True Fearlessness

[liminal_luke]

If you need money to be happy, you´ll be afraid of losing your wealth.

If you need the love of your partner, you´ll be afraid of disharmony and divorce.

If you need health, you´ll be afraid of the body´s inevitable decline.

If you need a functioning laptop, you´ll be afraid of electrical outages.  

If you need to live forever, you´ll be afraid of death.

 

But what if you can find a place of inner secret joy, a place where you don´t need money or somebody else´s love or even your body...what would be left to be afraid of then?

Edited October 9, 2016 by liminal_luke

[blue eyed snake]

 

If you need health, you´ll be afraid of the bodies inevitable decline.

 

 

But what if you can find a place of inner secret joy, a place where you don´t need money or somebody else´s love or even your body...what would be left to be afraid of then?

 

when I've found that place were the bodies inevitable decline, the endless pain, sleeplessness and  tiredness do not bother me anymore i'll post it here on the bums...think if i reach that...i might say i've crossed some threshold...

 

but do not count on it in the near future.... sigh

 

but, on a brighter note, I've come pretty far in that direction, thanks to the things I've learned from my teacher ( and all the teachers of this life  )

[liminal_luke]

when I've found that place were the bodies inevitable decline, the endless pain, sleeplessness and  tiredness do not bother me anymore i'll post it here on the bums...think if i reach that...i might say i've crossed some threshold...

 

but do not count on it in the near future.... sigh

 

but, on a brighter note, I've come pretty far in that direction, thanks to the things I've learned from my teacher ( and all the teachers of this life  )

 

I´m not there either, not by a longshot, but I believe in it as a human possibility.

[Karl]

nope, and btw, i'm not emotional about it, that's your idea...

 

I'll mirror it for you,

 

when i would say that your rhetoric's about objective thinking are equal to spouting rot 

you might not feel too happy about that, it's insulting language instead of just making your point and, agreeing not to agree, going further to another topic.

 

the conviction that we just live in this body and go on after this body dies is one that is shared by many people, you're taking as example the jihadists and then you go on using offensive language. Thereby insulting all Hindus and Buddhists, to name just a few... That's not how we go along here on the bums, therefore I just politely warned you that you're stepping out of bounds

 

and when spoken about it you try to wiggle out of it...

 

sort of sad really... small boy behaviour

LOL since I have been on this forum the number of explicit and implicit retorts of that nature have been both regular and numerous. Duck and back come to mind, people are welcome to judge me and I them. If you want to call my rhetoric rot BES then be my guest, infact join the bloody Q :-) I really can't get much more covered in rotten fruit than I am already, so one or two more or less really won't make much difference.

 

I will note your intended insult of 'small boy behaviour' as been a low level attempt to get me to bite :-) not going to happen, but good try.

 

So, it's not OK to rubbish Hindu philosophy, but fine to rubbish objectivist philosopy. Get a life.

[neti neti]

My apologies if Hindu philosophy seems to deconstruct your assertions into foolishness. But here's another tomato you shouldn't mind.

 

Not identifying oneself with the body isn't to say one must neglect it or, as in your extreme example, move to destroy it.

[Karl]

My apologies if Hindu philosophy seems to deconstruct your assertions into foolishness. But here's another tomato you shouldn't mind.

 

Not identifying oneself with the body isn't to say one must neglect it or, as in your extreme example, move to destroy it.

I'm glad you took it that way neti neti. All tomatoes gathered and one day maybe a good soup ? ;-)

 

People tell others to sacrifice in the same sense that you opined. I find that kind of talk highly dangerous, especially as the people who say these kind of things have no proof to offer and rely on the naivety and ignorance of those to whom they charm.

[neti neti]

On 10/9/2016 at 4:42 PM, Karl said:

.

 

Edited August 24, 2020 by neti neti

[Karl]

 

 

sort of sad really... small boy behaviour

I'm going to save that up for a rainy day filed under Sexist abuse. :-) sweetie

[Karl]

Me too Karl. Either that or a mean pasta.   

 

I agree. A blind kind of faith can open people up to manipulation... the propagation of fantasy as if it were reality rarely proves to be profitable.

 

The intent of what I proposed is that faithfulness in knowing oneself produces tangible results. There is neither fear nor fearlessness apart from the attention we give these emotions.

Pasta is good. Mind you I have a LOT of tomatoes, seriously dude, tons. :-)

 

TaoMaow got the sense of this and I added the label 'moral courage' . In other words this is self confidence which means you are impervious to the manipulations of others-heroic man.

 

The heroic man is not concerned by what others think of him, he doesn't need prestige, nor wealth, nor fame, nor fair weather friends. He may have all of these things, but they don't define him as a man.

 

That does not mean there is no fear. Fear of death is a primary, our lives are our primary value, so losing our lives is to be very much feared and practical action taken to prevent that occurring. Our lives are the primary value around which all other values circulate like orbiting planets around a star. The closer these values are, the more we regard them as necessities in supporting the primary value. For instance I regard my wife as a very high value and totally necessary to the quality of my life. I fear losing my wife. I do not wish not to fear it, nor not to fear for my life.

[Marblehead]

I'm going to save that up for a rainy day filed under Sexist abuse. :-) sweetie

 

It has been a long time since I have been sexually abused by some fine young lady.

[Karl]

It has been a long time since I have been sexually abused by some fine young lady.

Have you seen the film 'the last Indian' ? If not you will like it. It stars Anthony Hopkins as a man in his twilight years taking a 50 year old motorcycle he virtually built himself to race at Boneville salt flats. It's based on a true story of a guy from New Zealand. Great film and very funny.

[Marblehead]

No, I haven't seen it.  I'll keep my eye out for it.

[Karl]

No, I haven't seen it. I'll keep my eye out for it.

It's been out a few years now, actually it might be called 'the worlds fastest Indian' rather the 'the last indian'

Edited October 9, 2016 by Karl

[Marblehead]

I just made a note.  If it's been out that long it might well be on Netflix.

[Karl]

I just made a note.  If it's been out that long it might well be on Netflix.

Oh definitely

 

Preview https://youtu.be/3bu9dGRQvJY

[neti neti]

Pasta is good. Mind you I have a LOT of tomatoes, seriously dude, tons. :-)

 

TaoMaow got the sense of this and I added the label 'moral courage' . In other words this is self confidence which means you are impervious to the manipulations of others-heroic man.

 

The heroic man is not concerned by what others think of him, he doesn't need prestige, nor wealth, nor fame, nor fair weather friends. He may have all of these things, but they don't define him as a man.

 

That does not mean there is no fear. Fear of death is a primary, our lives are our primary value, so losing our lives is to be very much feared and practical action taken to prevent that occurring. Our lives are the primary value around which all other values circulate like orbiting planets around a star. The closer these values are, the more we regard them as necessities in supporting the primary value. For instance I regard my wife as a very high value and totally necessary to the quality of my life. I fear losing my wife. I do not wish not to fear it, nor not to fear for my life.

 

Speaking of cinema, sometimes, it takes spilling the popcorn to remind us we're not on the screen. BOO! Fear can be fun, but fear can paralyze if taken too seriously.

[Marblehead]

Oh definitely

 

 

It's not available for me right now.  I'll put it on my wish list with Netflix.  Maybe it'll happen.

Edited October 9, 2016 by Marblehead

[blue eyed snake]

I´m not there either, not by a longshot, but I believe in it as a human possibility.

 

it's not about the goal liminal, but about taking another step, again and again 

 

and yes, the possibility is there,

there are some people walking this globe who show us that, as compassionate examples.

[dust]

If you need money to be happy, you´ll be afraid of losing your wealth.

If you need the love of your partner, you´ll be afraid of disharmony and divorce.

If you need health, you´ll be afraid of the body´s inevitable decline.

If you need a functioning laptop, you´ll be afraid of electrical outages.  

If you need to live forever, you´ll be afraid of death.

 

But what if you can find a place of inner secret joy, a place where you don´t need money or somebody else´s love or even your body...what would be left to be afraid of then?

 

I don't want to 'rain on' what is a nice idea, but I felt that something was missing:

 

If you need consciousness, you'll be afraid of the mind's inevitable decline.

 

Everything you listed is true, but so -- I think -- is this. If we need anything, we'll be afraid to lose it. And of course we need consciousness/mind in order to be happy, as happiness is a process of the consciousness/mind. And the end of consciousness is death.