I want to start practicing Tao, but there are some problems...

[beginner16]

[jan1107]

Hi!

 

Do not make yourselve crazy. Start with one method and make your experiences in it. There are "wrongs" and "rights" about lots of methods. We all want to find the perfect teachers. But are we the perfect students?

You do not have to practice a technique all your life. Go deep into one thing and it will flower for you.

You will know the time to move on.

 

In my opinion the best results comes from praciticing regularely. The person itself is more important than the technique. But then again - good technique doesnt bother either.

 

In the end - in my opinion - real dedication is the key to succes. There are "bad" teachers who have "good "students.

 

People who tell "bad" things about certain teachers at least went there and found out. That is one step.

 

On the other hand: people also tend to blame teachers for their lack of succes. It is easy to blame someone else because then you do not have to change yourselve.

 

If you practice an "easy" thing like meditating with the Dantian for a couple of hours a day for sure you will have stunning results.

 

Good luck on your path!

 

Jan.

Edited November 26, 2007 by jan1107

[Procurator]

Hello

 

I would really need some advice on how or even if I should start practicing Tao

You should start practicing Tao by asking himself and honestly answering a question:

 

How much am I able to pay for this?

 

 

 

You get what you pay for.

[VeeCee]

You should start practicing Tao by asking himself and honestly answering a question:

 

How much am I able to pay for this?

You get what you pay for.

 

Huh? I don't think that dollars spent necessarily equates with the quality of teaching. This is something that has been kicked around on this forum before. There are lots of students on this site with lots of teachers - some cost more, some cost less.

 

 

Do not make yourselve crazy. Start with one method and make your experiences in it. There are "wrongs" and "rights" about lots of methods. We all want to find the perfect teachers. But are we the perfect students?

You do not have to practice a technique all your life. Go deep into one thing and it will flower for you.

You will know the time to move on.

 

Agreed.

[Procurator]

some cost more, some cost less.

all blind, all leading the blind.

[VeeCee]

all blind, all leading the blind.

 

In the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is king. Whatever that means.

[sunshine]

You are young. No need to hurry. Take your time to read through the forum. You will find lots of information on different teachers, you will find pros and cons for one and for the other. Take one teacher and you can BET that you will find students that are delighted, former students that felt misleaded no students at all and still judging, complaining etc. etc. etc.

 

Before you judge a person by what others say meet them and see for yourself. The question of which path is a proper one is a pretty difficult one to answer. If there is any true answer at all. I personally believe you need a proper master with a proper lineage behind him to truly move forward... others will chime in and say that you just have to look inside yourself and all is there.

 

You will get so many different views, opnions, vows etc. that at the end of the day you are more confused than you are now.

 

Again. Read through the forum, take your time, and at some place you will feel something resonating for you and you are much more interested in this than the other stuff. Go for it. Find out what has for you... if upon seeing or doing it does not resonate with you any longer look further... most of us have been searching for many many years and we are not all following the same today...

 

 

Harry

[Eric23]

When you say you want to start practicing Tao, what do you mean? I know that there could be a language translation issue, please forgive me. Taoist studies can mean many things to all people. Do you wish to study the writings of LaoTzu, do you want to begin qi gong or tai chi? Do you want to learn alchemy? There are many paths a person can take to learning about the Tao. Take some time and read through the posts here and see just how varied this practice can be. Once you have an idea of what is available, your decision will be easier.

[doc benway]

[nightwatchdog]

Step one: Go take a few classes with the only two options open to you. A bit of something is better than a lot of nothing. Try out both teachers, stay with the one you like. If you like neither, than stay with the yoga.

 

Second step: Understand right now that any legitimate teacher is going to ask you to push yourself. Proper chi kung will open that nostril. Yoga will open that nostril. None of what you hope to do will allow you to avoid deep breathing. Get over your reluctance to work on breathing and do what your teacher tells you to do.

 

Lastly: If what you are getting out of this forum is that Kumar Frantzis and Mantak Chia are rubbish, I suggest your first step be to avoid this forum completly and totally after reading this post. The critisizm you are absorbing is from people who have an agenda. Thier agenda is not your agenda. Stop reading, and start practicing.

 

You will make mistakes. You will learn from some of them. You will probably give up. You can always start again.

[Guest sykkelpump]

I suggest you start here: http://springforestqigong.com/

[arnquist]

I think "pop tao" if often just as valid as the more esoteric stuff, don't automatically dismiss it just because it's new or popular. As for the second teacher, the tao has a lot to do with the proper use of power, perhaps that's why he uses martial arts. And perhaps he seems like a jerk simply because he demands a lot of his students.

 

I'm just playing the devil's advocate here, I don't know what these teachers are really like, I'm just encouraging you to keep an open mind and find out for yourself.

[jan1107]

Yes - in some ways I would be willing to argue that "true tao" can ONLY be self taught. Teachers and methods are valuable in putting your foot on the path and steering you in the right direction. At some point you must abandon method and teacher and find the truth within yourself. That is not something anyone can do for you. Like the description of Zen as being the finger pointing at the moon. If you're too focused on the finger....

 

You are very right. I totally agree right now.

After all there has been quite a path for me to say that.

 

I just thought that after reading the post of Sunshine a "beginner" has to start at some point.

 

Maybe some people already on this path for a while come to the point of studying "alone" for a while and have great results in it. At least that is what counts for me right now.

 

I believe it is good to have some tools to adapt to that changes. And for a beginner (as the starter of this threath calls himself) it may be good to do what Sunshine suggested. Finding someone resonating with you.

 

Namaste,

 

jan.

[rain]

http://wholehealthclinic.com/index.php?opt...4&Itemid=38

 

 

breathing properly is fundamental

 

good luck

[doc benway]

You are very right. I totally agree right now.

After all there has been quite a path for me to say that.

 

I just thought that after reading the post of Sunshine a "beginner" has to start at some point.

 

Maybe some people already on this path for a while come to the point of studying "alone" for a while and have great results in it. At least that is what counts for me right now.

 

I believe it is good to have some tools to adapt to that changes. And for a beginner (as the starter of this threath calls himself) it may be good to do what Sunshine suggested. Finding someone resonating with you.

 

Namaste,

 

jan.

I totally agree -- perhaps there are those out there who can wake up without a teacher or method from the very begining (someone had to) but most of us need guidance of some sort in the begining - I sure did. Much of my guidance came from books, some from teachers, most from practice. At some point, however, I think it's critical to recognize the trap - that whatever method one is using or whatever teacher one is following simply reinforces the sense of individuality that we are trying to lose... there is really no exception to that. To follow a method or a teacher, someone needs to be following and someone needs to be followed. The funny thing is - they are one and the same - both are an illusion, so it has to go away.... at that point, the only teacher can be the Self (in the Vedanta sense)

[Fire Dragon]

Hello

test some problems

[Bum Grasshopper]

I had a similar problem with my breathing. The doctor said it was polyps in my nasal canal and the only way to get rid of them was surgery.

 

I don't know exactly when it happened, but my nasal passage is now clear, so hang in there and do the best you can with what you've got.

[joeblast]

Train the breath enough so that it is calm, soft, slender, yet full...and you will have no turbulence to deal with

[Fire Dragon]

Sorry did have problems with my last post.

 

Hello

 

I have practised the Universal tao system for 7 years and my recomendation is to start with this. As I know from my own experience you will at least have the possibility to learn wery good exercises for at least 5 years. And as I belive if you want to the rest of your life.

 

I have also done kundalini yoga for about 2 years and hatha yoga four many years buth without instructions.

And a litle from two other taoists paths.

 

I see Matak Chia as a wery sincere teacher. Hes books is greate and realy explains alot about qigong and higher practises. Some of the books are popular but the most of them are serious but perhaps to detailed.

 

My advise is. Start with the teacher that teach Matak Chias system. As I see it the critisism is not true at least not on the levels I have reached which still is about the basics. If the teacher isn't good try to find another in europe. You can go to the site forum/healingdao.com/practise and ask Michael Winn for good teachers in Europe. There are some in Germany and Spain and perhaps closer to you also. If you want to try for yourself without a teacher I recomend the book by Yudelove "100 days to better healt, good sex and long life" to start with. You can do one weeks exercise in a mounth instead so you get them well intergrated. If any problems with the exersises visit the page I recomended you or ask questions here.

 

Mantak Chia also recomend that you ad some yang exercises to his system. It could be the martial art exercises with the guy you mentioned. I have the same problem as you did write about with my Karate that I have newly started. But the exercises are greate and if you also have the more deeper stuf from Mantak Chia you have something real good. Don't stay with the things not working or feeling bad. Also ad some ohter aerobic exercises or weight lifting or some other good western exercises to reach maximum effect of the tao.

 

Continue with the breathing exercises from the yoga if it not is uncomfortable. Do it daily for about three months and if nothing happens ask the yoga teachers why not. Let them come up with new sugestions and try them wery sincerely. Make this a test if the system works for you. If it not does stop it and hang in to the other two. If it works when you have tried several of their sugestions keep on training with this guys. It was good for you! The breathing is something you have to deel with soner or later.

 

Let the tao form your solution for you. Stay with the paths that works for you in the moment. Let your exercises be like an arrow not stopping for anything untill it has reach your goal. And another thing start doing the exercises a litle each day. Not bother if you miss some day just start it again the next day. Perhaps 5 minutes each day to start with and if this feels greate increase after a while to 10 minutes and so on. Shoose the exercises you like the most from the beginning. Or the ones you feel most energy with. Or the ones you thing is good for you.

 

Ask the people saying Mantak Chia is bad. Which theire own experiences is with his teaching. If they have done anything and find it bad. Ask a quesion about it on the page I recomended you. Be curious find out for yourself and learn from books and peoples. See what is real with your own experiences.

 

Sincerely S D

[tumoessence]

Hi,

 

I would check out ayp If the title yoga turns you off put some taiji and baguas on your wall as you practice, because in many ways this approach could just as well be taoist. The lessons are free, and nothing is held back. You can tell from the beginning what practices you could take up as you progress. I would add to that some taiji chuan practice. One suggestion is classical tai chi

Bill

[beginner16]

[thelerner]

My advice would be forget Best. Find a practice that is good and resonates with you. Marry it, do it faithfully for a year or two. From that vantage point see where your next step lies. From what I've seen here over the years, the sincerity of the practitioner-how they incorporate the system into there whole life- has more to do with results then the particular practice.

 

 

Yours

 

Michael

 

 

I'm old and blind enough to say Forget the 'more money equal more tao' thinking. Ultimately we must throw away the books, videos, seminars and other's opinions and just practice, practice, practice.

 

When you get off your computer and commit. You're on your path. Don't know if it will be THE PATH, but even if its just sitting quietly you'll be moving along

[宁]

my 2 cents:

 

studying anything does not resemble being in a supermarket and searching for the best and cheap product

 

once you understand that correctly, the path is open

 

listen, all the practice and evolution is a process of developing a relationship between you and God, or the Heavens

 

you need not convince or be convinced by a man

 

your relationship is with the Life itself

 

That means what?

 

That you will be pointed a good path and a good teacher by Life itself

 

You need not convince a man to be teached, you need to convince Life itself, that you can be valuable enough for the Heavens to invest in you

 

the only language Heavens listen to is that of: good mind, good heart, good chi, good action

 

good luck

[Fire Dragon]

Hello

 

Ohh I don't know if it is dangerous. I have heard the opposite also. People saying the best thing is to use both the yoga (Indian) and the tao. But perhaps this was about sexual practises I''m not shore. Anyway in the tao system you not leave so much energy in the head. You take it back into the centre where is it safe and not dangerous. You work with grournding alot whick is a path starting from the physical and when the physical is prepered you ad some spititual exercises with huge energy. If the body is prepered you don't risk side efects like being mad or something. It's slower but safer.

 

Yoga as I see it on the other hand is more direct to the spiritual. Up to heaven. Save more energy in the head. Look at how your inner picture of a developed yogi looks like. Then compare with your inner picture of a well developed tao master. For instance a tai chi master or some other tao master looks like. Do you feel the difference? Perhaps this tells you something. Think about it and feel what you believe is your path. Then try it and see if you like it.

 

If you do both you learn to have more energy in the head and also have a safty to put it in the centre and make it safe and use both dependent of what you want and what you need. It could be to much to learn two system at once in the beginning though. One aproach from mantak Chia and other taoists is that they use the things that works, they are not always keeping into just one system. The systems is always alive and is always developing. It is not to follow some old or perhaps dead master and follow his practise and advises wihtout the ability to change things. You change if you find somthing that works better for you. This is of course nothing for the beginner. First learn the methods your teachers teach when developed in it you might change some litle part in the beginning.

 

I happy to hear you will try the Mantak Chia guy. What I ment by the chat sides was not that you should be without a teacher. No a good teacher is fundamental. But it also a wise decision as some told you here not to go for the best. Go for the good that is availabla at the moment. The universe will let the rigth path evolve rigth in front of you. . From moment to moment. I meant the chat side as a complement. Perhaps you got an advise from your teacher and you can check that advise and compare it with what the people tell you on the chat side also.

 

Perhaps if you find the article on the dangers to mix the practises you can put it here on tao bums and people we can see what it is and then you/we will have more knowledge on this.

 

 

Best wishes F D

[Fire Dragon]

And some more

 

The best way not to be like the self developed healers is to develop your grounding! This will be emphasised in the Mantak Chia system! From the beginning.

 

It's ok to start with M.C by yourself I guess. This was the way I started the practise. From Mantak Chias first book "awaken heling energy of the tao" i think that was the name. But you are better of to start from Yudeloves book as I told you before. It's a more holistic aproach and you can do several things parallell. The M.C is in it also. It will just take longer but you will learn alot of stuf during the way. Another possibility is to do bouth of course. If doing the M.C from a book be careful and read all the warnings and added information before starting it. Then you have alot of safty.

 

Which book is it you wanted to work from by the way?

 

Another thing is. If you start the UT=Universal Tao (Mantak Chia) then you have a greate system emphasising direct contact with the energy. This is a bit more difficult for men than for woman. But with diligent practise even the men developes. When you have done this regularly for a year you will have a much better sence of the enerys. Then it is easier for you to know by your own experience what is good and what is bad for you. Your feeling upon people things around you and theire energy increases. Your intuition about bad and good thing increases. This is one of the main benefits from this type of practises. You will be qucker on knowing what is the right path for you in all aspects in your life and can decide what to do better. Think about what this could mean in a mans life!

 

Sincerely S D