The Kundalini Thread!

[Wun Yuen Gong]

Ok, lots of talk on Kundalini, ive never practiced it but have some dowload books and watched clips etc.

 

So far there is Kundalini exerices of twisting, and spiraling the spine and other things and there is meditation Kundalini where there is no exerices so which is correct?

 

Anyone completed TRUE Kundalini here?

 

Whats your views and stories of how you attained Kundalini?

 

WYG

[Sunya]

http://biologyofkundalini.com

 

a great site on the topic.

 

there are multiple ways of awakening kundalini. it's pretty late but i'll try to ramble a bit

 

it can happen spontaneously to those that lead a spiritual selfless and loving life, you can practice various yogas .all yoga is meant to awaken kundalini, such as hatha yoga for the body, but more importantly ones focused on breathing exercises (pranayama) and spinal breathing, very similar to microcosmic orbit. there are also various body locks performed wher eyou tighten your ass and stomach, . it's all about the kundalini, babay.

 

there's also the route of receiving the grace of a master. it's called shaktipat (shakti is kundalini and pat means to bestow), that's the route i'm taking. it's called maha yoga or siddha yoga. it's a bit difficult to find a true master though, but it's the easiest, safest, and best way to awaken the kundalini.

 

the idea of kundalini differs though from the taoist (neo-taoist) concepts of immortality. there is no talk of immortality in mystical hinduism, infact getting rid of the ego is imperative before you awaken the kundalini (hence the guru-disciple relationship), but it does tie into the taoist concept of merging with the tao, because that's what happens when you fully awaken the kundalini.

 

there is much emphasis on kundalini in tantra because they view it as the catalyst for awakening. it isn't some strange foreign energy that enters us, but rather it is consciousness,creativity, evolution, you.

[mantis]

you cannot awaken the kundalini without sex.

 

Never have I slept without a sweetheart

Nor have I spent a single drop of sperm.

- The Sixth Dalai Lama

 

nothing is spontaneous, as nothing in nature is spontaneous. a tree does not go from a seed to a tree "spontaneously" it happens with time; as so is the kundalini. i'd be highly weary of any techniques that support spontaneous awakenings.

[Jakara]

Ok, lots of talk on Kundalini, ive never practiced it but have some dowload books and watched clips etc.

 

So far there is Kundalini exerices of twisting, and spiraling the spine and other things and there is meditation Kundalini where there is no exerices so which is correct?

 

Anyone completed TRUE Kundalini here?

 

Whats your views and stories of how you attained Kundalini?

 

WYG

 

There is a great book on it called Kundalini Tantra: http://www.amazon.com/Kundalini-Tantra-Swa...i/dp/8185787158

 

It says (roughly) that its a combination of yogic postures, the correct breathing, visualisation, mudras, mantras and meditation. All used to bring about kundalini, which occurs when two types of internal energy are combined. This resulting kundalini is then sent up the spinal meridian (which its called sushumna) to open to chakras. Here is a diagram http://www.tantra-kundalini.com/nadis.htm

[Sunya]

you cannot awaken the kundalini without sex.

nothing is spontaneous, as nothing in nature is spontaneous. a tree does not go from a seed to a tree "spontaneously" it happens with time; as so is the kundalini. i'd be highly weary of any techniques that support spontaneous awakenings.

 

many have spontaneous kundalini awakenings, it is documented. there are many accounts. there are support networks that sprouted up just because of that.

and many have risen kundalini without sex, two such individuals being my guru and Robert Bruce.

 

please don't base all your facts off a video, i've seen it. but its only one piece of the puzzle.

what you're saying goes against everything that is known about kundalini, don't be so bold without offering proof.

 

oh and i'm sure that quote by dalai lama is misinterpreted, i'm sure he meant "a sweet heart"

Edited December 14, 2007 by mikaelz

[mantis]

if it was sweet heart then it would have literally been "sweet heart" not "sweetheart." white tantra (sahaja maithuna) is actually practiced in tibet in the buddhist tantra.

 

just because people feel tension in their head or something similar does not mean they have awakened their kundalini. nothing in nature is spontaneous; i repeat nothing in nature is spontaneous. people looking for "spontaneous" awakenings in my opinion are laggards, people who do not wish to work and just want things to happen for them while doing absolutely nothing. you must comprehend the ego before you try to dismantle it, not even a transmission from siddhartha gautama would do it for you. i have seen videos of people who have allegedly had spontaneous kundalini awakenings, they are not enlightened. this man here is a perfect example.

 

smg5ZHAl8X4

 

the whole idea of spontaneous activity is completely against the tao. the tao is for nature, and nature never makes leaps of any kind. it is a steady seed, slowly nurturing itself until it is ready to bloom with it's ripe fruits.

 

in the bible mankind was banished from eden because of the orgasm, thus it is through chaste sex we must enter again. the sexual energies are easily the most powerful energy we have accessible to us; they creates life. trying to awaken the consciousness and leaving the sexual energy out in the dark simply makes no sense whatsoever.

 

where are these "documented" spontaneous kundalini awakenings? where is the proof? tell me, since when can people here in the west determine if someone has awakened the kundalini. they can diagnose headaches and pressure in the head, but both can easily be related to stress. you are all for proof and down bring when it is not present yet you yourself do not provide any to support your claims.

Edited December 14, 2007 by mantis

[WhiteTiger]

the idea of kundalini differs though from the taoist (neo-taoist) concepts of immortality. there is no talk of immortality in mystical hinduism, infact getting rid of the ego is imperative before you awaken the kundalini (hence the guru-disciple relationship), but it does tie into the taoist concept of merging with the tao, because that's what happens when you fully awaken the kundalini.

 

So i'm just trying to learn here so I got a few questions. My understanding (which i'm claiming is quite limited) I was taught Kundalini is different then immortality. Even though novice experiences of immortality it seemed to me the more people talked about Kundalini the more it reminded me of Immortality. I don't know what you define as Ego, but my understanding is in immortality you need to dissolve your the ego also, but yet at the same time protect it and yourself from harm.

 

The Obvious problem or reasons I can't actually say its the same thing or similar, is because i never practiced any Kundalini practices.

 

you cannot awaken the kundalini without sex.

nothing is spontaneous, as nothing in nature is spontaneous. a tree does not go from a seed to a tree "spontaneously" it happens with time; as so is the kundalini. i'd be highly weary of any techniques that support spontaneous awakenings.

 

So i think you are getting mixed up. You claim you cannot awaken the Kundalini without sex... this i don't know about and i don't claim to. Where your getting mixed up is. is the way your defining spontaneity. We can say there are two groups of people who each consider spontaneity meaning two different things.

 

1. is that spontaneity means something just happens because it just happens. There are no laws involved with it just happened randomly out of no where.

 

2. Is Spontaneity is when multipule things happen in order and all a sudden because it did this in the exact order (that happened to be the proper and correct order) something happens. For example, Awakening of Kundalini. Because you are not aware of how it happened you call it spontaneity, but in reality you were just on your way to discover it for yourself because you had done all the other steps in order. Yes it spontaneously happened but also as you said "a tree does not go from a seed to a tree" "spontaneously" it happens with time; as so is the Kundalini". It happened the way it naturally happened as it is supposed to happen. As Siddhartha supposedly made the Eighth Fold Path for others to follow he must have figured them out by the same way, as he did the same as he became enlightened.

 

many have spontaneous kundalini awakenings, it is documented. there are many accounts.

 

Gopi Krishna I do believe he discovered the awakening of Kundalini. He is documented in history. (Weather this is actually true or not idk. but my understanding it is is. If you, Mantis claim this isn't Awakening of Kundalini, please say so. so i can basically retract all my questioning and questions i had about the Kundalini.)

 

I hope me saying the word "discovered" doesn't turn into a debate where he didn't discover it and then say whom the first person in history was to discover it is. It really doesn't matter whom first discovered it. It matters that you can find a teacher that teaches it. It shows hard that one person worked to rediscover it. Like Gopi Krishna it means he was deep down inside searching for it and had the right tools to find what he was looking for. Anyway, Gopi Krishna seems to be quit popular with the books on Kundalini matters.

 

just because people feel tension in their head or something similar does not mean they have awakened their kundalini. nothing in nature is spontaneous; i repeat nothing in nature is spontaneous. people looking for "spontaneous" awakenings in my opinion are laggards, people who do not wish to work and just want things to happen for them while doing absolutely nothing. you must comprehend the ego before you try to dismantle it, not even a transmission from siddhartha gautama would do it for you. i have seen videos of people who have allegedly had spontaneous kundalini awakenings, they are not enlightened.

 

Ok, so quit clearly you have made your point people looking just to gain something as instantly without hard work bothers you. And things don't happen from nothing to something great. it takes time. You can't go from level 1 and spontaneously end up at level 20 without going through all the levels in between. I'm sure someone claiming to gain something instantly bothers many other people also.

 

the whole idea of spontaneous activity is completely against the tao. the tao is for nature, and nature never makes leaps of any kind. it is a steady seed, slowly nurturing itself until it is ready to bloom with it's ripe fruits.

 

From my understanding of the Tao I thought it was different then nature but it co-exists with nature. Mind explaining?

Edited December 14, 2007 by WhiteTiger

[Sunya]

and Gopi Krishna is someone who had a full spontaneous kundalini awakening.

 

you're misinterpreting what spontaneous means. it isn't like a random thing, it's evolution. kundalini is tied to genius, creativity, and the next step in human evolution.

 

also, the dalai lama is celibate and does not have sex, tantric or not.

 

H.H.: According to our tradition, we are monastics and are celibate, and we practice the Tantrayana simultaneously. But the way of practice is through visualization. For example, we visualize the consort, but we never touch. We never implement this in actual practice.

http://www2.hawaii.edu/~tsomo/ordination/hh_q_a.html

 

http://www.kundalinisupportnetwork.com/ this group is a support group for those going through kundalini.

it is a real process, and it is happening to many people. these are regular people

 

the information is out there, i'm not going to spoon feed it to you. if you don't believe in spontaneous kundalini awakenings that you are ignorant of what many people are going through and misunderstand what kundalini is.

and you still have not read that link i sent you which is the best scientific approach to kundalini i've found http://biologyofkundalini.com

 

you also misunderstand what a shaktipat, or transmission does. it is merely one candle lighting another. the fuse is lit and the kundalini gets to work. it's a process and does not happen over night. you think that kundalini is merely sexual energy, but if that was the case 90% of america would be enlightened. it is more than that.

 

your interpretation of the bible is also just that, an interpretation which you received from a gnostic teacher. you can't know that it is 100% the truth. also, even if this is 100% the interpretation of the bible.. it doesn't matter because its still only one piece in the puzzle. unless you can find every spiritual text talking about white tantric sex then maybe you'll have a point, but you won't. in fact, in India where shakti/kundalini has been practiced for thousands of years.. most Gurus recommend celibacy and sublimating the sexual energy. all the swamis that live in the himalayas alone in caves must have blow up dolls eh?

 

really these neo-gnostic teachings are interesting, but they are only theories. don't get so closed minded that you believe only their teachings to be fact.

 

mantis, buddy, you have some studying to do.

Edited December 14, 2007 by mikaelz

[mantis]

the whole quote reads

 

H.H.: According to our tradition, we are monastics and are celibate, and we practice the Tantrayana simultaneously. But the way of practice is through visualization. For example, we visualize the consort, but we never touch. We never implement this in actual practice. Unless we have reached a stage where we have completely developed the power to control all our energy and have gained the correct understanding of sunya (emptiness, reality), unless we truly possess all the faculties through which those negative emotions can be transformed into positive energy, we never implement practice with an actual consort.

 

its safe to say the dalai lama would be at this level, wouldn't it?

 

90% of america would not be enlightened because there are certain ways of conducting yourself in the maithuna, mainly that you do not have an orgasm or ejaculate. that rules out that same "90%" you gave me.

 

whitetiger, the ego is your personality. everything that you believe defines you as a person. your behaviors, emotions, habits, fears, etc is all the ego. i don't know exactly what the concept is behind taoist immortality but i do know that all enlightenment is is when you make your subconscious mind the conscious.

 

my intentions where good when i first entered this discussion, i wanted people to be able to find out about this. but now it has turned into some form of a spiritual pride battle and i apologize, i'll stop posting here.

Edited December 15, 2007 by mantis

[Sunya]

did you not read the whole quote you yourself just posted?

 

"we never implement practice with an actual consort."

 

find me another source that says sex is the only way besides samael aun woer

 

this isn't about spiritual pride and i'm not saying that tantric sex can't be very beneficial for spiritual advancement and kundalini. you can even read about it here http://biologyofkundalini.com/article.php?story=TantricUnion

 

but when you say sex is the only way and your only source is one person, that is wrong and I want some proof of your claims

 

really though, it's just a healthy debate man. :]

Edited December 15, 2007 by mikaelz

[mantis]

http://xsplat.wordpress.com/2006/11/29/kun...ot-tantric-sex/

http://www.anmolmehta.com/blog/category/he...ing/tantra-sex/

 

those are two links ripped right off of google. look for any old traditions in which a caduceus is shown, it will hint you the ancient knowledge of the kundalini and the act of sex required to initiate it.

 

 

the sign of the aquarius; a woman trying to intelligently mix the sexual waters in order to create the divine.

 

 

the shiva linga of india, showing the need for the sexual connection of man and woman.

 

 

assyrian image of a caduceus - dating back to 2350 - 2150 BC

 

 

aztec caduceus

 

all of these cultures knew the importance of sexual magic (white tantra) in order to bring the kundalini into existence. none of this is neo-anything, this has and always been. lastly, here is the true image of the holy grail.

 

 

you can see the man and woman controlling the sexual waters with their snakes (which is the kundalini) as to not spill a drop (of semen, sexual liquor) and from the sexual waters rises a column (our spinal column) where the caduceus is shown, ida and pingala. the elohim surround them in these moments.

 

it is by far fine with me i just don't want this to escalate into some type of battle. everyone has their own path, i simply strongly believe this is mine.

 

here are some books on buddhist tantra

 

http://www.amazon.com/Introduction-Tantra-...8340&sr=8-1

http://www.amazon.com/Bliss-Inner-Fire-Pra...8340&sr=8-3

http://www.amazon.com/Preparing-Tantra-Mou...8428&sr=1-1

http://www.amazon.com/Kalachakra-Tantra-In...8510&sr=8-1

 

pretty "vivid" cover on that last one. the problem is that tantra itself is esoteric - it was a mystery school of hinduism, what we in the west would call occult. because of this secrecy about it i think this leaves a lot of room for charlatans to improvise and make up their own systems and techniques and what not. certainly interesting discussion.

Edited December 15, 2007 by mantis

[Wun Yuen Gong]

Great information and i didnt mean to start any arguements!

 

Does anyone have any pictures or clips of the true Kundalini exercises for the body?

 

cool thread lots of info keep it up, i think debates are all good and makes people express there feelings as long as its all in good chi!

[Sunya]

mantis,

 

by sources i didn't mean blogs. show me some real masters saying sex is the only way to awaken kundalini. show me one, and i'll show you 10 that say otherwise. but actually, i know anmol mehta. he lives by me and he knows his stuff. email him and ask yourself if sex is necessary, he will tell you no.

 

yes there is esoteric imagery that hints at sex, but none if it says sex is the only way. also it can be interpreted as male and female aspects of each human pointing to an androgynous person, someone who fully balances his yin and yang aspects.

 

the caduceus is a symbol of kundalini but it does not point to sex.it is the ida and pingala energy pathways going up the spine.

 

i didn't check out all the books you posted, but the one on kalachakra... that is a visualization exercise where you envision yourself as the buddha. it has nothing to do with sex. but i don't doubt tha tantra made its way to tibet and that its been used there. all i'm saying is that to say tantra is the only way to enlightenment is ignorant and singleminded. yes tantra can help for some, but it isn't necessary.

 

i just can't put any faith in your viewpoint when it says that any master, any yogi, any enlightened person who doesn't have sex can't become enlightened. thats just ridiculous, mate. i don't buy it.

Edited December 15, 2007 by mikaelz

[mantis]

you don't have to and that's the beauty of an opinion

[Wun Yuen Gong]

Mantis,

 

Do you or have you done the Vajrasattva visualization?

[WhiteTiger]

whitetiger, the ego is your personality. everything that you believe defines you as a person. your behaviors, emotions, habits, fears, etc is all the ego. i don't know exactly what the concept is behind taoist immortality but i do know that all enlightenment is is when you make your subconscious mind the conscious.

 

Thanks for the response. I believe along the way to immortality. (because I never reached there) that all your ego has to dissolve.

 

yes there is esoteric imagery that hints at sex, but none if it says sex is the only way. also it can be interpreted as male and female aspects of each human pointing to an androgynous person, someone who fully balances his yin and yang aspects.

 

Yet another show of similarities in the same practice of immortality. "Someone who fully balances his Yin and Yang aspects"

Edited December 15, 2007 by WhiteTiger

[Sunya]

mantis,

 

one of the links you posted was the website of anmol mehta.

i emailed him about this discussion,

here's what he had to say

 

Hi Mikael,

 

Sex is one method of awakening Kundalini, it is not necessary though as besides sex many other methods can be employed.

 

If this approach is to be used, a great deal of detachment and freedom from the sexual impulse is first needed.

[mantis]

i said up above you are free to your own opinion, do not take matters so seriously. this is my path, it may not be yours.

 

take it easy.

[Sunya]

about spontaneous kundalini awakening

 

http://swamij.com/kundalini-awakening.htm

 

The approach of these writings is to describe the systematic process of intentional Kundalini Awakening. However, it may also come spontaneously to people who have done no intentional practices. One may argue that spontaneous awakening may be coming as a result of previous practices that are not remembered, but in either case the perception of the individual may be that nothing was done to bring forward the experience.

 

not doubting your path buddy, but clearing it up to those who may read this thread and think your path is the only one

[mantis]

it is the only one - i don't see anyone enlightened on this forum

Edited December 19, 2007 by mantis

[Sunya]

and you are?

 

le sigh.

such arrogance.

 

haven't you learned anything from Star Wars? fear is the path to the dark side. I sense much fear in you.

scared you're on the wrong path are you? i can find you many 'enlightened' sources that say tantric sex is good stuff but isn't the only way, but you only got one source and a bunch of pictures for the 'one path' thing, buddy.

 

this is going nowhere.

 

we both obviously are not enlightened. this is merely an educational debate, and really you aren't doing that well in proving your position that sex is the only way. why keep arguing? this isn't about my path your path, this is you stating your path is the ONLY path. kinda like Jesus is the only way to heaven kinda thing. get my drift? it's annoying and ignorant.

[mYTHmAKER]

it is the only one - i don't see anyone enlightened on this forum

 

You don't?

[mantis]

see the thing is i never wished for intellectual debate - this is my path and that's that. i believe it is the only way, why do you wish to bring me elsewhere?

 

the entire idea of debating is to convince. to convince someone else you're right to make them more like you; you do not have to believe and more power to you if you don't - i do.

[Sunya]

for you this is about convincing, maybe you're unsure of your path.

for me it's making sure that people aren't misled by your opinion.. you claim it as fact, that was my point the whole time.

if you were so confident in your path you wouldn't need to argue its validity and say it's the only path. we each have different paths, my friend. don't get so big headed so as to assume that yours is the only one for everyone.

we are all different, that is why there are so many different yogas out there, besides tantric yoga. they all have the same goal.

Edited December 19, 2007 by mikaelz

[mantis]

i have stated many times it may not be for everyone but it is mine - people have the ability to decipher, you aren't needed as a middle man.