the effects of psychedelics on the energy body?

[freesun]

 

For me, the negatives have outweighed the positive...............One of the major negatives for me is that it opened me up to things that I can't shut off and has taken the last 30 years to balance out..........................While being empathic can be a good thing, I am constantly picking up stuff from people, the environment etc and it can be a real pain in the ass.

 

I also have a very strong tendency to pick up all sorts of stuff form my environment and people, but i cannot trace that back to having used psychedelics in my late teens. I do still have side-effects but those are only physical in nature as far as i can tell (permanent change of visual perception).

How do you make the connection that these things are related to your psychedelics use in your case?

Edited December 2, 2007 by freesun

[karen]

I can say that the days I spent in Portland mired in the drug culture were some of the best of my life though...........I miss the comradary of those days.

 

Yeah, I have fond memories too. My sense is that there's a lesson here, about what exactly is that intimate connection that we're looking for. The kind of high we get from the drug culture, and the feeling of connection that comes with it, is perhaps not what the true self really needs.

 

We need connection for sure, but sometimes we have to let go of the old ways of getting it, to find new ones that are more deeply satisfying on the soul/spiritual level. And that may mean going through some lean times, when we quit indulging the false ego's desires but we're not feeling plugged in at the higher level yet.

 

-Karen

[gendao]

Just curious, what about the plants that South American shamans use - like Ayahuasca, etc?

 

Might those also prematurely use up your "death energy" (or have any other negative effets)? Or no?

Max says that there is a price to pay for the visions, and it is your death-energy that suffers. That means when you die you don't have as much juice to fully transition and can get stuck between worlds.

Edited December 2, 2007 by vortex

[rex]

I also have a very strong tendency to pick up all sorts of stuff form my environment and people, but i cannot trace that back to having used psychedelics in my late teens.

Perhaps your solar plexus centre is naturally open?

[sheng zhen]

When it comes to the damage psychedelics does on the energy systems there is a lot of things that can happen. From my own experience, the most important effect is that it damages the energysenters that define reality. The aura gets full off blocks, clounds and things like that, which distorts the reality we observe. We might think we get openings, but it is actually distortions. We feel things in the enivironment, see colours in auras and stuff like that, but it is not the real colours. It is all distorted.

 

We also get a lot of openings in aura and chakras. The effects of these openings are varying from individual to individual.

 

From what I have seen in friends and clients who have done a lot of drugs, including psychedelics, is that the connection to ones true self is severely damaged. I think this weak connection is part of the reason people take drugs in the first place, they dont really like them selves. And doing drugs makes this connection even worse.

 

Psychedelics also damages the higher centers of the energysystems. The higer chakras and higher consciousness layers. They get dull and non-substantial. We think we get in touch with the higher levels of reality, but in reality we disconnect ourselves from it.

 

I dont give much credit to drugs. I did drugs to open up, but too many of my last years have been spent to undo the damage. But i dont dismiss the possibility that psychedelics can be used for good purposes under the right circumstances and right guidance. But we dont get those circumstances in the city or with our regular friends. We hardly get them with experienced shamans. I think it is best to lay off drugs all together if one is concerned about the energetic body and cultivation.

[Djshorty]

Hey,

I'm in my early twenties. Two years ago I was doing MJ (until it ended up providing me with a paranoid high, instead of a relaxed one), and up until about a year ago I had done Salvia Divinorum at least 12-15 times. I've quit everything within the last year, except maybe booze, which I stopped a month ago. For those who don't know about Salvia; it's a legal plant that's relatively easy to grow indoors, and I believe it originates in Mexico. It provides a brief high if smoked, about 2-10 minutes max, but it completely shatters you. It's been compared to DMT, and some people believe it's more powerful than LSD. For instance, I experienced ego loss on several occasions (couldn't remember who I was), and I got the feeling that there was a definite presence to this plant (although I didn't really see any beings), more like felt them. I wasn't able to tell if this presence was healing me, or possessing me.

 

I won't get too much into my experiences here, as I know this isn't the thread to do this in. However, after I experienced ego loss several times, I decided that I actually enjoy having one. I believed the ego is needed to really experience life (otherwise there is no one that experiences it). All in all, it seems that it had scared me away from any practices that attempt to get rid of the ego. I didn't want to practice meditation, eat healthy, or even think about how to get rid of an ego. What the hell is enjoyable about life if no ones home to experience it? (this was the mindset it gave me).

 

While we're on the subject, I'd be very interested in knowing what I can do to reverse any 'distortions' that Salvia and Marijuana have caused to my energy body. Other than becoming more withdrawn after experimenting with these plants, I no longer feel any negative side effects they may have caused. Has anyone found particular ways of healing the effects of these entheogens? At the time, I didn't know anything about energy bodies, or chakras, and so didn't feel like they would cause any harm if done in moderation. After reading this thread, it seems they may have.

 

Thanks

Peace

 

Thanks

[Lozen]

I think there is a difference between drugs and medicine--between ritualistic cultural use of a plant and just drug use.

 

I don't really agree that the things we see and feel while on drugs aren't real... only that we're not necessarily ready to see them.

[ToP-fan]

To Freesun, in answer to your question "How do I know that psychedelics are responsible for my being sensitive to other's energies etc?"

 

Only you know your life experiences and through the act of attention, you notice certain shifts.

A major one for me was that the after effect was kind of like an acid hangover which lingered and it seemed to have a carry over to day to day existence.

That carry over, was the sensitivity to energies........ animate and inanimate.

 

Through the works of Barbara Brennan and Dr. Valerie Hunt, I received some validation from my assumptions....................In their research, they could tell which people had done hallucinogens through weaknesses and tears in the aura which left them vulnerable to influences from many sources.

 

 

" I don't know karate, but I do know crazy"

 

James Brown

 

To Freesun, in answer to your question "How do I know that psychedelics are responsible for my being sensitive to other's energies etc?"

 

Only you know your life experiences and through the act of attention, you notice certain shifts.

A major one for me was that the after effect was kind of like an acid hangover which lingered and it seemed to have a carry over from day to day existence.

That carry over, was the sensitivity to energies........ animate and inanimate.

 

Through the works of Barbara Brennan and Dr. Valerie Hunt, I received some validation from my assumptions....................In their research, they could tell which people had done hallucinogens through weaknesses and tears in the aura which left them vulnerable to influences from many sources.

 

 

" I don't know karate, but I do know crazy"

 

James Brown

 

To all concerned,

 

I wanted to edit my last post, but somehow it doubled.

Sorry bout that!

[karen]

Just curious, what about the plants that South American shamans use - like Ayahuasca, etc?

 

It's the same as other psychoactive plants in terms of causing energetic disturbances. It's pretty interesting to look at the materia medica of these substances and read through the detailed descriptions of the effects.

 

The relationship that the native shaman has with that substance is different from ours, as their consciousness and whole relationship to the natural world is different from ours. We can't just participate in the same activities and get the same results.

 

About removing the disturbances caused by these substances - it's very doable with homeopathic isodes. They're diluted/potentized forms of the same substance, used on the basis of the law of similars ("like cures like"). Although for people who've done these drugs over a period of time, it may take some time and repeated doses of the isode.

 

In the US, we can't buy isodes of illegal substances, even though the end product is so diluted that it doesn't even contain one molecule of the original substance! (It contains the energy signature). But there are pracitioners who use these and can work with people anywhere in the world.

 

And anyway, it's best to have a skilled practitioner give the proper dose and potency, and at the proper time. There may be other disturbances that would need to be cleared first, before that one can be addressed, so all these things really call for professional treatment.

 

-Karen

[Lozen]

Homeopathic peyote makes you trip real nice and good, but the crash is really hard.

 

Just sayin'.

[freesun]

Perhaps your solar plexus centre is naturally open?

 

I'd say unprotected more likely. In fact it seems more closed/inactive than open. Sort of stagnant.

 

A major one for me was that the after effect was kind of like an acid hangover which lingered and it seemed to have a carry over from day to day existence.

...

In their research, they could tell which people had done hallucinogens through weaknesses and tears in the aura which left them vulnerable to influences from many sources.

 

I know the hangover feeling. That is exactly how i have experienced my visual disturbances developing. Possibly i crarried over more than i was aware.

A weak aura can have many causes. Do these have a specific quality that makes it so obvious to have been caused by psychedelic use or is it a specific energy signature?

 

About removing the disturbances caused by these substances - it's very doable with homeopathic isodes.

 

Very interesting. I did not realize this could be treated through homeopathy. I shall talk to my homeopathic practitioner about it (I live in Germany so there is a good chance that those isodes are available here).

[sheng zhen]

I think there is a difference between drugs and medicine--between ritualistic cultural use of a plant and just drug use.

 

I don't really agree that the things we see and feel while on drugs aren't real... only that we're not necessarily ready to see them.

They are real experiences to us, but not really real.

 

Its comparable to the childs mind playing with his toy car. He is driving really really fast and say vroooom. In his mind he is the perfect driver. But it has nothing to do with true driving. The child dosent have the competancy to drive a real car, but in his mind he has.

 

Its the same with drugs. Our brain dosent have the competency to deal with these things, but in our mind, during the experience, we think we do.

 

When we grow up and learn more about auras, energetic sensations and feelings of oneness, it is a lot more to it than the feeling we had on drugs. Just as driving a real car is a lot more than playing. To get a premature feeling we can do drugs, but to truly deal with it and live it... drugs dosent bring us anywere.

 

One more argument that makes drug experiences unreal, is that the brain dosent have the ability to comprenhend anything that is beyond its present framework. That is why dreams are chaotic. The mind tries to interpret actions that is outside of its own realm of reality with elements from inside that realm. Drug experiences is to the brain the same as dreams. Reality gets distorted. The brain needs to be cultivated to deal with higher and more and more subtle realizations.

[jjwalters]

-Karen

....My sense is that there's a lesson here, about what exactly is that intimate connection that we're looking for.

 

jj.....I believe that although the drugs were a part of it...they weren't the glue that held things together in my experience.........most heavy narc users seemed to live for the drug and were a different breed altogether.

 

I went into the peace/love thing full bore.......acid was a side issue experiement.....

 

I look back now and see that I was in search of family...something I never had as a kid..........and after an 18 month romp through asia the change (after acid) was tremendous..............

 

a solo trip through life is doable.......but .............it's lonely

[Lozen]

I disagree that they're not really real, because I've seen similar things when not on drugs as I have on them. The difference was that I had the grounding and training to be able to deal with them.

 

I also think dreams are really real.

[sheng zhen]

I disagree that they're not really real, because I've seen similar things when not on drugs as I have on them. The difference was that I had the grounding and training to be able to deal with them.

 

I also think dreams are really real.

I dont say dream are not real. Sorry if what I wrote gave you that impression.

 

What Im saying is that the images we remember as dreams is the best interpretation the brain was able to come up with. Which is much the same process that happens while tripping on psychedelics. The brain does its best, but it is not an expert in reality observation. Its the other way around, the brain is an expert in reality distortion.

[karen]

Sheng zhen, great analogy. Reality has far more depth and dimension than dreams. There may be elements of the dream that are real, But to critically examine what is real and what isn't, beyond subjective opinions, I think would take a lot more discussion of epistemology.

 

Freesun, most homeopathic practitioners use the classical approach which doesn't usually use isodes but sticks to what they call constitutional prescribing - one remedy that's supposed to be THE one for you.. unless you happen upon a particular practitioner who thinks outside the box . Heilkunst practitioners are a better bet, www.homeopathy.com/clinic

 

Lozen, just for the record .. the remedy doesn't "make" you trip out or anything else - it simply destroys the impingement on your life force caused by the drug or disease. What you experience after that are healing reactions, which come from the natural healing power of your body as it's working to rebalance things. Each person experiences a healing reaction differently, and it's not always noticeable.

 

-Karen

[gendao]

Thanks for the info, Karen.

 

Here's a vid on Michael Persinger - Psychotropic drugs and nature of reality. I haven't watched it all yet...but sounds like he's tried to analyze and recreate mystical or drug experiences electromechanically with a "Koren 'God' Helmet" using weak magnetic fields (perhaps similar to a Mindfold?).

Shakti uses magnetic fields that carry signals from the human brain. These allow it to 'target' specific brain structures known to be involved with spirituality and to induce altered states of consciousness.

 

Shakti uses your PC computer's sound card to produce it's signals. Magnetic coils convert the sound card's electrical output to the magnetic signals Shakti works with.

Interesting, he mentions harmine (telepathine)...which is found in Banisteriopsis caapi (yage, ayahuasca) - and inhibits the breakdown of dimethyltryptamine (DMT). Dimethyltryptamine is known as the "spiritual molecule." Some people can make DMT within their pineal organ, because melatonin is effectively DMT.

 

He also says that Martin Luther was just an ordinary monk...until he was STRUCK BY LIGHTNING (*cough* MAX *cough*)!

Edited December 5, 2007 by vortex

[Lozen]

Lozen, just for the record .. the remedy doesn't "make" you trip out or anything else - it simply destroys the impingement on your life force caused by the drug or disease. What you experience after that are healing reactions, which come from the natural healing power of your body as it's working to rebalance things. Each person experiences a healing reaction differently, and it's not always noticeable.

 

I know, you keep saying...and yet I have never tripped on anything other than homeopathics. lol.

[karen]

sounds like he's tried to analyze and recreate mystical or drug experiences electromechanically

 

Yup, there are all sorts of things that can manipulate brain chemistry to produce all sorts of experiences. The question is, do those experiences further real spiritual development, or are they just attractive distractions?

 

And do you simply want to GET experiences any way you can, or do you want only to live in truth and trust that the experiences that will truly fulfill your needs will arise out of that.

 

-Karen

[jjwalters]

Yup, there are all sorts of things that can manipulate brain chemistry to produce all sorts of experiences. The question is, do those experiences further real spiritual development, or are they just attractive distractions?

 

And do you simply want to GET experiences any way you can, or do you want only to live in truth and trust that the experiences that will truly fulfill your needs will arise out of that.

 

-Karen

 

exactly.....

[gendao]

Yup, there are all sorts of things that can manipulate brain chemistry to produce all sorts of experiences. The question is, do those experiences further real spiritual development, or are they just attractive distractions?

 

And do you simply want to GET experiences any way you can, or do you want only to live in truth and trust that the experiences that will truly fulfill your needs will arise out of that.

 

-Karen

True, personally I prefer the internal organic approach...but I still find his findings interesting nonetheless.

[minkus]

Yup, there are all sorts of things that can manipulate brain chemistry to produce all sorts of experiences. The question is, do those experiences further real spiritual development, or are they just attractive distractions?

-Karen

 

Made an answering post but deleted it as its still a public forum.

 

I can only say that yes great spiritual development is certainly possible but i would never advocate said practice.

 

Very short: the risks do not outweight the benefits for 90% of people involved. Ive seen many people die before i came to this conclusion, owyeah and some that ended up with the mind of a banana.

 

If anyone cares to try .. your boss of your own body but i warned you, vaguely but i did.

 

Kind regards, M.