The Problem With The Forum Admin...

[dawei]

29 minutes ago, dawei said:

This will make no sense until one is beyond Qi energy connections.  Without the experience, what I say is essentially meaningless and I accept that.  

 

I rest my case

 

[Nungali]

5 hours ago, Aletheia said:

 

I have no idea what you're even talking about. And this is the problem with this forum there's so much nonsense talk that's allowed to go on that it's pretty difficult to find anything worthwhile.

 

 

 

Aha !  I see the problem here .

 

Yes, you do have no idea what people are talking about .

 

But we do know what each other is talking about .,    So, why don't you ?    (That was a rhetorical question )

 

So, you see, the problem lies in you and your perceptions  - not the forum.

[Nungali]

6 hours ago, Aletheia said:

I just found a backup password. I was thinking I might keep it just to browse the hidden parts of the forum if I ever need to read that stuff.

.....

 

 

 

"Right ! That's it !   I am not going to come around and visit you anymore ... I even  threw the front door key you gave me in the river ! So There ! "

 

" Oh ?   Okay then  . "

 

< next day, he appears in the kitchen >

 

"Oh , you're back ? "

 

" I found an old set of keys in my draw . "

 

[Aletheia]

36 minutes ago, dawei said:

 

I rest my case

 

 

Right so you are more advanced than me. So would you like to tell us about your experiences concerning what happened when you filled the 3rd eye and fully opened up the crown chakra?

 

If you'd rather keep that quiet and not tell us about it please tell us something you can do at your level...

 

What's it like to mediate with the crown chakra open?

Edited August 17, 2017 by Aletheia

[Aletheia]

Because I only just got the 3rd eye open and would say it's about 2% open but I can talk about 3rd eye meditation and how my face was magnetic all day during the last full moon and what it was like to open the 3rd eye. So you're saying you're beyond that level so let's hear it...

 

@dawei

 

Edited August 17, 2017 by Aletheia

[Marblehead]

4 hours ago, Aletheia said:

 

Marblehead I think you're a great guy. However, this is what I'm talking about right here in your reply.

 

What you have written is insulting to me because it completely lacks any nuance of genuine understanding. Okay I'm not upset but I'm just making a general point about the situation of the forum as it stands.

 

Most simply an ego would be crushed by the experiences gleaned by the 3rd eye. That's why we have steps working up to those kinds of experiences.

 

Literally take someone just starting out and put them in the middle of a meditation with the 3rd eye open and the guy would lose his mind through amplified emotional and psychological shock, differences in spacetime experience, overwhelmed by all the energy etc.

 

Typical emotional issues have to be pretty much taken care of before one even receives qi because otherwise you'll be dealing with a whole lot of impurities that will make you run in the other direction, or worse.

 

I'm not saying people can't have emotional issues with their 3rd eye open, but what I am saying is its real significance will be lost on anyone whose not experienced that level.

 

So i see people saying I'm insane, a troll, off my meds and all other kinds of things at the level particular to egoic emotional baggage and I wonder why the mods are okay with people leaving comments like that?

 

When I say something I'm told I'm suffering emotional issues and spoken to as if I'm a little slow or something.

I'm glad you felt you had the freedom to express yourself.  We need to be able to do that.

 

I can't recall ever accusing you or anyone else active in this thread of being insane or any other form of insult.  My statement above was a statement for the general population and not directed at any one person.  The reason I made the statement is to prevent anyone from getting into trouble as a result of combative interaction with others.

 

I don't like seeing a "Moderator's Warning" or any other such type of post from one of our moderators.

 

So anyhow, I'm not a moderator.  I'm just a regular member with a duty of welcoming new members.

 

I welcomed you, remember?

 

Now really, did you feel insulted because of the insulting words I used or is there something else that was bothering you?

 

There will always be moderation here for the foreseeable future.  Right now we have some pretty mellow Mods.  And Admin. are trying their best to insure the terms and rules of the owner are complied with.

 

Anyhow, best wishes and I hope you are able to remain a member here as long as you feel it is in your benefit to be here.

 

[Hancock]

I've read this an find it somewhat apropos

 

 

passage from the Chuang-tzu, viz.

the Great Sage Dream anecdote:

“He who dreams of drinking wine may weep when morning comes; he who dreams of weeping may in the morning go off to hunt. While he is dreaming he does not know it is a dream, and in his dream he may even try to interpret a dream. Only after he wakes does he know it was a dream. And someday there will be a great awakening when we know that this is all a great dream. Yet the stupid believe they are awake, busily and brightly assuming they understand things, calling this man ruler, that one herdsman--how dense! Confucius and you are both dreaming! And when I say you are dreaming, I am dreaming, too. Words like these will be labeled the Supreme Swindle. Yet, after ten thousand generations, a great sage may appear who will know their meaning, and it will still be as though he appeared with astonishing speed.”

[dawei]

33 minutes ago, Aletheia said:

 

Right so you are more advanced than me. So would you like to tell us about your experiences concerning what happened when you filled the 3rd eye and fully opened up the crown chakra?

 

If you'd rather keep that quiet and not tell us about it please tell us something you can do at your level...

 

What's it like to mediate with the crown chakra open?

 

No need to meditate...  that is a seeking and separation idea.  Find Unity.   once there, everything is connected.   Find any deity or anyone, even through another's consciousness.   Think universal consciousness.   

 

I've been through two medical qigong masters and appreciate how they lead me along my path. 

 

Mencius is famous for the idea that:  "Yi leads the Qi".    Very important in medical qigong.

 

But Qi can lead one to beyond Qi...   don't stop with a understand or concept of Qi as energy. 

[Aletheia]

1 hour ago, Marblehead said:

I'm glad you felt you had the freedom to express yourself.  We need to be able to do that.

 

I can't recall ever accusing you or anyone else active in this thread of being insane or any other form of insult.  My statement above was a statement for the general population and not directed at any one person.  The reason I made the statement is to prevent anyone from getting into trouble as a result of combative interaction with others.

 

I don't like seeing a "Moderator's Warning" or any other such type of post from one of our moderators.

 

So anyhow, I'm not a moderator.  I'm just a regular member with a duty of welcoming new members.

 

I welcomed you, remember?

 

Now really, did you feel insulted because of the insulting words I used or is there something else that was bothering you?

 

There will always be moderation here for the foreseeable future.  Right now we have some pretty mellow Mods.  And Admin. are trying their best to insure the terms and rules of the owner are complied with.

 

Anyhow, best wishes and I hope you are able to remain a member here as long as you feel it is in your benefit to be here.

 

 

I'm not insulted and my post isn't really directed at you in particular. I'm just upset by the general standard of the forum and the way so many people hide behind the fact that advanced practitioners by nature don't talk much. It gives a window of opportunity for people that are not anywhere near advanced to talk about things which they most obviously have not the first clue about.

 

Once they're managed to build up their confidence they begin to truly believe they're at some level they've only read about in texts or heard about yoga class etc.

 

Right so then someone like me comes along with pretty much no theoretical or textual knowledge and all these fantasists come out the woodwork to proclaim I don't know what I'm talking about or suffering immature emotional issues etc.

 

Of course I'm not trying to put down the mods for this, but if they were a little more clued up they'd see what was going on with the fakes talking about things well beyond their own personal experience.

 

I'm not insulted, but I just don't want to have to swim through a cesspit of other people's BS when I come to the forum,

 

Quote

I welcomed you, remember?

 

Yes and I remember saying it was funny in that thread that no one seemed to understand what I was talking about with their zen like attitudes.

 

At the time I had no idea I wasn't doing the MCO but I was experiencing a Kundalini awakening so I naively assumed everyone experienced that amount of energy when they did the MCO LOL.

 

drew was the only one that recognised what was going on and I think he wrote about it on his blog in the context of the San saying the fire is painful etc.

 

Literally my pelvic region was red hot and my head was flooded with warm dreamlike reality. I didn't want to make a big deal about it because I just thought everyone experienced that every time they did the orbit so I didn't want to sound like a noob.

 

And I didn't really know what to ask because I was so out of it. But at the time I knew the energy had to be stored in a certain place which I now know is the DT so I was trying to ask where I was supposed to store the energy.

 

I mean I don't even believe many people here have even experienced what I did in my first post. What I experienced with the 3rd eye opening was a completely different level because not only is their the spiritual energy but SUPER HEAVY PHYSICAL FORCES TOO I MEAN IT'S LIKE BEING INSIDE A BLACK HOLE WITH ALL THE ENERGY GOING ON, MY WHOLE HEAD WAS GONE INSIDE A SUPERMASSIVE MAGNETIC FORCE FIELD ALONG WITH SPIRITUAL ENERGY COMING DOWN FROM ABOVE.

 

RIGHT SO WHAT ABOUT THE 3RD EYE MEDITATION WHERE THE WHOLE BODY, GROUND, ABOVE THE HEAD TURNS TO ENERGY WAVES?

 

NOW I SIMPLY DON'T BELIEVE PEOPLE HERE ARE AT THAT LEVEL. AND I'VE NOT EVEN SAID ANYTHING ABOUT PROJECTING QI IN THIS POST

Edited August 17, 2017 by Aletheia

[Aetherous]

24 minutes ago, Aletheia said:

RIGHT SO WHAT ABOUT THE 3RD EYE MEDITATION WHERE THE WHOLE BODY, GROUND, ABOVE THE HEAD TURNS TO ENERGY WAVES?

Basic.

[Marblehead]

12 minutes ago, Aletheia said:

 

I'm not insulted and my post isn't really directed at you in particular.

Okay.  That's settled.

 

12 minutes ago, Aletheia said:

I'm just upset by the general standard of the forum and the way so many people hide behind the fact that advanced practitioners by nature don't talk much. It gives a window of opportunity for people that are not anywhere near advanced to talk about things which they most obviously have not the first clue about.

But then, neither the Admin or Mods have the responsibility of insuring that all posts are valid or that those who give advice actually know what they are talking about.  This just isn't a classroom environment.  Members do sometimes question and challenge what other members have said.  But even this doesn't mean that anyone is actually going to be correct.

 

12 minutes ago, Aletheia said:

Once they're managed to build up their confidence they begin to truly believe they're at some level they're only read about in texts or heard about yoga class etc.

Sure.  That's the ego thing I was talking about.

 

12 minutes ago, Aletheia said:

Right so then someone like me comes along with pretty much no theoretical or textual knowledge and all these fantasists come out the woodwork to proclaim I don't know what I'm talking about or suffering immature emotional issues etc.

And you noticed that I opted out of that discussion.  I don't talk about practices.

 

12 minutes ago, Aletheia said:

Of course I'm not trying to put down the mods for this, but if they were a little more clued up they'd see what was going on with the fakes talking about things well beyond their own personal experience.

Again, that is not one of the responsibilities of the Moderators.  Not even the Admins or Owner do that.  We each must make our own decisions of who we are going to listen to and who we will ignore.

 

12 minutes ago, Aletheia said:

I'm not insulted, but I just don't want to have to swim through a cesspit of other people's BS when I come to the forum,

Great.  But keep in mind, the quality of posts are not moderated.  If they were my post count would at least half of what it is now.

 

12 minutes ago, Aletheia said:

Yes and I remember saying it was funny in that thread that no one seemed to understand what I was talking about with their zen like attitudes.

And you noticed I immediately opted out and gave you not indication that I would be able to discuss your questions with you.

 

12 minutes ago, Aletheia said:

At the time ...

The rest of your post is valid but I have nothing to say to it.

 

[Aletheia]

1 minute ago, Aetherous said:

Basic.

 

Okay then tell us about something at your level... and try not to steal ideas from Spotless's posts like that other guy that said he doesn't need to meditate now he's got the crown chakra open. Because I read that post too where Spotless said that LOL.

 

Tell us something without using technical terms because I'd like to hear it. What was it like once you filled the 3rd eye and the crown chakra opened up?

[Aletheia]

And I'm not saying I think I'm advanced myself. I'm just saying there are a lot of people behind me that don't seem to notice where they really stand.

 

This is a problem for me because I have no background in this stuff so it would be good if I had a place where I could learn about these things and ask questions without having to suffer a barrage of insults along the way.

 

Anyway, I've decided I'll just report Starjumper's posts in future so hopefully he'll get the message in the end.

Edited August 18, 2017 by Aletheia

[Kar3n]

22 minutes ago, Aletheia said:

 

Okay then tell us about something at your level... and try not to steal ideas from Spotless's posts like that other guy that said he doesn't need to meditate now he's got the crown chakra open. Because I read that post too where Spotless said that LOL.

 

Tell us something without using technical terms because I'd like to hear it. What was it like once you filled the 3rd eye and the crown chakra opened up?

You will find that there is a vast array of what people practice on TBD and not all experiences are the same, though there might be similarities. There are many of us who do not meditate on a daily basis but do group energy practices instead.

 

Demanding tales of openings and continually congratulating yourself is no way to help to drain a cesspool or add credence to your achievements.

 

Why don't you do some searches and find out about people on your own? Most have posted quite a bit about their experiences. You just need to take the time to look for them.

 

Projecting qi is easy, my 12 year old son is quite good at it. He says chi balls are fun, just as energy play should be for a young boy.

[Aletheia]

43 minutes ago, Kar3n said:

Projecting qi is easy, my 12 year old son is quite good at it. He says chi balls are fun, just as energy play should be for a young boy.

 

I'm not talking about qi balls LOL.

 

I'm talking about healing energy which transforms a swollen, painful and purple leg that looks like something you'd find on a bloated corpse pulled from a river in hell to something like a normal looking leg. I'm talking about the colour of the leg changing colour in an instant when I pulled bad energy out of it and I'm talking about people seeing how the leg changed as I projected qi into it.

 

So this is why it gets a little tiresome when people want to say I'm a car crash in slow motion. I think exactly how retarded are these people and why do the mods not see this guy is a total moron?

 

If this were my forum ALL FAKES WOULD RECEIVE A LIFETIME BAN!

 

NO FAKES ALLOWED!

 

Instead here you see this thread. I'm an authentic practitioner having to waste my time here. Something is not right with this forum when people are allowed to openly call me silly names.

 

You see I see this fake and I wonder why no one else can see it and then I just put 2 and 2 together and realise most people are obviously fakes! We are living in the era of the Kali Yuga so there you go. That's why there are lots of fakes about today.

Edited August 18, 2017 by Aletheia

[Aletheia]

I was thinking about maybe reading Kant's Critique of Pure Reason too. Because it occurred to me that his Noumenon is something like the Dao and I looked it up on wikipedia and it actually says that.

 

Classical Taoist philosophy was well aware of a similar concept, as expressed by its proverb "[phenomenal] Tao which can be spoken is not true [nomenal] Tao".

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noumenon#Concept_in_pre-Kantian_philosophy

 

All Kant's metaphysical epistemology of the understanding and spacetime intuitions are products of pure waking consciousness. He's like a clockwork gnome LOL.

 

 

[dawei]

1 hour ago, Aletheia said:

 

I'm not insulted and my post isn't really directed at you in particular. I'm just upset by the general standard of the forum and the way so many people hide behind the fact that advanced practitioners by nature don't talk much. It gives a window of opportunity for people that are not anywhere near advanced to talk about things which they most obviously have not the first clue about.

 

fair point

 

Some folks don't talk because nobody will quite believe it... without experience, it can seem crazy.

 

There is healing to be found in many manners and energy arts.  I've allowed other kinds of healers here, or folks in magic, to connect with me to do 'their thing'...  and then they want to know if I 'felt them'...  A resounding YES...  their presence was felt; heat overcomes; the 3rd eye sparks; energy flows.   One person said they got a big dizzy when connecting to me and had to get themself under control to continue.  I was at complete ease myself.  

 

I started with pairs energy exchange.  My first lessons were group energy transmission and how to affect another person. We'd stand behind someone and then make them move in a direction we wanted.  We pass silently in a circle, energy and you have to 'know' who sent it. We'd do heart energy exchange with the hands that seemed more Taiji than Qigong...  An inner intuition was nurtured to simply know the whole of what was going on.  

 

I tested many book examples by Dr. Yang in terms of meridian flow;  I confirmed them all.   At this point, I knew Qi was real and was controllable and could be transmitted with ease.   Later clinicals with very dark energy situations confirmed how to even combat what felt like energy attacks.   I learned a few lessons and improvised in a few sessions to deal with dark/dirty energy.  It was all very educational in a real way.    BTW: The program focused on cancer healing.

 

I tested Taiji next.  I wanted to see how that differed, or not.  I found I had to 'turn off' my inner qigong bias to allow Taiji to flow easier, and visa versa.  For example: Taiji likes to keep the palms downward (grounding) in the front breathing posture of passing the hands in front of the body.  In Qigong, we like the hands upward (heaven energy).. I coupled that later to create a movement cycle of Qigong (receive heaven energy) to Taiji (transmit/release to the ground); connect heaven and earth.

 

To cut to the chase, my experience and everything I read and saw about QIgong healers, including my two masters, is that Qigong exhausts the person in healing... if you're doing serious healing issues.   I meet some reiki masters who thought the Qigong was much more effective, yet I thought their method of channel was more helpful to protect the healer, except their connection to the source was simply not strong enough.  THe found they could use their own energy but that is a bad method in the end.  Master Jiang who was rather internally well known Qigong master of healing died trying to heal someone.

 

Getting beyond the idea of Qi leads to a higher understanding of primordial energy and universal connectedness.  That part is hard to share as without experience, it just is too hard to accept or understand... and folks roll their eyes or share their negative experience of it.  I can't explain it, I can only show it. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Aletheia]

Then from Kant you can go to mad black Deleuzian Nick Land! I LOVE CONTEMPORARY PHILOSOPHY

 

https://ectpodcast.wordpress.com/2016/01/10/ect-3-nick-land-2/

 

 

http://www.ccru.net/swarm1/1_melt.htm

[Aletheia]

8 minutes ago, dawei said:

 

fair point

 

Some folks don't talk because nobody will quite believe it... without experience, it can seem crazy.

 

There is healing to be found in many manners and energy arts.  I've allowed other kinds of healers here, or folks in magic, to connect with me to do 'their thing'...  and then they want to know if I 'felt them'...  A resounding YES...  their presence was felt; heat overcomes; the 3rd eye sparks; energy flows.   One person said they got a big dizzy when connecting to me and had to get themself under control to continue.  I was at complete ease myself.  

 

I started with pairs energy exchange.  My first lessons were group energy transmission and how to affect another person. We'd stand behind someone and then make them move in a direction we wanted.  We pass silently in a circle, energy and you have to 'know' who sent it. We'd do heart energy exchange with the hands that seemed more Taiji than Qigong...  An inner intuition was nurtured to simply know the whole of what was going on.  

 

I tested many book examples by Dr. Yang in terms of meridian flow;  I confirmed them all.   At this point, I knew Qi was real and was controllable and could be transmitted with ease.   Later clinicals with very dark energy situations confirmed how to even combat what felt like energy attacks.   I learned a few lessons and improvised in a few sessions to deal with dark/dirty energy.  It was all very educational in a real way.    BTW: The program focused on cancer healing.

 

I tested Taiji next.  I wanted to see how that differed, or not.  I found I had to 'turn off' my inner qigong bias to allow Taiji to flow easier, and visa versa.  For example: Taiji likes to keep the palms downward (grounding) in the front breathing posture of passing the hands in front of the body.  In Qigong, we like the hands upward (heaven energy).. I coupled that later to create a movement cycle of Qigong (receive heaven energy) to Taiji (transmit/release to the ground); connect heaven and earth.

 

To cut to the chase, my experience and everything I read and saw about QIgong healers, including my two masters, is that Qigong exhausts the person in healing... if you're doing serious healing issues.   I meet some reiki masters who thought the Qigong was much more effective, yet I thought their method of channel was more helpful to protect the healer, except their connection to the source was simply not strong enough.  THe found they could use their own energy but that is a bad method in the end.  Master Jiang who was rather internally well known Qigong master of healing died trying to heal someone.

 

Getting beyond the idea of Qi leads to a higher understanding of primordial energy and universal connectedness.  That part is hard to share as without experience, it just is too hard to accept or understand... and folks roll their eyes or share their negative experience of it.  I can't explain it, I can only show it. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Well I think using primordial energy rather than your own energy fully occurs when the crown chakra opens.

 

I think that's how drew screwed up because he only had his 3rd eye half open and then like he says he fell into worldliness and started using his own energy to heal rather than filling the 3rd eye and opening the top of the head.

 

I could feel the 3rd eye before it opened and now it's open I can feel the top of the head so I think it's easy to just assume the crown is open because you can feel it when in fact its not really open at all rather you've feeling it from within the 6th chakra.

 

drew says something different though about the energy going up the front rather than the back. So I don't really know about that and maybe I'm wrong. I'm just saying stuff from my own experience.

 

But I think once the 3rd eye is open and you have more energy people do start to react to it so that's why if you want to build up your energy to open the crown you have to do it in isolation.

 

That's just what I think right now probably it will change when I know more.

[dawei]

2 minutes ago, Aletheia said:

 

Well I think using primordial energy rather than your own energy fully occurs when the crown chakra opens.

...

 

That's just what I think right now probably it will change when I know more.

 

Ask if you can connect and use the energy of specific deities?  If not, then how can one possibly access primordial energy? 

 

Let's not talk Drew.

 

The heart chakra is key... Daoist said it is the 'General' that directs all energy.   3rd eye can communicate but sometimes it is stuck in the local mind of astral stuff.   At least what I'm talking about is more heart based connection to the source.  The more the other chakras open the better the layers peel back and reveal the primordial.

 

In other words, regardless of what chakra is open,  if you skip the heart opening and creating a connection, you just remain in local Qigong connection stuff...   there are just too many stories that I leave out and don't really care to get into... just giving a more summary point of view.

 

And of course, this is just my opinion and experience.  

[Aletheia]

 

 

[Aletheia]

2 minutes ago, dawei said:

 

Ask if you can connect and use the energy of specific deities?  If not, then how can one possibly access primordial energy? 

 

Let's not talk Drew.

 

The heart chakra is key... Daoist said it is the 'General' that directs all energy.   3rd eye can communicate but sometimes it is stuck in the local mind of astral stuff.   At least what I'm talking about is more heart based connection to the source.  The more the other chakras open the better the layers peel back and reveal the primordial.

 

In other words, regardless of what chakra is open,  if you skip the heart opening and creating a connection, you just remain in local Qigong connection stuff...   there are just too many stories that I leave out and don't really care to get into... just giving a more summary point of view.

 

And of course, this is just my opinion and experience.  

 

Well I don't know about the heart, I read a Lomax post and he said it's important to have the heart open before the 3rd eye and I've felt the heart open up and energy there but not anything like the DT or the 3rd eye. Although I was thinking it might have opened when I did the healing because after that it got really warm, but I think that's not good energy in that case so I don't really know.

[Aletheia]

And I don't like to focus on anything other than the DT when I meditate so I've never concentrated at the heart to really see what happens either.

[Kar3n]

24 minutes ago, Aletheia said:

 

Well I think using primordial energy rather than your own energy fully occurs when the crown chakra opens.

 

I think that's how drew screwed up because he only had his 3rd eye half open and then like he says he fell into worldliness and started using his own energy to heal rather than filling the 3rd eye and opening the top of the head.

 

I could feel the 3rd eye before it opened and now it's open I can feel the top of the head so I think it's easy to just assume the crown is open because you can feel it when in fact its not really open at all rather you've feeling it from within the 6th chakra.

 

drew says something different though about the energy going up the front rather than the back. So I don't really know about that and maybe I'm wrong. I'm just saying stuff from my own experience.

 

But I think once the 3rd eye is open and you have more energy people do start to react to it so that's why if you want to build up your energy to open the crown you have to do it in isolation.

 

That's just what I think right now probably it will change when I know more.

Primordial energy takes over when all chakras are open to some degree and become more like a unified field rather than individual parts of the whole.

 

Getting hung up on third eye stuff is what holds a lot of folks back. They believe they have "arrived" because they can feel and see. Believe me, there is more.

 

It has never been my experience that isolation is the way to go, but hey if it works for you, cool.

[Aletheia]

10 minutes ago, Kar3n said:

It has never been my experience that isolation is the way to go, but hey if it works for you, cool.

 

It does work for me and I can not only afford to do it in isolation but it suits me too because I have a monthly income now and don't have to work so the less I go out the more money I save! Plus like I said I don't like being around other people with energy even if I'm not feeling it myself I still notice people acting funny around me.

 

I'm not thinking much about the 3rd eye other than that's the level I'm at atm. Right now I think there's something above the head which is the next level beyond the 3rd eye and I haven't been doing much in the way of serious meditation the last few days so I don't even feel much energy now anyway.

 

I'm going to get started properly tomorrow.

 

Anyway it's possible I do have all the chakras open and that's why I feel everything unified when I meditate now. Even my brain turns to energy so it's really weird thinking when your brain and consciousness have changed into a state of something like pure energy!

Edited August 18, 2017 by Aletheia