I would like to delete my account

[Aetherous]

I invite you to quote the parts in my post where I...

 

I claimed that you said the following (I was paraphrasing you)...

 

"If your practice is real, you can demonstrate that you have qi...I can do that of course, so you should believe me when I say that all practices in the West are fake...but demonstrating would waste my qi, so I don't want to. But believe me." 

 

Here is where I got that impression...

 

Anyone who disagrees with this statement, please ask yourself the following question.

 

Can I demonstrate that I have qi in any way that is beyond explanation? Something concrete, that cannot be explained away as placebo, or requires the person you show to be sensitive enough to feel it.

 

Also, we as a species don't understand the power of the mind yet, healing someone, or alleviating pain through focusing on an injured area doesn't mean you have qi, it means we have minds that are incredible and the full capability is not even close to being understood. 

 

If you can't, then you must consider that maybe you don't have qi, and if you don't have qi, then you don't have a dantian, and if you don't have a dantian, then you haven't opened the MCO. There is really a sequence that needs to be followed.

 

 

Now, the making little shreds of paper fly around. This is something that concretely proves to the person who has been training that he has in fact refined qi. He has a control over qi and can affect a physical object with it. The goal surely has never been to do this, but it's a wonderful way to know you have actually done what you are intended to do. Refine qi and gain control over it.

 

There is no way that placebo, sheer force of will or blind belief can make those papers fly around without you having qi. The same goes for emitting qi that feels electrical, or being able to light something on fire with your qi.

 

It's never about those "pointless" acts. It's about having the ability to confirm that you have achieved your goal of refining jing into qi. 

 

 

This is part of the problem, too many people have too much to lose by admitting that having qi also leads to being able to demonstrate that they have qi. 

 

 

In those three quotes, it's clear that you're saying basically "if your practice is real, you can demonstrate that you have qi."

 

Besides your apparent confidence in the system of training that you adhere to, stating it as if you know it as a fact that it's the one true way, as a result of personal experience (because you became able to "demonstrate qi" to yourself in an objective way) you also say that you're able to here:

 

I will share some videos in time. 

 

Once you have qi, and control over qi, you could do a myriad of demonstrations, in different forms. 

 

 

Oh really. So when I paraphrase you as saying basically, "I can do that of course", it's accurate.

 

I hope my reasoning and posts are enough to make some rethink what we are taught in the west.  For now, I just want to share my limited knowledge and in so doing try to help some people.

 

 

...no easy task however, despite what we are told in the west.

 

 

I didn't actually ever say anyone's practice is incorrect. I said a step is missing.

 

 

So in other words, incorrect.

 

I have met more than one teacher from more than one lineage who can demonstrate that they have qi. All the schools and teachers who can demonstrate have the foundation practice in their system that is missing from the west

 

 

...an important part is missing from from most systems...

 

I think those quotes are adequate to express your view that "all practices in the West are fake". Fake meaning incomplete and won't lead to the results you think are a sign of attainment.

 

If you think this statement is misrepresenting you, especially the "all practices" part, please name a teacher in the West that has what you consider to be a legitimate (complete and in the correct sequence) method of training.

 

...see?

 

All demonstrations are pointless. There is no value in making bits of paper flying around or pulling/pushing boxes 

 

 

Demonstrations are always a byproduct of training and never the goal surely. Once you have qi, and control over qi, you could do a myriad of demonstrations, in different forms. Why you would want to is a different question all together. Once you have had confirmation that you are in fact on the right path, wasting you qi to demonstrate becomes a burden. 

 

 

There is no importance on being able to use your qi in this way. The importance lies with the fact that you have qi. 

 

 

These demonstrations are confirmations that you are on the right track. They serve no other purpose really. Learning to effective bring qi up and use is vitally important too. So you could say these demonstrations are practicing the process over and over. 

 

 

I also have not once mentioned anyone should come forward and demonstrate anything. I am highly respectful of teachers, and would not demand anything from anyone.

 

 

Truthfully though, I am not really up for sharing videos at this point in my life. I hope my reasoning and posts are enough to make some rethink what we are taught in the west.

 

 

As far as me posting videos, would you post videos on youtube of yourself.

 

 

If I had some kind of decent demonstration to show, yes. However, qi is 98% invisible and intangible. It doesn't move boxes, make shreds of paper fly around as if there were a breeze, light things on fire, etc. That's not how qi works. And a forum member here wore a mask when posting videos before. It's not a big deal to post a video. I actually did post a video of myself doing spontaneous qigong here once years ago...it looked really stupid.

 

I don't want my face known on the internet. I am sure for some it would be wonderful to be able to post some videos doing something others can't. I just have no desire to do this. 

 

I think those quotes are all adequate to show that you are basically saying "demonstrating would waste my qi" (or any other excuse, such as not wanting your face to be known, or not having the desire).

 

I have not misrepresented or misunderstood you.

[小梦想]

.

Edited August 10, 2018 by 小梦想

[Karl]

Whether you see these as positive or not depends on your agenda.

https://youtu.be/mxD-5z_xHBU

https://youtu.be/4ecWDo-HpbE

Funny how Star Trek eventually cottoned on to the power of the collective cyborg consciousness and went all Borg. Instead of messing around with multi coloured aliens all you really need is to strap some mechanicals onto the human body and connect to a 'hive mind'. Funny also, that it is the BBC that makes horror out of the idea of a collective consciousness when it's a very socialist broadcaster. I suppose it's because they believe that it isn't the collective consciousness that's bad, just the loss of emotional steering. Loss of emotion trumps loss of freedom.

[cheya]

I was only referencing his own posts in this thread. He said those things.

 

 

Aetherous, he did not say "those things." 

That was your paraphrasing of what you think he said.

 

I heard it differently.

 

Very interesting that a couple people allowed his posts to push their buttons, while others seem to have read his words differently and to be perfectly fine with their interpretation of what he said!

 

Hope you can shake it off and have a nice day!

[Karl]

De ja vu ......the TB matrix changed something.

[dawei]

Would you please tell me how to multi quote though?

 

Seems something changed and this problem was mentioned here.

 

http://www.thedaobums.com/topic/41262-tdb-upgrade-testing-is-happening/

 

Two ways to manually do it:

1. After the first quote, manually create subsequent quotes 

[quote]
put quoted text here
[/quote]

2. Click the same post several times and it will create a new quote each time but then you have to manually clean up each quote.

 

Hopefully the next version goes back to being nice about this.

[Jim D.]

Finally, an adm. answer. We might be getting somewhere. Looks like we are heading back to the question, "how can I delet my account."

[Jonesboy]

We don't really delete accounts... you can either just not come back or we can 'ban' it.

 

I'd prefer that you just take some time and decide when and/or if to come back.  

First page of the thread.

[Aetherous]

Aetherous, he did not say "those things." 

That was your paraphrasing of what you think he said.

 

My paraphrasing was accurate as I demonstrated above.

 

You seem to think that I'm angry at this person...please reread my posts and look for the good. It's there. I am interested in learning more about what he has to say or show. The communication gap is due to people's perceptions here...actual reality is outside of these perceptions.

[Aetherous]

If I think back to how  i was say 5 years ago, then I would have completely agreed with you. 

 

The system that I practice is not that different from many systems practiced in the west. There is just a small something added to it. I wanted to share that this step is profoundly important to those who cared to know. If you don't care to know, or don't believe me, then move on. This is a forum, you can take what I say, or you can leave it.

 

I've told you already two or three times now that I'm actually interested in what you have to say. I do care...but it is just for the sake of knowledge. I have my dedicated practice which I'm happy with.

 

I can and have demonstrated to myself that I have qi. I have perfect confidence in the my practice.

 

Since you've attempted to challenge me a few times now...same here.

 

I did not demand anyone else demonstrate anything to me. I asked whether they can demonstrate to themselves.

 

I suppose if that's truly all you were saying, it's a good question to ask - is my practice bearing fruit? Nothing wrong with that. I think everyone does it already.

 

This does not mean I have any desire whatsoever to post anything online. If you don't believe me, that is perfectly fine. 

I do believe that you are not wanting to post a video of a demonstration.

 

I think you should take the time to find out what fake means. There is a huge difference between pointing out that a part of the process is missing, and calling a system fake. If you cannot see the difference, then I am afraid there is little I can do to help. It is no ones fault that the system they learned and now teach is missing something. They do not deliberately withhold this part, nor do they misrepresent the system they teach. It is just how it is, nothing to do with being fake.

 

It's not fake, it just doesn't produce results and something is entirely missing. Okay.

 

I do like how you are a expert on qi though. You now all of a sudden know what qi is, and the qualities that qi possesses.

 

Yes, all of a sudden. I've only been at this for years. I was practicing lower dantian methods in 2008, and in 2011 have moved on to something that's not even Daoist or deals with the dantian. I've now studied Chinese medicine for 2 years, after self studying pretty intensely for 1. I think that's enough time to have become aware of qi and be able to define it to some extent.

 

You are writing your opinions on this forum with the experience you have. You do not intend to cheat or lie to people in any way. This is just your experience of qi. The information you give, is done so with no ill intent. Your information is not entirely accurate, but doesn't mean that it is fake. It is just all you know.

 

I agree entirely with what you've said...that's why I keep saying I'm interested in learning more from you. I'm not closed off to the idea of having incomplete knowledge...I'm fully aware of how little I know in comparison to how much there is to know.

 

That being said...I'm not too quick to blindly believe in myths and parlor tricks. Basically I'd only believe it when I'm personally able to do it.

 

This has been fun, but I believe 10 pages has been long enough for this discussion to go on. You clearly do not agree with me, and this is ok. We do not have to agree about everything. You think the systems in the west teach people all the required information, then so be it. Enjoy your practice. The main thing about practice is that the person doing it, gets out of the practice what they really want. More than this you can't really ask for can you.

 

Yes, everyone is responsible for their path.

 

Anyway, if you're saying this enough I'll leave you with this. In my view, I challenged you after you challenged others and claimed to be able to do things that very few can. I did this for multiple reasons at once, one of them being an interest in what you were saying here. Please don't walk away from this thinking you just angered some blockhead...that is not what happened. There is a chance for you to share what you have to share with this community, and help people...I am not hindering you in your quest here...actually the opposite. So - peace.

[Jim D.]

All right all ready!!!!!  Ban the this account. It's driving me crazy not to know where the buss let's me off.

[Marblehead]

All right all ready!!!!!  Ban the this account. It's driving me crazy not to know where the buss let's me off.

 

The bus will let you off whenever you stand up, wait for the bus to stop, and when the doors open you walk off the bus.

 

The DaoBums policy is that accounts are not deleted.  That's just the way life is.  Options are:  Suspension, banning, or just stop posting.

[Brian]

Yeah... I have him the instructions to effectively fulfill his stated objective on page one.

 

<shrug>

 

Personally, I welcome him to stay as long as he wishes and post as much or as little has he'd like.

[Aetherous]

Options are:  Suspension, banning, or just stop posting.

Once a bum, always a bum.

[liminal_luke]

Once a bum, always a bum.

 

What a bummer.

[lessdaomorebum]

If lesstaomorebum was on the fence about his participation here before now, reading this thread through should cinch the decision. 

 

I want to delete

[lessdaomorebum]

Regarding the debate of the last few pages, there are lots of bogus systems in China, and some genuinely intact lineages in the West, but those sorts are less likely to advertise, generally speaking. Not everyone wants a "following". Some teachers just want a few good students who really appreciate the art they are learning. Just like if a friend makes you a delicious meal; that doesn't mean they want to be a chef at a famous restaurant.

Edited August 11, 2016 by lessdaomorebum

[liminal_luke]

I want to delete

 

Unfortunately, lessdaomorebum, deletion doesn´t seem to be an option.  You could, of course, simply choose to stop posting, but even that -- as you may have noticed -- is harder than it looks. 

[lessdaomorebum]

Unfortunately, lessdaomorebum, deletion doesn´t seem to be an option.  You could, of course, simply choose to stop posting, but even that -- as you may have noticed -- is harder than it looks. 

I could stop going to a particular bank, but I would close out the account.

[liminal_luke]

Quickest approach is to go into your Profile, select Notifications, and clear the checkboxes.

[lessdaomorebum]

 

Quickest approach is to go into your Profile, select Notifications, and clear the checkboxes.

 

I know all that.

[Jim D.]

I know all that.

 

Sooooooooo! What are you waiting for!  More begging! O.K. Please, please, pretty please stay with us. How's that? Doesn't make it any better does it? You are just not ready to go, are you. I was at one time in an all female support group. Two of the senior members harrassed me. I told them I will leave when I choose to leave. You are not going to run me off. So, I stayed until I was ready to go. That was about two months later.

[silent thunder]

well

I'm thoroughly bummed

my son is currently gummed

my wife has an amazing bum

 

and.... if you don't like the bums

i'd say 'good on ya mate! you appear suffer from some seriously awesome first world problems that are solvable with less than a click!'

[Nungali]

Sooooooooo! What are you waiting for!  More begging! O.K. Please, please, pretty please stay with us. How's that? Doesn't make it any better does it? You are just not ready to go, are you. I was at one time in an all female support group. Two of the senior members harrassed me. I told them I will leave when I choose to leave. You are not going to run me off. So, I stayed until I was ready to go. That was about two months later.

 

 

 

[Nungali]

" Just do it then , 'baby' ! "