassana. They either do it formally or informally all day long. Its good you are learning this.

My advice is don't get caught up in all the Ascended Spiritual Masters who attend these things. They are experts at appearances only. Approach things like a mechanic. Focus on what makes the process work, the bare essentials. Otherwise you'll be convinced by these people that you need to attach 90 other BS lifestyle thingamajigs to make it work. Just learn Vipassana and why it works.

[Mandrake]

I finally got accepted into my Vipassana retreat in early August!!! For those of you that don't know what Vipassana is it's basically an ancient Buddhist ritual where you meditate for ten or more hours a day, for ten days straight.

 

I was just wondering if anyone in the forum has done this before or done anything similar so I know what to expect. Btw, I got the idea for this from an old post on Mantak Chia's stuff. The person reccomended this as a way to start a spiritual path.

 

Just note that there is not one Vipassana. Vipassana/Vipashyana is one of the two* main modes of meditation in the Buddhist traditions. Each tradition has its own aim with it (and accompanying theory), and in the tradition there are multiple traditions with their own twist on technique.

 

Thus, Goenka style vipassana is not The Buddhist vipassana; it is one of many flavours found within Buddhism.

 

*technically one can argue there are a couple more modes in esoteric Buddhism.

 

 

Mandrake

[Shad282]

months ago i attended a 10 days vipassana retreat by goenka... it is pure sensational experience physical.. no visualization or anything just body focus and concentration... try to follow the instruction carefully and don't add anything up to the technique and such... try to enjoy it.. i enjoyed it.

 

It is not good to know what to expect because the idea of the retreat is people to stay silent and not share experience.. because some may induce an expected told feeling about what they should feel ..etc.

 

Go there with no expectations or anything.. and follow instruction clearly.. the food may be tough and u might feel hungry.. just make sure not to OVER eat.. thinking you might reduce ur hunger but it will make it worse. 

 

and keep on meditating and never stop. 

 

Good luck!

 

Just note that there is not one Vipassana. Vipassana/Vipashyana is one of the two* main modes of meditation in the Buddhist traditions. Each tradition has its own aim with it (and accompanying theory), and in the tradition there are multiple traditions with their own twist on technique.

 

Thus, Goenka style vipassana is not The Buddhist vipassana; it is one of many flavours found within Buddhism.

 

*technically one can argue there are a couple more modes in esoteric Buddhism.

 

 

Mandrake

What are the other techniques of vipassana ?

[Chi Boy]

I think it'll be a good chance to study my mind and body.

 

Ill let you guys know of my experiences on this thread afterwards.

 

Thanks for the replies everyone

[Mandrake]

 

What are the other techniques of vipassana ?

 

First of all, one has to remember that the Buddhist lineages basically died out in southeast asia. There was a huge revival in the 19th century with the resurge of national identity, and in this time period a lot of experimentation occured in order to get working techniques of vipassana back. During this interval you got techniques such as the Goenka variety, Mahasi Sayadaw etc; in typical Asian fashion many claim that they had hidden access to an ancient lineage, without much evidence of one.

In the Theravada lineages you have the modern varieties such as above, and on the other hand Vipassana styles based on historical commentaries - check out the Pa Auk forest tradition, and the free books by Pa Auk Sayadaw.

 

Roughly speaking regarding Vipassana:

In Theravada/Hinayana the aim is to thoroughly realize the three marks of existence - impermanence, unsatisactoriness, non-self (anicca, dukkha, anatta) - in all parts of one's being.

In Mahayana (where it is called Vipashyana in sanskrit) the aim is to realize Shunyata, which is entirely different.

Realizing the three marks of existence doesn't make one realize Shunyata, but realizing Shunyata automatically entails understanding the three marks of existence. Success in Vipashyana also requires much more strict prerequisites (provess in other modes of meditation and more).

[Mandrake]

I think it'll be a good chance to study my mind and body.

 

Ill let you guys know of my experiences on this thread afterwards.

 

Thanks for the replies everyone

 

It's time well spent (in all my cases).

A tip is to bring both a meditation pillow and a meditation bench (i.e. allow you options for comfort), and to take advantage of standing.

Hope you have a fruitful time!

 

 

Mandrake

[doc benway]

Options for comfort - the best thing you can do to prepare if you do not have a lot of sitting experience.

Enjoy!

[Chi Boy]

It's time well spent (in all my cases).

A tip is to bring both a meditation pillow and a meditation bench (i.e. allow you options for comfort), and to take advantage of standing.

Hope you have a fruitful time!

 

 

Mandrake

So your saying that zhan zhuang can be a part of the Vipassana experience?

[Mandrake]

So your saying that zhan zhuang can be a part of the Vipassana experience?

 

All things will be clear at the retreat ; )

[Jetsun]

I wouldn't mix anything up with the instructions they give you, don't do any extra practices is my advice

[C T]

Just remember to stay real and don't come away from the retreat with a false sense of accomplishment. 

 

Keep the mind open, receptive and supple as best you can.

 

Take any doubts and discomforts that come up as incentives to stay present. 

 

Ten days will tend to seem longer if the mind is not allowed to find its own natural space. 

This being your first experience, chances are you will be rather overly conscious of everything that goes on. 

 

 

Thoughts will seem to magnify themselves in the first 3 - 4 days and nights. 

 

Look into these arising thoughts and find out, again and again if necessary, the essence

or ground from where these thoughts arise. 

 

The more you look, the clearer it will occur to you that that they come from nowhere in particular,

remain nowhere in particular for a very brief time, and then dissipate nowhere in particular. 

 

In time, you will discover that your awareness and control over the quality of your thinking 

will become rather prominent without having to do anything in particular other than the

mere recognition of the ephemeral nature in the coming and passing away of each thought. 

Edited July 10, 2016 by C T

[Chi Boy]

I wouldn't mix anything up with the instructions they give you, don't do any extra practices is my advice

 

 

All things will be clear at the retreat ; )

 

 

Options for comfort - the best thing you can do to prepare if you do not have a lot of sitting experience.

Enjoy!

So this morning I'm sitting at the mechanic shop waiting to get my car done and I typing a few things into google to see if anyone had tips for Vipassana, the ret and ended up reading this  https://forum.culteducation.com/read.php?12,117747,page=1 talking about how the whole Vipassana thing is cult-like and that many people who did it for years don't see it' value. I'm going to my course in a few weeks so I found this alarming. I'm glad a lot of you all have positive outlooks on it. The idea of Vipassana seems great. However, some aspects of Goenka's teaching lead to further questions. Someone on this thread says that he believes in celibacy. which seems accurate because in his 10 day courses, males and females are in separate atmospheres. He also believes that Vipassana is the way to enlightenment. I'm posting something else in gen discussion. Check it if you may.

 

Warmly,

Chi Boy

[doc benway]

It's good to do your research and go into this well informed.

[Mandrake]

So this morning I'm sitting at the mechanic shop waiting to get my car done and I typing a few things into google to see if anyone had tips for Vipassana, the ret and ended up reading this  https://forum.culteducation.com/read.php?12,117747,page=1 talking about how the whole Vipassana thing is cult-like and that many people who did it for years don't see it' value. I'm going to my course in a few weeks so I found this alarming. I'm glad a lot of you all have positive outlooks on it. The idea of Vipassana seems great. However, some aspects of Goenka's teaching lead to further questions. Someone on this thread says that he believes in celibacy. which seems accurate because in his 10 day courses, males and females are in separate atmospheres. He also believes that Vipassana is the way to enlightenment. I'm posting something else in gen discussion. Check it if you may.

 

Warmly,

Chi Boy

 

It is your decision.

However, very few westerners (I don't speak for others) enter conditions that are similar to those in a silent retreat for 10 days. Being alone with yourself  without distractions is terrifying for many. Also, be aware that this is a controlled environment and that it is for your and the others' safety. The retreat holders know that under these parameters the system does what it is intended to do. If participants start to mix and experiment, then there are no sure outcomes, and even some risk. But individualistic westerners dislike being told to follow rules and a regimen, so they immediately get cult-vibes.

 

Second point: people who dislike things are much more prone to go out and announce their experiences. But you will find them everywhere, for every system out there. But we almost never get to question them back: what went wrong? Did this individual misbehave, fulfill the conditions, stick to the instructions etc.?

 

Regarding the teachings: You don't need to believe everything Goenka does (gasp!). He teaches a form of meditation. It has benefits - great for some, good for others, not much for some people. So just do it, and then you can develop from there and follow other meditation traditions if you like (including theory, behaviour, and techniques). You don't need to follow the system for years. Maybe one retreat is enough for you, but you will still learn something. Check out the youtube documentary on vipassana in Indian prisons.

 

The retreat is for  free. You have no obligations to do anything post-retreat at all. People won't turn up at your door nor spy at you. If your fear holds you back, maybe that's where you need to do work.

 

 

Mandrake

[Lao Sun Tao]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WkxSyv5R1sg

[Chi Boy]

https://morespiritualmatters.wordpress.com/2013/08/15/the-10-day-vipassana-retreat-a-warning/

 

I left after the 5th day. That was totally a cult. The only information you are given from any source is that this is an end all be all texhnique for reaching enlightnment and ending "misery" and to free yourself from problems in later lives. Nothing against them, it just isn't how I was raised and so I choose not to believe what they're saying.

 

If you like sitting all day and listen to chanting in another language and watching people walk around staring at their feet then this is for you. Also if like sitting with exruciating back/leg pain, go for it. Cause the instructors have it and sp do the students. From sitting all day everyone experiences the pain. You are taught that it will help you in your journey.

Edited August 9, 2016 by Chi Boy

[rex]

Thanks for sharing and well done for trying it out. I didn't take to the part about eschewing all current spiritual practice. Personally I think there are other ways to develop stoicism then enduring the pain of physical restriction as a training to deal with the harshness of life.

[Miffymog]

I remember I left my first retreat half way through as it wasn't right for me. Then, when I found a meditation style that suited me and I'd been practising it for a while I went on another retreat using that same form of meditation and it was a good experience. So there might be better ones out there for you.

[Lao Sun Tao]

https://morespiritualmatters.wordpress.com/2013/08/15/the-10-day-vipassana-retreat-a-warning/

 

I left after the 5th day. That was totally a cult. The only information you are given from any source is that this is an end all be all texhnique for reaching enlightnment and ending "misery" and to free yourself from problems in later lives. Nothing against them, it just isn't how I was raised and so I choose not to believe what they're saying.

 

If you like sitting all day and listen to chanting in another language and watching people walk around staring at their feet then this is for you. Also if like sitting with exruciating back/leg pain, go for it. Cause the instructors have it and sp do the students. From sitting all day everyone experiences the pain. You are taught that it will help you in your journey.

 

 

 

I don't want to discredit your claims or anything. I have never been to a Vipassana retreat so I can't really say what's going on. But, in my opinion, you gave up too easily. You should have stayed for the whole course and draw your conclusions afterwards. You could survive for five more days, no matter how intolerable you found the place to be. Then, who knows, maybe something would have clicked. 5 days is half the course, which makes half the experience, which isn't an experience really.

 

Someone could say that you couldn't handle your inner struggles and decided to blame everything else. A valid argument, in my opinion. Having said that, let me ask you a question. Let's say that this whole thing really was a cult and they really wanted to brainwash you or whatever. Do you think if you have stayed for 5 more days they would have achieved that?

 

Don't get me wrong; what you've done is something I see myself doing, considering the things you've mentioned, and this is the reason I'm questioning it. However, throwing the word "cult" around is very serious, too serious to just throwing it around so loosely. I have done a lot of research on Vipassana and this is the first time I see this word surrounding it. Perception shapes reality. If you consider that you have to, for 10 days, follow exactly what people instruct you to do and temporally reduce your freedom a cult, then yes Vipassana is a cult, a cult that demands no money and has no initiation, no leader and no followers.

 

And I know it doesn't have all that, not because I know it from personal experience but because it cannot have all that. Vipassana is a meditation technique. If I found an apple merchant intolerable, his teeth ugly, his remarks inappropriate, his attitude disgusting, I wouldn't blame the apples, nor I would tell everyone that apples are shit, or that no matter how delicious and red the apples were it wasn't worth it. What's intolerable to some can be amusing or irrelevant to others.

 

Anyway, my advice: if you don't want to go back there, fine. But you should seriously consider doing the practice whatsoever. The whole course is on youtube. Now that you've seen how things are done you can do it on your own, no problem. As technique Vipassana is simple and powerful. Don't give up on it because of technicalities.

[Jetsun]

I have never been on vipassana retreat but in general meditation retreats aren't fun as they bring up all your defences and puts pressure on the force of unconsciousness within you, so it's hard to know if the voice telling you to leave is a genuine voice of concern or just unconsciousness (Mara) tricking you. It's basically little different than Buddha under the Bodhi tree or Jesus in the Garden of Gethsemene, you may be tempted by power or assaulted by inner attacks and forces.

[Chi Boy]

I remember I left my first retreat half way through as it wasn't right for me. Then, when I found a meditation style that suited me and I'd been practising it for a while I went on another retreat using that same form of meditation and it was a good experience. So there might be better ones out there for you.

What meditation style are you practicing?

[Chi Boy]

I have never been on vipassana retreat but in general meditation retreats aren't fun as they bring up all your defences and puts pressure on the force of unconsciousness within you, so it's hard to know if the voice telling you to leave is a genuine voice of concern or just unconsciousness (Mara) tricking you. It's basically little different than Buddha under the Bodhi tree or Jesus in the Garden of Gethsemene, you may be tempted by power or assaulted by inner attacks and forces.

Yeah idk, I just didnt like what they were trying to make me believe. And I dont know if all that subconscious shit is true just cause someone says this or that.

 

However, meditation does lower brain wave activity so I still want to meditate.

 

I likes the anapana technique I was taught. Does anyone use anapana here?

[Miffymog]

What meditation style are you practicing?

 

The retreat I went on that didn't work was one that concentrated on the Koan, 'What is this?'. I had not been studying this before the retreat and I just didn't take to it.

 

The retreat I went on which was a success was using the Chan method of 'Silent Illumination', where you sit with a bright and clear mind. I had been practising this daily for 6 months before and so not only was I already familiar with it, I knew that I liked it too. During the retreat when I relayed my experiences to the retreat leader, she passed comment that I'd found my meditation technique.

 

I continued it for a few years afterwards but did give up. But it was very useful as I use a similar state of mind while doing my current practice of ZZ .

Edited August 13, 2016 by Miffymog