Depression and Bad Dreams after Vipassana

[Rocco]

Strange things happening to me...

 

From time to time I like practicing observing my breath as meditation (as given in "Spiritual Reality"), since I enjoy the clear and concentrated state of mind afterwards. I focus on a point in my nose and "observe" the feelings of my breath there. Some call this Vipassana meditation, but since I concentrate quite intense, it's rather a kind of Samatha meditation.
After a while my breath almost ceases for a minute or so and then I have to take a deep breath again.

Meitation Time: 30-40 mins.

I am also doing Zhan Zhuang and PC muscle exercises.

So far, so good....

 

What I observe is, in the night following the breath meditation I have often intense and bad dreams and now I had a really awful depressed feeling in the morning! May this relate to the meditation? Am I doing something wrong? Or is this probably some kind of "clearing" the subconcious?

 

I did this kind of meditation last summer for one month once a day for 50 mins. with no other meditations during that period and I had no bad side effects. Maybe it is the combination with other meditation types that makes trouble?

 

 

Thanks for your help!

Edited December 14, 2016 by Rocco

[C T]

good dreams, bad dreams .. all are dreams. 

 

Dreams are empty.. thoughts that occur while in the sleep state.

Thoughts are empty... merely dreams that occur in the waking state. 

 

Do not be disturbed by either. Find the essence of both, and you will forever be free. 

[SeekerOfHealing]

The guy up saying that you need to convince yourself into believing that dreams are empty so they will be not affecting you which is not the right way or effort as Buddha put it about. (actually people speaking about emptiness have no idea what it is beside intellectual understanding which gives literally nothing beside talking unpractical gibberish)

 

What you are experiencing is just results of disturbed and stagnant Qi. There are various ways to cure it. The best would be some qigong exercises, secondly chanting for mantra purification (try usnisa dharani from usnisa dharani sutra - miracles and cleanses Qi like nothing else). Do not try to cheat or make conclusion about it. If someone is really about emptiness and have such high achievements let them put fire in the hand or go into cold naked - we will see if the same stuff works. Just do not be hypocrite. If you know how to realize threefold or fourfold emptiness then you would be godlike as body related things, seasons, influence of the planet, thoughts, feeling would cease to exists on experiencal besis. So right now do not treat your condition as empty but as very real thing which needs to be balanced by acupuncture, herbs, proper meditation related to balancing and calming, opening jing mai and other ways to first build the foundation. If you do post natal meditation you need to keep celibacy otherwise it's make no really sense to do such things.

Edited December 17, 2016 by SeekerOfHealing

[thelerner]

 Do not try to cheat or make conclusion about it. If someone is really about emptiness and have such high achievements let them put fire in the hand or go into cold naked - we will see if the same stuff works. Just do not be hypocrite. If you know how to realize threefold or fourfold emptiness then you would be godlike as body related things, seasons, influence of the planet, thoughts, feeling would cease to exists on experiencal besis. So right now do not treat your condition as empty but as very real thing which needs to be balanced by acupuncture, herbs, proper meditation related to balancing and calming, opening jing mai and other ways to first build the foundation.

I respect what you're saying and it'd be great if it works for the writer.  Still, we can put our hand to the fire and cold of a dream and be just fine.   The dream is.. empty, filled with what value we give it.   In this case the author's bought into the emotional symbolisms of it.   Is what CT pointing.. if you don't buy in/cling, if you realize its essential emptiness, you can get peace.   And that metaphor for dream is the same as life..??   Much of the drama is of our own making. 

 

Not so much becoming godlike as.. a bit more Zen, less pulled and pushed by the dramas of the world.

 

 

On the third hand, I like one famous dreamwork authors exhortation to take dreams more seriously (honor and figure them out) and life, less seriously.  Life as dream (full of symbolism and synchronicity, yet not to be taken too seriously), dreams as life (full of important messages to ponder and figure out).. to a certain point.   

[centertime]

I experienced similar things after energy exercises.. Things you do stir you up...

For me , one thing helps if you not do these exercises close to going bed... They seem to be more interns then...

You could also reduce the amount of exercises you do.

[SeekerOfHealing]

Emptiness for most people is just concept not real experience so it's makes no sense to say "Oh this is empty" - how it can help ? It's like saying to poor person on the street like hobo "hey you get rich" and thinking you did something good. Without understanding limitation of people you can not really point out emptiness by slogans like that for them.

 

Nightmares are typical signs and depression of weakness of kidney.

Edited December 17, 2016 by SeekerOfHealing

[atask]

Might be a late to reply but have just joined the forum.. I searched vipassana as recently did a 10 day retreat learning the technique with S.N. Goenka, they are free 10 day silent meditations in many countries.., the website is dhamma.org if you are interested however...

 

 What you are describing sounds like things deep rooted in your mind are coming to the surface, this also happened with me during the retreat and what we are told there is to just keep doing the practice (uprooting the mind) without reacting to what the mind is bringing up and showing us, by doing this we let it go and our mind is clearer.. It really works and after the 10 days my mind was much clearer and focus within meditation came easier.

 

 Also did the retreat to clear my mind to be able to start work with chi energy as had read about it a lot but had heard it is best to start with a clear mind as possible otherwise it can be dangerous so maybe the 10 day course would be good for you. I had meditated for a number of years before hand but during the first 10 hour day I realised the surface had been scratched slightly and by the end I had discovered a good practice. 

 

 Seeing as it's been a year since the dreams have there been any changes for you since then?

[C T]

9 hours ago, atask said:

Might be a late to reply but have just joined the forum.. I searched vipassana as recently did a 10 day retreat learning the technique with S.N. Goenka, they are free 10 day silent meditations in many countries.., the website is dhamma.org if you are interested however...

 

 What you are describing sounds like things deep rooted in your mind are coming to the surface, this also happened with me during the retreat and what we are told there is to just keep doing the practice (uprooting the mind) without reacting to what the mind is bringing up and showing us, by doing this we let it go and our mind is clearer.. It really works and after the 10 days my mind was much clearer and focus within meditation came easier.

 

 Also did the retreat to clear my mind to be able to start work with chi energy as had read about it a lot but had heard it is best to start with a clear mind as possible otherwise it can be dangerous so maybe the 10 day course would be good for you. I had meditated for a number of years before hand but during the first 10 hour day I realised the surface had been scratched slightly and by the end I had discovered a good practice. 

 

 Seeing as it's been a year since the dreams have there been any changes for you since then?

 

Hi, and welcome to TDB..

 

Just to let you know that Rocco hasn't 'officially' visited the site since April, so you might have to wait a bit to get an acknowledgement from him. It could be anytime, really. 

[Maddie]

In reply to the OP, yes this happens to me as well, as in for years. I get all sorts of different answers depending on who I ask, monk or not. In my opinion what happens is the practice brings awareness to the unpleasant stuff that was hidden in the mind previously. While unpleasant it is still useful if we make being mindful of the depression or what ever other suffering we become aware of part of the practice of observation.