Long men pai nei gong and mo pai

[liminal_luke]

I want to join the group but I`m "not the kind of person they are looking for."  It`s something of a catch 22, you see.  My interest in learning a little bit about Mo Pai, both the nature of the techniques and the likely results of practice, disqualify me. Oh well.  I guess I`m doomed to practice some untested and unscientific method like Spring Forest or Stillness-Movement or Flying Phoenix.  Thank goodness I still have a few matches around if I need to light a piece of paper on fire or something. 

Edited July 10, 2017 by liminal_luke

[Marblehead]

Well, if you held no expectations you could learn more about Mo Pai just to see what it can do for you.

 

I bought a "Fire Starter" at a gun show I attended a couple years ago.  I don't need magic to start a fire.

 

 

[ralis]

6 hours ago, Mudfoot said:

Estimated Time to fill LDT: 10 years. 

 

 

You were told that which is another belief system without foundation. So, the LDT is some vast receptacle that requires filling? Time based belief systems and practices are a waste of time and energy. This is the very reason I don't take students in spite of being asked to teach any number of times.

[Starjumper]

4 minutes ago, ralis said:

 

 

You were told that which is another belief system without foundation. So, the LDT is some vast receptacle that requires filling? Time based belief systems and practices are a waste of time and energy. This is the very reason I don't take students in spite of being asked to teach any number of times.

 

Just curious Ralis, what is it that people ask you to teach them?

 

The way I heard it is that first you need to create the empty vessel before you can fill it, and according to the literature I am vaguely familiar with, you create the empty vessel with yin energy before you can add yang energy.  So, a teeny weeny empty vessel should be easy to fill quickly, however I don't recall hearing the local MorePai experts say anything about cultivating yin energy first.

[Wells]

15 hours ago, Brian said:

but we had a member of the actual MoPai in Indonesia

 

Not one, but several in fact. And you are convinced that these guys are actually who they claim to be because...

[Mudfoot]

4 hours ago, Starjumper said:

 

The way I heard it is that first you need to create the empty vessel before you can fill it, and according to the literature I am vaguely familiar with, you create the empty vessel with yin energy before you can add yang energy.  So, a teeny weeny empty vessel should be easy to fill quickly, however I don't recall hearing the local MorePai experts say anything about cultivating yin energy first.

Would not the Yin connections while being seated on the ground automatically do this? 

And the deep mental state, would that not help? 

[Mudfoot]

4 hours ago, ralis said:

 

 

You were told that which is another belief system without foundation. 

So you say that the calculations on how long time it takes to do the 80 hours are wrong?

 

From estimation to guesstimation to fabulation? 

 

I am horrified! 

[Mudfoot]

In these Mo Pai threads, there is always the argument of (scientific) testing, ruling out fraud. 

 

And,  since there are fakers and scammers galore,  that is a good argument. Better the real thing than a scammer. 

 

But then there is the question of validity. 

 

Lets take the example of the copper wall projekt. 

 

A person can cause electrical surges. 

 

So? 

 

There are so many steps beyond that that remains unproven. 

 

1) Is high measurable electrical surges correllated to better healing results? 

 

2) Is high measurable electrical surges correllated to a higher degree of spiritual accomplishment? 

 

And if so, is that insight, enlightenment, Awakening,  creating an immortal spiritual body, or what? 

 

If anyone have access to research on these two points,  please add that research here on this marvellous thread (this troll-infested Circus) so that this discussion can move forward. 

[Starjumper]

9 hours ago, Mudfoot said:

Would not the Yin connections while being seated on the ground automatically do this? 

And the deep mental state, would that not help? 

 

I don't think either of those matter much, of course a quiet meditational state helps with many things, and  we can be quite certain that it is not automatic, it requires a certain kind of intent and movement.  I'll tell you a little secret here, yin energy goes up, yang energy goes down, but you (and by 'you' I do not mean you personally, I mean the great unknown all of you out there in the distance, everyone) have to make it go up or down, not by sitting around with your finger in your nose (well possibly it could help a little but it's extremely wimpy compared to our method).  We did it with certain chi kung movements while standing, on a carpeted floor.  There is no need to sit naked on the ground with a copper wire inserted in your butt and connect the wire to a grounded rod.   We never sat on the ground, we always sat in chairs, on a carpeted floor which was in the cement floored garage of my chi kung teacher.  This process made us into powerful fountains of yin energy, screw the yang energy.  

 

 

edit:   The 'process' I speak of here is not related to the sitting mediation but to the standing moving meditations, commonly known as chi kung 

 

Best wishes.

Edited July 11, 2017 by Starjumper

[Mudfoot]

I do this in standing positions, with my attention on specific processes. Your words would easily be used to describe what I do.

 

Gosh,  are you going to use that against me now? 

[Starjumper]

1 minute ago, Mudfoot said:

Gosh,  are you going to use that against me now? 

 

Not at all, but someone else might.

[Brian]

2 hours ago, Mudfoot said:

In these Mo Pai threads, there is always the argument of (scientific) testing, ruling out fraud. 

 

And,  since there are fakers and scammers galore,  that is a good argument. Better the real thing than a scammer. 

 

But then there is the question of validity. 

 

Lets take the example of the copper wall projekt. 

 

A person can cause electrical surges. 

 

So? 

 

There are so many steps beyond that that remains unproven. 

 

1) Is high measurable electrical surges correllated to better healing results? 

 

2) Is high measurable electrical surges correllated to a higher degree of spiritual accomplishment? 

 

And if so, is that insight, enlightenment, Awakening,  creating an immortal spiritual body, or what? 

 

If anyone have access to research on these two points,  please add that research here on this marvellous thread (this troll-infested Circus) so that this discussion can move forward. 

There's a relationship between electrical fields and magnetic fields, of course.  Some research suggest energetic healing is more of a magnetic thing than an electrical thing.

 

Not sure how you might measure spiritual accomplishment.

[Mudfoot]

23 minutes ago, Brian said:

 

 

Not sure how you might measure spiritual accomplishment.

Rational people don't pursue spiritual goals? 

[Kar3n]

21 minutes ago, Brian said:

Not sure how you might measure spiritual accomplishment.

I hear it is a voltmeter...

 

[Brian]

13 minutes ago, Mudfoot said:

Rational people don't pursue spiritual goals? 

Not saying that.  More like I'm not aware of a model which correlates "spiritual accomplishment" with "electrical surges" AND I am not sure what you would measure for "spiritual accomplishment" to use as data.  For "better healing results," it is fairly easy to arrive at some sort of metrics (tumor size, wound recovery rate, or what-have-you) and then do data analysis.

[allinone]

1 hour ago, Starjumper said:

 

I don't think either of those matter much, of course a quiet meditational state helps with many things, and  we can be quite certain that it is not automatic, it requires a certain kind of intent and movement.  I'll tell you a little secret here, yin energy goes up, yang energy goes down, but you (and by 'you' I do not mean you personally, I mean the great unknown all of you out there in the distance, everyone) have to make it go up or down, not by sitting around with your finger in your nose (well possibly it could help a little but it's extremely wimpy compared to our method).  We did it with certain chi kung movements while standing, on a carpeted floor.  There is no need to sit naked on the ground with a copper wire inserted in your butt and connect the wire to a grounded rod.   We never sat on the ground, we always sat in chairs, on a carpeted floor which was in the cement floored garage of my chi kung teacher.  This process made us into powerful fountains of yin energy, screw the yang energy.  

 

 

edit:   The 'process' I speak of here is not related to the sitting mediation but to the standing moving meditations, commonly known as chi kung 

 

Best wishes.

 

what is yin? if it exist it is compounded thing.

[allinone]

for what you need meditative state? it will cultivate earth, earth itself is yin. What is earth?

[allinone]

also i don't listen anyone who hasn't lvl4. So no need answers what are said like sure things or i know what it is

[Starjumper]

11 minutes ago, allinone said:

what is yin? if it exist it is compounded thing.

 

As far as I'm concerned yin energy does not exist, and in eight years my teacher never once used that word, I only use it on this forum because it is the common terminology here.

 

I say rising energy, and rarely I say Earth energy, but ya, energy rising, that's the ticket.

 

 

[allinone]

1 minute ago, Starjumper said:

 

As far as I'm concerned yin energy does not exist, and in eight years my teacher never once used that word, I only use it on this forum because it is the common terminology here.

 

I say rising energy, and rarely I say Earth energy, but ya, energy rising, that's the ticket.

 

 

 

from book

Quote

“And what is the yin ch’i like?”
“The yin is passive. It can only follow, never lead. It can absorb
energy but never initiate motion.

,

Quote

“When people walk on coals, it is yin ch’i that they are using,”
John said. “Sometimes it is the yin of their own bodies, sometimes it
is the yin ch’i of spirits. The yin absorbs the yang of the fire.”*

 

Quote

John came up behind me and pulled my shirt out of my pants. As
with Handoko, he put a knuckle up against the small of my back, in
the area of my kidneys.
Suddenly I felt like I was being pumped up with air. I could feel
my belly distending and my bladder being squeezed; I wanted to
pee. There was no other sensation; no cold, no rush of energy, no
electrical discharge, nothing. Just the feeling of fullness.

 

[allinone]

yang

 

Quote

“Can you show us what yin and yang are like, individually?”
Andreas asked.
“Yes. Touch my hand.” John extended his arm, and Andreas
touched his fingers with his own. John sent a burst of ch’i to his
fingertips; immediately Andreas pulled his hand back as it he had
been burned. I had suffered the same display many times in the past.
“Hot, isn’t it?” John laughed.
“So when you demonstrate by setting a newspaper on fire, it’s
yang ch’i that you send down to it?”
“Yes.”

 

[allinone]

Quote

“Sifu, can we hold this yin energy you transfer to us inside our
bodies for long periods of time?” I asked.
“No. You can only keep as much yin as you have yang. When I
do a demonstration like this, the yin energy I give you leaches from
your body almost immediately. It is a waste of my own energy, which
I have to replenish by meditation.”

 

Quote

The existence of yin energy
as a phenomenon that was associated with the energy field of
our planet could possibly fill in many gaps in field theory in general.
What was it? John had said that its behavior was similar to that of an
electromagnetic field, that an insulator could block it, and that its
flow could be easily disrupted.

 

..

Quote

John had mentioned that a student had to be at least Level Three
to be able to sense the yin; that a human being, by his own nature
yang, cannot sense yin energy directly. Rather, a human senses the
presence of yin by its reaction to the yang. Here is an unidentified
force that leaves no trace of itself, that we cannot feel inside our own
bodies even in excess (unlike electricity, but perhaps like gravity),
but whose results I had witnessed, experienced, and felt.

 

Edited July 11, 2017 by allinone

[allinone]

interesting quote

 

Quote

When we are finished with Level Three, we send
our yang down to the hui yin. There it gathers as much yin as we
have sent down yang. After a time, maybe even months or years, yin
and yang rise together

 

sry about spamming.

[allinone]

Also important is there is different systems. "The Lim persons example". He got about lvl 50-55. He wasn't Mo Pai.

And he did realtively short time his levels. And other notion is levels give out some "humming" sound, so you can tell the level.

I think that point is valid negotiation point.

 

level 50 power

Quote

It was because Lim is obviously more than Level Fifty. A
blow from a man like that runs through the bone marrow and crumbles
the bone to dust. Assam was hit at least three and maybe four times;
as you can see, there is not much left of him. His skull is mush; Lim
was unable to inspect the body to see if it was me or not.”

 

interesting is this that Lim was blind and couldn't sense the power difference..But its ok i think. (that quote means something else, i read, i took it out of context so its easy to make those faults, but it says all about reading comprehension)

Edited July 11, 2017 by allinone

[allinone]

there is a max level Bodhidharma. 1st Chan Patriarh. And the successors are known. Lots of reading material and facts inspection possibilities.

from book

Quote

“You know,” John said, “in the entire history of China, there have
only been two people who have made it all the way up to Level
Seventy-Two. One was Tamo, or Bodhidharma, who taught the
monks at Shaolin. The other was Chang San Feng of the Wutang-
Pai, who was also one of the Headmasters in our school’s lineage.”11

 

wiki link

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bodhidharma

Edited July 11, 2017 by allinone