bad connotation imo

[3bob]

sounds like many of us are experts in conceptual use of the term "empty",  which may give a false and or bad connotation to some imo..

 

better to walk around conceptually saying, everything is "happy" which is as close as words can get to fact, and that is happy without it's normal counter part of sadness.  So I suggest some might try that for a change of pace 

Edited April 24, 2017 by 3bob

[thelerner]

I like to use the term quiet, instead of empty.  My goal is to have a quiet mind.  Realizing there's the loud talking layer of mind, commenting and judging.  There's a lower level of emotional noise playing in the background, then there's a whole steaming mess of subconscious boiling away beneath that.  Full of cultural conditioning and bias's.   

 

So, striving to keep it quiet seems the best that I can do. 

 

In some ways 'happy' is just another thought, though it sets up the emotional level.  These days I'm thinking 'happy' is the difference between what we expect/hope the world/outcomes to be and what it is.  We'll gain greater contentment if give up constantly wanting things (and people to be) different then they are. 

 

There are gross wrongs that should irk us and call for action, but we have such hair triggers that its like living with an angry radio news shock jock, always on.   

[rex]

How about a Tai Chi mind? Movement in the stillness and stillness in the movement.

[3bob]

I like the quiet idea which translates to me as peaceful.  So with peace one is not up against the wall or walls of noise (so to speak)pressing down!  Thus there are more options that are available besides just the fight or flight reactions taking over. 

[3bob]

Btw, I did not mean a "happy" that comes and goes with highly conditional thoughts, emotions or the gaining of objects, more like what is the deep and abiding  happy smile on the face of a great master or realized being about and why?  (and our trying to at least touch into that now and then)

 

besides walking around in what can turn into a non-edifying and repetitious,  "everything is empty or is an illusion", blah, blah, blah

Edited April 24, 2017 by 3bob

[Zhongyongdaoist]

How about a Tai Chi mind? Movement in the stillness and stillness in the movement.

Wuji is probably a better description, since the point is to get outside of Taiji (Tai Chi, supreme ultimate), and into the limitless, wuji, outside of space and time, the prenatal void which is not empty. Put another way, it is to switch from the post-natal world of the Loshu to the prenatal world of the Hotu.

 

This is an interesting cross cultural comparison to a passage in Plato's dialogue Phaedrus:

 

. . . here is an example of Platonic writing in the form of a "philosophical myth" about the "feast of the Soul" on truth:

 

The soul (245c–249d)

 

In heaven, he explains, there is a procession led by Zeus, who looks after everything and puts things in order. All of the gods, with the exception of Hestia, follow Zeus in this procession. While the chariots of the gods are balanced and easier to control, other charioteers must struggle with their bad horse, which will drag them down to earth if it has not been properly trained.[Note 25] As the procession works its way upward, it eventually makes it up to the high ridge of heaven, where the gods take their stands, are taken in a circular motion and gaze at all that is beyond heaven.[Note 26]

 

What is outside of heaven, says Socrates, is quite difficult to describe, lacking color, shape, or solidity, as it is the subject of all true knowledge, visible only to intelligence.[Note 27] The gods delight in these things and are nourished. Feeling wonderful, they are taken around until they make a complete circle. On the way they are able to see Justice, Self-control, Knowledge, and other things as they are in themselves, unchanging. When they have seen all things and feasted on them, coming all the way around, they sink back down inside heaven.[Note 28] (Wikipedia article on the Phaedrus, On the Soul, emphasis mine, ZYD)

I hope this is helpful.

[3bob]

Zhongyongdaoist,  thanks for the information!

[rex]

Wuji is probably a better description, since the point is to get outside of Taiji (Tai Chi, supreme ultimate), and into the limitless, wuji, outside of space and time, the prenatal void which is not empty. Put another way, it is to switch from the post-natal world of the Loshu to the prenatal world of the Hotu.

 

This is an interesting cross cultural comparison to a passage in Plato's dialogue Phaedrus:

 

I hope this is helpful.

Thanks! Wuji is a much better description and the reference to Plato is illuminating.

 

Edit: Speling coerrtcion

Edited April 24, 2017 by rex

[3bob]

My take: The one eternal Atman is free from or "empty" of bindings to all forms for It knows Itself by the Self, yet that does not mean spiritual divorce from forms. 

[qicat]

sounds like many of us are experts in conceptual use of the term "empty",  which may give a false and or bad connotation to some imo..

 

better to walk around conceptually saying, everything is "happy" which is as close as words can get to fact, and that is happy without it's normal counter part of sadness.  So I suggest some might try that for a change of pace 

I believe in buddhist terms you are referring to rigpa state. Note, it's a little bit different than total non-duality "emptiness" ( as you cannot really function in that state as human anyway). But wuji/rigpa state in human form is a very pleasant state of being. 

[Jonesboy]

I believe in buddhist terms you are referring to rigpa state. Note, it's a little bit different than total non-duality "emptiness" ( as you cannot really function in that state as human anyway). But wuji/rigpa state in human form is a very pleasant state of being.

That sounds more like an open heart than Rigpa.

[C T]

I believe in buddhist terms you are referring to rigpa state. Note, it's a little bit different than total non-duality "emptiness" ( as you cannot really function in that state as human anyway). But wuji/rigpa state in human form is a very pleasant state of being. 

rigpa has nothing to do with pleasant states. 

[qicat]

rigpa has nothing to do with pleasant states. 

 

perhaps pleasant is not the right word

the concept is the same however

"being in the flow and be empty" alert and awake and with the quiet/clear  mind

[Fa Xin]

I like the quiet idea which translates to me as peaceful. So with peace one is not up against the wall or walls of noise (so to speak)pressing down! Thus there are more options that are available besides just the fight or flight reactions taking over.

Yes, quiet for me naturally translates to peaceful / happy !

[qicat]

That sounds more like an open heart than Rigpa.

perhaps

with the collective wisdom we will define the state and the moment it s defined we will lose it:) ( as Dao cannot be defined...)

[Jonesboy]

perhaps

with the collective wisdom we will define the state and the moment it s defined we will lose it:) ( as Dao cannot be defined...)

How will we lose it?

 

Also, Rigpa doesn't need a quiet mind....

[Brian]

Of all the things I've lost, I miss my mind the most.

[thelerner]

How will we lose it?

 

over thinking. 

analyzing instead of being

[Jonesboy]

over thinking. 

analyzing instead of being

That sure can happen

[rene]

perhaps pleasant is not the right word

the concept is the same however

"being in the flow and be empty" alert and awake and with the quiet/clear mind

I like 'unencumbered'.

[C T]

 

"being in the flow and be empty" alert and awake and with the quiet/clear  mind

rigpa is whats behind all of this jargon. 

[qicat]

I see we have lots of tantra experts here... okay.... MEOW...

[C T]

I see we have lots of tantra experts here... okay.... MEOW...

its basic knowledge for those who want the authenticity intact.