Homosexuality in the tao

[Orgasmic19]

I am sure this has been discussed before, but I was wondering how does one balance the energies in a homosexual relationship?

 

As human beings we both have feminine and masculine energies within us.

 

The male is naturally going to have more yang energy and the female more yin energy.

[Miffymog]

I feel the balance that is required is more within oneself. If you are able to balance your own yin and yang, then this is more important than external influences. If you are someone who gets lost in sexual energy, then chasing female sexual energy is just as draining as chasing male sexual energy.

[azucenaalev]

It's a tricky topic, but it seems to relate more to sex than other aspects of the relationship. Individuals may be more inclined to have yin/yang energies based on gender, but as unique people, it depends on the person. Plus, like Miffymog said, balancing your internal energy is what's important. 

 

Sexually though, it has to do with transference of energy. But I wouldn't say that the issue is restricted to homosexual relationships. At a basic level, men lose jing during sex and females lose jing as well, just less. Hypothetically, the amount of jing lost increases with homosexual couples.

 

There are ways to not lose energy, or to give energy when you don't normally based on your sex, etc. That's what Taoist sexual magic is for. So the solution then is if you're genuinely concerned with this energy thing, both partners train in Taoist sexual practices. But honestly, it's something all couples should (ideally) do, homosexual or heterosexual.

 

If you're interested in the Taoist sex practices, one good place to look is Matak Chia's books.

[Mandrake]

I'm afraid you're in uncharted territory. My intuition is that one should go for general principles: Learn how to feel the energies in your own body, how to balance them, to clean your mai, and work with the points in the central channel. Then expand to your environment.

 

Mantak Chia's sexual practices have screwed people up in a major way - search through past threads on this.

 

Anyway, I've only met a handful of people who have direct understanding and experience - hence authority -  of your question. PM me if you are interested.

 

 

M

[Bruce Qi]

Like mentioned above balance of your own energy regardless of what type of relationship you are in.

If you are naturally a passive partner make sure not to let the masculine energy go out of whack, practice yang exercises , if you are the dominant partner and more masculine balance it with some yin practices , practising surrender is good for this. Learn  inner orgasm for less energy drainage , stay away from chia !  energy orgasm book by ron james is the one I follow.

[[email protected]]

My understanding is that taoism relates to such cases as a deviation from our own nature, so homosexuality is treated as a serious spirit illness.
I dont want to say that such people have no chances in taoism or that they must change - it is their choise, I just wanted to figure out my understanding of taoist consept.

[Gofa]

My understanding is we possess a self balancing energy system

 

As a lesbian trapped in a mans body the spiritual implications of sex have always interested me

 

As i say. The Dao should be looked at through a smile

Edited February 19, 2017 by Gofa

[sillybearhappyhoneyeater]

One overlooked movement in 20th century Daoism in China is the field of modern Daoist philosophy and practice, such as those spearheaded by Chen Yingning, Pang Ming and others.   These people argued that Daoism has a modern application to current social problems and that as a living tradition, it must work in harmony with our  modern society.

I think Daoism in the west and China ought to start to investigate its views on homosexual unions, but that because it is a totally new subject, it hasn't been accurately argued yet.

My take on it is that homosexuality exists in the animal kingdom and as such, it is part of nature, but that from a Daoist paradigm, sexuality is something which is like an untamed horse and it should be brought under control and used carefully, so a homosexual union based on a long lasting relationship might be seen as a good thing for lay people, but just as is the case with heterosexual unions, the union should not be based purely on sexual gratification, since that has the effect of causing people to lose energy and become stagnant.   I haven't given that much thought to this, but that is my preliminary statement at least.

[SeekerOfHealing]

TCM can treat homosexuality like any other imbalance of yin and yang.

[Kar3n]

TCM can treat homosexuality like any other imbalance of yin and yang.

 

You have got to be kidding?  

 

I'd like to hear from a licensed TCM professional along with extensive research references before I give any credence that wild notion.

[SeekerOfHealing]

 

You have got to be kidding?

I'd like to hear from a licensed TCM professional along with extensive research references before I give any credence that wild notion.

I'm not kidding. Modern TCM practitioners needs to follow modern mind-set and accept homosexuality with "political correctness" but actually it can be treated. I wish I had homosexual friend to test those herbs. I think the recipe of herbal treatment was called something related to Dragon, if men have too much "dragon" they become gay. In nature everything can be changed by proper tools so men will start to carve women rather then men as it's just play of hormones so it can be fixed by TCM.

 

In free time I would look for this reference as it was very classic TCM/CCM book.

 

(By the same thing you can change heterosexual person into gay if you rise his dragon in the body)

 

It's all yin and yang, nothing it's fixed in Taji and everything can be changed one way or another but we do not always have method or knowledge to do so. Those who know yin and yang deeply can do almost anything with anyone.

Edited February 21, 2017 by SeekerOfHealing

[liminal_luke]

 I wish I had homosexual friend to test those herbs.

 

(By the same thing you can change heterosexual person into gay if you rise his dragon in the body)

 

It's all yin and yang, nothing it's fixed in Taji and everything can be changed one way or another but we do not always have method or knowledge to do so. Those who know yin and yang deeply can do almost anything with anyone.

 

Since you don`t have any homosexual friends to test your herbs on, why don`t you turn your straight friends gay instead?

 

(You can answer if you like, though I think I already know the answer.  I`m betting your straight friends don`t want to be gay because they see don`t see their straightness as a disease or defect.  They probably feel that they were meant to be straight, and don`t want to be "fixed."  Hmmm.....)

[SeekerOfHealing]

In terms of yin and yang being straight is okay. Being homosexual is imbalance. I would not say disease as it's not really pathogenic state. It's just imbalance which people can cope with one way or another but most of cases it's creating much tension in the mind. Too much dragon in med will led to much confusion in the world and he will be never feel "right" in the world or in harmony with the world.

 

"The Suicide Prevention Resource Center synthesized these studies and estimated that between 30 and 40% of LGBT youth, depending on age and sex groups, have attempted suicide, a rate 1.5-3 times higher than heterosexual youth".

 

So as gay you will not fully develop your spiritual potential - if you doubt it that means you do not yet reached high stage of cultivation when dragon is mingling with tiger.

Edited February 21, 2017 by SeekerOfHealing

[Kar3n]

 

I'm not kidding. Modern TCM practitioners needs to follow modern mind-set and accept homosexuality with "political correctness" but actually it can be treated. I wish I had homosexual friend to test those herbs. I think the recipe of herbal treatment was called something related to Dragon, if men have too much "dragon" they become gay. In nature everything can be changed by proper tools so men will start to carve women rather then men as it's just play of hormones so it can be fixed by TCM.

 

In free time I would look for this reference as it was very classic TCM/CCM book.

 

(By the same thing you can change heterosexual person into gay if you rise his dragon in the body)

 

It's all yin and yang, nothing it's fixed in Taji and everything can be changed one way or another but we do not always have method or knowledge to do so. Those who know yin and yang deeply can do almost anything with anyone.

I'd like to see some references of actual cures, not more claims of a cure from classic texts or anywhere else. 

 

There have been many changes in the way the Chinese view homosexuality in the last decade, so I would think that a lot of those classics are now obsolete.

 

 

In terms of yin and yang being straight is okay. Being homosexual is imbalance. I would not say disease as it's not really pathogenic state. It's just imbalance which people can cope with one way or another but most of cases it's creating much tension in the mind. Too much dragon in med will led to much confusion in the world and he will be never feel "right" in the world or in harmony with the world.

 

"The Suicide Prevention Resource Center synthesized these studies and estimated that between 30 and 40% of LGBT youth, depending on age and sex groups, have attempted suicide, a rate 1.5-3 times higher than heterosexual youth".

 

So as gay you will not fully develop your spiritual potential - if you doubt it that means you do not yet reached high stage of cultivation when dragon is mingling with tiger.

 

Every human gay or straight inherently embodies the tiger and the dragon energies. Finding the balance between the two has little or nothing to do with sexual orientation, but with the realization that they are present and then working to find that balance through practice.  As a heterosexual woman my energy tends to reside more on the side of the dragon. I have to practice to expand the tiger for balance. Based on your present theory, I should be gay, no? Or, if I expand the tiger too far, I will become gay?

 

You went from claiming that homosexuality can be cured with TCM to quoting suicide statistics for the LGBT community. I suspect that the suicide rate is high because of the judgement that something is wrong with them and rejection by their families and peers. Depression and anxiety are a byproduct of homosexuality, not the cause and can probably effectively be treated with TCM, but I am asking you to prove your claim for a cure, not for statistics on the mental health of the LGBT community.

 

There are many horror stories of people trying to be "cured" to please their families, none of them, through various methods of what can only be described as torture, everything from electro-shock therapy, to herbs, to exorcisms, to fecal therapy, have been "cured". Imagine that!

[Aetherous]

Dragon isn't a term used at all in TCM, nor do they have treatments for changing people's sexual orientation...but "dragon" was used in historical Chinese Medicine to describe the yang of the Kidneys. I'm not aware of a single Chinese Medicine practitioner who ever changed someone's sexual orientation.

[SeekerOfHealing]

No, big dragon in women do not make them gay or lesbian because gay women or lesbians do not exists so how you can become a lesbian? From TCM lesbians do not exist and some other people would agree on that. (This condition is only affected in men)

 

Big dragon means that you are loud women, very sexual and penis carving person. Strong dragon makes actually great "vampire" of women and they are pretty dangerous for men.

 

There is a lot to say and clarify in this topic as most people from what I see do not have even basic knowledge on this one so I can not talk rocket sciences to kindergarten kids beside in terms on examples as funny toys and fun. If I would start explaining it the way you want it you would not comperhand it anyway so it's up to you to follow up my things and research if they are true or not. Unless I can play with your big dragon we can then think of putting things on plate for you.

Edited February 21, 2017 by SeekerOfHealing

[Kar3n]

No, big dragon in women do not make them gay or lesbian because gay women or lesbians do not exists so how you can become a lesbian? From TCM lesbians do not exist and some other people would agree on that. (This condition is only affected in men)

 

Big dragon means that you are loud women, very sexual and penis carving person. Strong dragon makes actually great "vampire" of women and they are pretty dangerous for men.

 

There is a lot to say and clarify in this topic as most people from what I see do not have even basic knowledge on this one so I can not talk rocket sciences to kindergarten kids beside in terms on examples as funny toys and fun. If I would start explaining it the way you want it you would not comperhand it anyway so it's up to you to follow up my things and research if they are true or not. Unless I can play with your big dragon we can then think of putting things on plate for you.

 

Now you are just being insulting.

 

I have done research and have not found a single person who claims to have been cured, therefore I am asking you to back your claims with real documentation not insults and excuses as to why you will not.

[Brian]

My lesbian friends will get a kick out of learning they don't exist, I think.

 

I am reminded of the Iranian proclamation a while back that homosexuals simply didn't exist in Iran (except, apparently, the ones the were throwing off roofs...)

[Jonesboy]

No, big dragon in women do not make them gay or lesbian because gay women or lesbians do not exists so how you can become a lesbian? From TCM lesbians do not exist and some other people would agree on that. (This condition is only affected in men)

 

Big dragon means that you are loud women, very sexual and penis carving person. Strong dragon makes actually great "vampire" of women and they are pretty dangerous for men.

 

There is a lot to say and clarify in this topic as most people from what I see do not have even basic knowledge on this one so I can not talk rocket sciences to kindergarten kids beside in terms on examples as funny toys and fun. If I would start explaining it the way you want it you would not comperhand it anyway so it's up to you to follow up my things and research if they are true or not. Unless I can play with your big dragon we can then think of putting things on plate for you.

Maybe instead of thinking there is something wrong with people you can learn to accept them for who they are.

 

The things you are saying are a projection of the person you are. Read what you are saying and how it is making you look.

[SeekerOfHealing]

I do not see there any insults unless you take my words and beat yourself with them - I have no responsibility for people who insult themselves in that way as nobody else have responsibility of such when I'm doing that.

 

That's some old stuff I read about, you will not hear about healing homosexuals thru herbal medicine as it was in ancient times. You will find those recipes in old bedroom art books. I'm sure there are herbal remedies for homosexual imbalance and it would be nice to test them tho as some smart men can realize this can be problem for their wellbeing especially the HIV/AIDS statistics in gay community is outraging.

Edited February 21, 2017 by SeekerOfHealing

[Jonesboy]

I do not see there any insults unless you take my words and beat yourself with them - I have no responsibility for people who insult themselves in that way as nobody else have responsibility of such when I'm doing that.

 

That's some old stuff I read about, you will not hear about healing homosexuals thru herbal medicine as it was in ancient times. You will find those recipes in old bedroom art books. I'm sure there are herbal remedies for homosexual imbalance and it would be nice to test them tho as some smart men can realize this can be problem for their wellbeing especially the HIV/AIDS statistics in gay community is outraging.

Please reference my previous post.

[Mandrake]

Lol, somebody's clearly trolling this thread.

 

 

R

[Miffymog]

I'm going to try to find a middle way between what's been said here. If, innately, you are either one way leaning or the other way then that is pretty much how you are. If you are struggling to come to terms with that direction, the imbalances that SeekerOfHealing mentions may then result.

 

Due to what tends to be accepted in our society, the ones who do find it harder to come to terms with their direction are going to be those that are more homosexual leaning. BUT, for me, if you are comfortable with who you are, you will be quite happily balanced and it will have NO impact on your spiritual progress.

 

So, the nature of your sexuality is 'a prior' to your energetic balance. Which then means I'm with the majority of those on this thread where TCM neither can, nor should try to 'heal' you.

Edited February 21, 2017 by Miffymog

[Kar3n]

I do not see there any insults unless you take my words and beat yourself with them - I have no responsibility for people who insult themselves in that way as nobody else have responsibility of such when I'm doing that.

 

That's some old stuff I read about, you will not hear about healing homosexuals thru herbal medicine as it was in ancient times. You will find those recipes in old bedroom art books. I'm sure there are herbal remedies for homosexual imbalance and it would be nice to test them tho as some smart men can realize this can be problem for their wellbeing especially the HIV/AIDS statistics in gay community is outraging.

 

Please do not fool yourself into believing that you are not culpable for your actions. You have a responsibility on this forum to choose your words in a manner as to not insult another member for nationalities, genders, political preferences, lifestyle choices, etc. 

[SeekerOfHealing]

Yeah, but how stating facts is insulting? I mean if you say to someone that he is ugly while he is - yeah it will be not nice, but it will be true, do you understand? (and that person need to learn cope with that, with facts) I'm not saying homosexuals are bad or anything, you have attached your views to something which creates tensions if someone kick it out with ease, as most "views" are rather weak and without any ground in reality or any proofs beside creating comfort zone for people which then bark when someone step on it.

 

So, if you see any insult here - grow some... ba... beard.

 

You can not take facts as an insult if they are not directed to attack person otherwise you just giving birth for continuous stupidity and ignorance to roll on and which will end up bad for you too even if you had good intention.

 

Playing victimhood seems more and more popular even in spiritual forums, so called spiritual forum, which maybe 2 or 4 people here are genuine cultivators.

 

So, the nature of your sexuality is 'a prior' to your energetic balance. Which then means I'm with the majority of those on this thread where TCM neither can, nor should try to 'heal' you.

Homosexuality is results of energetic lack of balance of post natal energy. Good Qigong master can set gay men straight if he would like to or some qigong practices, or TCM remedies which mostly work on basis of Qi. It's basic concept of TCM.

Edited February 21, 2017 by SeekerOfHealing