What exactly is emptiness?

[WHITEROOMENERGYMINE1]

Emptiness is tathagatha, the embryo, the womb. The Empty sea. Everybody should check out the size of J Dilla's empty tracks. He hits these spaces in beats that are emptiness not NOTHING. Dao is eternal, Nothing is impermanent. Nihilists die young A true tathagatha is eternal. DUH.

 

Well..

Just a guess

[Bud Jetsun]

Looking up at the stars, human eyes detect some of the brighter and closer stars to Earth (our shared spaceship) in our relatively tiny 'milky way'  galaxy.  Expanding perspective further shows a sea of galaxies forming a galaxy cluster, and the relative spacing between each level expands again to reveal super galaxy clusters of galaxy clusters. Each level expansion increases the ratio of empty to the illusion of "occupied". 

 

When the "occupied" is examined more closely, just like our own sun and earth relationship of emptiness, so too is the spaces between the illusion of "solid atoms." Between vast gaps of emptyness in both structure of "stuff"  made of atoms, and the parts inside the atom composing it. When we again examine closer at the parts composing the sub atomic particles, we again find the same galaxy and solar system scale ratios of emptyness to up/down quarks and leptons.  Instrumentation is around its limits at exploring the nature of leptons, but it appears they also break into smaller parts which also have vast scales of emptyness between them. 

 

The nature of reality is emptiness, quite literally to the limit of our incredibly limited and inherently relative human sensory perception leveraging the best instrumentation constructed by humans to date. Zooming out perspective to oceans of galaxy clusters the universe approaches emptiness to the limit of our ability to know what emptyness may be, going further micro scale into the nature of the atom and whatever "matter" may be, it approaches the limit of emptyness to the limitations of our ability to construct instrumentation to observe. 

 

Emptyness is not a metaphor or dogma, it's correctly describing the nature of reality. 

 

Unlimited Love, 

-Bud

Edited October 10, 2017 by Bud Jetsun

[Bud Jetsun]

The empty offers no obstacles to manifestation, or limits of appreciation, or barriers between what is empty and not empty.

 

What we may know to be and not to be are equally empty without division. 

 

The emptyness is only limited by our own preference of confusion, it remains unbounded limitless potential even while optionally possible to carefully ensure it manifests only the mundane. 

 

Void and Abyss and Emptyness are a few types of words, equally not the describing the imfathomable splendor woven into this fabric of reality.  It's a great blessing given in compassion for all beings the emptyness mercifully does not manifest rapidly from the fleeting thoughts of unpointed minds.  

 

Unlimited Love,

-Bud

[Small Fur]

On July 7, 2017 at 7:55 AM, taoguy said:

As far as I'm aware of, the Buddhist definition of emptiness is not the same as the Taoist's definition, so let's keep it at the Buddhist's definition in this topic.

 

Sunyata seems to have multiple meanings and is pretty strange to me. For example:

 

• Some claim it is emptiness of self - which means the principle of anatta, where there is no present entity in either form, sensation, perception, karmic-formations or volition/consciousness.
• Other masters claim it is in fact interdependence, such as Thich Nhat Hanh and the 17th Karmapa, where we are one interconnected web, so the 'sense of self' should be devoted to this huge web of a bigger Self.
• Yet others claim that emptiness is the voidness of karmic hindrances.
• Emptiness also seems to be a realm where false-thoughts/delusions no longer arise, such as in the higher Bodhisattva Bhumi stages where dreams no longer arise, for example.
• Yet another one is the Jackson's Dzogchen view where no entity has ever risen nor passed away in rigpa and is ever-present.
• Yet another master claims that emptiness is One Taste, where the entire stream of consciousness whether thoughts rise or do not rise is taken as the object of meditation itself.

 

How exactly are these views reconciled?

 

I do understand how they link in theory, but experientially... what exactly is the emptiness meant in the Prajnaparamita Sutras?

 

 

In fact all of these are true statements about the states, conditions, locations and even transcendent non-locations often

experienced in different ways, at different levels by various awakened beings who have had profound experiences in nothingness.

 

The reason it is all spoken of interchangably is because not only are they very subtly distinct from one another, but they are also deeply interrelated, and mutually infused conditions of spiritually transcendent absence.

 

To re-cap specifically and simplify, all statements that you provided are foundational conditions and states of what is termed ‘emptiness’:

 

Two main states or ‘planes’: 

the emptiness of substance-  the potential from within nothing

the emptiness of non-substance- absolute nothing from which the emptiness of substance comes to exist

 

Two main conditions or perceptual orientations:

the existence of nothing (ie. “non-self”)

the existence of everything (ie “we are all one”)

 

Two main qualities of timelessness:

cessation- implying that there had been something that is no longer

absoluteness- from which there never was and never will be, or from which there always was and always will be

 

If you go through and look at all your intellectual confusions, you will see that all you wrote of falls into these basic understandings and experiences of emptiness. And they are all true.

 

It is not possible to reconcile this with the mind. The mind cannot grasp “nothing” because it is, in general not designed to problem-solve various conditions of absence. 

 

In a way, to read all of these things is a bit misleading because it engages the very mechanism that hinders you from experiencing this state. 

 

There is only one passage of entry to this understanding and it is through the sound of silence in your own vessel…

 

Edited October 24, 2017 by Small Fur

[Gunther]

On 15/07/2017 at 3:37 PM, SeekerOfHealing said:

Emptiness is this. You have a dream, you meet there something, eat something, have fun, sex or anything but when you woke up from that after night and realized that was only a dream without substances that's emptiness. This existence is too empty like a dream and you can realize the same way to wake up. I wish everybody could experience it. 

Very nice

But after waking up from the dream, who are you?

You are also emptiness.(awareness only)

Peace

 

Edited November 2, 2017 by Gunther

[SeekerOfHealing]

41 minutes ago, Gunther said:

Very nice

But after waking up from the dream, who are you?

You are also emptiness.(awareness only)

Peace

 

 

No. you are still the same, but your perception is just expanded. This can be only experienced if you develop high xin and yin shen. True reality is perceived thru yin shen, if you do not have attained it you can only image things like you do now speak without knowing it's first hand. Emptiness is where the xin is, if xin is very high you can perceive whole reality and be in touch with it, but this is still not yang shen, but you got insight into pre-natal energies with creates taji whuch are called wuji.   

[Gunther]

 

No. you are still the same, but ...

 

Sure, that's what we are: awareness

Sorry I don't know any Chinese Taoist terms. Would any of them translate to awareness?

[SeekerOfHealing]

You are not awareness. you can only think in terms of being this or that but this not make you this and that.

[Marblehead]

I like the way Buddhists use the words "you" and "I" and then tell us that you and I don't exist.  No, I'm not emptiness, I am of substance.  I am filling a space of what was emptiness.  And yes, I am aware of this.

 

I do like the term "Awareness".  Disagreements arise when trying to define where this awareness lies but that is only a fault of our understandings.

 

If you have ever had a thought then I suggest that you are awareness.

 

 

[9th]

“Listen Sariputra,
this Body itself is Emptiness
and Emptiness itself is this Body.

This Body is not other than Emptiness
and Emptiness is not other than this Body.

The same is true of Feelings,
Perceptions, Mental Formations,
and Consciousness.

 

“Listen Sariputra,
all phenomena bear the mark of Emptiness;
their true nature is the nature of
no Birth no Death,
no Being no Non-being,
no Defilement no Purity,
no Increasing no Decreasing.

 

“That is why in Emptiness,
Body, Feelings, Perceptions,
Mental Formations and Consciousness
are not separate self entities.

The Eighteen Realms of Phenomena
which are the six Sense Organs,
the six Sense Objects,
and the six Consciousnesses
are also not separate self entities.

 

The Twelve Links of Interdependent Arising
and their Extinction
are also not separate self entities.
Ill-being, the Causes of Ill-being,
the End of Ill-being, the Path,
insight and attainment,
are also not separate self entities.

 

Whoever can see this
no longer needs anything to attain.

Bodhisattvas who practice
the Insight that Brings Us to the Other Shore
see no more obstacles in their mind,
and because there
are no more obstacles in their mind,
they can overcome all fear,
destroy all wrong perceptions
and realize Perfect Nirvana.

 

“All Buddhas in the past, present and future
by practicing
the Insight that Brings Us to the Other Shore
are all capable of attaining
Authentic and Perfect Enlightenment.

 

“Therefore Sariputra,
it should be known that
the Insight that Brings Us to the Other Shore
is a Great Mantra,
the most illuminating mantra,
the highest mantra,
a mantra beyond compare,
the True Wisdom that has the power
to put an end to all kinds of suffering.

Therefore let us proclaim
a mantra to praise
the Insight that Brings Us to the Other Shore.

 

 

[Bud Jetsun]

 In respect for Buddhist tradition of over clarifying in compassion, the 'dreams' don't stop, they just become fully lucid and fully in your control to manifest bounded only by the limits of your imagination. They feel drastically unlike the qualities of experience of traditional unmindful wild dreams of a wild range of enriching experiences, but this is only limited by one's own choice in creativity 

This is what Siddhartha experienced as being tempted by 'Mara' s daughters.

 

My emperical experience is limited, enjoying only a single stretch of 3 nights of real time perfect and limitless manifesting in dreams that occurred after a few 14hr+ international flights of unbroken meditation while leveraging a carefully selected multi plant teacher dose combination.  4th night enjoyed the experience of almost immediate loss to 'Mara', and it's not been an interest to rush another choice to manifest the experience. 

 

Continuous mindful lucid clarity night to morning and morning to night in a realm of unbounded complete control as vivid and beautiful as the awake dreaming experience. 

 

What you pay your thought attention towards is what the universe manifests.  If you pay your attention to wanting something, instantly you have successfully manifested experiencing wanting.  To achieve a given outcome, one must manifest the outcome not the wanting of the outcome. 

 

When humans think they are not of the emptyness or place bounds on what the emptyness may or may not be, this is humans sharing their own choice in delusion and confusion while the emptyness remains the unbounded true nature of reality. 

 

Many folks here can relate to experiencing a dream sleeping at night and 'wake' to find themselves at home in bed, and at that moment they are easily able to see the whole of the dream world they had just been experiencing was emptyness in all aspects the whole time. 

'Waking' mind is just dreaming mind in equal emptyness, but while in the dream it appears as concrete as anything.  

 

A being is free to write unlimited tomes about philosophy, reality,  and whatever 'beliefs' they choose as a preference flavoring, but still lacks the sensory capacity to distinguish even sleeping dreams from 'wake' dreams. Sleeping dream they are happy to believe containing only aspects of emptyness, but until true awakening the 'wake' dreams remain optionally available to interpret as 'not-empty' to the limit of one's creativity in choosing to maintain delusion. 

 

Unlimited Love, 

-Bud

[C T]

emptiness is the benevolent ground that fulfils all desires, good and bad. 

Good or bad is self-made. So are excuses and truths. 

 

Emptiness is the changing landscape and the weather.

It is the water that leaves the tap cold, and leaves the kettle hot. 

 

It is the only force that separates and binds at the same time. 

 

Emptiness, the vast expanse beyond beginning and ending, supports all beings' wishes. 

It is like a carousel that spins round and round, and none on the rides know of first or last. 

 

Empty of desires, fullness is attained. 

 

Conundrums all ~~ Love them.