Definitions of Gnosticim

[Fire Dragon]

Hello all

 

My definition on Gnosticism:

 

You see God in yourself

 

 

Not Gnosticism: You see God in someone else. Jesus, Mohammed or Buddha.

 

 

 

What do you think about this definition do you have better jet simple ones yourselves?

 

F D

[Procurator]

 

What do you think about this definition do you have better jet simple ones yourselves?

 

F D

definition of gnostics themselves was quite different.

Edited January 8, 2008 by Procurator

[.broken.]

If you define gnosticism as seeing God within yourself then you place satanism, buddhism, taoism, theosophy and many other isms/sophies under the category of gnosticism. In my eyes, this could be both a correct and incorrect definition. It all depends on which term you wish to use for what is essentially the same discipline. The matter of practice is what differs between them.

[mantis]

gnosis means knowledge, not of an intellectual type but rather what i'd say experiential knowledge.

[Oolong Rabbit]

gnosis means knowledge, not of an intellectual type but rather what i'd say experiential knowledge.

 

I believe that the original gnostics were mystics who felt that man could have a direct experience of the divine. How did they do this? Likely through the ingestion of magic mushrooms. In my opinion the modern gnostics misinterpret the sexual imagery too literally. It actually symbolizes the mushroom stem penetrating the cap. Then again perhaps both views hold some truth. As above, so below. See my post on the Taoist Sorcery thread for more detail.

 

Brgds!

[mantis]

i believe that is absolutely positively wrong. gnosis has always condemned drug use. mushroom stem penetrating the cap... i don't think so man.

[Oolong Rabbit]

i believe that is absolutely positively wrong. gnosis has always condemned drug use. mushroom stem penetrating the cap... i don't think so man.

 

Could you please quote me some classical gnostic scriptures to prove your claim Mantis? I am not talking about the modern new age crap either. Have you read John Allegro's "The Mushroom and the Cross"? He's one of the people who translated the Dead Sea Scrolls. Have you read Clark Heinrich?

 

Here's just a couple of interesting scriptures for you:

 

The Nag Hammadi Library

 

The Prayer of Thanksgiving

 

Translated by James Brashler, Peter A. Dirkse and Douglas M. Parrott

 

This the prayer that they spoke:

 

"We give thanks to You! Every soul and heart is lifted up to You, undisturbed name, honored with the name 'God' and praised with the name 'Father', for to everyone and everything (comes) the fatherly kindness and affection and love, and any teaching there may be that is sweet and plain, giving us mind, speech, (and) knowledge: mind, so that we may understand You, speech, so that we may expound You, knowledge, so that we may know You. We rejoice, having been illuminated by Your knowledge. We rejoice because You have shown us Yourself. We rejoice because while we were in (the) body, You have made us divine through Your knowledge.

 

"The thanksgiving of the man who attains to You is one thing: that we know You. We have known You, intellectual light. Life of life, we have known You. Womb of every creature, we have known You. Womb pregnant with the nature of the Father, we have known You. Eternal permanence of the begetting Father, thus have we worshiped Your goodness. There is one petition that we ask: we would be preserved in knowledge. And there is one protection that we desire: that we not stumble in this kind of life."

 

When they had said these things in the prayer, they embraced each other and they went to eat their holy food, which has no blood in it.

 

 

The Nag Hammadi Library

 

The Gospel of Truth

 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Translated by Harold W. Attridge and George W. MacRae

 

excerpt:

 

Through this, the gospel of the one who is searched for, which <was> revealed to those who are perfect, through the mercies of the Father, the hidden mystery, Jesus, the Christ, enlightened those who were in darkness through oblivion. He enlightened them; he showed (them) a way; and the way is the truth which he taught them.

 

For this reason, error grew angry at him, persecuted him, was distressed at him, (and) was brought to naught. He was nailed to a tree (and) he became fruit of the knowledge of the Father. It did not, however, cause destruction because it was eaten, but to those who ate it, it gave (cause) to become glad in the discovery, and he discovered them in himself, and they discovered him in themselves.

 

 

And some notes on John Allegro who showed how the original texts carried hidden meanings and double entendres that are lost in translation:

 

Language, myth and religion

 

As a philologist, Allegro analysed the derivations of language. He traced biblical words and phrases back to their roots in Sumerian, and showed how Sumerian phonemes recur in varying but related contexts in many Semitic, classical and other Indo-European languages. Although meanings changed to some extent, Allegro found some basic religious ideas passing on through the genealogy of words. His book The Sacred Mushroom and the Cross relates the development of language on Eurasia to the development of myths, religions and cultic practices in many cultures. Allegro believed he could prove through etymology that the roots of Christianity, as of many other religions, lay in fertility cults; and that cultic practices, such as ingesting hallucinogenic drugs to perceive the mind of god, persisted into Christian times.

 

http://johnallegro.org/main/

 

Perhaps you may have a vested interest in your current belief system that prevents you from seeing the matter objectively. I don't really care one way or another, but I have at least done my homework on this one brother. Go read the classical western alchemical texts. Pierce the veil and look at the "red and white" stone of the philosophers:

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amanita_muscaria

[Procurator]

Could you please quote me some classical gnostic scriptures to prove your claim Mantis? I am not talking about the modern new age crap either. Have you read John Allegro's "The Mushroom and the Cross"?

This book is a work of a pure genius if there ever was one. The amount of learning and scientific insight that is stored in it is dazzling in its brilliance.

[mantis]

my friend the skeptic will always find a way to support what he believes, even if he is terribly mistaken. you cite some old texts in the desert which mind you, are not to be taken literally or understood with the intellectual mind and tell me with this ferocious tenacity that gnostics use magic mushrooms as the source of their knowledge? i will tell you this, you will always be able to fill your mind with theories and ideas, but do you really know anything oolong? i don't believe anything, i experience it myself, viewing the truth without the aid of sunglasses.

[Mal]

This book [John Allegro's "The Mushroom and the Cross"] is a work of a pure genius if there ever was one. The amount of learning and scientific insight that is stored in it is dazzling in its brilliance.

 

I have not read this book, but is that a sarcastic comment?

 

I enjoy your posts but sometimes they are a bit hard for me to understand

[Procurator]

I have not read this book, but is that a sarcastic comment?

 

I enjoy your posts but sometimes they are a bit hard for me to understand

no, no sarcasm i do admire this book, its one of the books that lifts the veil of common sense from the things and shows the reality as it is. If you are not a history buff, could be a tough read, though.