Why is there so much disrespect in the Taoist tradition?

[Cameron]

I agree with someone who PM'd me about this today.

 

I think the internet communication(not face to face or even on the phone) accounts for atleast 90% of the cause.

 

Cameron

[Wun Yuen Gong]

Unfortunately Cam, not all people see eye to eye and such as life you know! Sometimes there is truth hidden inside some post sometimes they are mere attacks but just shake it off as you know what is truth to you right?

 

Human nature is a B!TCH!!!

[三江源]

I just think...... DONT FEED THE TROLLS.

 

 

if you starve them out, they go away.

[Wayfarer64]

yo!

In NYC we just sez- WUZZITTUYA!?

[林愛偉]

Daoist cultivation not only consists of textual cultivation, but mind cultivation. People fail to realize that the mind is not formed during one lifetime. It holds successive lifetimes of memories, each influencing one's current life; life style, relationships, etc.

Cultivating the mind is cultivating one's Qi. People also fail to realize that there are other influences on one's mind all the times. Whether believed or not, they are out there, in there. These influences are of spirits, ghosts, demons, and even good knowing immortals, gods, dragons and Buddhas and Bodhisattvas.

If one's mind/heart is without afflictions, regardless of what cultivation the person is of, religion, the mind will not be disturbed, and there will be no arrogance, arguments of superiority, etc. But if one's mind is full of distinctions, views and the person/living being lives a life of ups and downs without knowing where their mind is, they will be subject to the influence of their own afflictions inner and outer.

 

This is why there is much disrespect, not only in Daoist traditions, but in almost every cultivation tradition. Within Daoism, the influence of ghosts, spirits, demons and gods, good and bad are strong. Because the cultivation of Daoism is of celestial nature, influence from various realms are inevitable. If the mind/heart cultivating is not clear, wholesome, then they will fall into views of arrogance, anger, greed, and ignorance.

 

It happens in many ways, and happens to everyone regardless of their cultivation...even if they are not cultivating. When someone decides to practice, the first thing is to understand the mind. This is to protect oneself from outer influences, as well as ones own personal views and attachments.

 

Without this foundation, the cultivation one chooses will only bring them down in the future.

 

Peace and Blessings,

Lin

Edited January 11, 2008 by 林愛偉

[三江源]

DONT FEED THE TROLLS!

 

external or internal, corporeal or otherwise!!

 

 

 

 

it's a practise in itself.

[mentalground0]

Daoist cultivation not only consists of textual cultivation, but mind cultivation. People fail to realize that the mind is not formed during one lifetime. It holds successive lifetimes of memories, each influencing one's current life; life style, relationships, etc.

Cultivating the mind is cultivating one's Qi. People also fail to realize that there are other influences on one's mind all the times. Whether believed or not, they are out there, in there. These influences are of spirits, ghosts, demons, and even good knowing immortals, gods, dragons and Buddhas and Bodhisattvas.

If one's mind/heart is without afflictions, regardless of what cultivation the person is of, religion, the mind will not be disturbed, and there will be no arrogance, arguments of superiority, etc. But if one's mind is full of distinctions, views and the person/living being lives a life of ups and downs without knowing where their mind is, they will be subject to the influence of their own afflictions inner and outer.

 

This is why there is much disrespect, not only in Daoist traditions, but in almost every cultivation tradition. Within Daoism, the influence of ghosts, spirits, demons and gods, good and bad are strong. Because the cultivation of Daoism is of celestial nature, influence from various realms are inevitable. If the mind/heart cultivating is not clear, wholesome, then they will fall into views of arrogance, anger, greed, and ignorance.

 

It happens in many ways, and happens to everyone regardless of their cultivation...even if they are not cultivating. When someone decides to practice, the first thing is to understand the mind. This is to protect oneself from outer influences, as well as ones own personal views and attachments.

 

Without this foundation, the cultivation one chooses will only bring them down in the future.

 

Peace and Blessings,

Lin

 

beautiful, Lin

thank you

[Wayfarer64]

well stated Lin...

 

I can remember many feelings and attitudes from past lives and deal with the karma of past lives as much as the living day by day -consciously as many here do...It is a very important aspect of life that many here realize and work with.

 

We each may also willfully " back-slide" some as well and provoke the forces of cosmic order-just for the kick of adding added zest to this life...

 

That sort of roller-coaster is a wonderful and thrilling aspect of being a human being. I for one have no wish to be calm, serene or passive, at least not as yet in this life... But I sure have slowed down some in the past twenty years...Such is life -

 

I just made a typo-of writing is as id - an interesting Fraudian slip indeed!

Edited January 12, 2008 by Wayfarer64

[VeeCee]

I just made a typo-of writing is as id - an interesting Fraudian slip indeed!

 

Was your Fraudian slip a freudian slip or was it intentional?

[Wayfarer64]

Hey -

 

YEAH,

only the fraudian/Freudian thing was intentional - the s/d thing was a typo(see keyboard)-

but i enjoyed seeing it and relating it to what I was saying - the id has its place in life as does the super-ego- (yet & still some other names for kharma/darma etc etc...)

 

Life has so many aspects to explore I do not put values on these aspects as much as Lin does, so I wished to comment on the hierarchical structure of some values placed on different aspects of our lives ...

 

I have lived a studius/stoic life at times and a fun filled life a time or two as well... Even when under severe duress I had a notion of life being worth the effort and suffering is not an aspect that I abhore...It is one i learn from

Edited January 12, 2008 by Wayfarer64

[eternalnoob]

This is all about equanimity,

 

though all this happens does it matter?

 

its just happening

 

do i need to be 'respected'? no, i don't i don't really want respect, because everything just is.

 

im just neutral, its all the universe, its all divine love, im not happy about all of it but somehow that doesn't matter

 

 

http://www.thetaobums.com/index.php?/topic/4522-why-is-there-so-much-disrespect-in-the-taoist-tradition/

 

disrespect is good in the taoist tradition, respect is more of underhanded way to attack people usually

respect is confucius

confucius would come to taoists and be like yes i have much respect for you

thus i have followed you here

and taoists are just like, man, dont follow me, your messing up by groove ,im not guiding you, im not a teacher, eff off

 

this is kind of a wierd really symettrical organized setup its organized to be very dualistic and thats strange to me but

but idunno i'de rather have disrespect than have respect turn me into a facist or something

 

 

disrespect or more so just neutrality,equanimity, not holding one thing high or something else low

 

no heirarchies at all

Edited February 12, 2012 by eternalnoob

[eternalnoob]

those who show it outwardly tend to not show it inwardly

 

confucius is not authentically looking for help, he represents the oppressive, trickster government trying to mess up offshoots, and stop people from freeing themselves to any alternatives

[Marblehead]

those who show it outwardly tend to not show it inwardly

 

confucius is not authentically looking for help, he represents the oppressive, trickster government trying to mess up offshoots, and stop people from freeing themselves to any alternatives

 

Interesting comments. No value judgements, just, ..., interesting comments.

[Spirit of the Tiger]

I guess it's also because people misinterpreting yin/yang and nondualism will say that since there is no "good or evil" or rather it is based on the interpretter then they can do anything they want without consequences as if there is no universal good for humanity. In thinking this way they might deliberately do wrong etc. when in reality this is just the same as deliberately doing good.

How's that for "nondualism?"

 

Also there seems to be a lot of this going against Confucianism thing.

Edited February 13, 2012 by Spirit of the Tiger

[Marblehead]

This post too has been read but still, no additional comments.

[lifeforce]

those who show it outwardly tend to not show it inwardly

 

confucius is not authentically looking for help, he represents the oppressive, trickster government trying to mess up offshoots, and stop people from freeing themselves to any alternatives

 

Confucius = morality and correct behaviour. A true sage and a man of the people.

[JustARandomPanda]

Ah Kunlun and the Kunlun Wars that raged at TB.

 

Those were the (not-so) Good Ol' Days.

 

You know...

 

I actually own both Max Kunlun books (the 2nd one in color). Maybe I should bust the color one out and give it a shot and see what happens. Except Max says not to mix Kunlun with anything else.

 

 

I do rather like my 6 Healing Sounds, Mantra and (occasional) White Skeleton and Lower Dantien practices but it might do me good to do some sort of actual Nei-Gong again.

 

 

And as for Confucius. It's my understanding he was teaching in an era of Chinese history when Society was experiencing breakdown of societal norms as well as less than helpful "governing" by elites. He was trying to steer Chinese Society in a more beneficial direction. Hence his prescription - Awareness (aka Mindfulness practice) as applied to virtue cultivation by every individual or group in Society. Master Nan Huai-Chin discusses Confucius and how beneficial he was and still is to this day for the Chinese (and the rest of the world too for that matter).

 

Master Nan says you can always tell what a Culture's People are lacking in by what their Sages call particular attention to. Jesus called for Loving Others as One's self (meaning his listeners didn't). Mohammed called for Submission to Allah (meaning the people had excessive amounts of Pride). Lao Tzu called for living in harmony with the Tao (meaning the Chinese weren't - and Master Nan says they still don't), etc.

[Cameron]

Hi Serene Blue,

 

Max wrote that you shouldn't mix Kunlun with other stuff. And personally, I think the Kunlun system would give the average cultivator everything she wants. But it's ok to mix in other stuff if you want.

 

The big no no is mixing something like Kundalini Yoga or practices that are considered fire paths to awakening.

 

Kunlun is the downward flow. So doing a fire practice and water practice together don't jive.

 

Best,

 

Cameron

[Cat Pillar]

Hi Serene Blue,

 

Max wrote that you shouldn't mix Kunlun with other stuff. And personally, I think the Kunlun system would give the average cultivator everything she wants. But it's ok to mix in other stuff if you want.

 

The big no no is mixing something like Kundalini Yoga or practices that are considered fire paths to awakening.

 

Kunlun is the downward flow. So doing a fire practice and water practice together don't jive.

 

Best,

 

Cameron

 

Would the practice of Hermetic (Bardon's IIH) magic be considered a fire path? I'm planning on attending a Kunlun seminar coming to Austin this March, but I may have to rethink that. I have a strong interest in both Western magical practices and Taoist cultivation practices, and am hoping that I can find paths in each that compliment each other.

 

I know eventually I'll need to stick with a primary path in order to achieve mastery, but right now it's hard for me to tell where my heart is on the matter.

 

As a practitioner, I'd be very interested in your opinion, Cameron.

[Cameron]

I don't study Magic myself.

 

Max would know the answer to your question.

 

He knows all about Egyptian practices and teaches them.

[Cat Pillar]

I don't study Magic myself.

 

Max would know the answer to your question.

 

He knows all about Egyptian practices and teaches them.

 

Even if you don't study magic, that's a promising response considering the origins of Hermetic magic.

 

I'll probably go to the seminar anyways. I'd be interested in meeting Max regardless if I end up studying under him or not.

[Cameron]

His knowledge is pretty vast.

 

I don't know how they do it now. But when I was going to the weekend seminars they would always do a friday evening talk.

 

You can vibe out if it's right for you or not if they do that.

[Protector]

The more familiar to me stuff you guys mention, the closer I feel to you

So fighting sounds hilarious, it's like bashing yourself

[Cat Pillar]

His knowledge is pretty vast.

 

I don't know how they do it now. But when I was going to the weekend seminars they would always do a friday evening talk.

 

You can vibe out if it's right for you or not if they do that.

 

Yup, they've got the Friday evening talk planned. I was planning on pre-registering though to save the dough.

[Spirit of the Tiger]