Edward M Posted August 22, 2016 Locate your centre, your self that is your spirit that operates through your nervous system/spinal cord and work from there. Gain back control. You as Spirit must take control of your body, don't let your body control you. When you operate from spirit, when you are yourself, your breath will change. This is your real breath. Not the other breath. Don't trust ANYONE that says they can enlighten or empower you. You are spirit. Triumph over the control by others whether human, or subtle beings or through any other means and regain your freewill. Stay away from societies, orders, esoteric schools etc Freedom is the only truth and contains all other truths within it. Peace 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Junko Posted August 22, 2016 It could mean 'you are ghost'...? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RiverSnake Posted August 22, 2016 You are spirit. So is everyone else. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
beingnature Posted August 22, 2016 The great manitou. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Edward M Posted August 23, 2016 Think i over reacted a bit to something when i wrote the op. Was just a certain society gave some kind of attunement without my permission after enquiring about a workshop they were running. Just for the record, i'm not claiming i reside in Spirit or anything like that... so take what you will from my the original post.. Apologies for the twattery! Peace Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted August 23, 2016 (edited) Hi Edward, Yeah, I read your OP right after you posted it but decided to stay out of it. But now, after this last post I feel comfortable responding. You use the word "spirit" differently than I do as I equate "spirit" with "Chi" (energy). I actually agree with your OP except from a different perspective. Yes, our spirit is closer to Tao than is any other aspect of what we are. I know, that likely sounded strange coming from a materialist. Hehehe. And I do like the way you linked "spirit" with freedom and free will. Nicely done although it could have been done more poetically. (But then you were fired up when making your OP.) This can still be a very interesting thread and even helpful for some. Edited August 23, 2016 by Marblehead 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Edward M Posted August 23, 2016 Hi Marblehead, Well, isn't everything energy/chi, just at different frequencies and densities? Someone once said to me that energy is awareness and awareness is energy. With the freedom part, where i was coming from was if spirit is the core of who we are, it is where the impulse to do something comes from, then the more free will we have the more we would be able to control our physical bodies, so i'm reminded of yogi's controlling their vital functions with their will. I wont go into details, but a decade ago things happened that took away some of my free will, i used to be able to raise each eyebrow individualy and had full control over my whole scalp. Now i can't raise either individually, and both together is not much movement, so i'm unable to fully express myself since then, which to me feels like i'm trapped in this body in this plane of existence. This isn't strictly the case as the spirit is multi dimensional though. You might not agree with that, being a materialist, but at least you know where i'm coming from. Also one interesting point about the expression thing is it also cut off some of the higher emotions, and this means i'm less able to tune into higher frequencies, which i fear means i'll attract lower vibration events etc maybe even rebirths. So, my freedom to cultivate towards a good rebirth or indeed freedom from rebirth has been significantly impaired by the events/beings involved back then. Hope this turns into an interesting thread. Peace Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Edward M Posted August 23, 2016 Just a thought, the difference between humans and animals, could well be just our ability to express ourselves as spirit through a physical body. So we go up in degrees of free will each time we go from one birth to another, until finally we attain complete freedom as pure spirit once more. Just an idea! Peace Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kar3n Posted August 23, 2016 Just a thought, the difference between humans and animals, could well be just our ability to express ourselves as spirit through a physical body. So we go up in degrees of free will each time we go from one birth to another, until finally we attain complete freedom as pure spirit once more. Just an idea! Peace And thumbs 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Edward M Posted August 23, 2016 Haha yeah i see your point however on the other hand (no pun intended) it's said pure spirit can shape-shift into different beings with different ways of expressing themselves. So thumbs are another avenue for expression of spirit. Peace 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kar3n Posted August 23, 2016 I believe we are ever-evolving, so I would agree, we do become closer to spirit with every birth, but only if we are paying attention. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted August 23, 2016 Great! We are getting some posts with substance. I don't hold to the concept of rebirth so I won't speak to that. But I will speak a little more to the concept of spirit from a modified Taoist perspective. Yes Edward, everything is energy therefore everything is Chi. I distinguish between between Universal Chi and Personal Chi (life force) though. And there is interaction between our Personal Chi and Universal. Each also can alter the other. The only way I can speak to the concept of spirit is through the concept of Personal Chi. (Our soul is our subconscious mind.) Our spirit is closer to Tao than is any other aspect of what we are is. Therefore I can agree with you that spirit is the core of all that we are. And it is our spirit that others are least capable of controlling (as long as we resist). Spirit will establish what our moral values are and these will in turn establish how we relate, physically, with words, and with thoughts with our external world. And our spirit is the best capable of attaining a state of freedom and free will. The rest of what we are is subject to input from our senses and our interactions with others. So considering this I must say that spirit is the most important aspect of our totality. If we allow our spirit to be One with Tao we can form the rest of what we are toward a state of inner peace and contentment. We all have had our problems in life so don't be thinking that you were picked out to be fucked with. And likewise, we all have created some of our own problems in life for whatever the reason. All part of being a human. Other animals don't have many of these kinds of problems. I agree that we are ever evolving (or devolving). Constant change. That's life. And with our spirit to guide us we can most times find a peaceful place to go with our spirit even though the rest of what we are might be in turmoil. We should never allow others or the problems we have in daily life to effect the state of our spirit. It is the one thing that is totally ours. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Edward M Posted August 23, 2016 Hi Marblehead, Just a quick one, i'll be back later.... when you say sub conscious mind, how do you see this, apart from being outside of our awareness? is it like a bank of automations, or is it more like the dream world, where we become aware in our dreams, the flip side of everyday waking awareness? If it's the flip side, where is it? does it reside in the brain tissue as a function, or is it another plane of awareness? If another plane of awareness, where is this plane? Are you this plane, or are you in this plane? Like i said just a quick one, i'll check back later... of course i'm guessing your answers on each question... so will be intersting to see what you say.. peace Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kar3n Posted August 23, 2016 Spirit inherently knows Tao, so I would say that free-will (desire) has less to do with spirit or Chi/energy. I am of the thought process that it is the conscious mind that exercises free-will to practice, acknowledge and be in-tune with spirit. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Edward M Posted August 23, 2016 still here, ok thanks for that Karen, when i say free will, i mean the will of the spirit, so spirit willing action through the medium of the body, rather than the body or desire nature etc willing the action. the spirit is truth, and will act in truth/do the right thing... so i'd say living in wu wei is when spirit has a direct avenue of action from where it is into this physical world, through the body. and for that to happen , the flesh the body must give up its will. ok peace out 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted August 23, 2016 Damn! Edward, those are excellent questions. I hope I con express myself well in attempting to respond. Hi Marblehead, Just a quick one, i'll be back later.... when you say sub conscious mind, how do you see this, apart from being outside of our awareness? is it like a bank of automations, or is it more like the dream world, where we become aware in our dreams, the flip side of everyday waking awareness? I think that our subconscious mind and our dreams are two different aspects of who/what we are. As I spoke to above, soul being our subconscious mind, it is our soul that inspires us to act one way over all other possibilities. Our dreams are totally random and more often than not gets data all mixed up. Our subconscious is rational but may operate with faulty logic. If it's the flip side, where is it? does it reside in the brain tissue as a function, or is it another plane of awareness? Remember, I am a materialist so yes, our soul resides in our brain. Our spirit is within all aspects of what we are, not just our brain. If another plane of awareness, where is this plane? No, not a different plane. But maybe we could say a different dimension? Given the three dimensions, I add a fourth being time/space, and then could justify saying that the fifth dimension is spirit. Are you this plane, or are you in this plane? Yes. (Sorry, that's the best I could do.) Like i said just a quick one, i'll check back later... of course i'm guessing your answers on each question... so will be intersting to see what you say.. peace Yeah, I don't normally get involved in "higher" essence of being beyond the material but this thread is one where I feel I won't be misunderstood while talking about the non-material. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted August 23, 2016 Spirit inherently knows Tao, so I would say that free-will (desire) has less to do with spirit or Chi/energy. I am of the thought process that it is the conscious mind that exercises free-will to practice, acknowledge and be in-tune with spirit. I agree with what you said as I see you speaking to the manifest aspect of what we are, that is, our physical being. I am speaking to a deeper aspect of what we are than just our physical essence. My "Peace & Contentment" speaks to this spiritual aspect of our total essence rather than just our physical state. And this is where we will find our true freedom. And with freedom we have free will. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted August 23, 2016 still here, ok thanks for that Karen, when i say free will, i mean the will of the spirit, so spirit willing action through the medium of the body, rather than the body or desire nature etc willing the action. the spirit is truth, and will act in truth/do the right thing... so i'd say living in wu wei is when spirit has a direct avenue of action from where it is into this physical world, through the body. and for that to happen , the flesh the body must give up its will. ok peace out Great until you got to that last part. We need allow our body, and even some desires of the body, to play out its needs. Maybe when one attains the state of "Sage" this can happen. I don't know, I've never been there. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Edward M Posted August 23, 2016 (edited) Marblehead, i like your answers!! i have one more question, if the other 4 dimensions didn't exist, could the 5th dimension of Spirit exist on its own without them? With your last reply, i agree we need to act our physical desires to continue living, but if it were the case that we are spirit and can exist independently of the other dimensions as pure spirit, then it would be a question of whether spirit wants to continue living through/operating in this physical the body/brain or not once self realisation occurs, which would determine whether it goes with what the body wants. Probably a lot more to it than that.. but well, thats all i got right now.. Peace Edited August 23, 2016 by Edward M Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted August 23, 2016 Marblehead, i like your answers!! i have one more question, if the other 4 dimensions didn't exist, could the 5th dimension of Spirit exist on its own without them? Fair question and consistent with the flow of thought. However, The fifth dimension does exist but it is equal to the state of "wu", that is, the unmanifested state of existence. Unmanifested means that there is no you or me so anything that could be said of that state would be meaningless to something in the state of "yu", the manifest. It has been said that a good life is one that is lived with one foot in "yu" and the other in "wu". I like to refer to "wu" as mystery and potential. This 5th dimension is total potential. But remember, this is only one aspect of what we are. We have a body so we have mortal concerns. With your last reply, i agree we need to act our physical desires to continue living, but if it were the case that we are spirit and can exist independently of the other dimensions as pure spirit, then it would be a question of whether spirit wants to continue living through/operating in this physical the body/brain or not once self realisation occurs, which would determine whether it goes with what the body wants. Probably a lot more to it than that.. but well, thats all i got right now.. Regretfully, our body dies when our spirit, ChI, Life Force leaves it. What we were still exists but it is no longer us. (I know, Buddhists would disagree with me here.) Peace 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Edward M Posted August 23, 2016 Infinite potential is a mystery, because it contains all within it, and is totally beyond our human intellectual understanding. However, it's as real as you can get. Yeah, agree with you that our body dies when spirit leaves, but i'd say that the spirit is not in the body, and the body serves as a door way into the greater awareness/world of spirit. I mean, what about experiences people have of meeting others in dreams, and both of them remember it upon awakening, that kind of thing. Peace Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Edward M Posted August 23, 2016 One idea springs to mind, we have the un-manifest, infinite potential, once something has become manifest, can it really then become un-manifest again, or can it continue as a kind of quantum memory? and if so, only in the minds of those manifest beings who experienced it, or is the fabric of reality itself aware and capable of retaining memory? would this mean that reality is made of spirit and is a being? Sorry i'm replying with mainly questions, today that seems to be my only way of expressing my will to find a mutual understanding/bridge between spiritual and material points of view. Peace Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted August 23, 2016 (edited) To your post #21: I can't go there with you Edward. Where you wish to go is not part of my understanding and for me to speak to it would be hypocritical. We each have our own special needs when it comes to spirituality. Edited August 23, 2016 by Marblehead 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Edward M Posted August 23, 2016 Cool Marblehead, totally respect your decision dude! 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted August 23, 2016 More difficult question. Remember, my responses are only my opinions and understandings. (And I reserve the right to be wrong.) One idea springs to mind, we have the un-manifest, infinite potential, once something has become manifest, can it really then become un-manifest again, or can it continue as a kind of quantum memory? and if so, only in the minds of those manifest beings who experienced it, or is the fabric of reality itself aware and capable of retaining memory? would this mean that reality is made of spirit and is a being? It is my understanding that when a living thing dies it is either consumed by other living things, become part of other things, or returns to the state of potential. So no, there would be no memory of what was. The bits and pieces vecome different things or they are potential for future things. I don't hold to the concept of "universal consciousness". And remember, Tao is not a thing, it is a process, the Way. Sorry i'm replying with mainly questions, today that seems to be my only way of expressing my will to find a mutual understanding/bridge between spiritual and material points of view. Yes, you must find the answers to "your" questions. And they don't have to be any that I provide. It is my understanding that we get only one shot at living this present manifest form. The beginning was birth and the end is death. Recycling and reversion will be the creation of something else. Peace 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
