Why LonemanPai is just another fake alchemy website

[Abzu]

Just now, voidisyinyang said:

 

Glad it helped! Yes I searched a lot to find a wide variety of references to corroborate this secret because it is very strange to practice! haha.

it's interesting because the body seems to want to do it naturally by default. when I was and do use LMP tech, it begins to respond towards forming breaths in this way without the mind knowing what it is doing. except the lmp tech has the perenium drop the flex on the inhale, but I have noticed a passive increase in perenium tightness from the practice in general. the reassurance of what is actually happening helps greatly. 

[beachbum78]

LoneManPai? The name itself is an oxymoron...

 

Questions.

 

1. Who is this guy?

2. Who is his teacher?

3. What skill did he master?

 

Personally my time and energy is too precious to spend on a guy who's credentials I cant verify. There are too many real taoist masters out there to spend my time on a fake one. 

 

Chinese culture isnt bullshit they have lineage charts for a reason. 

 

Plus just teaching and having a couple of teachings doesnt make a Pai. An informal or formal one. 

 

Honestly just sounds like a bunch of kids who read Magus of Java too many times and are having fun on the internet and just making it up as they go. 

Edited March 19, 2019 by beachbum78

[freeform]

14 hours ago, beachbum78 said:

Honestly just sounds like a bunch of kids who read Magus of Java too many times and are having fun on the internet and just making it up as they go. 

 

That was my first impression too

[Cheshire Cat]

On 18/3/2019 at 8:03 PM, voidisyinyang said:

Now the final secret is that Master Nan, Huai-chin teaches it’s crucial to hold the breath only after exhale.

 

Where did you read that?  There's a YouTube video where he says exactly the opposite: exhale, inhale, hold. 

[Abzu]

On ‎3‎/‎19‎/‎2019 at 1:13 PM, beachbum78 said:

LoneManPai? The name itself is an oxymoron...

 

Questions.

 

1. Who is this guy?

2. Who is his teacher?

3. What skill did he master?

 

Personally my time and energy is too precious to spend on a guy who's credentials I cant verify. There are too many real taoist masters out there to spend my time on a fake one. 

 

Chinese culture isnt bullshit they have lineage charts for a reason. 

 

Plus just teaching and having a couple of teachings doesnt make a Pai. An informal or formal one. 

 

Honestly just sounds like a bunch of kids who read Magus of Java too many times and are having fun on the internet and just making it up as they go. 

judging a practice based on what it appears to be is quite pretentious, imo

 

I categorize it under what falun gong would call a "crooked-door" path 

 

I'd wager every human body works the same on the inside; what you call what you're doing really doesn't matter, unless what you call your practice affects you, in which case, you're doing it wrong.

 

you say you're afraid of "spending your time on a guy" but I think that's already the wrong approach.

 

as someone who has used it, the technical maneuvers are good, and the thought processes around the ritual aspect is pretty clean and straightforward. 

 

it looks like a joke because it's western ritual thought and practice + gnostic philosophy + qigong under the guise that it's all mentalism+electromagnetic manipulation, and maybe some quantum spook. 

 

only issue I had with it is that ritual + coven-type is not my path currently. too much new age reminiscience. the actual physical woo (from the techs-your body) is pretty impressive though. 

 

not gonna praise it but I'm not gonna trash it

[Abzu]

ill put it this way, my practice was weirder and more intense using the techs. my body was in a more intense state. 

 

I got a lot of adrenaline and serotonin using it. I used it as a form of escapism. that was my own problem. 

 

abstaining from this, practicing milder and more traditional techs, I started working on my self, and eventually got the golden "holographic" light to manifest.

 

 

 

 

[voidisyinyang]

4 hours ago, Cheshire Cat said:

 

Where did you read that?  There's a YouTube video where he says exactly the opposite: exhale, inhale, hold. 

yes you can provide a link.

I am not sure where I read that from Master Nan, Huai-chin.

There is also the Kriya yoga teaching:

 

Quote

the breath is held for several seconds after the exhalation is complete.

http://perceivebelieve.tumblr.com/post/159904989496/the-idiots-guide-to-taoist-alchemy-qigong

 

So there is a science to this...

Quote

Dr. Shin Lin at UC-Irvine, documented, using transcranial Photon Migration Spectroscopy, a great increase in brain oxygen from holding the breath after exhale

the vagus nerve is activated from retention after exhale

Quote

Tumo was associated with a hyperdynamic vasodilated state with increased biventricular performance. We postulate that tumo results in a massive increase in sympathetic activity with activation of brown adipose tissue and marked heat production. The increased heat production may explain the paradoxical vasodilatation in tumo practitioners exposed to subzero temperatures.

 

So then as the breath is held after exhale you get the parasympathetic rebound which then increases the oxygen levels in the brain and stores up the qi or prana energy. As this technique of continued, with 30 deep breaths followed by breath retention after exhale, then with each cycle the oxygen in the brain increases and the parasympathetic nervous system stores up

[beachbum78]

Quote

Personally my time and energy is too precious to spend on a guy who's credentials I cant verify.

 

 

Your whole post just reiterates my point...

 

Look if he cant verify himself. 

 

Than he is a fraud. 

 

If he can go around an say John Chang is dead and a necromancer than I can say until he shows some proof that he is an actual teacher with an authentic practice that he didnt make up than he is a fraud.

 

LoneManPai is just made up bullshit prove me wrong.

Edited March 21, 2019 by beachbum78

[beachbum78]

6 hours ago, beachbum78 said:

None of that answers any questions which I posed a few times.

 

Who was his teacher?

What does he teach?

What skill did he develop?

 

Saying your a Pai and doing neigong and jin dan alchemy and you are not a taoist or a kung fu master or chikung teacher is just fraudulent. (maybe that's why he wears the mask..)

 

If he is a chikung teacher than what form of chikung does he teach?

 

I mean how can you validate that he's not lying to you and just making it up?

 

What makes lonemanpai a Pai?

 

What just because he says so give me a break.

 

How does he even know what a Pai is if he was never part of one?

 

In fact,

 

Until he answers the above questions I'll consider him and LoneManPai pure and utter fraud. 

 

There is no proof that he didnt just make this shit up and is passing it off as legit.

 

Should be easy to answer if he is authentic.

[Abzu]

18 minutes ago, beachbum78 said:

 

 

Your whole post just reiterates my point...

 

Look if he cant verify himself. 

 

Than he is a fraud. 

 

If he can go around an say John Chang is dead than I can say until he shows some proof that he is an actual teacher with an authentic practice that he didnt make up than he is a fraud.

 

LoneManPai is just made up bullshit prove me wrong.

I think the issue is you're trying to fit lonemanpai into an eastern context, and it isn't the same. 

 

his fault for framing his school that way 

 

it's a standalone practice, closer to a western lodge than an eastern lineage.

 

it utilizes eastern techniques and language, but is western in flavour

 

the dude claims to be heavy on enochian ritual magick and has books about it. thus, the information is "channeled-coming from the unconscious." different from being passed down orally. 

 

as with anything, the materials are more important than the picture they're framed in, and the utilizable technique is there.

 

i don't get why you're focusing on him as an individual over the materials he has put out. what is the point in that

 

i just feel like its pretty bad to say you can bash him because he bashes someone else. where's the wholesomeness in that 

 

Edited March 21, 2019 by Abzu

[beachbum78]

7 minutes ago, Abzu said:

I think the issue is you're trying to fit lonemanpai into an eastern context, and it isn't the same. 

 

his fault for framing his school that way 

 

it's a standalone practice, closer to a western lodge than an eastern lineage.

 

it utilizes eastern techniques and language, but is western in flavour

 

the dude claims to be heavy on enochian ritual magick and has books about it. thus, the information is "channeled-coming from the unconscious." different from being passed down orally. 

 

as with anything, the materials are more important than the picture they're framed in, and the utilizable technique is there.

 

i don't get why you're focusing on him as an individual over the materials he has put out. what is the point in that  

 

 

He uses the terms which alludes to it. Using those terms and accepting Toudai (students) and charging them a monthly fee like an instructor while recruiting online. Asking who he is - is just common sense. A just man presents himself justly like normal teachers.

 

Ya know the more I think about it how much you wanna bet he took the practices from a real teacher put a new name on it and hid behind a mask and started a private forum?

 

What do you think did I hit the nail on the head?

 

If not an he didnt make it up than he learned it honestly and justly and has his teacher's permission to teach that's if his practices are authentic. An not made up or pirated. 

 

Then answering my questions should be no problem.

Edited March 21, 2019 by beachbum78

[Abzu]

1 minute ago, beachbum78 said:

 

He uses the terms which alludes to it. Using those terms and accepting Toudai (students) and charging them a monthly fee like an instructor while recruiting online. Asking who he is - is just common sense. A just man presents himself justly like normal teachers.

 

Ya know the more I think about it how much you wanna bet he took the practices from a real teacher put a new name on it and hid behind a mask and started a private forum?

 

What do you think did I hit the nail on the head?

 

If not an he didnt make it up than he learned it honestly and justly and has his teacher's permission to teach that's if his practices are authentic. An not made up or pirated. 

he only recently started charging. it was running for 5 years before that and he has other things on the web under different names.

 

im guessing the goal in charging now is to keep registration low. 

 

if he took them from a different teacher, then i would very much like to find his source. I have not found anything precisely like it. i have however found comparable techniques on my own (through meditation, vision) after discontinuing use. 

 

that's kind of what im saying though. if he took them from what you call a "real" teacher, would you not still want the tech? also, to imply or make that accusation is pretty harsh, considering you have no way to back it up. and if you do, please give, because the techs are nice 

 

 

 

 

 

[beachbum78]

53 minutes ago, Abzu said:

 

imply or make that accusation is pretty harsh

 

Harsh? 

 

Life is harsh. Masters are harsh. You read the magus of java Pai Lok Nen took the eyes of Lim. They later fought so hard that each other died from the strikes - dim mak with shattered bones and busted organs.

 

Even in Wing Chun they have eye strikes to permanently damage the eyes and low leg kicks to break the knees. This is taught before any internal power development..

 

The Chinese are very thorough.

 

I hope the teacher of LonManPai has thought of all of this.  

[Abzu]

i simply meant that it is a bad accusation from a logical standpoint. making assumptions is bad. pointless to a waste of time. 

 

that being said, i look forward to looking into the forementioned story and pai 

[beachbum78]

Just now, Abzu said:

i simply meant that it is a bad accusation from a logical standpoint. making assumptions is bad. pointless to a waste of time. 

 

that being said, i look forward to looking into the forementioned story and pai 

 

No its not. Asking for credentials isnt a waste of time.

 

Paying and learning from a guy who may be bs is a waste of time.

 

Sorry.

[Abzu]

1 minute ago, beachbum78 said:

 

No its not. Asking for credentials isnt a waste of time.

 

Paying and learning from a guy who may be bs is a waste of time.

 

Sorry.

the assumption itself is the waste, my friend. that is my point. 

 

if it were beneficial for you to take the info he has, then it would not matter what the credentials are, nor would a pay in for access to them. bookstores work this way. you have decided it is not, and this is clearly fine. but, the point is that these 2 issues are separate, as he is not the info he provides. 

[beachbum78]

Just now, beachbum78 said:

Too bad LonmenPai guys due to an insane misunderstanding you could have got more from a simple kung fu school..

 

http://internalenergygongfu.com/it/foto

 

 

Oh well I guess Kung Fu isnt good enough ill leave you with this.

 

 

So sad you could have learned the real thing...

 

[Abzu]

20 minutes ago, beachbum78 said:

 

Right 

 

So you're making fun of a Crowleyian inspired goetia/qaballah/astral chatroom with qigong techs for not looking like a traditional Chinese lineage. 

 

All 3 of us (including me) look dumb right now. 

 

Let him wave his candles around in peace. 

 

Now the techs, the part of this that is relevant, some of them are phenomenal, and I have benefited greatly from using them. 

 

 

[Cheshire Cat]

5 hours ago, voidisyinyang said:

yes you can provide a link.

I am not sure where I read that from Master Nan, Huai-chin.

There is also the Kriya yoga teaching

 

 

 

[beachbum78]

54 minutes ago, Abzu said:

Right 

 

So you're making fun of a Crowleyian inspired goetia/qaballah/astral chatroom with qigong techs for not looking like a traditional Chinese lineage. 

 

All 3 of us (including me) look dumb right now. 

 

Let him wave his candles around in peace. 

 

Now the techs, the part of this that is relevant, some of them are phenomenal, and I have benefited greatly from using them. 

 

 

 

Abzu,

 

All those in the know know that magic cant hold up to kung fu.

 

Magic can bring bad luck and entities and some sickness but it cant destroy the flesh and bones like kung fu can. In pure destructiveness it cant compare. 

 

The Chinese are very good at understanding an insult even the slightest one. 

 

By saying lonemanpai your saying that son of the gods is greater than 90% of the masters out there of authentic Pai because he created his own. 

 

I believe there is hope for everyone even Sun Wukong in "Journey to the West" who rebelled against heaven and the Jade Emperor found salvation. After being subdued by Buddha's Palm. 

 

Believe it or not Abzu I only wish you the best that's why I posted links to all the masters I recommended. 

I hope that lonemanpai consider this as the work in the industry. 

Edited March 21, 2019 by beachbum78

[Abzu]

47 minutes ago, beachbum78 said:

 

Abzu,

 

All those in the know know that magic cant hold up to kung fu.

 

Magic can bring bad luck and entities and some sickness but it cant destroy the flesh and bones like kung fu can. In pure destructiveness it cant compare. 

 

The Chinese are very good at understanding an insult even the slightest one. 

 

By saying lonemanpai your saying that son of the gods is greater than 90% of the masters out there of authentic Pai because he created his own. 

 

I believe there is hope for everyone even Sun Wukong in "Journey to the West" who rebelled against heaven and the Jade Emperor found salvation. After being subdued by Buddha's Palm. 

 

Believe it or not Abzu I only wish you the best that's why I posted links to all the masters I recommended. 

I hope that lonemanpai consider this as the work in the industry. 

I actually deeply appreciate the time and thought you put in to your reply. I will be looking into the sources you provided. Thank you. 

[Abzu]

54 minutes ago, beachbum78 said:

 

Abzu,

 

All those in the know know that magic cant hold up to kung fu.

 

Magic can bring bad luck and entities and some sickness but it cant destroy the flesh and bones like kung fu can. In pure destructiveness it cant compare. 

 

The Chinese are very good at understanding an insult even the slightest one. 

 

By saying lonemanpai your saying that son of the gods is greater than 90% of the masters out there of authentic Pai because he created his own. 

 

I believe there is hope for everyone even Sun Wukong in "Journey to the West" who rebelled against heaven and the Jade Emperor found salvation. After being subdued by Buddha's Palm. 

 

Believe it or not Abzu I only wish you the best that's why I posted links to all the masters I recommended. 

I hope that lonemanpai consider this as the work in the industry. 

I'd add also that i was removed from this group after distasteful interactions. I am not defending the man or how his group is ran. It is the techniques themselves which i hold as intriguing. 

[voidisyinyang]

3 hours ago, Cheshire Cat said:

 

 

 

 

thanks! Yes I think I was relying on someone else telling me this. So I looked into it - I found this quote:

 

Quote

Let's take as an example the breath the T'ien-tai method calls "blowing." All you have to do is be conscious when the breath is emitted that you don't need to emit any sound. As the breath is exhaled, the lower abdomen naturally sinks in. When the breath is completely blown out to the point that there is no more breath that can be blown out, you must stop the sound. Once the mouth is closed, the nose will naturally draw in the breath. You should do this several times and then stop and listen to the sound.  Listen until breathing and  thoughts are focused: when there are no more miscellaneous thoughts, you will spontaneously empty out.

To REalize Enlightenment, page 5

https://terebess.hu/zen/mesterek/Nan-Huai-Chin-To-Realize-Enlightenment.pdf

 

And then this: 

 

Quote

This is to answer your question on how to reach Samadhi through breathing methods. In doing your practice, do not tie your mind rigidly to the breathing. Only if you want to, then observe the exhaling only, not the inhaling. A big mistake commonly committed by those practicing Qigong is to focus on the inhalation and to try to hold on to it. The truth is just the opposite. For correct practice, one should pay attention to the exhalation, if only for improving the health of the body and mind. The more one releases, the more one relaxes. This is the best of practice.

and http://www.meditationexpert.com/meditation-techniques/m_pranayama_breath_work_techniques_for_meditation.htm

Quote

 

When you reach this state of cessation, then the real chi (kundalini) of the body ignites (rises) and your chi channels start to open.

This is actually the safest and most gentle way to cultivate the Tao. It's the practice of following your breath until it calms down and seems to stop, and then trying to hold onto that state GENTLY after the exhalation. Simply watch your breath and let it calm down. When it stops every now and then, try to STAY in that period of cessation and the longer you can - without breathing -- the more your chi channels will transform.

 

 

Edited March 22, 2019 by voidisyinyang

[Cheshire Cat]

12 hours ago, voidisyinyang said:

 

thanks! Yes I think I was relying on someone else telling me this

 

Yes. Considering the fact that the bottle wind practice is the favorite breathing practice of Master Nan and in that practice the sequence is exhale, inhale, hold... it's very unlikely that he suggested to hold after exhale. 

 

At some point, I think that anything will do... none is going to fly in the air anytime soon and we just want some tricks to reduce random thoughts. 

[Forwards]

Lot of salt on this thread haha