All energy is equal?

[dwai]

Interesting theory. Are you somehow differentiating an "immortal" from what you are calling an "immortal spirit"? Or are you saying that an immortal is dualistic (and hence in your view unrealized)?

That which is truly immortal is the eternal awareness that is apart from being or non-being, existence or non-existence.

 

The immortal spirits are very close to that awareness but still have name and form. If they have name and form, they (the being of name and form) are not nondual. I don't say they are unrealized at all. They are quite the opposite -- wise, powerful, compassionate. They show us the way, help us when we are ready to grow out of our limited nature.

 

But that which is nondual is apart from either realization or non-realization as well. Immortality imho is to be outside space and time entirely, which ironically we all are, already

[Jeff]

That which is truly immortal is the eternal awareness that is apart from being or non-being, existence or non-existence.

 

The immortal spirits are very close to that awareness but still have name and form. If they have name and form, they (the being of name and form) are not nondual. I don't say they are unrealized at all. They are quite the opposite -- wise, powerful, compassionate. They show us the way, help us when we are ready to grow out of our limited nature.

 

But that which is nondual is apart from either realization or non-realization as well. Immortality imho is to be outside space and time entirely, which ironically we all are, already

 

 

A perceived name and form is in the eye of the beholder, not necessarily the immortal. Additionally, from the perspective of a true immortal, there is no such thing as being inside or outside of time and space. Such a "boundary" is only an illusion of the mind.

 

In buddhism, this is why a buddha is said to have three kayas/bodies.  The Nirmankaya is physically manifest, the Sambhogkaya is in time and space, but unbounded by it, and the Dharmakaya is beyond time and space and resides in emptiness.  But, there is only one "thing" from the view of the buddha, it is the sentient beings at different states of development that perceive different bodies.

[3bob]

I'll raise you a tit for that tat...

[allinone]

A perceived name and form is in the eye of the beholder, not necessarily the immortal. Additionally, from the perspective of a true immortal, there is no such thing as being inside or outside of time and space. Such a "boundary" is only an illusion of the mind.

 

In buddhism, this is why a buddha is said to have three kayas/bodies.  The Nirmankaya is physically manifest, the Sambhogkaya is in time and space, but unbounded by it, and the Dharmakaya is beyond time and space and resides in emptiness.  But, there is only one "thing" from the view of the buddha, it is the sentient beings at different states of development that perceive different bodies.

 

Three kayas? Head, torso, limbs. Truth body, Enjoyment body, Manifesting body.

[Marblehead]

I'll raise you a tit for that tat...

 

I always did like tits.

[cold]

Tea for two and tits for you!

[dwai]

A perceived name and form is in the eye of the beholder, not necessarily the immortal. Additionally, from the perspective of a true immortal, there is no such thing as being inside or outside of time and space. Such a "boundary" is only an illusion of the mind.

 

In buddhism, this is why a buddha is said to have three kayas/bodies. The Nirmankaya is physically manifest, the Sambhogkaya is in time and space, but unbounded by it, and the Dharmakaya is beyond time and space and resides in emptiness. But, there is only one "thing" from the view of the buddha, it is the sentient beings at different states of development that perceive different bodies.

I see. So sambhogakaya is like the annamaya Kosha + pranamaya kosha, nirmanakaya is like the manomaya + vijnanamaya + Anandamaya kosha and dharmakaya is the Brahman?

[Jeff]

I see. So sambhogakaya is like the annamaya Kosha + pranamaya kosha, nirmanakaya is like the manomaya + vijnanamaya + Anandamaya kosha and dharmakaya is the Brahman?

No, I think you may be missing my point. They are not separate Koshas (levels of Atman unfolding) or spiritual development. A Buddha has realized ultimate emptiness. As I stated earlier, the kayas are how sentient beings can interact or perceive the Buddha, depending on their own perceptional capacity. The "visible" form at a manifest level would be the nirmankaya. Only those who have realized the 8th bhumi can directly interact at the sambhogkaya, but all can feel the "effect" of that kaya even though they can't "see" it.

[Bindi]

That which is truly immortal is the eternal awareness that is apart from being or non-being, existence or non-existence.

 

The immortal spirits are very close to that awareness but still have name and form. If they have name and form, they (the being of name and form) are not nondual. I don't say they are unrealized at all. They are quite the opposite -- wise, powerful, compassionate. They show us the way, help us when we are ready to grow out of our limited nature.

 

But that which is nondual is apart from either realization or non-realization as well. Immortality imho is to be outside space and time entirely, which ironically we all are, already

I kind of agree with you about this, and keeping it simple ie. the one daoist immortal spirit, it can become a matter of personal philosophy/belief/experience, whether this life progresses to an immortal spirit or whether you can jump to non-dual 'eternal awareness'.