Zhuang zi translations recommendations

[Mig]

Zhuang ziers,

 

I am contemplating 3 books on Zhuang zi translation:

A.C. Graham

Burton Watson

Victor Mair

Any recommendation for a beginner who almost read the DDJ. Not looking for a fancy translation but something that is close to the original or it can be understood easily.

 

Thanks a bunch,

 

[Daeluin]

Hi Mig,

Personally I've found these translations to be hard to access clear meaning in, but have found Brook Ziporyn's translation to be incredibly lucid and accurate. Highly recommended.

[Mig]

14 minutes ago, Daeluin said:

Hi Mig,

Personally I've found these translations to be hard to access clear meaning in, but have found Brook Ziporyn's translation to be incredibly lucid and accurate. Highly recommended.

What did you like about this translation compared with the 3 I've been trying to read and understand?

 

Thanks

[Daeluin]

Might just be a personal thing, but when I read the other translations I find myself struggling to comprehend them, but when I read this one everything seems very logical.

 

There are lots of reviews on amazon with more specifics, just wanted to offer up another perspective. Good luck!

[Marblehead]

As always, I recommend Burton Watson's translation.  He has a nice introduction and good notes.  It includes all 33 chapters which is important for me in following Daoist thought based on Chuang Tzu's philosophy.

 

PS  I do have Ziporyn's translation but have not yet given it a fair reading so I cannot comment to it.

 

 

Edited May 17, 2017 by Marblehead

[dust]

Sorry I can't give you a straight answer but... I flit around between Legge and Watson, and more recently Mair. I've read through parts of Nina Correa's and Brook Ziporyn's too, though not much.

 

It depends on what you want out of it.

If you want a thorough reading, one isn't enough. Use at least 3! And use Legge, because he was wordy. Sometimes that's helpful.

If you want a leisurely read.. any of the above except for Legge's, probably. Watson's is not 'perfect' by any means but generally does the trick for me.

[dawei]

I like Eno

 

 

 

[Mig]

On 5/18/2017 at 9:49 AM, dust said:

Sorry I can't give you a straight answer but... I flit around between Legge and Watson, and more recently Mair. I've read through parts of Nina Correa's and Brook Ziporyn's too, though not much.

 

It depends on what you want out of it.

If you want a thorough reading, one isn't enough. Use at least 3! And use Legge, because he was wordy. Sometimes that's helpful.

If you want a leisurely read.. any of the above except for Legge's, probably. Watson's is not 'perfect' by any means but generally does the trick for me.

Thanks and I appreciate your effort in giving me some insight. What I want or what I need? I guess both but I don't want a reading that makes me sleep. For some reason I started reading Watson and after a few lines, I couldn't relate to the original line of thought. Maybe it is me. Not to mention Legge, it is too sophisticated to me. I will go back again and read some lines. My objective is to be able to compare the translation to the original text and being able to learn how to read the original text in Classical Chinese.

Thanks a bunch

[Mig]

On 5/18/2017 at 11:23 AM, dawei said:

I like Eno

 

 

 

Thanks Dawei, it is certainly helpful. I also wonder what is that you or people in general like in those translations for you to understand the message or the understanding of those short stories? Has that helped to have a profound understanding from the original Chinese text or is it the language style translation that resonates better to you? And why they don't translate all the chapters from Zhuang zi? Just curious

[dawei]

21 minutes ago, Mig said:

Thanks Dawei, it is certainly helpful. I also wonder what is that you or people in general like in those translations for you to understand the message or the understanding of those short stories? Has that helped to have a profound understanding from the original Chinese text or is it the language style translation that resonates better to you? And why they don't translate all the chapters from Zhuang zi? Just curious

 

I think two items:   Clarity and faithful to the original.

 

Not saying it is the best but so far, I have found in comparisons I keep going to it to understand the other translators.

[CityHermit!]

I almost made a thread to ask this too. Thanks for recommendations.

[Riyue]

Maybe interesting for people who can read german:

October 2017  a new translation got published:

Zhuangzi Herausgeber Viktor Kalinke 896 Seiten

[Christopher Tricker]

Using a few short examples, I compare my own translation to Watson's, Mair's, and Ziporyn's. I present the Chinese sinographs and discuss how each of us has gone about translating them. Here's a link:

https://www.thecicadaandthebird.com/why-this-new-translation-is-so-good

 

(Try to forgive the page title--why this new translation is so good. It's meant to be tongue-in-cheek.)

 

[Mig]

On 5/21/2023 at 3:54 PM, Christopher Tricker said:

Using a few short examples, I compare my own translation to Watson's, Mair's, and Ziporyn's. I present the Chinese sinographs and discuss how each of us has gone about translating them. Here's a link:

https://www.thecicadaandthebird.com/why-this-new-translation-is-so-good

 

(Try to forgive the page title--why this new translation is so good. It's meant to be tongue-in-cheek.)

 

Great initiative in explaining those stories rather than just translating them without any explanation. I am discovering that behind each commentary there are more explanations that can be useful in real life situations and the metaphors are helpful to bring those stories more vivid captions about what the author wanted to convey. So there is a tradition in which is explained and I have found some explanations that fit well in the Chinese mind. I am finding that many of those stories became idiomatic expressions 成语 chéng yǔ and in this way I can understand better the translations. Thanks for sharing your own translations. They are very helpful.