Independence Day

[Jim D.]

Does anybody know the true story of Independence Day? Look it up...put it in your browser. Then take a look at the words in the Star Spangel Banner.

 

I don't know about you, but I think most American People and kids see it as a day off, and an opportunity to see pretty displays of fireworks, drink a few, get laid, and call it a day...and  wish they could sleep it off Tuesday when they have to go back to work.

 

They might as well put in for a four day week and get some fireworks, brew, food and plan a "nooner" with the whomever every weekend, because that's as much as importance as Americians have placed on this Precious Holiday.

[thelerner]

I don't get too choked up over it.  I'm a proud American, but I realize without Independence, horror of horror's we'd be much like Canada.  Which imo ain't so bad.  Undoubtedly we'd be split into a few pieces- English, French, Spanish, various native tribes, some Americana states.   Perhaps a smattering of other European countries.  We'd definitely lose (never gain) a large chunk to Mexico, maybe even some permanent Russian province since they had a colony in California early on.

 

Europe would have ended slavery here earlier, sparing millions from horrible degradation, as well as lessening Jim Crow laws, that's a helluva big plus.  Probably less rape, theft and massacres of natives, a very good thing.   No civil war, but Europeans may well have brought there own annual wars here. 

 

The Star Spangle Banner, celebrating the war of 1812.  The US's first declaration of war (by congresss) on England which got pissed and burnt down our Capital.  

 

I toast the founders.  Some were good, some were great, all were flawed, full of the prejudices of there time, yet also brave, glimpsing a world without kings.  A democracy with checks and balances, ruled by citizens, at least those males who owned land (surprisingly there was an early state or two where woman could vote).  They produced inspired documents, that would help set the world on a progressive path of democracy and equality.   Ahh, nothing like a shot of Death's Head vodka from a skull shot glass, cept maybe a shot of some other vodka. 

 

Tomorrow we'll watch fireworks and stand to hear the Star Spangled banner, eat and drink and hopefully stand at attention later on that night.  And that's how it should be. 

Edited July 4, 2016 by thelerner

[Aetherous]

I don't get too choked up over it.  I'm a proud American, but I realize without Independence, horror of horror's we'd be much like Canada. 

 

Would Canada be like Canada today if America hadn't gained its independence?

[Jim D.]

The issue is that most Americans seem to care less about the significance of the Fourth of July. What I know about the conflict is that the American flag stayed up because there were guys willing to belly crawl out there and hold it up. That is how it stayed up. The ships that were firing on the flag prided themselves on their accuracy. It pissed them off not to be able to knock it down and keep it down. And all those bodies around the flag!!!!!!

 

Take a look at the lyrics.

 

Isn't that what America stands for...we are tenacious.

Edited July 4, 2016 by Jim D.

[Marblehead]

And I will continue to fight for my independence.

[Marblehead]

 

 

[joeblast]

Can anyone articulate the difference between the arbitrary rule, taxation without representation, and selective application of the law we had just after our independence vs now?

 

I contend that rule under england's throne was perhaps less arbitrary and capricious than what we have today.

 

And its not going to stop until the black flags are hoisted by the populace - Trump will be the best excuse for the bankers to pull the plug on things next to brexit.

[silent thunder]

Never been much for tribal chest thumping.

 

I'm from the Human Tribe.  Tribal distinctions are the foundation for violence.

 

One Race.  One Breath.

[Marblehead]

Can anyone articulate the difference between the arbitrary rule, taxation without representation, and selective application of the law we had just after our independence vs now?

 

I contend that rule under england's throne was perhaps less arbitrary and capricious than what we have today.

 

And its not going to stop until the black flags are hoisted by the populace - Trump will be the best excuse for the bankers to pull the plug on things next to brexit.

I have those feelings but it is happening so stealthily that it is hard to put a finger on it.  And it's not just the federal government but also the states and local governments as well.

 

We no longer have much representation.  It's a pretty recent thing too.  It is part of our (the USA) movement toward fascism.

[silent thunder]

In my mind it started with the establishment of the Military Industrial Complex which was founded on the Federal Reserve.

It's why Kennedy was assassinated and it was promoted most effectively and solidified by the policies of Reagan and his economist pal.

[Marblehead]

In my mind it started with the establishment of the Military Industrial Complex which was founded on the Federal Reserve.

It's why Kennedy was assassinated and it was promoted most effectively and solidified by the policies of Reagan and his economist pal.

Regretfully, that sounds about right.

[liminal_luke]

I believe in looking at ourselves (I´m a US citizen) in a balanced way: the United States is not the very best country in the world and certainly far from the worst.  Like most people in most places, we have things to be proud of as well as things we might have done a whole lot better. There´s a lot of talk about the US being a "great" country, rather than simply a good and fine place to live, all things considered.  I think this is a mistake.

 

Here´s a quote on the concept of "greatness" from one of my favorite books, Compassion and Self-Hate by Theodore Rubin.

 

Why must we strive for greatness?  Why must we zealously guard our pride, feed it and even die for it?  Do pride and greatness make for happiness or an increasing sense of isolation, dehumanization and even paranoia?  Is achieving greatness more self-satisfying than achieving self-acceptance and the ability to enjoy the commonplace?  Does the drive for glory through the actualization of ever-increasing demands for greater perfection and attainment of more and more positions of special privilege make for sustained contribution to the betterment of life?  Is a country great because it is "great," or is it a good place to live because its original premises are basically compassionate ones?  Our culture in a large part feeds the neurotic need for pride positions and so-called greatness.  This is probably its most destructive influence, and ultimately makes for an unreal, illusionary and destructive value system.  It also contributes to emptiness and fragility, and assaults the humility from which real and useful human strength springs. 

Edited July 4, 2016 by liminal_luke

[zerostao]

yet,

here even if ya aint looking for the promised land , ya gonna find it anyway

forget the cost

brought to you by pepsi

celebrate safely if possible

[Jim D.]

OooooooH Yeah!  James Brown. I like the little snippet showing the people on the bus passively sitting there. Don't you feel like that regarding our passivity and our inability to manage our government. What happened to our and we the people?

 

It's easier to sit around and get high, pontificate, and wish things were different.  Because "it doesn't affect me."  You guys are arguing about it, so it affects you some way.

 

Well, you might think and even confront me about what have I done at the grass routes level. Well, I tell you.

 

I've picketed as early as 2000 for better wages for me and others I worked for through Union ASCME.

 

I wrote a County policyand procedure protecting staff and prisoners who were being exposed to inmates that had infectious T.B. who had  infectied others including me.

 

I looked at that County Budget and bought it to the powers that be that they had a seperate bank account that was not being used for the benefit of it citizens. Tax payor's money just sitting there idle.

 

I discovered that our HOA has $700,000 just sitting there in a seperate account...just sitting there because it makes HOA look different than other HOA's. I told the Property Manager to give it back to the residents. That went over like a Lead Baloon.

 

I have described the Property Management staff as having political jobs, and thereby waisting time. Management tells me that they have now have accountability and are tracking the work orders and field staff's time.

 

I did a check for sex offenders in our subdivision...found five...one lives on our block. Brought this to the attention of HOA. They tried to brush it off. I told them I would be only to happy to come to their office, use their computer capababilities and send out a Memo to the 650 residents that live here. They got off their ass and supposedly brought it to the attention of the Board President. I told them that this new information was now on them since they wouldn't let me help them. And if these sex offenders act out, it is on them.

 

I have audited financial records and have discovered improprieties in record keeping and usury. Example: Furiture store running two accounts on the same piece of merchandise. The purchaser was paying the finance company who financed the furniture, and the store had a seperate ledger showing payments made to the store as well. The store was double dipping. Nice!

 

And so forth.

[zerostao]

Jim D,

stick with it.

 

3 founding fathers died on the 4th of july

monroe, jefferson, and adams--not sure if they were high when they went

altho, i'd think they may have been doing some celebrating on that day

 

https://www.yahoo.com/news/three-presidents-die-july-4th-just-coincidence-104209059.html?nhp=1

 

here it has been thunderstorms close and loud today and a good rain too

[Marblehead]

Well, my time is 6:08 pm and the temperature is 101.7 degrees.

[Jim D.]

John Adams in my opinion was the best out of the three. He walked the talk. He was away from his home for years in the name of Jurisprudence. He was for the people and with the people. I doubt that he took drinking lightly.

[zerostao]

[joeblast]

[Marblehead]

Well, that's the way losers normally look at things.  They consider the winner's favorable attributes to be faults.

[Junko]

American continent is very old. But American history and culture are young.

[silent thunder]

If you study the history and the alternative histories.  There's not that much to be proud of in this or any country.

America was founded on the enslavement of one race and the genocide of another, as were most.

 

I'm wondering if there were a country ever founded not on bloodshed and slavery... hmm,

[Jim D.]

War has always been the way of these United States. War has always been a part of mankind.

[Aetherous]

America was founded on the enslavement of one race and the genocide of another, as were most.

 

That's one way of looking at things. I definitely do not view the founding of the US to be directly related to black slavery and Native American genocide, but everyone chooses their perception.

[Jim D.]

Well who lived here before the Colonist came over. And who brought the Slaves over and in the process killed 10M. Where did the Indians end up...on Reservations. Who gave they blankets with small pocks...the U.S. Army. Who stuffed 600 Africans in the bow of a ship, chained to the next guy leaving them to lay with their legs pulled up in a fetal position...laying in their urine and fecal material. Who cut their nails so that they would not scratch the next guy in rage and delirium so as not to damage their property. BTW, what about the dead bodies that were not removed. Who was responsible...the Slave Traders.

 

Do the research!