How do you explain Daoism?

[Mig]

Do I explain Daoism?

--Nah. Not unless we're talking about a particular sect.

 

I might explain things usually related to it---but Daoism itself is too tricky.

If you had to start which sect will you talk about? Will that be your first way to explain something as Daoism?

[Brian]

Do you really need to believe in something? I guess those who are in touch with nature have less tendency to believe in something, they admire and respect nature, don't they?

Perhaps this will help:

 

How would I explain Daoism to people who have never heard of it, like my friends and family? I really want to show that it's who I am and what I believe in. My family is very atheist and all my friends are either Christian or Muslim. I fear they will judge me too heavily, as I am not even from the country Daoism is founded in.

^^^Does my question make sense now? Edited December 21, 2016 by Brian

[Stosh]

How can you live in harmony with the universe? Isn't living in an environment or a society far from harmony. How do you live yourself in harmony following Daoism? Where did you learn to live in harmony? From a book, a scripture or teachings from someone?

Since you didn't get a response, and its a legit question. ..

I'll jump in, if thats ok, One can live in harmony with the universe simply by not doing anything stupid. Trick is then, to determine what is,, Not based on illusions , doesnt bring you sorrow ,loneliness ,or hastens your own demise. ( an inclusive answer that I think covers Whomever used the phrase)  

 

 

Whos up for a game of  … Harmonyy    with the    UUNIVERSE !!

Choose A or B , , being in harmony with the universe ,or being Not in harmony with the universe.. 

Ok ready? ..

1    A) wanton destruction of natural resources             ,, or B recycling plastic bottles 

2    A) arguing with everyone at your place of work       ,, or B tender love making session with your spouse

3    A) heroin abuse                                                        ,, or B having a beer with dinner

4    A) an urbanite living in the city                               ,, or B urbanite wandering naked and cold in a forest 

5    A) soul searching to determine whats really imortant or  B keeping up with the Joneses

Edited December 22, 2016 by Stosh

[Mig]

Perhaps this will help:

 

^^^Does my question make sense now?

Isn't that the same for any other type of belief or belief in faith?

[Brian]

Isn't that the same for any other type of belief or belief in faith?

Seems to me that a person who wants help explaining to a potentially unsympathetic audience what it is that he or she believes should first consider what it is that he or she actually believes and try explaining it to an ostensibly sympathetic audience.

 

I'm funny that way.

 

<shrug>

[Mig]

Since you didn't get a response, and its a legit question. ..

I'll jump in, if thats ok, One can live in harmony with the universe simply by not doing anything stupid. Trick is then, to determine what is,, Not based on illusions , doesnt bring you sorrow ,loneliness ,or hastens your own demise. ( an inclusive answer that I think covers Whomever used the phrase)  

 

 

Whos up for a game of  … Harmonyy    with the    UUNIVERSE !!

Choose A or B , , being in harmony with the universe ,or being Not in harmony with the universe.. 

Ok ready? ..

1    A) wanton destruction of natural resources             ,, or B recycling plastic bottles 

2    A) arguing with everyone at your place of work       ,, or B tender love making session with your spouse

3    A) heroin abuse                                                        ,, or B having a beer with dinner

4    A) an urbanite living in the city                               ,, or B urbanite wandering naked and cold in a forest 

5    A) soul searching to determine whats really imortant or  B keeping up with the Joneses

Great response and I appreciate your posting. The way I see the world or universe (whatever that means) is chaos, unbalanced so doing something stupid is doing the opposite of what others call non stupid. So in accordance to the world or nature if you will, I observe and I respect. Not to alter anything by my human greed but to transform and adapt to change. Why do we have to chose between A and B and not having C, D. Isn't existence an infinite number of incidents that happen by nano seconds? Then when I read your A and B it seems to me more arbitrary choices since I won't choose any those or maybe 2b only LOL

[Stosh]

Great response and I appreciate your posting. The way I see the world or universe (whatever that means) is chaos, unbalanced so doing something stupid is doing the opposite of what others call non stupid. So in accordance to the world or nature if you will, I observe and I respect. Not to alter anything by my human greed but to transform and adapt to change. Why do we have to chose between A and B and not having C, D. Isn't existence an infinite number of incidents that happen by nano seconds? Then when I read your A and B it seems to me more arbitrary choices since I won't choose any those or maybe 2b only LOL

I am voicing personally slanted views, no doubt, and you might not , in real life choose either of the options for any item number presented. Its my opinion that the classical authors of Daoism did not see the world as chaotic , saw repeating themes and relationships in the world , their lives and so forth.

In a situation of True chaos one cant make predictions about what is going to happen whatsoever, the laws of nature, as we describe them would be inconsistent .. other people totally incomprehensible.

Though life is often difficult , its a great thing to have SOME idea of what is going on, and what is to come.

That's what Daoism offers , and I see it , that's what any faith , philosophy , pragmatism .... whatever ,, offers.

But You don't have to 'buy' any.

One can keep saying the universe is chaotic , deem one's own intended actions futile, and just suffer ineffectually through life flailing around. I certainly couldn't say that I knew it as a fact , that things would turn into a bed of roses , if you "just believe".

For some folks ,randomly flailing around, is really the best they can do. Look at the president elect !   

[awaken]

I don't tell my friends or my co-workers about what I am practicing

 

I use the words they can accept

 

I told them I am practicing Qi gung

 

The people who don't cultivate for many years can't distinguish what is the different between Qi gung and dan dao

 

The only thing my co-worker can see is that I am sitting there and close my eyes

 

They all think I am sleeping

 

They don't know what is going on inside of me

 

I won't tell them anything dan dao

 

It is impossible to explain dan dao to the people who never cultivate before

Edited December 23, 2016 by awaken

[Mig]

I don't tell my friends or my co-workers about what I am practicing

 

I use the words they can accept

 

I told them I am practicing Qi gung

 

The people who don't cultivate for many years can't distinguish what is the different between Qi gung and dan dao

 

The only thing my co-worker can see is that I am sitting there and close my eyes

 

They all think I am sleeping

 

They don't know what is going on inside of me

 

I won't tell them anything dan dao

 

It is impossible to explain dan dao to the people who never cultivate before

How would you say that in Chinese? I am curious how would you convey this idea in written Chinese. Just curios.

[dawei]

I don't tell my friends or my co-workers about what I am practicing

 

I use the words they can accept

 

I told them I am practicing Qi gung

 

The people who don't cultivate for many years can't distinguish what is the different between Qi gung and dan dao

 

I do the same thing... 

[Mig]

I do the same thing... 

I thought in general people don't tell what they practice in their spare time, sometimes people don't want to know especially now that we live in big cities or large metropolis. It is also cultural about communication and interaction with others. Now, if you don't tell them what you are practicing why tell them you practice qigong?

Now, if someone is interested to know how to explain Daoism, how would you do that? Is it religious based opinion or more of a philosophical explanation a la western idea?

[dawei]

I thought in general people don't tell what they practice in their spare time, sometimes people don't want to know especially now that we live in big cities or large metropolis. It is also cultural about communication and interaction with others. Now, if you don't tell them what you are practicing why tell them you practice qigong?

Now, if someone is interested to know how to explain Daoism, how would you do that? Is it religious based opinion or more of a philosophical explanation a la western idea?

 

I think you're asking good questions but we're saying something else... the latter first:  when you try to explain to chinese what you're doing... they have a limited grasp of practice or belief or even anything about energy... less seems best on some level.

 

Anyone should be able to share their practice in general terms... otherwise, they may just be trolling to some degree as there is no reason to be here... My feeling

 

Now, how to explain daoism?  It is nothing and everything.   When you can resolve that, then you might have a step in a direction to understand or explain dao..  

 

the 'ism' becomes a prison...  rap this line... not mine.... but in time... on your dime... 

[TheWhiteRabbit]

Taoism/Daoism -

 

It is an existential "religion".  Meaning that it is based upon what man learns from nature and natural concepts.  That is what the Tao Te Ching is also about.  People took information they experienced and used it in their lives.  From philosophical concepts to the non-mundane and religious concepts.  What Daoism comes from is not only Buddhism, but has its origins in Hinduism of Vedic and Pre-Vedic times.  Mantras or "passwords" in the religious and non-mundane aspects were used along with other rituals that have a beginning in Yajna.

 

Some Buddhists and Daoists ascribe magic to "The Gods" there are many temples to which one can go and obtain seals used in particular religious or non-mundane rites.  Some of these are written in a non-human language usually attributed to beings that are of non-terrestrial origin, (gods, aliens - whats the difference?)

 

In a purely mundane sense you have aspects of geomancy known as "Feng Shui" in its various forms.  In the highest mundane metaphysical practice you encounter "Qi Men Dun Jia" where you can calculate the direction and time and distance to travel that will bring you friendship, money, healing or if you choose the wrong one, death.

 

Differences between the religions:

Christianity is Deity centered, its teaching are based upon spiritual teaching from a deity.

Buddhism is primarily prophet/teacher based, teachings are based upon writings from holy people that worked.

Daoism is also teacher based.

Hinduism is for the most part teacher based with some deity attributed writings.

Vedic and Pre-Vedic was all Deity based writings, with some "colleges" that taught practices.

Tantra is difficult to sort out as Deities are a center piece, yet masters have methods taught.

 

Philosophy is an important aspect of all of them, yet all religions have their emphasis on Virtue (De) like Daoism.  It is emphasised in many religions that the correct way should be mastered first.  This eliminates issues with being to sloppy, animalistic or negligent later.  In that aspect, which is a core of many religions and philosophies... To forget this aspect is to lose the whole thing.  Atainments can not be had without the philosophical or religious practices.  Attainments cannot be reached without Virtue which is learned through philosophical or religious writings.

 

In short:  Without a deity or teacher there is no religion.  Without religion there is no Virtue, Attainment or Understanding.  Without Virtue there is no long standing attainment.  This means you may gain understanding or non-mundane abilities but will lose them.  With no understanding or practical application there is no point.  Philosophies and teachings come from religious and spiritual paths.  If man wakes up one day and decides to do away with any aspects of these, the information and practices will be lost for all time.  Until another comes along to reignite the fire of Yajna and continue things as they have continued from the world's beginning until now. 

 

 

I think you're asking good questions but we're saying something else... the latter first:  when you try to explain to chinese what you're doing... they have a limited grasp of practice or belief or even anything about energy... less seems best on some level.

 

Anyone should be able to share their practice in general terms... otherwise, they may just be trolling to some degree as there is no reason to be here... My feeling

 

Now, how to explain daoism?  It is nothing and everything.   When you can resolve that, then you might have a step in a direction to understand or explain dao..  

 

the 'ism' becomes a prison...  rap this line... not mine.... but in time... on your dime... 

 

I agree, Ism is a prison.  Sometimes when it comes to religion I feel that yes, religion is very important.

Yet, at the very same time which seems like a strange contradiction:

I also feel that the practices that one does currently, one should keep secret.

Messages from Deities... No.

Messages from a guide... Yes, I keep those secret.

Personal life... Yes, even in day to day encounters it is better to keep the activities of one's life secret.  People are strange jealous creatures and become enraged over strange and bizarre things even the strange need of some to feel superior to another.  I have seen it and understand its effects in the past on my life, yet would never do such to another human except to teach such people that such is pointless.  I have learned very well that in the grand scheme of things trying to seem the best at something has nothing to do with spiritual attainment.  It only matters what you can say to help a people in the present moment in a meaningful way with your understanding, beyond that what you accomplish yourself.

I believe christians term something "Showy display of one's means of life."  This was used originally to talk about wealth and rubbing it in people's faces.  If we rub something very personal that we are working on, meaning the inner-workings of something, it can also backfire on us.

 

To another extent what we do and what we accomplish sometimes is not always hidden.  We see some turning of emotional-mental gears from time to time when people find out what we really are.  I think the key to any spiritual life is really keeping as much hidden as possible.  When we come out and try to say "we know this and this"... It always backfires.  The response that has grown in recent years as the result of depression and people becoming more animal and "Limbic" is a term called "Cognitive Dissonance".  The comedian George Carlin used it, scientists use it.  It stems from a multitude of failures and rather than picking themselves back up they ride it out because they have been rewarded by this cynical behaviour (The poor me and sour grapes mechanisms).  This leads to the greater disbelief in religion and miracles as well as non-mundane things.

It may also have to do with for some people living in large cities which also leads to depression.  In a nutshell, our modern life we live in is very anti-spiritual.  As we start living in ways that makes us more like cattle, religion, spirituality and philosophy disappears.  I realize I have talked this point into the ground.  Let me not speak of it again.

Edited December 28, 2016 by TheWhiteRabbit

[Marblehead]

Well, my Daoism still doesn't have any religion in it.

 

Just saying.

[Stosh]

Taoism/Daoism -

 

It is an existential "religion".  Meaning that it is based upon what man learns from nature and natural concepts.     I realize I have talked this point into the ground.  Let me not speak of it again.

Actually a pretty nice job , of nutshelling it , ,, though I dont agree about parts 

Edited December 28, 2016 by Stosh

[TheWhiteRabbit]

On 12/28/2016 at 8:15 AM, Stosh said:

Actually a pretty nice job , of nutshelling it , ,, though I dont agree about parts 

 

To be perfectly honest, I care about people a lot.  If you do not like my post that is fine and are reasons which I will explain also.

Sometimes not always we have periods in our life when everyone literally is against us.

What makes a person great is acts 2:38

 

Wh has travesolation I can give you will prepare you for l Except those 

 

Jesus Lives

 

Edited June 27, 2023 by TheWhiteRabbit

[Marblehead]

Yep.  Today is the first day of the rest of your life.  Live it well.

[Kara_mia]

I believe that authentic and genuine daoism is not a religion. It is a Science but not a profane science but truly sacred science. Rene Guenon's works, in particular "The crisis of the Modern World" is a good source for reading about the sacred science and the difference between the sacred and the modern profane science.

[s1va]

Dao is the study of existence as it is; there is no dogma, only the journey to uncover the truth.  What is, Is.

 

Can "study of existence" become a dogma?  For those that see that as a path.  This is just a question that comes along in the mind.

 

Something along the lines that Buddha's teachings rebelled against dogma.  Mind Many made him into that which he rebelled against.

[Marblehead]

Can "study of existence" become a dogma?  For those that see that as a path.  This is just a question that comes along in the mind.

 

 

I'm sure it can, yes.  That would be a problem an Atheistic scientist would have to face.

[s1va]

living in harmony with the universe is taoism

 

How can you live in harmony with the universe? Isn't living in an environment or a society far from harmony. How do you live yourself in harmony following Daoism? Where did you learn to live in harmony? From a book, a scripture or teachings from someone?

 

I have asked these type of questions and then came to conclusion that there is no answer to these questions.

 

If we look at the quote that prompted your questions, it is not advocating anything to anyone.  It is simply stating something.   There is a beauty in those statements by itself.  If we chose to look at the quote without questions, we may find all answers on those few words.

[silent thunder]

I stood, staring at a trickle of water as it wound its way along the pavement and gutter of a parking lot.

 

Picking up debris as it flowed and carried along with it, disregarded bits of paper and plastic, leaves, clumps of dirt, a few hapless ants and a healthy portion of dog turd, recently deposited with rather remarkable precision.

 

It flowed along effortlessly, neutral to turd and flower alike, into the sewer and off to the ocean.

 

Tao in motion.  To me anyway, in that moment and now upon reflection... somewhat.